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Thread: Team Needs

  1. #21
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    Re: Team Needs

    The guarantee provision was an item of legal dispute at the time.
    I read various sources and one I just found minutes ago stated it ony applied for league year 2006.
    So, you may be right.
    But why would they renew McKinnie's contract during the 2006 season and 'cap' what they could offer him if they could wait until AFTER March 1 ( end of league year 2006 ) ?

    So, the Vikings are, apparently, not constrained by the guarantee provision, but common sense tell us they can't pay every OL $7M per year as that would consume $35m / $109M ~= 32% of the salary cap for 2007.
    With Birk expected to renegotiate his deal, to extend it toward his expected retirement date, that leaves little money left to add an expensive RG or RT.



    When we stop to think about it, most folks behavior isn't perplexing after all !

  2. #22
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    Re: Team Needs

    Here's a blurb from the past regarding McKinnie's deal.


    Vikings | McKinnie agrees to terms on seven-year deal - from www.KFFL.com
    Sat, 9 Sep 2006 10:43:34 -0700

    Sean Jensen, of the Pioneer Press, reports Minnesota Vikings OT Bryant McKinnie agreed to terms on a seven-year deal worth up to $54.4 million. The deal includes his $900,000 base salary for the 2006 season with another $17.25 million in guarantees. Due to OG Steve Hutchinson's contract, the contract is technically worth $48.5 million over seven years. This way Hutchinson remains the highest-paid offensive lineman on the team and will not guarantee his contract over the full seven years.
    I was also wondering how they will structure Birk's deal if they do ink him so he can retire in Minnesota.

    Vikings | Team still in talks with Birk - from www.KFFL.com
    Fri, 2 Mar 2007 20:05:18 -0800

    Sean Jensen, of the Pioneer Press, reports the Minnesota Vikings are still in talks about keeping free agent C Matt Birk in Minnesota.

    Vikings | Team talks new deal with Birk - from www.KFFL.com
    Sat, 24 Feb 2007 12:12:40 -0800

    Sean Jensen, of the St. Paul Pioneer Press, reports the Minnesota Vikings and the agent for C Matt Birk have begun preliminary discussions to keep Birk on the team for the rest of his career. Birk's agent, Joe Linta, said, "Matt wants to finish his career as a Viking, and he's instructed me to do what I can to make that happen."
    Some of the first comments Childress made as head coach were, "I've been a coordinator and a quarterbacks coach most of my life, and I understand that nothing in football happens without tough, physical, athletic lineman. I'm sure Carl (Eller) and Jim (Marshall) would attest. You have to run it, and you can't throw it with the quarterback laying on his back. Great defense starts on the front with the defensive line. They apply the pressure and choking off the run. For those reasons we will move quickly to solidify both of those fronts."

    I'm just banking on Rob Brzezinski continuing to work his magic so they don't end up in salary cap hell with the combination of the big contracts and the Hutch poison pill episode.
    Personally, there isn't another cap strategist in the NFL that that I would rather have on the team.


    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

  3. #23
    ejmat is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Team Needs

    Great post.
    I think there are plenty needs on the team right now whether it be to upgrade a starter or to add depth.
    IMO on defense there are two areas that can provide an immediate impact.
    They would be at DE and MLB.
    I agree there is some talent at DE but I don't believe any of them are going to be game impacting players.
    Maybe solid players.
    I like Edwards and Scott.
    James hasn't done enough to prove himself yet.
    Udeze has either been injured or non-effective for the most part.
    All talented players but there are still many questions.
    I would love to get Gaines Adams or Jamaal Anderson if they are available.

    MLB right now is probably Henderson's position to lose but we are all hoping Greenway comes back and is able to play up to his expectations.
    I don't think Henderson or D. Thomas are good cover LBers.
    Greenway may be but that's yet to be seen.
    However, I don't see any LBers worth that 7th pick that would be so much of an immediate impact.

    If the Vikes were going to use that first pick on offense the scenerios I see are either trading up to get CJ, picking Quinn if he is available, or trading down and taking one of the other decent WRs available like Bowe or Jarrett.

  4. #24
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    Re: Team Needs

    Mini-camps will tell the Vikings a few things they need to know about EJames, Greenway, Edwards and TWilliams degree of recovery from their injuries.

    Contract dealings with Birk will help eliminate the need to solidify the OL with a first day draft pick.
    Cook probably graded out well enough at RT for Rosenthal to be released.
    Or, they plan to designate Cook as backup Center, and possibly backup RT if they upgrade RT.
    The competition between Herrera, Hicks, Johnson, and a vet OL cut after the draft, or after pre-season, should yield a decent starter at RG.

    There are 3 key questions on defense that Frazier and Childress need to address in mini-camp which will affect the Vikings draft strategy;

    1. will Greenway be ready to play OLB, or MLB?
    2. will Tank Williams be effective at FS or SS?
    3. will EJames be recovered (not likely at the time of mini-camp) and effective?

    When we stop to think about it, most folks behavior isn't perplexing after all !

  5. #25
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    Re: Team Needs

    What an excellent thread! This is what makes this the best Team site on the internet! I agree with most of what has been written, I know we have alot of areas that need improvement.

    In his initial introduction as head coach BC said it all starts on the Line, on both sides of the ball. He made sure in FA last year he solidified the left side of the O-line. The right side has not had anyone step up and prove he is the man. I do think that Cook will have more chances then the others on that side of the line just due to the maneuvers BC went through to pick a kid HE was convinced is can't miss.

    The Defense, under Tomlin, was a vast improvement. Without a wholesale turnover in personnel, using his scheme we produce the top run stuffing D in the league, thus improving our overall defensive rating. And we had some key injuries on defense, time will tell how much we will improve against the pass this year. With the return of E. James, Greenway and Tank,.....we will see.

    Now as far as the draft goes, I seem to be caught in the paralysis of analysis, everytime I hear a well thought out argument for a position I change my mind! Would I like to see Calvin Johnson in a Vikings uniform, YES but he will not fall to us without some deal being done. And if we do get him that leaves the right side of our line vulnerable, TJack cannot find an open receiver from flat on his back! Even if we go after best player available and Quinn is there,......do we take him? Is Ted Ginn big enough to play over the middle in this league? Do we take another "can't miss D-line stud" in the first round? Should we upgrade in the secondary, should LaRon Landry trade LSU Purple and Gold for Vikings colors?

    The draft is a crap shoot, do all the study you want and you still get a Ryan Leaf drafted at the top of his year, and Tom Brady goes in the 6th round of his! It makes my head hurt,.......I cannot pay too much attention to all the mock drafts,.. it makes me dizzy! I just want them to fix all thats wrong with our Vikes,.....by early September please.

    And in conclusion,.....do whatever you have to do,.....Randy Moss is NOT to come back to this division unless it is with us! The thought of him wearing green and Yellow catching TD's from #4 makes me absolutely nauseous! I think of the spineless hoard accross the St Croix suddenly cheering #84 and I want to puke!

    Sorry,.....I'm ranting!
    UltraPurple, USAF (Ret)
    The Woodlands, Texas

  6. #26
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    Re: Team Needs

    "Ultrapurple" wrote:
    What an excellent thread! This is what makes this the best Team site on the internet! I agree with most of what has been written, I know we have alot of areas that need improvement.

    In his initial introduction as head coach BC said it all starts on the Line, on both sides of the ball. He made sure in FA last year he solidified the left side of the O-line. The right side has not had anyone step up and prove he is the man. I do think that Cook will have more chances then the others on that side of the line just due to the maneuvers BC went through to pick a kid HE was convinced is can't miss.

    The Defense, under Tomlin, was a vast improvement. Without a wholesale turnover in personnel, using his scheme we produce the top run stuffing D in the league, thus improving our overall defensive rating. And we had some key injuries on defense, time will tell how much we will improve against the pass this year. With the return of E. James, Greenway and Tank,.....we will see.

    Now as far as the draft goes, I seem to be caught in the paralysis of analysis, everytime I hear a well thought out argument for a position I change my mind! Would I like to see Calvin Johnson in a Vikings uniform, YES but he will not fall to us without some deal being done. And if we do get him that leaves the right side of our line vulnerable, TJack cannot find an open receiver from flat on his back! Even if we go after best player available and Quinn is there,......do we take him? Is Ted Ginn big enough to play over the middle in this league? Do we take another "can't miss D-line stud" in the first round? Should we upgrade in the secondary, should LaRon Landry trade LSU Purple and Gold for Vikings colors?

    The draft is a crap shoot, do all the study you want and you still get a Ryan Leaf drafted at the top of his year, and Tom Brady goes in the 6th round of his! It makes my head hurt,.......I cannot pay too much attention to all the mock drafts,.. it makes me dizzy! I just want them to fix all thats wrong with our Vikes,.....by early September please.

    And in conclusion,.....do whatever you have to do,.....Randy Moss is NOT to come back to this division unless it is with us! The thought of him wearing green and Yellow catching TD's from #4 makes me absolutely nauseous! I think of the spineless hoard accross the St Croix suddenly cheering #84 and I want to puke!


    Sorry,.....I'm ranting!
    I absolutely agree. I don't feel like the organization is that bothered by this idea but if he goes to GB, we will be getting smoked twice a year. Our secondary is good, but not good enough to stop GB WRs if they acquire Moss. We need to steal Moss from them, and maybe less for us to have him, but more to keep them from having him. We released people like Smoot, who could have been used as trade, so I don't know who we give up, but Moss on the back of a Green Jersey spells P-R-O-B-L-E-M-S for the Vikes.
    Trying to bring rationale to an irrational site

  7. #27
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    Re: Team Needs

    Gotta agree with Ultra here.

    What an excellent thread!
    Props to all, especially the new guy.
    Gotta agree, one of the best in a while.

    Sorry,.....I'm ranting!
    Keep on ranting Ultra if it makes sense
    ;D
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  8. #28
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    Re: Team Needs

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Gotta agree with Purp here.

    But are they REALLY THAT MUCH better than Cook, Herrera, Hicks, and Johnson?

    And, do those solid bodies come at a cost equal to or less than the 4 above?

    there's gotta be one guy in the group that's out there, if not two, that are more stable than what we go
    Which ones do you recommend?

    http://story.scout.com/a.z?s=63&p=2&c=627009
    maddro i have mentioned a bunch in other post.
    cooper carlise, the baltimore guy mutalio or whatever, guys we let slip by like wade, petitgoe.
    they're out there.
    the problem is, we dont know what we got in cook, and johnson may just be a flat out bust, so then you are talking about the same problems as last year.
    i dont have a problem drafting OL, but again we dont know what were getting.
    at least if we signed a vet or 2 if they dont start, if they must, we know we have an nfl calibre player as a backup plan.
    like i've said, you dont have to break the bank for whats out there and sitting on 30 million dollars i can't see why you wouldnt cover your own but.
    LET THAT WHICH DOES NOT MATTER, TRULY SLIDE

  9. #29
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    Re: Team Needs

    "bigbadragz" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Gotta agree with Purp here.

    But are they REALLY THAT MUCH better than Cook, Herrera, Hicks, and Johnson?

    And, do those solid bodies come at a cost equal to or less than the 4 above?

    there's gotta be one guy in the group that's out there, if not two, that are more stable than what we go
    Which ones do you recommend?

    http://story.scout.com/a.z?s=63&p=2&c=627009
    maddro i have mentioned a bunch in other post.
    cooper carlise, the baltimore guy mutalio or whatever, guys we let slip by like wade, petitgoe.
    they're out there.
    the problem is, we dont know what we got in cook, and johnson may just be a flat out bust, so then you are talking about the same problems as last year.
    i dont have a problem drafting OL, but again we dont know what were getting.
    at least if we signed a vet or 2 if they dont start, if they must, we know we have an nfl calibre player as a backup plan.
    like i've said, you dont have to break the bank for whats out there and sitting on 30 million dollars i can't see why you wouldnt cover your own but.
    I'm tracking now.
    Thanks.

    If I was to guess, I would have to assume the staff is thinking along the lines of what Purp said.
    Take the quote below and use "all positions".

    Mini-camps will tell the Vikings a few things they need to know about EJames, Greenway, Edwards and TWilliams degree of recovery from their injuries.
    Let the young guys do thier thing in mini camp.
    If it looks like we still have a few holes bring in a vet then at half the price you would pay for him now as the rest of the teams don't appear to be breaking down doors signing these guys either.
    (That might be another indicator of thier capabilities).

    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  10. #30
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    Re: Team Needs

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "bigbadragz" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Gotta agree with Purp here.

    But are they REALLY THAT MUCH better than Cook, Herrera, Hicks, and Johnson?

    And, do those solid bodies come at a cost equal to or less than the 4 above?

    there's gotta be one guy in the group that's out there, if not two, that are more stable than what we go
    Which ones do you recommend?

    http://story.scout.com/a.z?s=63&p=2&c=627009
    maddro i have mentioned a bunch in other post.
    cooper carlise, the baltimore guy mutalio or whatever, guys we let slip by like wade, petitgoe.
    they're out there.
    the problem is, we dont know what we got in cook, and johnson may just be a flat out bust, so then you are talking about the same problems as last year.
    i dont have a problem drafting OL, but again we dont know what were getting.
    at least if we signed a vet or 2 if they dont start, if they must, we know we have an nfl calibre player as a backup plan.
    like i've said, you dont have to break the bank for whats out there and sitting on 30 million dollars i can't see why you wouldnt cover your own but.
    I'm tracking now.
    Thanks.

    If I was to guess, I would have to assume the staff is thinking along the lines of what Purp said.
    Take the quote below and use "all positions".

    Mini-camps will tell the Vikings a few things they need to know about EJames, Greenway, Edwards and TWilliams degree of recovery from their injuries.
    Let the young guys do thier thing in mini camp.
    If it looks like we still have a few holes bring in a vet then at half the price you would pay for him now as the rest of the teams don't appear to be breaking down doors signing these guys either.
    (That might be another indicator of thier capabilities).

    yah that could be true.
    even though this time of free agency always dies down, especially when you are talking vets that are not facing their first time in free agency.
    you are right though they could just be letting things play out and then will address later.
    though i still would have preferred these guys competeing against each other, as opposed to us trying to fill a hole late once we know it's a problem.
    just as long as childress doen'st bring in any more eagle rethreads that end up contributing nothing to our team
    LET THAT WHICH DOES NOT MATTER, TRULY SLIDE

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