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  1. #11
    oaklandzoo24's Avatar
    oaklandzoo24 is offline Star Spokesman
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    Re: Mock My Mock part 1

    If CLE would want Wells that badly, they should trade down because that is a massive reach.
    "There are 3 things that sell in America:
    Violence, sex, and drugs.
    The only way you are going to make this game more appealing to the public than it was before is if there are on field orgies at halftime and the domes become massive opium dens."

    [img width=450 height=55]http://img216.imageshac

  2. #12
    bleedpurple is offline Ring of Fame
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    Re: Mock My Mock part 1

    "mountainviking" wrote:
    Chris "Beanie" Wells might be dashing back up the draft boards, with Marcus Freeman close on his heels...

    Representatives from 29 of 32 NFL teams were present, a school spokesman said, numbering about 60 people in all.

    Wells likely erased worries about his speed. After posting a 4.59-second time in the 40-yard dash at the scouting combine in February, he slipped in some mock drafts, from mid-first round to late in the round or even out of it.

    [size=10pt]But yesterday, he blazed to times in the 4.39 to 4.42 range -- one team had him at 4.34. That's impressive for a 235-pound bruiser.[/size]
    http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sports/stories/2009/03/14/osufb_pro_day_3-14.ART_ART_03-14-09_C1_A8D7T5Q.html?sid=101

    Dang!
    Now thats a mother truckin load!!

    Here's my look on CLE.
    They were 2nd last in total offense a year after lighting up the league.
    Most of the players are still there.
    26th rushing and 31 passing.
    Jamal Lewis was 20th in the league with just over 1000 yds rushing...although he was 11th in attempts/game, he was way down at 93rd with a mere 3.6 average.

    Players with Wells' combination of size, speed, vision, burst, and power are very rare.
    Sure, you could get a Matt Forte in the 2nd, or a Cedric Benson (bust) in the first, but you probably won't see a 230+ lb back with close to 4.3 speed in the 2nd unless he's already injured...did I mention, 25 reps on the bench and the best broad jump of all RBs with 10'8" too?


    This guy could use a half a year of learning and splitting carries with Lewis before taking over as a featured back...but would be an immediate, huge depth upgrade, that would help ease the learning curves of their questionable QBs.
    Likely, it makes JL better too, easing his workload, much like AP did for Chester Taylor.
    And, he's an Ohio guy, and, a ticket seller!!


    Better yet, according to my Mockery, they could still possibly land Laurinaitis at MLB with the 4th pick of the 2nd round, and improve their defense too!

    Can I say, "BOOOOYAAAAAA" yet?

    ;D
    if that's the case why not trade down and get him later... you have the 5th pick in the draft and your gonna draft a RB that wouldn't likely go until the mid to late first round?.. also, you have mangini who is a defensive minded coach... they will most likely go defense with the first pick..

    if not, you could easily nab a first and second round pick or a first and a third and a second rounder next year,.. yu dont' have to go by the chart if you really want him and can get him later...

    i just don't see him going 5th overall with a defensive minded coach, and him not being anywhere near the 5th best player on the board..

    you might as well wait until the second round and nab shon green out of iowa.. he's a bruiser and plays similar to Marion Barber... that would be better value...

    Drafting beenie wells at 5 could get his ass fired, and not to mention the Cleveland fans i'm sure would be pissed... esp if he gets hurt, which durability is not his strength, and big 10 rb's have been known to be injury prone.

    Chris Perry
    Marion barber
    Rashad mendenhall
    Laurence Maroney
    Larry Johnson

    when you can get guys like

    Matt Forte in the 2nd
    Ray Rice
    Kevin Smith in the 3rd
    Jamal Charles
    Steve Slaton
    Jerrious Norwood
    Frank Gore
    Justin Fargus

    so to me in reality... i kinda doens't make sense to take him that early....

  3. #13
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    Re: Mock My Mock part 1

    "Physio-Impossibility70" wrote:
    "mountainviking" wrote:
    Here we go...first run through.
    What do ya'all think?


    MOCK1 2009
    .
    .
    .
    5. CLE
    Chris “Beanie” Wells RB
    Mangini wants to run, JL is old with little depth.

    Vernon Gholston.

    I would be completely surprised if Mangini took another OSU player so soon. A WR is the only possibility I can see that would prevent some talent influx for the Browns D.

    .
    .
    .

    ...

    from waitingfornextyear.com:

    NFL Draft Preview: Are the Browns Tipping Their Hand with Jeremy Maclin?

    March 06, 2009 By: Scott Category: Cleveland Browns


    Note: It might have no validity, but, the fun value is through the roof for this time of year.
    ;D
    "There are two ways to live: you can live as if nothing is a miracle; you can live as if everything is a miracle. ~ Albert Einstein

  4. #14
    mountainviking's Avatar
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    Re: Mock My Mock part 1

    First off, I'd be more surprised if I got half right than if I got them ALL wrong!


    OK, so 5 may be a bit early for Wells.
    Got to wonder who's got the gas to move up to that spot, and who they would be after if they did...I could see somebody make a move for Raji perhaps...or whomever the last top OT is.

    Seriously, last year, McFadden went 4th, with a total of 4 RBs going in the first.
    Chris Johnson was a surprise first round pick, and look how that worked out.
    The year before AP and Lynch both went in the top half (third?)
    Its not like a team that needs a RB absolutely won't go there in the first.

    I realize, more and more as I look back at this, that I tend to go for the position that I feel will help the team the most immediately, slightly balanced with BPA...and then, mix in a bit of gut instinct and sheer randomness (some teams just always seem to make wierd picks, and others do follow trends.)
    Thing is, there really is never any clear, defined list of BPA...everybody has a different list.
    If I made my Mock look just like Kiper's or McCay's What Fun would that be???

    The way I see it, a first round pick is a first round pick.
    Sure, the top ten cost more and tend to be the rare physical specimens...whether its size, speed, strength, character, experience/production or, most often, a combo there of, but the thing is, for the most part, you got one pick in the first, so you really want to make it an impact player.
    There will always be somebody out there telling you, "That's not a good pick, you should have taken this guy," but if you need a top RB, and he's there, Fock those people and get your guy!
    Three or four years down the road (when that guy is approaching the end of his first contract and has the actual NFL xp to show for it) it really doesn't matter if you got your guy with the 5th, 10th, or 20 something pick...as long as he is producing and contributing.
    Control the line, control the time, and give your D a chance to shine!!

    "Balance it on end and thats the third side of the coin!!" -wookiefoot

  5. #15
    bleedpurple is offline Ring of Fame
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    Re: Mock My Mock part 1

    "mountainviking" wrote:
    First off, I'd be more surprised if I got half right than if I got them ALL wrong!



    OK, so 5 may be a bit early for Wells.
    Got to wonder who's got the gas to move up to that spot, and who they would be after if they did...I could see somebody make a move for Raji perhaps...or whomever the last top OT is.

    Seriously, last year, McFadden went 4th, with a total of 4 RBs going in the first.
    Chris Johnson was a surprise first round pick, and look how that worked out.
    The year before AP and Lynch both went in the top half (third?)
    Its not like a team that needs a RB absolutely won't go there in the first.

    I realize, more and more as I look back at this, that I tend to go for the position that I feel will help the team the most immediately, slightly balanced with BPA...and then, mix in a bit of gut instinct and sheer randomness (some teams just always seem to make wierd picks, and others do follow trends.)
    Thing is, there really is never any clear, defined list of BPA...everybody has a different list.
    If I made my Mock look just like Kiper's or McCay's What Fun would that be???

    The way I see it, a first round pick is a first round pick.
    Sure, the top ten cost more and tend to be the rare physical specimens...whether its size, speed, strength, character, experience/production or, most often, a combo there of, but the thing is, for the most part, you got one pick in the first, so you really want to make it an impact player.
    There will always be somebody out there telling you, "That's not a good pick, you should have taken this guy," but if you need a top RB, and he's there, Fock those people and get your guy!
    Three or four years down the road (when that guy is approaching the end of his first contract and has the actual NFL xp to show for it) it really doesn't matter if you got your guy with the 5th, 10th, or 20 something pick...as long as he is producing and contributing.
    the thing your missing is that the value is not there for beanie.. besides that, this year's rb class isn't close to what it has been the last few years.. esp. when it comes to speed... there is no clear cut favorite among rb's that stands out.. the top 5 rb's could all go one before the other...

    additionally, in the top half of the draft, teams do care what other ppl/fans/other GM's around the league think... and if you fuck up one of those picks esp. early on, your job could be on the line...



  6. #16
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re: Mock My Mock part 1

    "bleedpurple" wrote:
    "mountainviking" wrote:
    First off, I'd be more surprised if I got half right than if I got them ALL wrong!



    OK, so 5 may be a bit early for Wells.
    Got to wonder who's got the gas to move up to that spot, and who they would be after if they did...I could see somebody make a move for Raji perhaps...or whomever the last top OT is.

    Seriously, last year, McFadden went 4th, with a total of 4 RBs going in the first.
    Chris Johnson was a surprise first round pick, and look how that worked out.
    The year before AP and Lynch both went in the top half (third?)
    Its not like a team that needs a RB absolutely won't go there in the first.

    I realize, more and more as I look back at this, that I tend to go for the position that I feel will help the team the most immediately, slightly balanced with BPA...and then, mix in a bit of gut instinct and sheer randomness (some teams just always seem to make wierd picks, and others do follow trends.)
    Thing is, there really is never any clear, defined list of BPA...everybody has a different list.
    If I made my Mock look just like Kiper's or McCay's What Fun would that be???

    The way I see it, a first round pick is a first round pick.
    Sure, the top ten cost more and tend to be the rare physical specimens...whether its size, speed, strength, character, experience/production or, most often, a combo there of, but the thing is, for the most part, you got one pick in the first, so you really want to make it an impact player.
    There will always be somebody out there telling you, "That's not a good pick, you should have taken this guy," but if you need a top RB, and he's there, Fock those people and get your guy!
    Three or four years down the road (when that guy is approaching the end of his first contract and has the actual NFL xp to show for it) it really doesn't matter if you got your guy with the 5th, 10th, or 20 something pick...as long as he is producing and contributing.
    the thing your missing is that the value is not there for beanie.. besides that, this year's rb class isn't close to what it has been the last few years.. esp. when it comes to speed... there is no clear cut favorite among rb's that stands out.. the top 5 rb's could all go one before the other...

    additionally, in the top half of the draft, teams do care what other ppl/fans/other GM's around the league think... and if you floop up one of those picks esp. early on, your job could be on the line...


    Value is a hard thing to define when making up a mock draft.
    Sure there are Value Charts out there:

    http://www.nfldraftdog.com/2009_NFL_...alue_board.htm

    but they only alude to what round a cat should be taken at based on talent level.
    I no way do they help to determine were the cat should be taken in that round.

    As the Mountainman said, if a team has a need, the value can go up.
    Additionally, if they have multiple needs and a player of equal "Value" can be taken in a later round, the value will go down.

    Of late, teams are finding out that RB's are coming out of the draft in waves that can be picked up in later rounds, thus, devauling the RB position.

    Long story short, will Wells go in the top 5 or even the top 10?
    I don't know, however, my guess, his value isn't as high as his talent level is.
    A team would really have to need a RB or not have any needs at all to take him that high.
    My guess, all the teams that are up there that high have more needs than just a RB and Wells will drop, possibly even out of the top 10.

    Hell, the Iggles (and possibly the Cards) could be the only team that drafts a RB in the first round and I bet they don't do that until thier 2nd pick.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  7. #17
    mountainviking's Avatar
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    Re: Mock My Mock part 2

    Here we go again...complete with trades!!!!!

    1. DET
    Jason Smith OT
    It all starts up front and DET has neglected OL for years.
    2. STL
    Eugene Monroe OT
    Spagnoulo wants to go D, but Pace pushes them to OT.
    3. KC
    Aaron Curry LB
    He can play LB in 3-4 or 4-3.
    Safe pick, first year upgrade
    4. SEA
    Matt Stafford QB
    Matt could use some time with Matt.
    Want OL, but better value at QB?
    5. CLE
    Brian Orakpo
    Pass rushing OLB to replace McGinest.
    6. CIN
    Mike Oher OT
    They need help bad…30th in sacks allowed in 08!
    Sure, they could go with Andre, but at this point they can’t afford another problem.
    Go with the good guy story instead.
    7. OAK
    Jeremy Maclin WR
    This is where Raji should go, but Undead Al doesn’t like to do what he should.
    Instead of addressing their biggest weakness with the BPA, they go for the playmaker with speed.
    8. JAX
    Crabtree
    WR
    Consistent production at WR…JAX fans go, “What???”
    If he weren’t available, somebody might move up for Raji.
    9. GB
    Peria Jerry LDE/DT They’ve got Picket and Jolly at NT, but not much behind the oft injured Jenkins and Harrell on the ends.
    PJ makes them more physical up front and Aaron Kampman even more dangerous.
    10. SF
    Tyson Jackson
    I know, Raji is BPA, but Jackson has the build to play LDE in their 3-4 and while they got 40+ tkls each out of both of their DTs, they only got 40 tkls and 3.5 sacks total out of LDE last season.
    11. BUF
    Everette Brown DE
    26th in sacks and 20th vs. run means they need help up front, and seemingly mostly at DE, (LDE if Schobel is healthy, RDE otherwise)
    12. DEN
    BJ Raji
    DT
    I think he could still go higher.
    Broncos should be stoked, but seeing what JMc has done so far, he’ll probably go for Knowshon Moreno instead.
    Could he get Dirty with Sanchez?
    To me Cassell is not a WC QB.
    13. WAS
    Andre Smith
    OT
    They really do need some OL help…they’ve been buried by injuries and old age.
    Andre the giant will remind them of the hogs.
    If they’re not sold on Campbell, Sanchez is a WCO QB who might be hard for the new coach to pass on.
    14. NO
    Malcolm Jenkins
    CB/S
    At least a nickel back, possible starter/depth at both.
    15. HOU
    Brian Cushing
    OLB
    OK, I’m convinced, their need at OLB out weighs QB value.
    16. SD
    Robert Ayers
    LDE
    The big boys go early, and he’s a player with size to help out front.
    Wanted to go WR but wasn’t quite ready to reach for Harvin.
    17. NYJ
    Mark Sanchez
    QB
    They can’t believe he’s there for them.
    18. CHI
    Eben Britton OT
    This guy can play either side while they figure out where they want last year’s top pick, C. Williams.
    Both years starters at OT are gone!
    19. TB
    Vontae Davis
    CB
    The best DTs are gone and Freeman is a reach.
    BPA gives them youth behind Ronde and an upgrade at nickel.
    20. *1*trade**DEN
    Rey Maualuga MLB
    Instant upgrade to MLB and run defense!!
    With the FA additions of Dawkins, Goodman, and Hill, DEN now has the cornerstones of a very goof defense.
    Pound the rock, play solid D, Fuck the QB!
    21. PHI
    Knowshon Moreno RB
    A good all purpose back to team with Westbrook and insure them against injury and future negotiations.
    22. *2*trade** CLE
    Chris “Beanie” Wells RB
    A local beast of a RB to help carry the load in Mangini’s run first offense.
    He now knows all about protecting questionable QBs with the ground game, and doesn’t think J.Lewis can do it on his own.
    23. NE
    Aaron Maybin OLB
    He edges out Laurinaitis barely because of his speed, and gives Belicheck another dangerous weapon at LB.
    Vrabel who?
    24. ATL
    Clay Mathews OLB
    Fits the biggest need given their FA losses.
    25. MIA
    Percy Harvin WR
    A top notch playmaker for Pennington who makes their Wildcat even more dangerous.
    26. BAL
    Darius H-B WR
    The local kid gives the Ravens a real threat at WR.
    27. IND
    Hakeem Nicks WR
    A tough all around WR to replace the old.
    Yeah, I keep thinking they’ll draft defense, but they really like to keep Peyton happy I guess.
    28. PHI
    William Beatty OT
    Big enough to add bulk and quick enough to handle speed rushers.
    None of their current guys have started at LT, so a slight reach but a huge need.
    29. NYG
    Darius Butler CB
    He improves the nickel and their return game.
    With Ward signing elsewhere, Bradshaw will be relied upon to run more.
    30. TEN
    Ron Brace DT
    He’s not Haynesworth but he’s got the size to stop the run.
    31. ARI
    Brandon Pettigrew TE
    They had zero TDs at TE last season.
    Good all around player who will help their running game too.
    32. PIT
    Alphonso Smith CB
    I was going to give them Mack or Unger, since they could use help all over the OL, but the thing is, the Steelers don’t draft OL in the first round.
    Smith might make their cover D even better.
    (They lost McFadden (CB) and Smith (S) in FA.)


    Trades:

    1*
    DET gives Denver the 20th overall pick, Drew Stanton, and a conditional next year in the 2-5 range based on starts etc.
    DEN signs another vet QB (Garcia) and drafts a project later.

    2*
    CLE gives MIN their 2nd round pick for two years running.
    With the 4th pick of the 2nd round the Vikings select Kenny Britt, a tough physical receiver who will help out AP in more ways than one.
    With the 54th overall pick, (I’m hoping) we select Max Unger, the versatile OL guy to push Cook immediately and back us up in case Sullivan and/or Herrera have issues at Center.
    F’n Sweet!!!
    “Championship!!”

    Control the line, control the time, and give your D a chance to shine!!

    "Balance it on end and thats the third side of the coin!!" -wookiefoot

  8. #18
    bleedpurple is offline Ring of Fame
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    Re: Mock My Mock part 1

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "bleedpurple" wrote:
    "mountainviking" wrote:
    First off, I'd be more surprised if I got half right than if I got them ALL wrong!



    OK, so 5 may be a bit early for Wells.
    Got to wonder who's got the gas to move up to that spot, and who they would be after if they did...I could see somebody make a move for Raji perhaps...or whomever the last top OT is.

    Seriously, last year, McFadden went 4th, with a total of 4 RBs going in the first.
    Chris Johnson was a surprise first round pick, and look how that worked out.
    The year before AP and Lynch both went in the top half (third?)
    Its not like a team that needs a RB absolutely won't go there in the first.

    I realize, more and more as I look back at this, that I tend to go for the position that I feel will help the team the most immediately, slightly balanced with BPA...and then, mix in a bit of gut instinct and sheer randomness (some teams just always seem to make wierd picks, and others do follow trends.)
    Thing is, there really is never any clear, defined list of BPA...everybody has a different list.
    If I made my Mock look just like Kiper's or McCay's What Fun would that be???

    The way I see it, a first round pick is a first round pick.
    Sure, the top ten cost more and tend to be the rare physical specimens...whether its size, speed, strength, character, experience/production or, most often, a combo there of, but the thing is, for the most part, you got one pick in the first, so you really want to make it an impact player.
    There will always be somebody out there telling you, "That's not a good pick, you should have taken this guy," but if you need a top RB, and he's there, Fock those people and get your guy!
    Three or four years down the road (when that guy is approaching the end of his first contract and has the actual NFL xp to show for it) it really doesn't matter if you got your guy with the 5th, 10th, or 20 something pick...as long as he is producing and contributing.
    the thing your missing is that the value is not there for beanie.. besides that, this year's rb class isn't close to what it has been the last few years.. esp. when it comes to speed... there is no clear cut favorite among rb's that stands out.. the top 5 rb's could all go one before the other...

    additionally, in the top half of the draft, teams do care what other ppl/fans/other GM's around the league think... and if you floop up one of those picks esp. early on, your job could be on the line...


    Value is a hard thing to define when making up a mock draft.
    Sure there are Value Charts out there:

    http://www.nfldraftdog.com/2009_NFL_...alue_board.htm

    but they only alude to what round a cat should be taken at based on talent level.
    I no way do they help to determine were the cat should be taken in that round.

    As the Mountainman said, if a team has a need, the value can go up.
    Additionally, if they have multiple needs and a player of equal "Value" can be taken in a later round, the value will go down.

    Of late, teams are finding out that RB's are coming out of the draft in waves that can be picked up in later rounds, thus, devauling the RB position.

    Long story short, will Wells go in the top 5 or even the top 10?
    I don't know, however, my guess, his value isn't as high as his talent level is.
    A team would really have to need a RB or not have any needs at all to take him that high.
    My guess, all the teams that are up there that high have more needs than just a RB and Wells will drop, possibly even out of the top 10.

    Hell, the Iggles (and possibly the Cards) could be the only team that drafts a RB in the first round and I bet they don't do that until thier 2nd pick.
    my point exactly... hence u just proved my point... value.. taking him that high isn't worth the value... additionally, the trade chart has nothging to do with value.. just in trading picks... so that's not even relevant when discussing this..

  9. #19
    VikingsTw is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Mock My Mock part 1

    I think we definitly draft in the first round. I think our needs are exactly some of the core strength in this draft. WR, CB, and Center/Gaurd. I think it will be difficult to get a Tackle but Britton could be the guy, I just don't know if he'll be rated as high as some of the WR's or even CB's. Either way its getting closer, but I definitly want to get two good players in the first two rounds at positions of need.

  10. #20
    mountainviking's Avatar
    mountainviking is offline Team Alumni
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    Re: Mock My Mock part 1

    "VikingsTw" wrote:
    I think we definitly draft in the first round. I think our needs are exactly some of the core strength in this draft. WR, CB, and Center/Gaurd. I think it will be difficult to get a Tackle but Britton could be the guy, I just don't know if he'll be rated as high as some of the WR's or even CB's. Either way its getting closer, but I definitly want to get two good players in the first two rounds at positions of need.
    So, you wouldn't be happy with Britt and Unger in the 2nd...and an extra 2nd next year-or-third this year?
    The fact that the strengths of the draft fit our needs is exactly what makes trading back look enticing to me.
    You can still get good prospects later, and boost your picks...maybe even trade those thirds to move back toward the 2nd and three guys of equal value at our 3 biggest needs.

    Just an idea...fat chance I know...but, it is fun to speculate!!
    ;D 8)
    Control the line, control the time, and give your D a chance to shine!!

    "Balance it on end and thats the third side of the coin!!" -wookiefoot

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