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  1. #21
    Torontovik15 is offline Rookie
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    Re: It's Their Plan, And They're Sticking To It (All Read this one)

    I know all us Vikings fans are trying to justify the moves made by the administration this year, some questionable to say the least and I really hope that half work out great.
    It really concerns me that we are not willing to go after some 1st tier players.
    Let me say this, if we DO NOT OVERPAY to get a quality free agent, we will never sign another one cause the law of suppy and demand dictate this.
    We have to outbid all other teams inorder to get them, in todays game u will rarely find a FA that is paid what he is worth.
    So if that administration is not willing to spend that money on FA, then we will relatively have the same team this year as last.
    I hope it is not another 6-10 season.
    What we got here is a failure to communicate.

  2. #22
    Prophet's Avatar
    Prophet is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: It's Their Plan, And They're Sticking To It (All Read this one)

    "Torontovik15" wrote:
    I know all us Vikings fans are trying to justify the moves made by the administration this year, some questionable to say the least and I really hope that half work out great.
    It really concerns me that we are not willing to go after some 1st tier players.
    Let me say this, if we DO NOT OVERPAY to get a quality free agent, we will never sign another one cause the law of suppy and demand dictate this.
    We have to outbid all other teams inorder to get them, in todays game u will rarely find a FA that is paid what he is worth.
    So if that administration is not willing to spend that money on FA, then we will relatively have the same team this year as last.
    I hope it is not another 6-10 season.
    You can only hope that the boys at Winter Park read this.
    I'm sure that they have no idea how FA, the draft, and the salary cap works.
    It's interesting that they have no plan and are just picking up random people and somehow think they are going to get better.

    Good point.
    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

  3. #23
    nephilimstorm's Avatar
    nephilimstorm is offline Star Spokesman
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    Re: It's Their Plan, And They're Sticking To It (All Read this one)

    Wilf and CO> might want to stick to real estate...it is said that some peeps that are owners etc struggle with NFL franchises

  4. #24
    Join Date
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    Re: It's Their Plan, And They're Sticking To It (All Read this one)

    "Torontovik15" wrote:
    I know all us Vikings fans are trying to justify the moves made by the administration this year, some questionable to say the least and I really hope that half work out great.
    It really concerns me that we are not willing to go after some 1st tier players.
    Let me say this, if we DO NOT OVERPAY to get a quality free agent, we will never sign another one cause the law of suppy and demand dictate this.
    We have to outbid all other teams inorder to get them, in todays game u will rarely find a FA that is paid what he is worth.
    So if that administration is not willing to spend that money on FA, then we will relatively have the same team this year as last.
    I hope it is not another 6-10 season.
    Pay them too much now, cut them loose later when their contract is prohibitive relative to their performance...

    e.g. Randall Cunningham, Denard Walker, Duane Alexander, Daunte Culpepper, Fred Smoot,....

    ...........Jim Kleinsasser?

    That's not a formula for roster continuity, which is one of the goals of the Pentagon of Power.

    And, overpaying for bread today means you have no money to buy guns later...

    When we stop to think about it, most folks behavior isn't perplexing after all !

  5. #25
    Caine's Avatar
    Caine is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: It's Their Plan, And They're Sticking To It (All Read this one)

    I hate free agency.

    Every single year, every fan out there pins their hopes on their teams next season on who their teams do or don't pick up.
    And, every year, it's almost like a feeding frenzy as players who aren't really all that good wind up soaking some team for a huge contract while teams complete to see who can spend the most money on the most worthless people.

    Remember when we signed Smoot?
    Everyone here was creaming their jeans thinking we'd have an untouchable secondary....ooops.
    That didn't work out so well.

    Remember when we traded Randy Moss for Napolean "Hardest Hitting Linebacker in teh NFL" Harris and the 7th overall pick?
    Here we are 3 years later, and NONE of it worked for ANYONE.
    Moss isn't what he was, Harris isn't on the team, and our former 7th overall pick can't catch...period.

    It's almost as bad on draft day, teams - and fans - try and wrangle in players they think might possibly be good, offer them WAAAAAY too much money, then cry when it doesn't pan out.
    But, that's a topic for the future.
    Back to free agency.

    This year, despite our desperate need at certain skill positions, there were simply not very many quality people available.
    We NEED a Quarterback.
    We NEED a pair of Wide Receivers.
    We NEED a speed rushing end.
    We NEED another fast linebacker who can cover.
    We NEED a receiving tight end.

    Yet, who was really out there?
    Anyone?
    All of the A listers are locked up by contract or asking the moon as a downpayment.
    The B listers are getting former A lister money, and the C listers are seriously delusional in what they're asking...even if they are getting it.

    In my opinion, sooner of later (I'm guessing later), the NFL is going to collapse under the weight of it's run-away salaries.
    We saw it happen in Hockey, Basketball, and Baseball.
    Players start making far more than they're worth, teams start ponying up huge money for unproven players, and franchises wind up in the crapper for a few YEARS while they try and dig out of their holes.

    So, am I really upset by the Vikings lack of activity in Free Agency?
    Only in the receiver area.
    A handful of "Better than we have now" receivers were avaialable...we got none of them.
    Other than that, not really.
    There wasn't anyone out there worth getting excited about.

    However, I did find THIS passage in the original article to be interesting:

    Several agents said Minnesota is not an appealing destination for players, given the climate, the Vikings' record last season and the lack of clarity at quarterback. But Spielman insisted that hasn't hampered the Vikings, that the area offers a high quality of life, and the team offers strong ownership and a franchise headed in the right direction.

    "It has never been a hindrance," Spielman said. "It was a big plus, to be a part of such a quality area. We never had one guy we talked to say they didn't want to come to this area, play for this head coach, play for these owners. It's been all positive."
    I don't believe Spielman for a second.
    Of course no one is going to TELL YOU that they don't like the climate, ownership, or coach...they're waiting to see how much CASH you're willing to throw at them.
    Of course they're going to say positive things...to YOU.

    Look at it like this:


    Example 1:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh....gee, Mr. Spielman, I don't know.
    Your new owner sure seems like a clueless dork with more money than sense.
    I don't think I'd like it here.

    Spielman:
    Uhhh.......well......nevermind.

    EXAMPLE 2:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh....gee, Mr. Spielman, I don't know.
    Your new Coach sure seems like a clueless dork on a power trip.
    I don't think I'd like it here.

    Spielman:
    Uhhh.......well......nevermind.

    EXAMPLE 3:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh....gee, Mr. Spielman, I don't know.
    It sure is cold in Minnesota, and your stadium is old and kind of sucky.
    I don't think I'd like it here.

    Spielman:
    Uhhh.......well......nevermind.

    EXAMPLE 4:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh....gee, Mr. Spielman, that'd be great.
    You guys sure seem like a great franchise.

    Spielman:
    How does forty kazillion dollars over 3 years, with 20 kazillion guaranteed sound?

    Goober:
    Sounds like I'm a Viking, Mr. Spielman.

    Which of the above do you think the most likely?
    Players AREN'T going to cut their own throats before the money is on the table.
    Instead, they're listening to offers, saying nice things, then telling their AGENTS, "Are you friggin kidding me?!?!?!?
    Those guys haven't got a clue!!!!!
    But for 7 million a year, I'd go there..."

    Caine

  6. #26
    Del Rio is offline Coordinator
    Join Date
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    Posts
    881

    Re: It's Their Plan, And They're Sticking To It (All Read this one)

    "Caine" wrote:
    I hate free agency.

    Every single year, every fan out there pins their hopes on their teams next season on who their teams do or don't pick up.
    And, every year, it's almost like a feeding frenzy as players who aren't really all that good wind up soaking some team for a huge contract while teams complete to see who can spend the most money on the most worthless people.

    Remember when we signed Smoot?
    Everyone here was creaming their jeans thinking we'd have an untouchable secondary....ooops.
    That didn't work out so well.

    Remember when we traded Randy Moss for Napolean "Hardest Hitting Linebacker in teh NFL" Harris and the 7th overall pick?
    Here we are 3 years later, and NONE of it worked for ANYONE.
    Moss isn't what he was, Harris isn't on the team, and our former 7th overall pick can't catch...period.

    It's almost as bad on draft day, teams - and fans - try and wrangle in players they think might possibly be good, offer them WAAAAAY too much money, then cry when it doesn't pan out.
    But, that's a topic for the future.
    Back to free agency.

    This year, despite our desperate need at certain skill positions, there were simply not very many quality people available.
    We NEED a Quarterback.
    We NEED a pair of Wide Receivers.
    We NEED a speed rushing end.
    We NEED another fast linebacker who can cover.
    We NEED a receiving tight end.

    Yet, who was really out there?
    Anyone?
    All of the A listers are locked up by contract or asking the moon as a downpayment.
    The B listers are getting former A lister money, and the C listers are seriously delusional in what they're asking...even if they are getting it.

    In my opinion, sooner of later (I'm guessing later), the NFL is going to collapse under the weight of it's run-away salaries.
    We saw it happen in Hockey, Basketball, and Baseball.
    Players start making far more than they're worth, teams start ponying up huge money for unproven players, and franchises wind up in the crapper for a few YEARS while they try and dig out of their holes.

    So, am I really upset by the Vikings lack of activity in Free Agency?
    Only in the receiver area.
    A handful of "Better than we have now" receivers were avaialable...we got none of them.
    Other than that, not really.
    There wasn't anyone out there worth getting excited about.

    However, I did find THIS passage in the original article to be interesting:

    Several agents said Minnesota is not an appealing destination for players, given the climate, the Vikings' record last season and the lack of clarity at quarterback. But Spielman insisted that hasn't hampered the Vikings, that the area offers a high quality of life, and the team offers strong ownership and a franchise headed in the right direction.

    "It has never been a hindrance," Spielman said. "It was a big plus, to be a part of such a quality area. We never had one guy we talked to say they didn't want to come to this area, play for this head coach, play for these owners. It's been all positive."
    I don't believe Spielman for a second.
    Of course no one is going to TELL YOU that they don't like the climate, ownership, or coach...they're waiting to see how much CASH you're willing to throw at them.
    Of course they're going to say positive things...to YOU.

    Look at it like this:


    Example 1:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh....gee, Mr. Spielman, I don't know.
    Your new owner sure seems like a clueless dork with more money than sense.
    I don't think I'd like it here.

    Spielman:
    Uhhh.......well......nevermind.

    EXAMPLE 2:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh....gee, Mr. Spielman, I don't know.
    Your new Coach sure seems like a clueless dork on a power trip.
    I don't think I'd like it here.

    Spielman:
    Uhhh.......well......nevermind.

    EXAMPLE 3:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh....gee, Mr. Spielman, I don't know.
    It sure is cold in Minnesota, and your stadium is old and kind of sucky.
    I don't think I'd like it here.

    Spielman:
    Uhhh.......well......nevermind.

    EXAMPLE 4:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh....gee, Mr. Spielman, that'd be great.
    You guys sure seem like a great franchise.

    Spielman:
    How does forty kazillion dollars over 3 years, with 20 kazillion guaranteed sound?

    Goober:
    Sounds like I'm a Viking, Mr. Spielman.

    Which of the above do you think the most likely?
    Players AREN'T going to cut their own throats before the money is on the table.
    Instead, they're listening to offers, saying nice things, then telling their AGENTS, "Are you friggin kidding me?!?!?!?
    Those guys haven't got a clue!!!!!
    But for 7 million a year, I'd go there..."

    Caine
    As usual I enjoyed the read, just have to point out that not everyone was happy with the Smoot pickup.

    There were other cheaper options and of course Brian Williams.

    This is why I say to tell me we are doomed is a discredit to the 40+ players we retain from last year. They seem to be forgotten during this period of time.

    Being the team sport it is it makes no sense to look at an individuals stats and assume they will contribute to our team. This is why I never complain about bringing in a no namer, if he can work within the system and be productive, THAT is what wins games.

    Nice post Caine.
    If you promise to be smarter, I will promise to be nicer.

    My posts are worth 6 of yours.

  7. #27
    Prophet's Avatar
    Prophet is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: It's Their Plan, And They're Sticking To It (All Read this one)

    "Caine" wrote:
    ...
    ..."It has never been a hindrance," Spielman said. "It was a big plus, to be a part of such a quality area. We never had one guy we talked to say they didn't want to come to this area, play for this head coach, play for these owners. It's been all positive."
    I don't believe Spielman for a second.
    Of course no one is going to TELL YOU that they don't like the climate, ownership, or coach...they're waiting to see how much CASH you're willing to throw at them.
    Of course they're going to say positive things...to YOU.

    Look at it like this:


    Example 1:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh....gee, Mr. Spielman, I don't know.
    Your new owner sure seems like a clueless dork with more money than sense.
    I don't think I'd like it here.

    Spielman:
    Uhhh.......well......nevermind.

    EXAMPLE 2:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh....gee, Mr. Spielman, I don't know.
    Your new Coach sure seems like a clueless dork on a power trip.
    I don't think I'd like it here.

    Spielman:
    Uhhh.......well......nevermind.

    EXAMPLE 3:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh....gee, Mr. Spielman, I don't know.
    It sure is cold in Minnesota, and your stadium is old and kind of sucky.
    I don't think I'd like it here.

    Spielman:
    Uhhh.......well......nevermind.

    EXAMPLE 4:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh....gee, Mr. Spielman, that'd be great.
    You guys sure seem like a great franchise.

    Spielman:
    How does forty kazillion dollars over 3 years, with 20 kazillion guaranteed sound?

    Goober:
    Sounds like I'm a Viking, Mr. Spielman.

    Which of the above do you think the most likely?
    Players AREN'T going to cut their own throats before the money is on the table.
    Instead, they're listening to offers, saying nice things, then telling their AGENTS, "Are you friggin kidding me?!?!?!?
    Those guys haven't got a clue!!!!!
    But for 7 million a year, I'd go there..."

    Caine
    Damn, I was laughing my ass off reading this.
    Nice post.
    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

  8. #28
    Vikingsx92 is offline Waterboy
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    16

    Re: It's Their Plan, And They're Sticking To It (All Read this one)

    "Caine" wrote:
    I hate free agency.

    Every single year, every fan out there pins their hopes on their teams next season on who their teams do or don't pick up.
    And, every year, it's almost like a feeding frenzy as players who aren't really all that good wind up soaking some team for a huge contract while teams complete to see who can spend the most money on the most worthless people.

    Remember when we signed Smoot?
    Everyone here was creaming their jeans thinking we'd have an untouchable secondary. . . . ooops.
    That didn't work out so well.

    Remember when we traded Randy Moss for Napolean "Hardest Hitting Linebacker in teh NFL" Harris and the 7th overall pick?
    Here we are 3 years later, and NONE of it worked for ANYONE.
    Moss isn't what he was, Harris isn't on the team, and our former 7th overall pick can't catch. . . period.

    It's almost as bad on draft day, teams - and fans - try and wrangle in players they think might possibly be good, offer them WAAAAAY too much money, then cry when it doesn't pan out.
    But, that's a topic for the future.
    Back to free agency.

    This year, despite our desperate need at certain skill positions, there were simply not very many quality people available.
    We NEED a Quarterback.
    We NEED a pair of Wide Receivers.
    We NEED a speed rushing end.
    We NEED another fast linebacker who can cover.
    We NEED a receiving tight end.

    Yet, who was really out there?
    Anyone?
    All of the A listers are locked up by contract or asking the moon as a downpayment.
    The B listers are getting former A lister money, and the C listers are seriously delusional in what they're asking. . . even if they are getting it.

    In my opinion, sooner of later (I'm guessing later), the NFL is going to collapse under the weight of it's run-away salaries.
    We saw it happen in Hockey, Basketball, and Baseball.
    Players start making far more than they're worth, teams start ponying up huge money for unproven players, and franchises wind up in the crapper for a few YEARS while they try and dig out of their holes.

    So, am I really upset by the Vikings lack of activity in Free Agency?
    Only in the receiver area.
    A handful of "Better than we have now" receivers were avaialable. . . we got none of them.
    Other than that, not really.
    There wasn't anyone out there worth getting excited about.

    However, I did find THIS passage in the original article to be interesting:

    Several agents said Minnesota is not an appealing destination for players, given the climate, the Vikings' record last season and the lack of clarity at quarterback.
    But Spielman insisted that hasn't hampered the Vikings, that the area offers a high quality of life, and the team offers strong ownership and a franchise headed in the right direction.

    "It has never been a hindrance," Spielman said.
    "It was a big plus, to be a part of such a quality area.
    We never had one guy we talked to say they didn't want to come to this area, play for this head coach, play for these owners.
    It's been all positive. "
    I don't believe Spielman for a second.
    Of course no one is going to TELL YOU that they don't like the climate, ownership, or coach. . . they're waiting to see how much CASH you're willing to throw at them.
    Of course they're going to say positive things. . . to YOU.

    Look at it like this:


    Example 1:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh. . . . gee, Mr.
    Spielman, I don't know.
    Your new owner sure seems like a clueless dork with more money than sense.
    I don't think I'd like it here.

    Spielman:
    Uhhh. . . . . . . well. . . . . . nevermind.

    EXAMPLE 2:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh. . . . gee, Mr.
    Spielman, I don't know.
    Your new Coach sure seems like a clueless dork on a power trip.
    I don't think I'd like it here.

    Spielman:
    Uhhh. . . . . . . well. . . . . . nevermind.

    EXAMPLE 3:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh. . . . gee, Mr.
    Spielman, I don't know.
    It sure is cold in Minnesota, and your stadium is old and kind of sucky.
    I don't think I'd like it here.

    Spielman:
    Uhhh. . . . . . . well. . . . . . nevermind.

    EXAMPLE 4:

    Spielman:
    So, Goober, we'd really like you to be a Viking next season, and we're prepared to talk contract.

    Goober:
    Uhhh. . . . gee, Mr.
    Spielman, that'd be great.
    You guys sure seem like a great franchise.

    Spielman:
    How does forty kazillion dollars over 3 years, with 20 kazillion guaranteed sound?

    Goober:
    Sounds like I'm a Viking, Mr.
    Spielman.

    Which of the above do you think the most likely?
    Players AREN'T going to cut their own throats before the money is on the table.
    Instead, they're listening to offers, saying nice things, then telling their AGENTS, "Are you friggin kidding me?!?!?!?
    Those guys haven't got a clue!!!!!
    But for 7 million a year, I'd go there. . . "

    Caine

    One of my first post here and i have to say great post, I agree 100 %

  9. #29
    bigbadragz's Avatar
    bigbadragz is offline Coordinator
    Join Date
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    823

    Re: It's Their Plan, And They're Sticking To It (All Read this one)

    "Prophet" wrote:
    "cogitans" wrote:
    That is the first article I've read since FA began that gave a little bit of information that was at a more solid level than the ballboy's cousin's friend.
    If they targeted four and got three of the four and the only one they didn't get, yet, is Curtis, they are meeting their objectives well.
    Will it work, I have no idea.

    ..."Out of the four guys we targeted," Vikings vice president of player personnel Rick Spielman said, "we landed three."...

    ...The fourth is receiver Kevin Curtis...

    ..."Out of the receivers out there, what he brings to our offense, he does extremely well," Spielman said. "Sometimes, as you build this roster, it's our job to bring in players that fit the schemes that we're running. Maybe in another scheme, he doesn't fit as well."

    Spielman described Wade as the "next-best option" to Curtis, who apparently received an impressive offer from the Vikings...
    Spielman still makes me nervous, but at least this article tells some of the rational behind the moves.
    no doubt prophet.
    i live in florida and his track record down here was not exactly stellar.
    and geez, his quotes weren't exactly inspiring.
    couldnt he have blown a little bit more smoke up our butts and make us think bobby wade is gonna turn into the next jerry rice.
    and by the sound of that article it sounds like were done unless some trade comes up which is more than likely to happen around draft time.
    so that was our free agent period.
    anybody have a grade to give it?
    LET THAT WHICH DOES NOT MATTER, TRULY SLIDE

  10. #30
    cajunvike's Avatar
    cajunvike is offline Jersey Retired
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    32,063

    Re: It's Their Plan, And They're Sticking To It (All Read this one)

    "Caine" wrote:


    "So, am I really upset by the Vikings lack of activity in Free Agency?
    Only in the receiver area.
    A handful of "Better than we have now" receivers were avaialable...we got none of them.
    Other than that, not really.
    There wasn't anyone out there worth getting excited about."

    Caine
    I fully agree with the above statements...we should have gotten at least ONE of those guys!
    Oh yeah...and Donnie Edwards!
    BANNED OR DEAD...I'LL TAKE EITHER ONE

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