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  1. #11
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re: Replacing M Williams Six Candidates For New Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1100400
    Quote Originally Posted by "jargomcfargo" #1100399
    Quote Originally Posted by "Mr Anderson" #1100397
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1100391
    Replacing Madieu Williams: Six Candidates For New Vikings Safety

    One thing to "Ponder" as you consider shitcanning M-will to save CAP space, it will probably cost us more in CAP to find a replacement that actualy plays better than him. Anyone they bring in that would be cheaper......well, theres a reason why he is cheaper.
    What!?

    There are probably 30 safeties in the league that are both cheaper, and better than Madieu Williams. At 6 years $33 million, Williams is one of the worst values in the league.
    Some are more about being right on an internet site than their team winning.

    Taking the stance that Madieu is a solid safety because the front four didn't do their job is just as crazy as saying Favre was a noodle arm in 2009.

    Some take a stance and that's it.
    I can agree to this. Also ranks up there to claiming Gerhart is almost as fast as AP.
    Are you saying he isn't?

    You probably are cause, as always, your confusing game speed to 40 times. In one AD is extremely faster than Toby.

    In the other he is .01 slower than AD depending on what scouting report source you use.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  2. #12
    i_bleed_purple's Avatar
    i_bleed_purple is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Replacing M Williams Six Candidates For New Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1100412
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1100400
    Quote Originally Posted by "jargomcfargo" #1100399
    Quote Originally Posted by "Mr Anderson" #1100397
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1100391
    Replacing Madieu Williams: Six Candidates For New Vikings Safety

    One thing to "Ponder" as you consider shitcanning M-will to save CAP space, it will probably cost us more in CAP to find a replacement that actualy plays better than him. Anyone they bring in that would be cheaper......well, theres a reason why he is cheaper.
    What!?

    There are probably 30 safeties in the league that are both cheaper, and better than Madieu Williams. At 6 years $33 million, Williams is one of the worst values in the league.
    Some are more about being right on an internet site than their team winning.

    Taking the stance that Madieu is a solid safety because the front four didn't do their job is just as crazy as saying Favre was a noodle arm in 2009.

    Some take a stance and that's it.
    I can agree to this. Also ranks up there to claiming Gerhart is almost as fast as AP.
    Are you saying he isn't?

    You probably are cause, as always, your confusing game speed to 40 times. In one AD is extremely faster than Toby.

    In the other he is .01 slower than AD depending on what scouting report source you use.
    And if games were won or lost based on combine stats, Gerhart might be a decent option. Funny thing though, is they're not.

  3. #13
    Mr Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Replacing M Williams Six Candidates For New Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1100410
    Quote Originally Posted by "Mr Anderson" #1100397
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1100391
    Replacing Madieu Williams: Six Candidates For New Vikings Safety

    One thing to "Ponder" as you consider shitcanning M-will to save CAP space, it will probably cost us more in CAP to find a replacement that actualy plays better than him. Anyone they bring in that would be cheaper......well, theres a reason why he is cheaper.
    What!?

    There are probably 30 safeties in the league that are both cheaper, and better than Madieu Williams. At 6 years $33 million, Williams is one of the worst values in the league.

    EDIT: That being said, I don't know if any of the top safeties in this class are really worth spending on. We need to make a move at safety, but with this class we'd be better off taking a risk with an underachieving/unproven guy than overpay for someone mediocre(again.) I'd rather we spend on the offensive line and on retaining some of our own free agents.

    By making some roster alterations(cutting some deadweight: Berrian, Williams, letting Edwards and Leber( :unsure: ) walk) we can afford to bring in some solid offensive linemen, replacements/competition for both Herrera and Sullivan, retain Rice, bring in a cheap-ish veteran QB, and maybe extend Peterson, so long as we're able to avoid big initial cap hits by backloading contracts.
    I think you fix the DL so your S's don't look so bad. The OL will improve just by getting all the starters back healthy this year.
    The defensive line, even if they didn't play great, did not cause Madieu Williams to take horrible angles in pursuit on multiple occasions, be out of place in coverage, or drop interceptions.

    And blaming the defensive line defies logic. If the defensive line underperformed in 2010, they certainly exceeded expectations, or at least played their asses off in 2009? Do we agree on this?(Yes.) And if safety play is dependent on defensive line play, when the line recorded 48 sacks in 2009, Williams should have been one of the best safeties in the league.

    But, to no one's surprise, he wasn't. Williams had statistically comparable seasons in both 2009 and 2010. And by statistically comparable I mean in both years there was a nearly total lack of playmaking from his position. There are obviously other relevant factors, such as injuries at corner, but it's not like we're asking him to cover guys who Cedric Griffin would be otherwise. Nor does it change the fact that at times when he was given an opportunity to make a big play, or even just a simple play he failed frequently.

    He's not worth 1/5th of what we're paying him, we could use his $5.4 million for far better things.

    And who knows, maybe if we let him go he'll have a career resurgence elsewhere... like Canada, or maybe on your Destroyers.

  4. #14
    jmcdon00's Avatar
    jmcdon00 is offline Jersey Retired Snake Champion, Moto Trial Fest 2: Mountain Pack Champion, LL City Truck 2 Champion, Arithmetic sequence Champion, Troops Tower Defense Champion
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    Re: Replacing M Williams Six Candidates For New Safety

    I say keep Williams and replace him via the draft later. IMHO he is an adequate NFL starter, and a good guy to have on the team(walter payton award winner).
    Just don't see anything in FA that would be an instant upgrade, other than Landry, and he's not going to be available IMHO.

    Full disclosure I don't pay much attention to the safeties. I know we gave up alot of big plays, but I don't put that solely on Medieu, especially with all the injuries in the secondary and lack of production on the D-line.

  5. #15
    Mr Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Replacing M Williams Six Candidates For New Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1100419
    I say keep Williams and replace him via the draft later. IMHO he is an adequate NFL starter, and a good guy to have on the team(walter payton award winner).
    Just don't see anything in FA that would be an instant upgrade, other than Landry, and he's not going to be available IMHO.

    Full disclosure I don't pay much attention to the safeties. I know we gave up alot of big plays, but I don't put that solely on Medieu, especially with all the injuries in the secondary and lack of production on the D-line.
    He and Berrian are combining for ~$10million this season. We need to re-sign Rice, rework Peterson's contract, sign rookies, bring in a veteran QB, retain some other free agents, and IMO create some offensive line competition for Sullivan and Herrera. It's would be a lot easier to do that with an extra $10 million in breathing room.

    And frankly, the guys who back-up those two, couldn't contribute much less. Berrian was just taking up space on the field last season, when he was out there. And Williams made more notable bad plays than good.

  6. #16
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    Re: Replacing M Williams Six Candidates For New Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1100415
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1100412
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1100400
    Quote Originally Posted by "jargomcfargo" #1100399
    Quote Originally Posted by "Mr Anderson" #1100397
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1100391
    Replacing Madieu Williams: Six Candidates For New Vikings Safety

    One thing to "Ponder" as you consider shitcanning M-will to save CAP space, it will probably cost us more in CAP to find a replacement that actualy plays better than him. Anyone they bring in that would be cheaper......well, theres a reason why he is cheaper.
    What!?

    There are probably 30 safeties in the league that are both cheaper, and better than Madieu Williams. At 6 years $33 million, Williams is one of the worst values in the league.
    Some are more about being right on an internet site than their team winning.

    Taking the stance that Madieu is a solid safety because the front four didn't do their job is just as crazy as saying Favre was a noodle arm in 2009.

    Some take a stance and that's it.
    I can agree to this. Also ranks up there to claiming Gerhart is almost as fast as AP.
    Are you saying he isn't?

    You probably are cause, as always, your confusing game speed to 40 times. In one AD is extremely faster than Toby.

    In the other he is .01 slower than AD depending on what scouting report source you use.
    And if games were won or lost based on combine stats, Gerhart might be a decent option. Funny thing though, is they're not.
    Gerhart is a decent option. He has the size, speed, intelligence, and work ethic to be a decent option. Coming into this year he will also have the experience.
    No he'll never be peterson, but that's ok, we already have one of those. What he will be is a very consistant north and south runner who will help wear down a defense and put the offense in good positions.
    I think this year he will get about twice the carries he did a year ago.

  7. #17
    Mark_The_Viking is offline Asst. Coach
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    Re: Replacing M Williams Six Candidates For New Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by "Mr Anderson" #1100420
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1100419
    I say keep Williams and replace him via the draft later. IMHO he is an adequate NFL starter, and a good guy to have on the team(walter payton award winner).
    Just don't see anything in FA that would be an instant upgrade, other than Landry, and he's not going to be available IMHO.

    Full disclosure I don't pay much attention to the safeties. I know we gave up alot of big plays, but I don't put that solely on Medieu, especially with all the injuries in the secondary and lack of production on the D-line.
    He and Berrian are combining for ~$10million this season. We need to re-sign Rice, rework Peterson's contract, sign rookies, bring in a veteran QB, retain some other free agents, and IMO create some offensive line competition for Sullivan and Herrera. It's would be a lot easier to do that with an extra $10 million in breathing room.

    And frankly, the guys who back-up those two, couldn't contribute much less. Berrian was just taking up space on the field last season, when he was out there. And Williams made more notable bad plays than good.
    +1
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  8. #18
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    Re: Replacing M Williams Six Candidates For New Safety

    I was one who thought highly of M-will when we first got him, but hes not been worth the money he got so he needs to go. i think that weve got enough young guys to see between sanford, johnson, abdullah. this year is gonna be the year these guys either sink or swim on this team. Frazier only has two years if im not mistaken on his deal so this is his year to figure out which guys he'll keep or lose next year.

    on Gerhart they run similar 40s but gerhart a one gear guy while peterson has that 2nd and even better 3rd gear which is super rare.

  9. #19
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    Re: Replacing M Williams Six Candidates For New Safety

    Anyone still saying it's out DL's fault for M. Williams' poor play should look at the is video.

    It's the Lowlights of the Pats game last season.
    http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d81bc40a0/GameDay-Vikings-vs-Patriots-highlights

    :35 sec mark. Did the DL force him to completely miss the damn ball and give up a play that is almost impossible to not make.

    1:18. Yes plenty of time for Brady led to the catch. But the attempt at the tackle by Williams is the worst I have ever scene. The WR made no move and he some how scored. I think this guy's neck injury really ruined him. He has never recovered from it and it shows.

    BTW I just threw up in my mouth watching that video again.

  10. #20
    kevoncox's Avatar
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    Re: Replacing M Williams Six Candidates For New Safety

    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1100422
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1100415
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1100412
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1100400
    Quote Originally Posted by "jargomcfargo" #1100399
    Quote Originally Posted by "Mr Anderson" #1100397
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1100391
    Replacing Madieu Williams: Six Candidates For New Vikings Safety

    One thing to "Ponder" as you consider shitcanning M-will to save CAP space, it will probably cost us more in CAP to find a replacement that actualy plays better than him. Anyone they bring in that would be cheaper......well, theres a reason why he is cheaper.
    What!?

    There are probably 30 safeties in the league that are both cheaper, and better than Madieu Williams. At 6 years $33 million, Williams is one of the worst values in the league.
    Some are more about being right on an internet site than their team winning.

    Taking the stance that Madieu is a solid safety because the front four didn't do their job is just as crazy as saying Favre was a noodle arm in 2009.

    Some take a stance and that's it.
    I can agree to this. Also ranks up there to claiming Gerhart is almost as fast as AP.
    Are you saying he isn't?

    You probably are cause, as always, your confusing game speed to 40 times. In one AD is extremely faster than Toby.

    In the other he is .01 slower than AD depending on what scouting report source you use.
    And if games were won or lost based on combine stats, Gerhart might be a decent option. Funny thing though, is they're not.
    Gerhart is a decent option. He has the size, speed, intelligence, and work ethic to be a decent option. Coming into this year he will also have the experience.
    No he'll never be peterson, but that's ok, we already have one of those. What he will be is a very consistant north and south runner who will help wear down a defense and put the offense in good positions.
    I think this year he will get about twice the carries he did a year ago.
    Taking the ball out of Peterson's hands worked so well for us last season. Move Gerhart to FB and let him block and catch passes out of the back field. He is a guy that much like Peterson, needs touches to excel. He gets better with every carry but you are taking the ball out of Peterson's hands.

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