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  1. #11
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    Re: Ponder and Webb learning from a vet...

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1098264
    Quote Originally Posted by "marshallvike" #1098262
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1098259
    Wait a minute, wait a minute. Webb I can understand having problems with the verbiage, but the Noodle?

    Comeon guys, at somepoint almost all of you were telling me he was smarter than the coaches and was running the offense all by himself.

    Now your pissing and moaning about how hard it was for him.

    Truth of the matter is, the WCO offense is a very complicated offense to call in the huddle as well as make adjustments at the line so I am glad to hear Musgrove is going to simplyfy things. Only makes sense considering he is going to have a rookie as his starter, a 2nd year man as his backup and a mid tier vet there as the third stringer only to help the two youngsters prep for games.

    On a side note, all of you who wanted Chucky as the HC would have been even more pissed when you heard/hear how hard his offense is to call for QB's. Judging by Chucky himself, and the cats on NFLN, his WCO variant is the toughest to get down of all of them.
    Farve was smarter than the coaches.
    Shoot, Terry Bradshaw was probably smarter than our coaches and he was not considered bright by anyones standards when he was playing.
    OK, so if that is a fact, why is everyone now saying that he struggled with the verbiage? :unsure:
    Where did it say specifically that Brett struggled with the verbiage? It did say he thought it was too complicated and that was a reflection of the talent around him and their ability to run it at the same level he could. Nothing more than that.

  2. #12
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    Re: Ponder and Webb learning from a vet...

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1098264
    Quote Originally Posted by "marshallvike" #1098262
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1098259
    Wait a minute, wait a minute. Webb I can understand having problems with the verbiage, but the Noodle?

    Comeon guys, at somepoint almost all of you were telling me he was smarter than the coaches and was running the offense all by himself.

    Now your pissing and moaning about how hard it was for him.

    Truth of the matter is, the WCO offense is a very complicated offense to call in the huddle as well as make adjustments at the line so I am glad to hear Musgrove is going to simplyfy things. Only makes sense considering he is going to have a rookie as his starter, a 2nd year man as his backup and a mid tier vet there as the third stringer only to help the two youngsters prep for games.

    On a side note, all of you who wanted Chucky as the HC would have been even more pissed when you heard/hear how hard his offense is to call for QB's. Judging by Chucky himself, and the cats on NFLN, his WCO variant is the toughest to get down of all of them.
    Farve was smarter than the coaches.
    Shoot, Terry Bradshaw was probably smarter than our coaches and he was not considered bright by anyones standards when he was playing.
    OK, so if that is a fact, why is everyone now saying that he struggled with the verbiage? :unsure:
    I don't recall Farve referring to the verbiage when he said they needed to simplify the offense. I recall there were too many variants associated with each play making it too hard for everyone to get on the same page.

    And I think even the cookie monster was smarter than Chilly.
    Why must you defend everything this FO does....to the point of making your self look like a yes man.

  3. #13
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    Re: Ponder and Webb learning from a vet...

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1098259
    Wait a minute, wait a minute. Webb I can understand having problems with the verbiage, but the Noodle?

    Comeon guys, at somepoint almost all of you were telling me he was smarter than the coaches and was running the offense all by himself.
    To start, people are speaking incorrectly.

    What Favre said was he thought they needed to focus on the basics, as they were trying to do too much at once. Not once did he say the offense was too hard for him, or that he didn't understand the verbage.
    Truth of the matter is, the WCO offense is a very complicated offense to call in the huddle as well as make adjustments at the line so I am glad to hear Musgrove is going to simplyfy things. Only makes sense considering he is going to have a rookie as his starter, a 2nd year man as his backup and a mid tier vet there as the third stringer only to help the two youngsters prep for games.
    I'd agree. With young guys like Webb and Ponder, if they don't get a guy who has experience in the WCO, he needs to dumb it down a bit. However, the thing about the WCO is, it's complicated. Every WCO QB who talks about it says how complicated the playcalling is. Remember the commercials with Hasselbeck where he was describingp lays? The playcalls were about 12-16 words long. I recall watching something on the NFLN showing Bruce Gradkowski in TC with Gruden, and Gruden was tearing him a new one because he kept screwing up the incredibly complicated playcalls.

    [qutoe]
    On a side note, all of you who wanted Chucky as the HC would have been even more pissed when you heard/hear how hard his offense is to call for QB's. Judging by Chucky himself, and the cats on NFLN, his WCO variant is the toughest to get down of all of them.[/quote]
    Heh... seems you got that base covered.

  4. #14
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    Re: Ponder and Webb learning from a vet...

    Quote Originally Posted by "Purple Floyd" #1098266
    Where did it say specifically that Brett struggled with the verbiage?
    It didn't. It didn't have to eitehr. Marty likes to take things and run with it when he thinks he has some little seam to 'prove' us wrong (I know, I know... he's not here to 'prove' anything :dry: )

  5. #15
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    Re: Ponder and Webb learning from a vet...

    Quote Originally Posted by "Purple Floyd" #1098265
    The noodle thought all the player personnel packages were too complicated for the young guys to be able to execute proficiently and that made him spend too much time in the huddle telling guys what to do.

    Yep. But he shouldn't have had to also teach the players what to do and where to be.
    I can almost live with that, however, why did it click in 2009 and not in 2010?

    Could it be because the guys that were on the field in 2009 know it and the backups that were on the field in 2010 didn't?

    If thats the case then one could almost say that the coaches (and not the Noodle) had the team ready to go in 2009. One could almost then say that the Noodle didn't carry the team in 2009. If he did, then one would have to "Ponder" why he couldn't carry the team in 2010.

    Just saying......:unsure:


    It's as complicated as the staff makes it. There was plenty of room for Childress to do the same things Musgrave is doing but he chose not to.
    How so? Again, it worked in 2009 didn't it?

    Which is a big reason he is now on TV and not the sidelines.
    They had a very interesting discussion on Sirius about Chucky and his ability to develop a QB. He never has.

    They attribute it to the complicated offense he runs which makes me wonder how many on here, that wanted him to be the HC, would now change their minds.

    Again, just saying.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  6. #16
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    Re: Ponder and Webb learning from a vet...

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1098275
    Quote Originally Posted by "Purple Floyd" #1098265
    The noodle thought all the player personnel packages were too complicated for the young guys to be able to execute proficiently and that made him spend too much time in the huddle telling guys what to do.

    Yep. But he shouldn't have had to also teach the players what to do and where to be.
    I can almost live with that, however, why did it click in 2009 and not in 2010?
    Injuries to Favre
    Injuries to the OL
    Injuries to Favre
    Injuries to the WR's
    Injuries to Favre
    Injuries to Peterson
    Injuries to Favre
    Injuries to TJ
    Injuries to Favre

    Get the idea? Last season I don't think there was a single offensive starter who didn't deal with some type of injury. Maybe Loadholt. in 2009, we started shaky (kinda blows your 'coaches had our guys ready to play' scenario out of the water), then when Favre + the receivers got in sync, it took off.
    Could it be because the guys that were on the field in 2009 know it and the backups that were on the field in 2010 didn't?
    Could be because we couldn't get our QB time to pass
    Could be because we couldn't get our RB holes to run
    Could be because we couldn't get the ball to our WR's when the QB had time to pass
    Could be because Childress is a colossal moron (likely scenario)

    If thats the case then one could almost say that the coaches (and not the Noodle) had the team ready to go in 2009. One could almost then say that the Noodle didn't carry the team in 2009. If he did, then one would have to "Ponder" why he couldn't carry the team in 2010.
    If one believes the coaches had ANYTHING ready in 2009 one needs to take a step back and slap themselves in the face and return to the real world.

    In 2009, the coaches didn't have a fucking quarterback until august. Just goes to show how ready they were.
    in 2009, Harvin was clearly not ready in September. Had to be eased in and brought up to speed by Favre (yes, Harvin says Favre was huge in his development... funny, thought that was the coaches job?)

    Just saying......:unsure:

    It's as complicated as the staff makes it. There was plenty of room for Childress to do the same things Musgrave is doing but he chose not to.
    How so? Again, it worked in 2009 didn't it?
    Yep, we had a guy who understood it all. now we don't
    Which is a big reason he is now on TV and not the sidelines.
    They had a very interesting discussion on Sirius about Chucky and his ability to develop a QB. He never has.

    They attribute it to the complicated offense he runs which makes me wonder how many on here, that wanted him to be the HC, would now change their minds.
    I'm betting there were so many here who wanted him because a sloppy brown asshole would be an improvement over what we had.

    I never wanted Chucky, because quite frankly I didn't think he was a good coach.

    Again, just saying.

  7. #17
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    Re: Ponder and Webb learning from a vet...

    Marrdro wrote:
    I can almost live with that, however, why did it click in 2009 and not in 2010?
    Several factors I guess.

    First and foremost being that in the beginning Brett had a chip on his shoulder and had something to prove so he did everything he could to make things work including spending extra time with the new guys and ,when necessary, changing plays or terms in order to get the job done. Of course we all know how that went over with Childress.

    The next year Brett was still beat to hell from the previous year and IMHO he didn't want to be there and IMHO he shouldn't have been there. His play was terrible and his mobility was nearly no existent. The bitch is there was nobody else on the team capable of taking up the slack for him or even to replace him on the roster and run the team like Brett did in 2009. And much of the rest of the talent on the team was also playing at a lower level.
    All that being said, a simpler offense could have helped jackson be a better QB and it could have helped Webb to be better when he was called upon.

  8. #18
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    Re: Ponder and Webb learning from a vet...

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1098275
    I can almost live with that, however, why did it click in 2009 and not in 2010?
    In 2009, Favre had actually worked out in the offseason & was in better physical shape to perform his duties.

    In 2010, even though he was still under contract with the Vikings, he didn't work out like he did in previous seasons & basically crawled off his tractor in August to play football another season after he was tossed millions of more dollars.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  9. #19
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    Re: Ponder and Webb learning from a vet...

    Webb has to overcome "project" stigma to beat out Ponder

    Somewhere in Florida, Joe Webb and Christian Ponder are working out together, each vying for the same goal: to become the starting quarterback of the Minnesota Vikings.

    Awkward.

    http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/blogs/122740774.html

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  10. #20
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    Re: Ponder and Webb learning from a vet...

    Good read, thanks for that.

    This one line sums it up for me.. "One game doesn’t mean a whole lot. Consistency matters."

    As good as he was in the Iggles game, he was as equally bad against the Bears.

    Do i see him as a franchise QB here?.. if i'm honest, no. I think he could be an excellent KR/PR/WR with his skills though.

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