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  1. #11
    C Mac D's Avatar
    C Mac D is offline Posting to P'own
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    Re: Can anyone see us trading up in the draft?

    No
    Disclaimer: I'm an idiot.

  2. #12
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re: Can anyone see us trading up in the draft?

    "HEY" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Our needs are DE, S, DT, LB, RB with a possible selection of WR, QB, TE or FB depending on how the draft falls.
    OK... I get that our needs are at DE and S, but you're way off when you say that our needs are DT, LB, and in particularly RB.

    We drafted AD last year for God sake! And Taylor is maby the best backup there is in the NFC. Our LBs are one the most underrated and we have the best pair of DTs in the league. Shure, Pat is getting old, but still, there are much bigger needs.
    Here's our needs in order (IMO)
    WR
    DE
    S
    QB
    TE
    OL
    CB
    DT
    LB
    FB
    RB
    OK, I'll play along.

    I am gonna make a wild guess that most of the areas we disagree (i.e. RB, DT etc) are in the areas you believe we have good starters at so you don't worry about them or the guys that rotate in and out when they get tired (see your quoted comments).

    We drafted AD last year for God sake! And Taylor is maby the best backup there is in the NFC. Our LBs are one the most underrated and we have the best pair of DTs in the league. Shure, Pat is getting old, but still, there are much bigger needs
    Regardless, my draft priorities are based on a few things but mostly center whether or not thier is an actual roster spot (I.e. replacement for Memo) for the kid to make the team and not because I don't like the current starters at that position.

    Your order with my reasons they won't/will draft that guy in that order:

    WR - Already have two young talented WR's on the roster and only one roster spot open (the one Twill vacated).
    Are you telling me they will waste thier number one pick on a guy that there isn't even a roster spot for?
    I guess you figure that this staff will let Ferg walk as a FA and we will go into the season with only B-wade as a experienced Vet on the roster.
    Guess thats were we differ
    DE - I am torn here.
    I believe that this draft is extremely deep with DE's and the staff will sign a FA DE making this easier spot to fill with a talented guy in the second or 3rd round.


    S - I have this as our biggest need.
    We currently are looking at 3 of 5 S leaving leaving the team with no clear indication the team intends to sign either of the 2 FA's.
    Even if they add a Vet FA and sign either Tank or Doss we are still one short.
    That means a open roster spot that isn't filled.
    That means a need to me.
    QB - We don't need a starting QB, we have TJ.
    Do you really think they are gonna waste a first day pick on a QB that will just sit on the bench?
    They will draft a guy but it won't be until after the 5th or 6th round and after they have addressed all the other positions that have actual vacancies on them.
    TE - Again, here is a roster spot you are trying to fix because you don't like who is currently on the roster.
    Tell me my friend, who leaves so that you can open up a roster position for your TE?
    OL - As with TE, you appear to believe we need a upgrade here because you don't like who is currently on the roster.
    In fact if you look closely at the starters, all but one are signed to large, longterm contracts and we seem to be set with a viable backup at C, and at least one rookie backup OT that we don't know to much about other than he was highly ranked coming out of college.
    Give me a reason on who goes here in the OL and who you draft to replace him.
    CB - Agree with you that we need to replace a guy leaving. Do you know who that is by the way.
    DT - Why do you have this so low?
    We currently have 3 DT's under contract and a open hole in an area that not only has a aging vet playing (Pat Pat) but another Vet (Kevin) who seems to have shown a droppoff in production over the last 3 years.
    I consider this a huge need, especially when none of the 3 currently on the roster seem to be able to collapse the pocket in passing situations.
    LB - Again, why so low when we have several backups leaving?
    Seems you don't realize that just because we have 3 good starters the other guys play important roles as well.
    FB - Agree with you here.
    FB isn't as big a need as some think.
    I really believe this staff wants to get Mills on the field and he is a bit small to play TE in this scheme.
    He will be worked at FB this year and will take T-richs spot.
    RB - Again, just because we have CT and AD we still carry a third back.
    He can/will come in and get reps on ST's and will also learn behind two of the best.
    By the way, what happens if either CT or AD go down and we don't have a another RB standing in the wings ready to go.
    Deep class at RB with lots of talent, draft one on the second day as a project, ST's/backup.

    Current FA's that might not be on the roster next year. (9 if your counting)
    S Doss
    WR Ferguson
    RB Moore
    FB Richardson
    S Williams,Tank
    LB Thomas
    CB Whitaker
    DT Johnson
    DE Scott


    Released/traded/injury/illness (4 if your counting)
    James
    Udeze
    Williamson
    Smith
    9 + 4 = 13.
    We only have 8 draft picks.
    Everyone needs to be used wisely to ensure we get a quality player for all the positions that will have vacancies.

    My order (Note:
    I am still leaning towards S in the first round but have been second guessing that a bit).
    1. DE (Keneche, James, Scott plus poor production overall from unit in QB pressure)
    2. S (Smith, Doss, Williamson plus Sharper isn't getting any younger)
    3a. DT (Loss of Johnson plus need to upgrade with a guy who can collapse the pocket.
    Even if that doesn't convince you, go back and watch tape on how many times K-will and Phat Pat rotate out.)
    3b. LB
    (Thomas needs to be replaced.
    Could be Rufus but Heath Farwell is also a RFA.
    Could leave to a team if Vikes don't match offer.
    Even with Rufus coming back from injury we have one opening)
    (Note:
    Again, 4 through 7 I don't really care what order as long as they take a guy of value that fits the scheme)
    4. RB (Memo leaves a roster position)
    5. QB (They will draft a Thygpen kindof guy someplace late in the draft)
    6. S (Grecox has convinced me they will draft 2 S's)
    7. CB (Whitakers replacement)

    WR (No one will get drafted here unless they don't sign a FA or if Fergy leaves)
    TE (To many on the roster that are either under contract or fit the scheme.
    No one will get drafted unless the staff somehow decides to change the scheme and look for somebody else and pooh cans the guys on the roster and takes the associated CAP hit in the process).
    FB (No one gets drafted in this positions.
    T-rich will be replaced by Mills.
    Staff likes a TE/FB kindof H-back guy that can catch, run and block vice the traditional blocking FB.)

    Use FA money on a VET WR (Twills spot) and resign Ferg, DE, S, and if there is enough money, a QB to replace either Brooks or KH and use the other slot for the rookie.

    Your turn.
    You tell me why you want them to draft the way you do and make sure you give me a valid roster position for the guy drafted.
    Only silly GM's waste valuable draft picks on guys that won't make the roster.

    ;D
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  3. #13
    thepacksux's Avatar
    thepacksux is offline Asst. Coach
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    Re: Can anyone see us trading up in the draft?

    I would say probably not.
    This draft is filled with good players but not too many blue chip prospects worth trading up for.
    I could see us moving into the top half of the second round but not higher in the first.

  4. #14
    kevoncox's Avatar
    kevoncox is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Can anyone see us trading up in the draft?

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Or..........

    We could just address our needs during the draft with the picks we have.

    Comeon guys, there is value in every round if your scouting staff does thier jobs.
    Last year we got several of our players in rounds below were they were slated to go becuase the scouts and front office did their jobs.

    They found guys that had minor issues with respect to production or off field issues, knew what the teams ahead of them were gonna do and worked the board to our advantage.
    That is how a draft is supposed to work.

    Teams like the Saints who go out and give it up for a player or two (ala Ricky) are teh guys who get worked by guys like Rick Spielman.

    Our needs are DE, S, DT, LB, RB with a possible selection of WR, QB, TE or FB depending on how the draft falls.

    If the staff drafts wisely they will draft good players that will fill vacancies on the roster and won't reach for players of need.
    Simply ludicrous to believe other wise.
    It isn't this staffs track record.

    Check out my comment in the "Is there anyone in the draft you would be happy if we traded up and got" thread.
    I get on the soap box a bit more in that one.
    Marr -
    Always looking for a bargin. The issue with that is they type of draft we had last year is rare. We have 2 many picks and not enough spots.
    With 8 or 9 picks this year. Selecting all these guys and cutting most of them ( or worse putting them on a practice squad only to get signed by someone else) doesn't make sense. We are a team that is rounding the corner. We need to be more agressive in getting the superstar talents we need. Sitting and hoping somone falls to you did not work so well when we needed a Qb. Why would we continue to use that method? We don't need 8 solid players, we need about 3 great ones and 2 solid ones.

    Give up a 3rd and 6th.

  5. #15
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    Re: Can anyone see us trading up in the draft?

    I can't see us moving up but it would be nice to see Kenny Phlips come here

  6. #16
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    Re: Can anyone see us trading up in the draft?

    If we could trade up to snab Gholston somehow i would be all for it, otherwise probably not.

  7. #17
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re: Can anyone see us trading up in the draft?

    "kevoncox" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Or..........

    We could just address our needs during the draft with the picks we have.

    Comeon guys, there is value in every round if your scouting staff does thier jobs.
    Last year we got several of our players in rounds below were they were slated to go becuase the scouts and front office did their jobs.

    They found guys that had minor issues with respect to production or off field issues, knew what the teams ahead of them were gonna do and worked the board to our advantage.
    That is how a draft is supposed to work.

    Teams like the Saints who go out and give it up for a player or two (ala Ricky) are teh guys who get worked by guys like Rick Spielman.

    Our needs are DE, S, DT, LB, RB with a possible selection of WR, QB, TE or FB depending on how the draft falls.

    If the staff drafts wisely they will draft good players that will fill vacancies on the roster and won't reach for players of need.
    Simply ludicrous to believe other wise.
    It isn't this staffs track record.

    Check out my comment in the "Is there anyone in the draft you would be happy if we traded up and got" thread.
    I get on the soap box a bit more in that one.
    Marr -
    Always looking for a bargin. The issue with that is they type of draft we had last year is rare. We have 2 many picks and not enough spots.
    With 8 or 9 picks this year. Selecting all these guys and cutting most of them ( or worse putting them on a practice squad only to get signed by someone else) doesn't make sense. We are a team that is rounding the corner. We need to be more agressive in getting the superstar talents we need. Sitting and hoping somone falls to you did not work so well when we needed a Qb. Why would we continue to use that method? We don't need 8 solid players, we need about 3 great ones and 2 solid ones.

    Give up a 3rd and 6th.
    You need to do your homework my friend.
    Counting the guys that are UFA (9) RFA (1) and possible cuts/sick/injured (4) we have 14 roster openings.

    Not sure how you believe we won't have roster spots for every pick this year.
    In fact, if we don't use every pick and tried to fill the other spots with CAP via FA pickups there wouldn't be enough money to go around for that.

    UFA



    (9)
    T-rich
    Memo
    Ferg
    Spencer
    Darrion
    Dontarrious
    Ronyell
    Tank
    Doss

    RFA




    (1)
    Farwell

    Sick/cut/injured
    (4)
    T-will
    KH
    Keneche
    James

    9 + 1 + 4 = 14.


    Go ahead.
    Keep thinking the right answer is to make an arm chair QB trade, however, I will continue to say that it is wise to use all your picks and spend wisely in FA to ensure you have replacements at all positions.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  8. #18
    i_bleed_purple's Avatar
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    Re: Can anyone see us trading up in the draft?

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "kevoncox" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Or..........

    We could just address our needs during the draft with the picks we have.

    Comeon guys, there is value in every round if your scouting staff does thier jobs.
    Last year we got several of our players in rounds below were they were slated to go becuase the scouts and front office did their jobs.

    They found guys that had minor issues with respect to production or off field issues, knew what the teams ahead of them were gonna do and worked the board to our advantage.
    That is how a draft is supposed to work.

    Teams like the Saints who go out and give it up for a player or two (ala Ricky) are teh guys who get worked by guys like Rick Spielman.

    Our needs are DE, S, DT, LB, RB with a possible selection of WR, QB, TE or FB depending on how the draft falls.

    If the staff drafts wisely they will draft good players that will fill vacancies on the roster and won't reach for players of need.
    Simply ludicrous to believe other wise.
    It isn't this staffs track record.

    Check out my comment in the "Is there anyone in the draft you would be happy if we traded up and got" thread.
    I get on the soap box a bit more in that one.
    Marr -
    Always looking for a bargin. The issue with that is they type of draft we had last year is rare. We have 2 many picks and not enough spots.
    With 8 or 9 picks this year. Selecting all these guys and cutting most of them ( or worse putting them on a practice squad only to get signed by someone else) doesn't make sense. We are a team that is rounding the corner. We need to be more agressive in getting the superstar talents we need. Sitting and hoping somone falls to you did not work so well when we needed a Qb. Why would we continue to use that method? We don't need 8 solid players, we need about 3 great ones and 2 solid ones.

    Give up a 3rd and 6th.
    You need to do your homework my friend.
    Counting the guys that are UFA (9) RFA (1) and possible cuts/sick/injured (4) we have 14 roster openings.

    Not sure how you believe we won't have roster spots for every pick this year.
    In fact, if we don't use every pick and tried to fill the other spots with CAP via FA pickups there wouldn't be enough money to go around for that.

    UFA



    (9)
    T-rich
    Memo
    Ferg
    Spencer
    Darrion
    Dontarrious
    Ronyell
    Tank
    Doss

    RFA




    (1)
    Farwell

    Sick/cut/injured
    (4)
    T-will
    KH
    Keneche
    James

    9 + 1 + 4 = 14.


    Go ahead.
    Keep thinking the right answer is to make an arm chair QB trade, however, I will continue to say that it is wise to use all your picks and spend wisely in FA to ensure you have replacements at all positions.
    In al lfairness, you and I both konw that some of these guys will be back next year.
    I'm thinking mabye Richardson, Ferguson and Mabye even Darrion Scott WIll be back.
    Farwell has already recieved a high tender, which probably won't be matched.

    that leaves 10 spots.

    Now are you telling me that they are not going to sign ANY free agents??
    highly doubtfull.
    I expect at least 3 free agent signings, probably more, whether it be starters or backups.

    that leaves 7 spots for 9 picks.
    A few guys drafted will not make the team, and you and I both know that.

  9. #19
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re: Can anyone see us trading up in the draft?

    "i_bleed_purple" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "kevoncox" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Or..........

    We could just address our needs during the draft with the picks we have.

    Comeon guys, there is value in every round if your scouting staff does thier jobs.
    Last year we got several of our players in rounds below were they were slated to go becuase the scouts and front office did their jobs.

    They found guys that had minor issues with respect to production or off field issues, knew what the teams ahead of them were gonna do and worked the board to our advantage.
    That is how a draft is supposed to work.

    Teams like the Saints who go out and give it up for a player or two (ala Ricky) are teh guys who get worked by guys like Rick Spielman.

    Our needs are DE, S, DT, LB, RB with a possible selection of WR, QB, TE or FB depending on how the draft falls.

    If the staff drafts wisely they will draft good players that will fill vacancies on the roster and won't reach for players of need.
    Simply ludicrous to believe other wise.
    It isn't this staffs track record.

    Check out my comment in the "Is there anyone in the draft you would be happy if we traded up and got" thread.
    I get on the soap box a bit more in that one.
    Marr -
    Always looking for a bargin. The issue with that is they type of draft we had last year is rare. We have 2 many picks and not enough spots.
    With 8 or 9 picks this year. Selecting all these guys and cutting most of them ( or worse putting them on a practice squad only to get signed by someone else) doesn't make sense. We are a team that is rounding the corner. We need to be more agressive in getting the superstar talents we need. Sitting and hoping somone falls to you did not work so well when we needed a Qb. Why would we continue to use that method? We don't need 8 solid players, we need about 3 great ones and 2 solid ones.

    Give up a 3rd and 6th.
    You need to do your homework my friend.
    Counting the guys that are UFA (9) RFA (1) and possible cuts/sick/injured (4) we have 14 roster openings.

    Not sure how you believe we won't have roster spots for every pick this year.
    In fact, if we don't use every pick and tried to fill the other spots with CAP via FA pickups there wouldn't be enough money to go around for that.

    UFA




    (9)
    T-rich
    Memo
    Ferg
    Spencer
    Darrion
    Dontarrious
    Ronyell
    Tank
    Doss

    RFA





    (1)
    Farwell

    Sick/cut/injured
    (4)
    T-will
    KH
    Keneche
    James

    9 + 1 + 4 = 14.


    Go ahead.
    Keep thinking the right answer is to make an arm chair QB trade, however, I will continue to say that it is wise to use all your picks and spend wisely in FA to ensure you have replacements at all positions.
    In al lfairness, you and I both konw that some of these guys will be back next year.
    I'm thinking mabye Richardson, Ferguson and Mabye even Darrion Scott WIll be back.
    Farwell has already recieved a high tender, which probably won't be matched.

    that leaves 10 spots.

    Now are you telling me that they are not going to sign ANY free agents??
    highly doubtfull.
    I expect at least 3 free agent signings, probably more, whether it be starters or backups.

    that leaves 7 spots for 9 picks.
    A few guys drafted will not make the team, and you and I both know that.
    T-rich was released today my friend.

    Darion Scott wasn't happy with the staffs decision last year, he is coming off an injury and thier is a wide open FA market were he can get his money.
    He won't be back unless he isn't healed, and if that is the case, we don't need him.

    I can see Ferg coming back.

    Spencer Johnson is to small to play the 3 Gap Techniques so he will be gone, unless of course they elect to keep him and play him at LDE.
    To me, he is a bit to slow to do that so I don't see that happening.

    Comeon my friend.
    You are probably one of the guys who kept telling me that Smith wasn't going anywere as well.
    ;D
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  10. #20
    V-Unit's Avatar
    V-Unit is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Can anyone see us trading up in the draft?

    I hope we trade. We won't. Maybe Late rounders.

    I see picks in the 6th and 7th rounds as pretty much worthless. If we packaged them to move into the 4th/5th round every year, I would never complain.
    "I hate when threads are destroyed by facts and logic."
    - Prophet


    Thanks Josdin!

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