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  1. #11
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    Re: Liveleaks Drops "Anti-Islam" Film After Threats

    LOL, I have a feeling this thread is gonna make someone really pissed pretty soon...

    Funny picture "singersp"!
    ;D

  2. #12
    davike's Avatar
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    Re: Liveleaks Drops "Anti-Islam" Film After Threats

    "The" wrote:
    "hx38596" wrote:
    "The" wrote:
    The reason is because in Islam, you are not allowed to depict anyone's likeness. For example, the Ottoman empire used no faces on their currency, the Hache. It's just a rule. Silly? Sure, but so are a lot of rules and dogmas in many different religions. Some people, who take texts literally, are more concerned about these things than others. Being a secularist myself, I find them all pretty ridiculous to get worked up about, especially when things turn violent.

    Anyways, the fact is that things like this film are just fodder for the uneducated, much like they are any place. People hear some pundit or zealot get riled up about something and get pissed off without even trying to figure out the issues for themselves, or completely ignoring anyone else's point of view.

    This world could use a whole lot more empathy and understanding on all sides.

    Edit: I was not referring to any of you as uneducated. I was talking about the Islamic literalists that are up in arms. I just realized that I didn't do a good job of indicating that.
    Tell me which sides needs understanding?

    /educated christian
    I'm pretty sure I said all of them. I could post pictures of all kinds of horrible pooh that Christians, Hindus, Jews and others say (or have said) and do (or have done), but I won't. Nor do I hardly need mention that the Holocaust or the Native American genocide, or the displacement of Palestinians, or the killing fields of the Khmer Rouge (just to name a few), were committed by people other than Muslims.

    All I'm trying to say is that showing respect for others is the only way to avoid constant conflict. The Muslims who are bent out of shape over something as dumb as this aren't showing any knowledge or consideration for Western culture, nor are the people who made this idiotic film showing any knowledge or consideration for Islam.

    It is an endless, vicious circle, and the whole thing is stupid.
    Not true Christians.....

    All I'm trying to say is that showing respect for others is the only way to avoid constant conflict. The Muslims who are bent out of shape over something as dumb as this aren't showing any knowledge or consideration for Western culture, nor are the people who made this idiotic film showing any knowledge or consideration for Islam.
    We are supposed to show respect for Islam when they are a growing threat who want America and Christians all dead? They want an Islamic ruled world....I don't think that sounds very peaceful.

    My grandmother (French) lived in north Africa, a little town in Algeria. And the Muslims threw them out and if they didn't leave they killed them. Either threw out or killed a whole French community. This was done unprovoked. They were even friends with many of them, and treated them just like any other French person. Now she goes back to France and the muslims are taking over there to. I am not saying they are going to try to kick the French out of there to, but there is so many radicals over there that you can't say anything against Islam or muslims without getting yourself killed.

    They don't want peace.....call those sort of people "untrue to Islam", but they are just following their Korin. Which if I understand right is the basis for all Islamic beliefs, no matter how radical. The deeper you get into Islam the more radical you will become. Even if they really aren't the true followers of Islam, there is enough of the radicals out there to pose a threat to thousands and even millions of lives across the globe.

    Thanks Josdin00 for the sig!

  3. #13
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    Re: Liveleaks Drops "Anti-Islam" Film After Threats

    "davike" wrote:
    "The" wrote:
    "hx38596" wrote:
    "The" wrote:
    The reason is because in Islam, you are not allowed to depict anyone's likeness. For example, the Ottoman empire used no faces on their currency, the Hache. It's just a rule. Silly? Sure, but so are a lot of rules and dogmas in many different religions. Some people, who take texts literally, are more concerned about these things than others. Being a secularist myself, I find them all pretty ridiculous to get worked up about, especially when things turn violent.

    Anyways, the fact is that things like this film are just fodder for the uneducated, much like they are any place. People hear some pundit or zealot get riled up about something and get pissed off without even trying to figure out the issues for themselves, or completely ignoring anyone else's point of view.

    This world could use a whole lot more empathy and understanding on all sides.

    Edit: I was not referring to any of you as uneducated. I was talking about the Islamic literalists that are up in arms. I just realized that I didn't do a good job of indicating that.
    Tell me which sides needs understanding?

    /educated christian
    I'm pretty sure I said all of them. I could post pictures of all kinds of horrible pooh that Christians, Hindus, Jews and others say (or have said) and do (or have done), but I won't. Nor do I hardly need mention that the Holocaust or the Native American genocide, or the displacement of Palestinians, or the killing fields of the Khmer Rouge (just to name a few), were committed by people other than Muslims.

    All I'm trying to say is that showing respect for others is the only way to avoid constant conflict. The Muslims who are bent out of shape over something as dumb as this aren't showing any knowledge or consideration for Western culture, nor are the people who made this idiotic film showing any knowledge or consideration for Islam.

    It is an endless, vicious circle, and the whole thing is stupid.
    Not true Christians.....

    All I'm trying to say is that showing respect for others is the only way to avoid constant conflict. The Muslims who are bent out of shape over something as dumb as this aren't showing any knowledge or consideration for Western culture, nor are the people who made this idiotic film showing any knowledge or consideration for Islam.
    We are supposed to show respect for Islam when they are a growing threat who want America and Christians all dead? They want an Islamic ruled world....I don't think that sounds very peaceful.

    My grandmother (French) lived in north Africa, a little town in Algeria. And the Muslims threw them out and if they didn't leave they killed them. Either threw out or killed a whole French community. This was done unprovoked. They were even friends with many of them, and treated them just like any other French person. Now she goes back to France and the muslims are taking over there to. I am not saying they are going to try to kick the French out of there to, but there is so many radicals over there that you can't say anything against Islam or muslims without getting yourself killed.

    They don't want peace.....call those sort of people "untrue to Islam", but they are just following their Korin. Which if I understand right is the basis for all Islamic beliefs, no matter how radical. The deeper you get into Islam the more radical you will become. Even if they really aren't the true followers of Islam, there is enough of the radicals out there to pose a threat to thousands and even millions of lives across the globe.
    Oh man. Thank-you. I really needed a good laugh today. Wow do you not know your Algerian history. Unprovoked? Umm...you mean other than that whole colonialist thing? Perhaps you had forgotten that the French treated native Algerians like second class citizens in their own country. Across the world, from Haiti to Vietnam, the French did some horrible fucking things to all kinds of people. If you want to close your eyes to those things that's your problem.

    That doesn't mean that the French deserved to die; I would argue that no one does. But what would you do if someone overtook your state and your were forced to live in a slum and work a shit job while the people who invaded your land lived off of your toil?


    As to the rest of your points, look, the only thing I'm trying to get at is don't single Muslims out. All kinds of people have done all kinds of shitty things to each other. Extremists are radicals are literalists are radicals are extremists. It doesn't matter what religion, creed, ideology or anything else you come from. All of these people are a threat to the status quo. It is as simple as that. The important thing is to realize what these people really are: extremists. What kind of extremist doesn't matter two shits.

  4. #14
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    Re: Liveleaks Drops "Anti-Islam" Film After Threats

    The only thing people care about is what's happening NOW.
    The french aren't killing people and the North Americans aren't killing off the Indians.

    The Islam extremests are creating more problems throughout the world than anybody else...it's no wonder that people focus their anger towards them...doesnt' make it right, but it's understandable.

  5. #15
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    Re: Liveleaks Drops "Anti-Islam" Film After Threats

    "The" wrote:
    "hx38596" wrote:
    "The" wrote:
    The reason is because in Islam, you are not allowed to depict anyone's likeness. For example, the Ottoman empire used no faces on their currency, the Hache. It's just a rule. Silly? Sure, but so are a lot of rules and dogmas in many different religions. Some people, who take texts literally, are more concerned about these things than others. Being a secularist myself, I find them all pretty ridiculous to get worked up about, especially when things turn violent.

    Anyways, the fact is that things like this film are just fodder for the uneducated, much like they are any place. People hear some pundit or zealot get riled up about something and get pissed off without even trying to figure out the issues for themselves, or completely ignoring anyone else's point of view.

    This world could use a whole lot more empathy and understanding on all sides.

    Edit: I was not referring to any of you as uneducated. I was talking about the Islamic literalists that are up in arms. I just realized that I didn't do a good job of indicating that.
    Tell me which sides needs understanding?

    /educated christian
    I'm pretty sure I said all of them. I could post pictures of all kinds of horrible pooh that Christians, Hindus, Jews and others say (or have said) and do (or have done), but I won't. Nor do I hardly need mention that the Holocaust or the Native American genocide, or the displacement of Palestinians, or the killing fields of the Khmer Rouge (just to name a few), were committed by people other than Muslims.

    All I'm trying to say is that showing respect for others is the only way to avoid constant conflict. The Muslims who are bent out of shape over something as dumb as this aren't showing any knowledge or consideration for Western culture, nor are the people who made this idiotic film showing any knowledge or consideration for Islam.

    It is an endless, vicious circle, and the whole thing is stupid.
    Very well put Dropper.
    I have been arguing the same thing in the other thread that was started on this film (which eventually got locked I believe).

    Taking the pictures of extremist Muslims and applying them to the entire Islam faith like that is exactly the same thing as posting pictures of Nazis and the KKK and likening them to all Christians.
    Zeus wrote:
    When are you going to realize that picking out the 20 bad throws this year and ignoring the 300 good ones does not make your point?

    =Z=

  6. #16
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    Re: Liveleaks Drops "Anti-Islam" Film After Threats

    "BloodyHorns82" wrote:
    The only thing people care about is what's happening NOW.
    The french aren't killing people and the North Americans aren't killing off the Indians.

    The Islam extremests are creating more problems throughout the world than anybody else...it's no wonder that people focus their anger towards them...doesnt' make it right, but it's understandable.
    Correct.
    The extremists.
    Not the Islam religion as a whole, and not a majority of Muslims worldwide.
    In fact, a very small minority.
    Zeus wrote:
    When are you going to realize that picking out the 20 bad throws this year and ignoring the 300 good ones does not make your point?

    =Z=

  7. #17
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    Re: Liveleaks Drops "Anti-Islam" Film After Threats

    "BloodyHorns82" wrote:
    The only thing people care about is what's happening NOW.
    The french aren't killing people and the North Americans aren't killing off the Indians.

    The Islam extremests are creating more problems throughout the world than anybody else...it's no wonder that people focus their anger towards them...doesnt' make it right, but it's understandable.
    I think that's a pretty fair argument, but it's also important to remember your history. One thing I know well about the Muslim world is that, as a generalization, they definitely do not forget history like we tend to do in the West. But this is just another point of understanding about other cultures that I feel is critical to moving towards a more peaceful world. We need to
    understand this about the Middle East just as they need understand how important free speech is in our part of the world.

  8. #18
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    Re: Liveleaks Drops "Anti-Islam" Film After Threats

    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "BloodyHorns82" wrote:
    The only thing people care about is what's happening NOW.
    The french aren't killing people and the North Americans aren't killing off the Indians.

    The Islam extremests are creating more problems throughout the world than anybody else...it's no wonder that people focus their anger towards them...doesnt' make it right, but it's understandable.
    Correct.
    The extremists.
    Not the Islam religion as a whole, and not a majority of Muslims worldwide.
    In fact, a very small minority.
    Correct.
    Which is why is wrote "extremists.

    ;D

  9. #19
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    Re: Liveleaks Drops "Anti-Islam" Film After Threats

    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "The" wrote:
    "hx38596" wrote:
    "The" wrote:
    The reason is because in Islam, you are not allowed to depict anyone's likeness. For example, the Ottoman empire used no faces on their currency, the Hache. It's just a rule. Silly? Sure, but so are a lot of rules and dogmas in many different religions. Some people, who take texts literally, are more concerned about these things than others. Being a secularist myself, I find them all pretty ridiculous to get worked up about, especially when things turn violent.

    Anyways, the fact is that things like this film are just fodder for the uneducated, much like they are any place. People hear some pundit or zealot get riled up about something and get pissed off without even trying to figure out the issues for themselves, or completely ignoring anyone else's point of view.

    This world could use a whole lot more empathy and understanding on all sides.

    Edit: I was not referring to any of you as uneducated. I was talking about the Islamic literalists that are up in arms. I just realized that I didn't do a good job of indicating that.
    Tell me which sides needs understanding?

    /educated christian
    I'm pretty sure I said all of them. I could post pictures of all kinds of horrible pooh that Christians, Hindus, Jews and others say (or have said) and do (or have done), but I won't. Nor do I hardly need mention that the Holocaust or the Native American genocide, or the displacement of Palestinians, or the killing fields of the Khmer Rouge (just to name a few), were committed by people other than Muslims.

    All I'm trying to say is that showing respect for others is the only way to avoid constant conflict. The Muslims who are bent out of shape over something as dumb as this aren't showing any knowledge or consideration for Western culture, nor are the people who made this idiotic film showing any knowledge or consideration for Islam.

    It is an endless, vicious circle, and the whole thing is stupid.
    Very well put Dropper.
    I have been arguing the same thing in the other thread that was started on this film (which eventually got locked I believe).

    Taking the pictures of extremist Muslims and applying them to the entire Islam faith like that is exactly the same thing as posting pictures of Nazis and the KKK and likening them to all Christians.
    Thanks for the kind words, Paul.

    These threads can be tricky to navigate. The main thing is I try to keep politics and theology out of it while hopefully opening some doors to understanding for others (and allowing others to open doors for me as well).

  10. #20
    davike's Avatar
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    Re: Liveleaks Drops "Anti-Islam" Film After Threats

    "The" wrote:
    "davike" wrote:
    "The" wrote:
    "hx38596" wrote:
    "The" wrote:
    The reason is because in Islam, you are not allowed to depict anyone's likeness. For example, the Ottoman empire used no faces on their currency, the Hache. It's just a rule. Silly? Sure, but so are a lot of rules and dogmas in many different religions. Some people, who take texts literally, are more concerned about these things than others. Being a secularist myself, I find them all pretty ridiculous to get worked up about, especially when things turn violent.

    Anyways, the fact is that things like this film are just fodder for the uneducated, much like they are any place. People hear some pundit or zealot get riled up about something and get pissed off without even trying to figure out the issues for themselves, or completely ignoring anyone else's point of view.

    This world could use a whole lot more empathy and understanding on all sides.

    Edit: I was not referring to any of you as uneducated. I was talking about the Islamic literalists that are up in arms. I just realized that I didn't do a good job of indicating that.
    Tell me which sides needs understanding?

    /educated christian
    I'm pretty sure I said all of them. I could post pictures of all kinds of horrible pooh that Christians, Hindus, Jews and others say (or have said) and do (or have done), but I won't. Nor do I hardly need mention that the Holocaust or the Native American genocide, or the displacement of Palestinians, or the killing fields of the Khmer Rouge (just to name a few), were committed by people other than Muslims.

    All I'm trying to say is that showing respect for others is the only way to avoid constant conflict. The Muslims who are bent out of shape over something as dumb as this aren't showing any knowledge or consideration for Western culture, nor are the people who made this idiotic film showing any knowledge or consideration for Islam.

    It is an endless, vicious circle, and the whole thing is stupid.
    Not true Christians.....

    All I'm trying to say is that showing respect for others is the only way to avoid constant conflict. The Muslims who are bent out of shape over something as dumb as this aren't showing any knowledge or consideration for Western culture, nor are the people who made this idiotic film showing any knowledge or consideration for Islam.
    We are supposed to show respect for Islam when they are a growing threat who want America and Christians all dead? They want an Islamic ruled world....I don't think that sounds very peaceful.

    My grandmother (French) lived in north Africa, a little town in Algeria. And the Muslims threw them out and if they didn't leave they killed them. Either threw out or killed a whole French community. This was done unprovoked. They were even friends with many of them, and treated them just like any other French person. Now she goes back to France and the muslims are taking over there to. I am not saying they are going to try to kick the French out of there to, but there is so many radicals over there that you can't say anything against Islam or muslims without getting yourself killed.

    They don't want peace.....call those sort of people "untrue to Islam", but they are just following their Korin. Which if I understand right is the basis for all Islamic beliefs, no matter how radical. The deeper you get into Islam the more radical you will become. Even if they really aren't the true followers of Islam, there is enough of the radicals out there to pose a threat to thousands and even millions of lives across the globe.
    Oh man. Thank-you. I really needed a good laugh today. Wow do you not know your Algerian history. Unprovoked? Umm...you mean other than that whole colonialist thing? Perhaps you had forgotten that the French treated native Algerians like second class citizens in their own country. Across the world, from Haiti to Vietnam, the French did some horrible fricken things to all kinds of people. If you want to close your eyes to those things that's your problem.

    That doesn't mean that the French deserved to die; I would argue that no one does. But what would you do if someone overtook your state and your were forced to live in a slum and work a pooh job while the people who invaded your land lived off of your toil?


    As to the rest of your points, look, the only thing I'm trying to get at is don't single Muslims out. All kinds of people have done all kinds of poohie things to each other. Extremists are radicals are literalists are radicals are extremists. It doesn't matter what religion, creed, ideology or anything else you come from. All of these people are a threat to the status quo. It is as simple as that. The important thing is to realize what these people really are: extremists. What kind of extremist doesn't matter two poohies.
    I realize what the French did. But in my Grandmothers small town they lived among them like everyone else and my grandmother played with the Arabic children just as much as the other French. They were treated just like everyone else. I know that in that village it was unprovoked. Say what you will but my grandma was there. In the Muslims defense I will say that I know they gave them warning, so it wasn't like a massacre.

    Muslims are making themselves standout by massive protests and threats. They are to many of the muslim extemists to ignore.

    Thanks Josdin00 for the sig!

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