Thread: Brohm

"Marrdro" wrote:

"V" wrote:

It has nothing to do with the school you came from or your style of play. The point is that Brohm has been labeled "NFL Ready" by scouts around the league. Yes, they could be dead wrong, but guys like Flacco, Henne, Booty, and Johnson certainly are not receiving that label. If you want to go with the value pick with big upside I can understand that, but I want the sure thing.

Is Brohm worth pick 17 right now? No, but if Harvey is gone, and our FO is confident in Robison, Edwards, and Cook, and McKinnie is given a chance to smooth things over, (Yes, that is a lot of ifs), Brohm makes a lot of sense.

This idea that I think TJ is a flop is ridiculous. Every scenario I have talked about this offseason involves TJ as the starting QB. I am talking about the future of our franchise. I have also said that if Brohm is our best option at 17, we should trade down before taking him.

Frankly, I'm sick of defending my stance. It's time for you guys to take it for what it is, respect it, and make strong points against it. Take a deep breath and read well.

TJ is on the right path to becoming a solid NFL QB. If he continues at this rate, he should be our franchise QB by midseason next year. However, one problem we had last year was when TJ struggled. He showed inconsintency, and the fact is we had no one to go to, short or long term, when these troubles started. Taking Brohm would put pressure on TJ, which I believe is a good thing, and give us a long term plan B. If we take Brohm and TJ fails, we will hopefully have another QB ready to start by the start of the 2009 season, A la Young, Leinart, Cutler, Russell, Manning, etc. I do not believe that any other QB in the draft gives us that option other than Matt Ryan, and it would be stupid to trade up for him. Another problem area last year was when TJ got injured. This problem has been addressed by signing Frerotte. He would play, even if we did draft Brohm, if TJ gets hurt. However, Frerotte will not be around forever, and the league is chock full of young backup QBs. If drafting Brohm means not having to sign a new backup QB every year, like we have been doing for the last 3, I am for it.

There are some who believe that TJ's struggles are a result of the play around, him, and not actually TJ himself. Obviously, if you are in that camp, you will never agree with me. I concede that if Harvey and/or Williams is on the board, passing them up for Brohm is not a good choice. However, if you believe that we need a long term backup plan for TJ, I beg you to understand that Brohm is the only one who can fill our needs. We are not in a position to take a chance on another QB. Is there a chance Brohm could flop? Yes, but I would put my money on him over any other QB in the draft any day.

Now, for those that think it is ridiculous to usurp TJ when he has barely gotten a chance to play. Let me just say that if you are more than 60% sure that TJ is the answer, there is no need to draft Brohm. In fact I would say there is no reason to draft QB at all. What's the point in drafting a QB when he is going to sit on the becnh for 10 years? I would rather do what the Chiefs did, and get a rookie FA as our 3rd QB. I myself am 50/50 on TJ. Even if you disagree with that, you have to admit that if TJ fails, we will need a different answer at QB, and we will need that answer FAST.

Now, if Brohm is our BPA at 17, I think the best choice would be trade down to around 22 take somebody like Cherilus, Groves, or Merling, and hopefully get back into the high second round to still take Brohm.

I think that is all I have to say. Seeing as it is 3 am, forgive me if I add to this later. Let me make one thing certain before I go. This is less about my questions on TJ and more about my certainty on Brohm. If you have any doubts about TJ, I just don't think Henne, Flacco, Booty, Johnson, etc will silence those worries. There are two NFL Ready QBs in this draft and Brohm is the only one within our reach.

So let me see if I can read between the lines here as you seem to be beating around the bush a little (JK
;D)

Excellent post, but I still have one issue with your stance and that is based around your arguement that Brohm is NFL ready now when in fact, very few scouts say that at all.
Infact very few scouts say that Ryan is NFL read at this point.

If either of them were NFL ready they would be going number 1 to a team that needs a NFL ready QB (and we all know there are a few of them in this draft) and the other would go shortly after him somplace in the top 10.

The fact of the matter is the top rated QB just might not go in the top 5 let alone even in the top 10 (if the Ravens opt for one of those project QB's you mention).

There are two NFL Ready QBs in this draft and Brohm is the only one within our reach.

Again, love your post and all your points.
I just don't agree with you that Brohm is NFL ready right now.

But Mar maybe certain teams just have a scouting department that sees something we can't, much like the Viking's medical staff finding that AP was actually healthy unlike everybody else.
;D

"Schutz" wrote:

"Marrdro" wrote:

"V" wrote:

It has nothing to do with the school you came from or your style of play. The point is that Brohm has been labeled "NFL Ready" by scouts around the league. Yes, they could be dead wrong, but guys like Flacco, Henne, Booty, and Johnson certainly are not receiving that label. If you want to go with the value pick with big upside I can understand that, but I want the sure thing.

Is Brohm worth pick 17 right now? No, but if Harvey is gone, and our FO is confident in Robison, Edwards, and Cook, and McKinnie is given a chance to smooth things over, (Yes, that is a lot of ifs), Brohm makes a lot of sense.

This idea that I think TJ is a flop is ridiculous. Every scenario I have talked about this offseason involves TJ as the starting QB. I am talking about the future of our franchise. I have also said that if Brohm is our best option at 17, we should trade down before taking him.

Frankly, I'm sick of defending my stance. It's time for you guys to take it for what it is, respect it, and make strong points against it. Take a deep breath and read well.

TJ is on the right path to becoming a solid NFL QB. If he continues at this rate, he should be our franchise QB by midseason next year. However, one problem we had last year was when TJ struggled. He showed inconsintency, and the fact is we had no one to go to, short or long term, when these troubles started. Taking Brohm would put pressure on TJ, which I believe is a good thing, and give us a long term plan B. If we take Brohm and TJ fails, we will hopefully have another QB ready to start by the start of the 2009 season, A la Young, Leinart, Cutler, Russell, Manning, etc. I do not believe that any other QB in the draft gives us that option other than Matt Ryan, and it would be stupid to trade up for him. Another problem area last year was when TJ got injured. This problem has been addressed by signing Frerotte. He would play, even if we did draft Brohm, if TJ gets hurt. However, Frerotte will not be around forever, and the league is chock full of young backup QBs. If drafting Brohm means not having to sign a new backup QB every year, like we have been doing for the last 3, I am for it.

There are some who believe that TJ's struggles are a result of the play around, him, and not actually TJ himself. Obviously, if you are in that camp, you will never agree with me. I concede that if Harvey and/or Williams is on the board, passing them up for Brohm is not a good choice. However, if you believe that we need a long term backup plan for TJ, I beg you to understand that Brohm is the only one who can fill our needs. We are not in a position to take a chance on another QB. Is there a chance Brohm could flop? Yes, but I would put my money on him over any other QB in the draft any day.

Now, for those that think it is ridiculous to usurp TJ when he has barely gotten a chance to play. Let me just say that if you are more than 60% sure that TJ is the answer, there is no need to draft Brohm. In fact I would say there is no reason to draft QB at all. What's the point in drafting a QB when he is going to sit on the becnh for 10 years? I would rather do what the Chiefs did, and get a rookie FA as our 3rd QB. I myself am 50/50 on TJ. Even if you disagree with that, you have to admit that if TJ fails, we will need a different answer at QB, and we will need that answer FAST.

Now, if Brohm is our BPA at 17, I think the best choice would be trade down to around 22 take somebody like Cherilus, Groves, or Merling, and hopefully get back into the high second round to still take Brohm.

I think that is all I have to say. Seeing as it is 3 am, forgive me if I add to this later. Let me make one thing certain before I go. This is less about my questions on TJ and more about my certainty on Brohm. If you have any doubts about TJ, I just don't think Henne, Flacco, Booty, Johnson, etc will silence those worries. There are two NFL Ready QBs in this draft and Brohm is the only one within our reach.

So let me see if I can read between the lines here as you seem to be beating around the bush a little (JK
;D)

Excellent post, but I still have one issue with your stance and that is based around your arguement that Brohm is NFL ready now when in fact, very few scouts say that at all.
Infact very few scouts say that Ryan is NFL read at this point.

If either of them were NFL ready they would be going number 1 to a team that needs a NFL ready QB (and we all know there are a few of them in this draft) and the other would go shortly after him somplace in the top 10.

The fact of the matter is the top rated QB just might not go in the top 5 let alone even in the top 10 (if the Ravens opt for one of those project QB's you mention).

There are two NFL Ready QBs in this draft and Brohm is the only one within our reach.

Again, love your post and all your points.
I just don't agree with you that Brohm is NFL ready right now.

But Mar maybe certain teams just have a scouting department that sees something we can't, much like the Viking's medical staff finding that AP was actually healthy unlike everybody else.
;D

What do they see that we can't?
I see a crop of QB in this class that all have some sort of problem that will take time to fix at the next level.
That equates to "Not NFL Ready" in my book.

No thank you.
We already have one of them starting now.
Get one in the later rounds, develop him for the future and if the current project fails (I don't think he will anymore) move on to the new guy.

By the way.....Well played.
;D

"Marrdro" wrote:

"Schutz" wrote:

"Marrdro" wrote:

"V" wrote:

It has nothing to do with the school you came from or your style of play. The point is that Brohm has been labeled "NFL Ready" by scouts around the league. Yes, they could be dead wrong, but guys like Flacco, Henne, Booty, and Johnson certainly are not receiving that label. If you want to go with the value pick with big upside I can understand that, but I want the sure thing.

Is Brohm worth pick 17 right now? No, but if Harvey is gone, and our FO is confident in Robison, Edwards, and Cook, and McKinnie is given a chance to smooth things over, (Yes, that is a lot of ifs), Brohm makes a lot of sense.

This idea that I think TJ is a flop is ridiculous. Every scenario I have talked about this offseason involves TJ as the starting QB. I am talking about the future of our franchise. I have also said that if Brohm is our best option at 17, we should trade down before taking him.

Frankly, I'm sick of defending my stance. It's time for you guys to take it for what it is, respect it, and make strong points against it. Take a deep breath and read well.

TJ is on the right path to becoming a solid NFL QB. If he continues at this rate, he should be our franchise QB by midseason next year. However, one problem we had last year was when TJ struggled. He showed inconsintency, and the fact is we had no one to go to, short or long term, when these troubles started. Taking Brohm would put pressure on TJ, which I believe is a good thing, and give us a long term plan B. If we take Brohm and TJ fails, we will hopefully have another QB ready to start by the start of the 2009 season, A la Young, Leinart, Cutler, Russell, Manning, etc. I do not believe that any other QB in the draft gives us that option other than Matt Ryan, and it would be stupid to trade up for him. Another problem area last year was when TJ got injured. This problem has been addressed by signing Frerotte. He would play, even if we did draft Brohm, if TJ gets hurt. However, Frerotte will not be around forever, and the league is chock full of young backup QBs. If drafting Brohm means not having to sign a new backup QB every year, like we have been doing for the last 3, I am for it.

There are some who believe that TJ's struggles are a result of the play around, him, and not actually TJ himself. Obviously, if you are in that camp, you will never agree with me. I concede that if Harvey and/or Williams is on the board, passing them up for Brohm is not a good choice. However, if you believe that we need a long term backup plan for TJ, I beg you to understand that Brohm is the only one who can fill our needs. We are not in a position to take a chance on another QB. Is there a chance Brohm could flop? Yes, but I would put my money on him over any other QB in the draft any day.

Now, for those that think it is ridiculous to usurp TJ when he has barely gotten a chance to play. Let me just say that if you are more than 60% sure that TJ is the answer, there is no need to draft Brohm. In fact I would say there is no reason to draft QB at all. What's the point in drafting a QB when he is going to sit on the becnh for 10 years? I would rather do what the Chiefs did, and get a rookie FA as our 3rd QB. I myself am 50/50 on TJ. Even if you disagree with that, you have to admit that if TJ fails, we will need a different answer at QB, and we will need that answer FAST.

Now, if Brohm is our BPA at 17, I think the best choice would be trade down to around 22 take somebody like Cherilus, Groves, or Merling, and hopefully get back into the high second round to still take Brohm.

I think that is all I have to say. Seeing as it is 3 am, forgive me if I add to this later. Let me make one thing certain before I go. This is less about my questions on TJ and more about my certainty on Brohm. If you have any doubts about TJ, I just don't think Henne, Flacco, Booty, Johnson, etc will silence those worries. There are two NFL Ready QBs in this draft and Brohm is the only one within our reach.

So let me see if I can read between the lines here as you seem to be beating around the bush a little (JK
;D)

Excellent post, but I still have one issue with your stance and that is based around your arguement that Brohm is NFL ready now when in fact, very few scouts say that at all.
Infact very few scouts say that Ryan is NFL read at this point.

If either of them were NFL ready they would be going number 1 to a team that needs a NFL ready QB (and we all know there are a few of them in this draft) and the other would go shortly after him somplace in the top 10.

The fact of the matter is the top rated QB just might not go in the top 5 let alone even in the top 10 (if the Ravens opt for one of those project QB's you mention).

There are two NFL Ready QBs in this draft and Brohm is the only one within our reach.

Again, love your post and all your points.
I just don't agree with you that Brohm is NFL ready right now.

But Mar maybe certain teams just have a scouting department that sees something we can't, much like the Viking's medical staff finding that AP was actually healthy unlike everybody else.
;D

What do they see that we can't? I see a crop of QB in this class that all have some sort of problem that will take time to fix at the next level.
That equates to "Not NFL Ready" in my book.

No thank you.
We already have one of them starting now.
Get one in the later rounds, develop him for the future and if the current project fails (I don't think he will anymore) move on to the new guy.

By the way.....Well played.
;D

How do they say that? "If they told you thy would have to kill you" ;D ;D

I would pass on Brohm, although he did put up numbers he is a good college QB, he lacks arm strength, mobility and the ability to recognize what the defense is doing quickly and adjust on the fly that you need to excel in the NFL.

there will be a slim to none chance that we get him if we get Jared Allen

"Marrdro" wrote:

"Schutz" wrote:

"Marrdro" wrote:

"V" wrote:

It has nothing to do with the school you came from or your style of play. The point is that Brohm has been labeled "NFL Ready" by scouts around the league. Yes, they could be dead wrong, but guys like Flacco, Henne, Booty, and Johnson certainly are not receiving that label. If you want to go with the value pick with big upside I can understand that, but I want the sure thing.

Is Brohm worth pick 17 right now? No, but if Harvey is gone, and our FO is confident in Robison, Edwards, and Cook, and McKinnie is given a chance to smooth things over, (Yes, that is a lot of ifs), Brohm makes a lot of sense.

This idea that I think TJ is a flop is ridiculous. Every scenario I have talked about this offseason involves TJ as the starting QB. I am talking about the future of our franchise. I have also said that if Brohm is our best option at 17, we should trade down before taking him.

Frankly, I'm sick of defending my stance. It's time for you guys to take it for what it is, respect it, and make strong points against it. Take a deep breath and read well.

TJ is on the right path to becoming a solid NFL QB. If he continues at this rate, he should be our franchise QB by midseason next year. However, one problem we had last year was when TJ struggled. He showed inconsintency, and the fact is we had no one to go to, short or long term, when these troubles started. Taking Brohm would put pressure on TJ, which I believe is a good thing, and give us a long term plan B. If we take Brohm and TJ fails, we will hopefully have another QB ready to start by the start of the 2009 season, A la Young, Leinart, Cutler, Russell, Manning, etc. I do not believe that any other QB in the draft gives us that option other than Matt Ryan, and it would be stupid to trade up for him. Another problem area last year was when TJ got injured. This problem has been addressed by signing Frerotte. He would play, even if we did draft Brohm, if TJ gets hurt. However, Frerotte will not be around forever, and the league is chock full of young backup QBs. If drafting Brohm means not having to sign a new backup QB every year, like we have been doing for the last 3, I am for it.

There are some who believe that TJ's struggles are a result of the play around, him, and not actually TJ himself. Obviously, if you are in that camp, you will never agree with me. I concede that if Harvey and/or Williams is on the board, passing them up for Brohm is not a good choice. However, if you believe that we need a long term backup plan for TJ, I beg you to understand that Brohm is the only one who can fill our needs. We are not in a position to take a chance on another QB. Is there a chance Brohm could flop? Yes, but I would put my money on him over any other QB in the draft any day.

Now, for those that think it is ridiculous to usurp TJ when he has barely gotten a chance to play. Let me just say that if you are more than 60% sure that TJ is the answer, there is no need to draft Brohm. In fact I would say there is no reason to draft QB at all. What's the point in drafting a QB when he is going to sit on the becnh for 10 years? I would rather do what the Chiefs did, and get a rookie FA as our 3rd QB. I myself am 50/50 on TJ. Even if you disagree with that, you have to admit that if TJ fails, we will need a different answer at QB, and we will need that answer FAST.

Now, if Brohm is our BPA at 17, I think the best choice would be trade down to around 22 take somebody like Cherilus, Groves, or Merling, and hopefully get back into the high second round to still take Brohm.

I think that is all I have to say. Seeing as it is 3 am, forgive me if I add to this later. Let me make one thing certain before I go. This is less about my questions on TJ and more about my certainty on Brohm. If you have any doubts about TJ, I just don't think Henne, Flacco, Booty, Johnson, etc will silence those worries. There are two NFL Ready QBs in this draft and Brohm is the only one within our reach.

So let me see if I can read between the lines here as you seem to be beating around the bush a little (JK
;D)

Excellent post, but I still have one issue with your stance and that is based around your arguement that Brohm is NFL ready now when in fact, very few scouts say that at all.
Infact very few scouts say that Ryan is NFL read at this point.

If either of them were NFL ready they would be going number 1 to a team that needs a NFL ready QB (and we all know there are a few of them in this draft) and the other would go shortly after him somplace in the top 10.

The fact of the matter is the top rated QB just might not go in the top 5 let alone even in the top 10 (if the Ravens opt for one of those project QB's you mention).

There are two NFL Ready QBs in this draft and Brohm is the only one within our reach.

Again, love your post and all your points.
I just don't agree with you that Brohm is NFL ready right now.

But Mar maybe certain teams just have a scouting department that sees something we can't, much like the Viking's medical staff finding that AP was actually healthy unlike everybody else.
;D

What do they see that we can't?
I see a crop of QB in this class that all have some sort of problem that will take time to fix at the next level.
That equates to "Not NFL Ready" in my book.

No thank you.
We already have one of them starting now.
Get one in the later rounds, develop him for the future and if the current project fails (I don't think he will anymore) move on to the new guy.

By the way.....Well played.

;D

i think nfl ready is the wrong term anyway.
brohm has experience an nfl like offense, but the speed and all the other things that go into the game no young qb can be ready for.
if you use peyton manning as the prime example, chances are he was more ready than any qb that has come outta the draft.
he still threw 29 ints in his rookie season.
the point is, almost all young qbs struggle to some extent.
so even if we went with the theory that tjack fails this year and brohm is our starter in 2009, we are still gonna deal with bad decisions and bumps along the way.
the vikes are a team that is close now, and if they add jared allen they get even closer.
so to me if tjack fails, chances are we are gonna try to get a veteran qb who can lead this team now, not take a step back and wait for another young guy to develop.
that's my guess.


like i said if they like em that much and he's around in the 2nd, okay, but i'd have no problem drafting one of the other guys a little later and let them develop and see what we got in em.
hopefully this is all moot and we dont have a first rounder to even worry about this, but i still think it's too early to draft a guy who is not the future at that position, at least right now he wouldn't be.
that pick would have to be used on a guy tht contribute for us right now cuz we are not that good where we can use picks on promise alone, in my opinion.