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  1. #11
    Marrdro's Avatar
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    Re: 2012 NFL Mock Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by "b_sandhar_29" #1090770
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1090769
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1090625
    I, for one, don't think we will be drafting in the top half of the 2012 draft.

    I also don't think we will be draft a QB in the first round of the 2012 draft.

    Rationale, I think we go out and compete with the likes of the Titans, Cards and 49rs and get either Marc Bulger or a Matt Hassleback as a stop gap for the kid we draft this year to learn behind for a year or two.

    Then we will watch that kid muck through a couple of years of growing pains on the field.
    If we don't draft a first round guy this year, I don't want to draft a QB at all. No sense at all drafting some crap player who has less than a 5% chance of being a great player. I'd rather wait for someone real. That's why I wanted us to go after McCoy so badly last year. He's a guy we could have gotten in the second, I wouldn't even be upset about first, who we could sit behind Favre, let him start this year and see how he goes. He did pretty damn well this season, despite being a rookie, AND a Brown.

    I don't want to keep dealing with crap QB's. We have Webb, stick with him unless we get a vet or a top QB in the draft.
    Exactly I'm tired of projects and guys off the street. I think we should stick with Webb give him a full season to showcase his talents. If our season is a downer we're in position for a top notch QB Luck hopefully, but if not I'll settle for Barkley.
    Every team has projects at QB. Every team. Problem for us is we had to rely on a project long before he was ready.

    I can't say it enough, if the staff would have kept drafting QB's after we drafted Pepp, we wouldn't be in the mess we were in in 2006. We would have had atleast 2 QB's with time/experience on the bench and wouldn't have had to run a rook out there.
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  2. #12
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    Re: 2012 NFL Mock Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1090771
    Yep. No QB we pick in rounds 3-7 will be better than Webb right out of the gate. Might as well just use those picks on positions that you CAN get good players in late, and draft next year. I still say we screwed ourselves by not drafting QB early last year.
    Who would have you drafted early last year? McCoy? There is a reason he slipped to the 3rd round. He didn't have 1rst round talent.

    Tebow? We now know he wasn't worth a first round selection. My guess, they will draft another QB high this year and will be looking to either move Tebow to another position or to deal him to a team who can't evaluate QB talent.

    Clausen? Wow, he is even worse than McCoy.

    Surely not Kafka or Skelton.
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  3. #13
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    Re: 2012 NFL Mock Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1090858
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1090771
    Yep. No QB we pick in rounds 3-7 will be better than Webb right out of the gate. Might as well just use those picks on positions that you CAN get good players in late, and draft next year. I still say we screwed ourselves by not drafting QB early last year.
    Who would have you drafted early last year? McCoy? There is a reason he slipped to the 3rd round. He didn't have 1rst round talent.
    I would have taken him in the second. We traded down, but if recall, we somehow ended up with the same, if not fewer draft picks? We did NOT need a RB, we needed a QB. We needed a CB, but could have also went elsewhere with that pick (hell, Best might have even been a better option than Toby IMHO). Or, we trade our second down to early 3rd, pick up a 5th, and still draft McCoy. I'm saying he was there, and I liked his talent. As for saying he didn't have first round talent? That statement is highly subjective. Who says? You? He was high on everyones draft boards, then dropped. Now, yes, we've seen that before (Brian Brohm?), but we've also seen guys like Aaron Rodgers drop from #1 overall to #23 or whatever. Drops happen, and believe it or not, college scouts aren't always right.

    I wasn't a fan of Clausen, and I would have kicked my computer if we drafted Tebow. McCoy on the other hand, I think will be at least a decent NFL starter in a couple years. Probably not a franchise QB, but decent. Better than whoever we have, or anybody available in this years draft.

    Surely not Kafka or Skelton.
    Didn't even consider those guys as options.

    Again, we need a top talent guy, not some mid-round developmental piece...

    I think McCoy in the 3rd was an absolute steal. Browns will be happy with what they got. Panthers are probably kicking themselves as predicted (Look back, I was not a fan of Clausen unless he could be had in the third or so.)

    But again, the numbers don't lie. Every round you wait, the odds of getting a franchise player, or even a good player (QB) drops dramatically.

  4. #14
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    Re: 2012 NFL Mock Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1090858
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1090771
    Yep. No QB we pick in rounds 3-7 will be better than Webb right out of the gate. Might as well just use those picks on positions that you CAN get good players in late, and draft next year. I still say we screwed ourselves by not drafting QB early last year.
    Who would have you drafted early last year? McCoy? There is a reason he slipped to the 3rd round. He didn't have 1rst round talent.

    Tebow? We now know he wasn't worth a first round selection. My guess, they will draft another QB high this year and will be looking to either move Tebow to another position or to deal him to a team who can't evaluate QB talent.

    Clausen? Wow, he is even worse than McCoy.

    Surely not Kafka or Skelton.
    Doesn't really matter gentlemen. The milk was spilled. All we can do now is hope the situation can be rectified. Do not know how that will happen, especially since Denver has decided Orton is their starter and is not available.
    Why must you defend everything this FO does....to the point of making your self look like a yes man.

  5. #15
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    Re: 2012 NFL Mock Draft

    I don't really give a damn about rankings for the 2012 season as you have seen before, you can never predict what is going to go on in an NFL season, let alone a season that might not be played..


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  6. #16
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    Re: 2012 NFL Mock Draft

    @Marshallvike.

    They say he's their starter, but at this point, words mean nothing. I"m willing to bet this is as an effort to raise up his trade value. They'd want more to trade away a starter than a backup. If they said they were shopping Orton, the offers given would be lower than if someone needed to pry away a starter.

  7. #17
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    Re: 2012 NFL Mock Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1090868
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1090858
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1090771
    Yep. No QB we pick in rounds 3-7 will be better than Webb right out of the gate. Might as well just use those picks on positions that you CAN get good players in late, and draft next year. I still say we screwed ourselves by not drafting QB early last year.
    Who would have you drafted early last year? McCoy? There is a reason he slipped to the 3rd round. He didn't have 1rst round talent.
    I would have taken him in the second. We traded down, but if recall, we somehow ended up with the same, if not fewer draft picks? We did NOT need a RB, we needed a QB. We needed a CB, but could have also went elsewhere with that pick (hell, Best might have even been a better option than Toby IMHO). Or, we trade our second down to early 3rd, pick up a 5th, and still draft McCoy. I'm saying he was there, and I liked his talent. As for saying he didn't have first round talent? That statement is highly subjective. Who says? You? He was high on everyones draft boards, then dropped. Now, yes, we've seen that before (Brian Brohm?), but we've also seen guys like Aaron Rodgers drop from #1 overall to #23 or whatever. Drops happen, and believe it or not, college scouts aren't always right.

    I wasn't a fan of Clausen, and I would have kicked my computer if we drafted Tebow. McCoy on the other hand, I think will be at least a decent NFL starter in a couple years. Probably not a franchise QB, but decent. Better than whoever we have, or anybody available in this years draft.

    Surely not Kafka or Skelton.
    Didn't even consider those guys as options.

    Again, we need a top talent guy, not some mid-round developmental piece...

    I think McCoy in the 3rd was an absolute steal. Browns will be happy with what they got. Panthers are probably kicking themselves as predicted (Look back, I was not a fan of Clausen unless he could be had in the third or so.)

    But again, the numbers don't lie. Every round you wait, the odds of getting a franchise player, or even a good player (QB) drops dramatically.
    I did say that I didn't think he was worth a first round pick, but that doesn't count. What counts is that the guys who do this for real didn't waste a first round pick on him. Hell, they didn't waste a second rounder on him either.

    Why do you think your right and they are wrong?

    As to we don't need a RB. What happens if they can't resign AD at the end of the year. Do you want them to draft a rookie and run him out there?

    Not me, I would expect them, like every other staff, to have someone sitting on the bench ready to go. That kid is now Toby.

    On a side note, because they have Toby, they also have a bit of leverage when it comes to trying to resign AD.

    In the end, you don't wait until you have holes and then try to fix them with the draft. Good staffs anticipate those holes and fix them ahead of time.

    Thats why teams that do that are always contenders.
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  8. #18
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    Re: 2012 NFL Mock Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1090902
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1090868
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1090858
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1090771
    Yep. No QB we pick in rounds 3-7 will be better than Webb right out of the gate. Might as well just use those picks on positions that you CAN get good players in late, and draft next year. I still say we screwed ourselves by not drafting QB early last year.
    Who would have you drafted early last year? McCoy? There is a reason he slipped to the 3rd round. He didn't have 1rst round talent.
    I would have taken him in the second. We traded down, but if recall, we somehow ended up with the same, if not fewer draft picks? We did NOT need a RB, we needed a QB. We needed a CB, but could have also went elsewhere with that pick (hell, Best might have even been a better option than Toby IMHO). Or, we trade our second down to early 3rd, pick up a 5th, and still draft McCoy. I'm saying he was there, and I liked his talent. As for saying he didn't have first round talent? That statement is highly subjective. Who says? You? He was high on everyones draft boards, then dropped. Now, yes, we've seen that before (Brian Brohm?), but we've also seen guys like Aaron Rodgers drop from #1 overall to #23 or whatever. Drops happen, and believe it or not, college scouts aren't always right.

    I wasn't a fan of Clausen, and I would have kicked my computer if we drafted Tebow. McCoy on the other hand, I think will be at least a decent NFL starter in a couple years. Probably not a franchise QB, but decent. Better than whoever we have, or anybody available in this years draft.

    Surely not Kafka or Skelton.
    Didn't even consider those guys as options.

    Again, we need a top talent guy, not some mid-round developmental piece...

    I think McCoy in the 3rd was an absolute steal. Browns will be happy with what they got. Panthers are probably kicking themselves as predicted (Look back, I was not a fan of Clausen unless he could be had in the third or so.)

    But again, the numbers don't lie. Every round you wait, the odds of getting a franchise player, or even a good player (QB) drops dramatically.
    I did say that I didn't think he was worth a first round pick, but that doesn't count. What counts is that the guys who do this for real didn't waste a first round pick on him. Hell, they didn't waste a second rounder on him either.

    Why do you think your right and they are wrong?
    It's happened before, it will happen again. Believe it or not, NFL scouts can be, and frequently are wrong. I thought McCoy would be a better player than Clausen, and on a team with no weapons, I was right. Scouts were wrong. I thought Matt Ryan would bust, they were right, I was wrong. I never said I am right, I said I wanted him. That's all. I still wish we got him over Toby.

    As to we don't need a RB. What happens if they can't resign AD at the end of the year. Do you want them to draft a rookie and run him out there?
    UFA RB's this season:
    Deangelo Williams
    Cedric Benson
    Ahmad Bradshaw
    Ronnie Brown
    Joseph Addai
    Ricky Williams
    Darren Sproles
    Leon washington
    Michael Bush
    jerious Norwood
    Laurence Maroney
    Sammy Morris
    Mewelde Moore

    That's a decent crop of UFA RB's available this offseason. If we really didn't think AD was coming back, I'd love to try for Deangelo Williams.

    Either way, I think AD will be back. he's said he'll be back (of course, all depends on how talks go, but he wants to be here).
    Not me, I would expect them, like every other staff, to have someone sitting on the bench ready to go. That kid is now Toby.
    Yes, but you can get a comparable, if not better RB as a FA, or late in the draft. Most teams somehow seem to make a little-known RB work out just fine. Reaching with a second for an OK powerback was not what I have in mind as a starting RB. He's not a dominating power runner like Jacobs, and he's not quick enough to be a versatile back like a guy like Portis was.

    On a side note, because they have Toby, they also have a bit of leverage when it comes to trying to resign AD.
    Yeah, AD will say "Yeah, you're going to start Toby if I don't agree to your low offer? Good luck, I'm outty"

    In the end, you don't wait until you have holes and then try to fix them with the draft. Good staffs anticipate those holes and fix them ahead of time.
    I never said wait until we have a hole. I'm saying get something we needed more and address the RB position later in the draft, or in free agency.

    Thats why teams that do that are always contenders.
    Ah, so NE and Indy are drafting replacement QB's in the rare case the face of their franchise decides to peace? Not so much.

    In fact, teams like them draft skilled players who fit their scheme, and let go of the aging veterans. However, for the one or two positions their scheme depends on, they make damn sure to hang onto them. Brady's contract was up after this season, but they didn't go get his replacement with a second round pick. They had more important needs.

    just like us. We still have a year left with AD at the very least. I think we re-sign him anyway. Even if we didn't, Toby isn't the guy I want being our starting RB.

  9. #19
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    Re: 2012 NFL Mock Draft

    However, none of htis would matter if we could land LT....

  10. #20
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    Re: 2012 NFL Mock Draft

    I have been watching film of QB's and other positions and I have come to the conclusion that we should hope for Julio Jones to be on the board at 12 and then draft Stanzi in the 2nd at QB.

    IMHO this would be a devastating combo and I know that Stanzi isn't at the top of everybody's board but watching him throw and make plays he seems like he has the mental and physical tools to do the job. And having Harvin and Jones to throw to along with AP running the ball and using FA and later rounds to shore up the OL I believe we could have a great nucleus.

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