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  1. #21
    Caine's Avatar
    Caine is offline Jersey Retired
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    5,139

    Re: Iraq, Katrina and Bush

    I'm not trying to take anything away from NodakVike's experience, but look at the scale of the two events - the breaking of the dikes, and Katrina. There is really no comparrison in scope. Of course Clinton could ride in and give a cheery speech...the damage was restricted, primarily, to Grand Forks.

    In this case, the entire Gulf Coast got pasted. New Orleans, for all intents and purposes, no longer exists.

    The Media sit on thier high horses and say, "Why has it taken so long". Truth is, if they paused for a moment and thought - something the media in general appears incapable of - they would realize that NO ONE in the WORLD is capacle of immediately responding to a disaster of this scope. NO ONE.

    The resources (Planes, trains, trucks, boats, etc) required just to ship in the resources for rescue/stabilization is staggering. And that takes TIME to assemble. It's not like we have a fleet of vehicles with relief supplies and personell just waiting around for a disaster to strike.

    When Grand Forks flooded, about 50,000 people were affected. New Orleans in 2000 had a population of 484,674...ten times that of Grand Forks. Add in the rest of the affected areas and the amount becomes staggering.

    And people expect relief...yesterday?!?!?!? As unfortunate as it may be, that's simply not possible.

    People are also raging about Politicians "standing around"...what did you expect them to do? Get dirty? Pol's don't do that...they send people like us to get dirty. They simply draft some piece of paper authorizing the release of OUR money to pay for the materials and labor. truth be told, I wouldn't want them on the scene...they'd simply get in the way.

    The President, however, is another story altogether. He is not just George W. Bush, he is also a symbol of all that is the United States. If HE shows up, you can bet your bottom dollar that help is either there now, or will be VERY soon.

    People criticized him for showing up when the food arrived. Obviously they have never worked a protection detail or executive protection. He can't simply ride in on the heels of the storm. He has to wait until the Secret Service affirms that they can control the risk to an acceptable level. When FOOD arrives, people who are hungry don't want to kill you...they want to eat. That makes that a pretty safe time to show up.

    So, if you read this entire post, congrats. If not, and you reply to it anyway, bite me. The criticism I have seen here and in the media of Bush's handling of this disaster is both misplaced and short sighted. Before you respond with another rant, take the time to think your position through.

    I'm no great fan of G.W. Bush, but I'm not going to bash the guy for doing what he's supposed to.

    Caine

  2. #22
    akvikefan89 is offline Star Spokesman
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    2,160

    Re: Iraq, Katrina and Bush

    "Caine" wrote:
    I'm not trying to take anything away from NodakVike's experience, but look at the scale of the two events - the breaking of the dikes, and Katrina. There is really no comparrison in scope. Of course Clinton could ride in and give a cheery speech...the damage was restricted, primarily, to Grand Forks.

    In this case, the entire Gulf Coast got pasted. New Orleans, for all intents and purposes, no longer exists.

    The Media sit on thier high horses and say, "Why has it taken so long". Truth is, if they paused for a moment and thought - something the media in general appears incapable of - they would realize that NO ONE in the WORLD is capacle of immediately responding to a disaster of this scope. NO ONE.

    The resources (Planes, trains, trucks, boats, etc) required just to ship in the resources for rescue/stabilization is staggering. And that takes TIME to assemble. It's not like we have a fleet of vehicles with relief supplies and personell just waiting around for a disaster to strike.

    When Grand Forks flooded, about 50,000 people were affected. New Orleans in 2000 had a population of 484,674...ten times that of Grand Forks. Add in the rest of the affected areas and the amount becomes staggering.

    And people expect relief...yesterday?!?!?!? As unfortunate as it may be, that's simply not possible.

    People are also raging about Politicians "standing around"...what did you expect them to do? Get dirty? Pol's don't do that...they send people like us to get dirty. They simply draft some piece of paper authorizing the release of OUR money to pay for the materials and labor. truth be told, I wouldn't want them on the scene...they'd simply get in the way.

    The President, however, is another story altogether. He is not just George W. Bush, he is also a symbol of all that is the United States. If HE shows up, you can bet your bottom dollar that help is either there now, or will be VERY soon.

    People criticized him for showing up when the food arrived. Obviously they have never worked a protection detail or executive protection. He can't simply ride in on the heels of the storm. He has to wait until the Secret Service affirms that they can control the risk to an acceptable level. When FOOD arrives, people who are hungry don't want to kill you...they want to eat. That makes that a pretty safe time to show up.

    So, if you read this entire post, congrats. If not, and you reply to it anyway, bite me. The criticism I have seen here and in the media of Bush's handling of this disaster is both misplaced and short sighted. Before you respond with another rant, take the time to think your position through.

    I'm no great fan of G.W. Bush, but I'm not going to bash the guy for doing what he's supposed to.

    Caine
    Caine for pres! :lol:

    Exellent post Caine, really.

  3. #23
    6-KINGS Guest

    Re: Iraq, Katrina and Bush

    "cajunvike" wrote:
    Great quote...but Bush is no Teddy Roosevelt...not even close!

    Sorry 6, but Teddy led troops into battle...W was nowhere near the battlefield.

    That quote belongs under a different thread title...a title that says: "American soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan, health workers in Third World countries, and all the rescue and aid personnel helping out in the wake of Hurricane Katrina"...for starters anyway. We could probably add all those others who give selflessly to help enrich the lives of others with no hope or expectation of getting anything else back in return, except the self-knowledge that they did something to make a difference in the lives of the less fortunate.

    No knock on Bush...it is just that his name doesn't merit being attached to such a noble quote...but then again neither does my name...and I would never suppose to do that.
    You missed the whole point Cajun.
    Kinda sad really.

  4. #24
    6-KINGS Guest

    Re: Iraq, Katrina and Bush

    "audioghost" wrote:
    "6-KINGS" wrote:
    "It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself for a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat."

    Teddy Roosevelt
    "Citizenship in a Republic,"
    Speech at the Sorbonne, Paris, April 23, 1910
    A very wise man..................

    Are you in the Arena?
    Or are you just a critic?

    Hard not to be when money I pay helps pay the guy, and the stupid decisions he makes directly effects my life....if he fudged up and it effected him, then so be it...but it affects me, therefore I have a right to be a critic.....and this whole using a Teddy Roosevelt quote to defend Bush....spare me, Teddy was a great president, Bush will go down in history as the anus he is....but hey, I wasn't dumb enough to vote for him....
    And when it is all said and done that is why you don't count.
    You have nothing to offer to make anything better.
    You just have hatred and blame.
    And the misguided attitude of "what have you done for me lately"
    You are the non entity spoken of in politics.
    What is called back burner people.
    Last in line due to reactive thought patterns.

  5. #25
    6-KINGS Guest

    Re: Iraq, Katrina and Bush

    "cajunvike" wrote:
    "ltrey33" wrote:
    "dfwvike" wrote:
    The bunker in Nebraska was by no means the arena.
    You want them to send the leader of the free world to the front lines?
    NOT NOW...but it would have been nice if he had volunteered to go back when he was in the service!
    And this is why Cajun, in the end you don't have anything of substance to offer except whatever "substance" has pickled his brain.
    Never a fair look, never a fair assessmeant(sp for you) only a view or reply that backs your final agenda. Never waiver from the final goal right Cajun?
    Law school basics right?

  6. #26
    audioghost is offline Star Spokesman
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    2,005

    Re: Iraq, Katrina and Bush

    "6-KINGS" wrote:
    "audioghost" wrote:
    "6-KINGS" wrote:
    "It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself for a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat."

    Teddy Roosevelt
    "Citizenship in a Republic,"
    Speech at the Sorbonne, Paris, April 23, 1910
    A very wise man..................

    Are you in the Arena?
    Or are you just a critic?

    Hard not to be when money I pay helps pay the guy, and the stupid decisions he makes directly effects my life....if he fudged up and it effected him, then so be it...but it affects me, therefore I have a right to be a critic.....and this whole using a Teddy Roosevelt quote to defend Bush....spare me, Teddy was a great president, Bush will go down in history as the anus he is....but hey, I wasn't dumb enough to vote for him....
    And when it is all said and done that is why you don't count.
    You have nothing to offer to make anything better.
    You just have hatred and blame.
    And the misguided attitude of "what have you done for me lately"
    You are the non entity spoken of in politics.
    What is called back burner people.
    Last in line due to reactive thought patterns.

    I don't count....F U C K U! You really think you know it all don't you? How are you making things better compadre??? How much money have you sent to help the hurricane victims? What the f*** have you done that was so great you f ucking snake? Just cuz you are on the presidents ballz about everything makes you a better person, eh? F*** right off, and your 6 kings thing doesn't work because of Warren Moon, he was washed up and sucked for the Vikes.....kick me off this f****ing site if you want to, then at least I won't get pissed when some slave to the system douche bagger takes shots at me like he knows something that makes him better than me.....lick my ballz you b!tch....

    A.G s HOTTEST NEW RAP CD: AUDIO GHOST & MAIN EVENT drop THE SEED: I made tha beats www.myspace.com/audioghost2006

  7. #27
    audioghost is offline Star Spokesman
    Join Date
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    Re: Iraq, Katrina and Bush

    6-kings is Mr. Intellectual all of a sudden.....your time will come........

    A.G s HOTTEST NEW RAP CD: AUDIO GHOST & MAIN EVENT drop THE SEED: I made tha beats www.myspace.com/audioghost2006

  8. #28
    6-KINGS Guest

    Re: Iraq, Katrina and Bush

    "eelpout72" wrote:
    "6-KINGS" wrote:
    "It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself for a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat."

    Teddy Roosevelt
    "Citizenship in a Republic,"
    Speech at the Sorbonne, Paris, April 23, 1910
    A very wise man..................

    Are you in the Arena?
    Or are you just a critic?
    So we should never criticize Bush regardless of what he does or doesnt do, huh? If people in various parts of the world (Iraq or New Orleans)suffer based on his actions or inactions, we should all just keep our mouths shut because he is the one making decisions and we are just stupid bystanders and not worthy of expressing our opinion, right?

    Im not sure how Bush is "marred by dust and sweat and blood" It appears that many others are including: soldiers, national guardsman, policeman, volunteers, and people who are stuck in the national disaster. These are the people that i do respect. I do not see how Bush shows "great devotions", how he is "daring greatly", and is exhibiting "high achievement".

    I certainly dont agree with all of the critics out there. Criticism in the media, unfortunately, is a part of getting good ratings. However, i do believe that everybody's opinion should matter, whether you agree with that person or not.
    That is because you are on the sidelines, in the critic booth.
    Always with an idea of what to say, merely awaiting the time to say it in such a way as to appear in the "know"
    But you really just use your pre conceived thoughts to further an idea of a man that you have carried with malice since his election.

    And what good comes to anyone with your hate?
    Not one single person is better off.
    And that is why you are a back burner man.
    Another reactive American, with little to no proactive thoughts to offer a tragic situation.

  9. #29
    6-KINGS Guest

    Re: Iraq, Katrina and Bush

    "audioghost" wrote:
    "kramer9guy" wrote:
    ...

    OK, give me a list of GREAT things he's done since he's been in office, I'd be interested to hear them patna!
    We already had this thread weeks ago.
    If ya can't keep up keep notes.

    Need a crayon?

  10. #30
    6-KINGS Guest

    Re: Iraq, Katrina and Bush

    "audioghost" wrote:
    As for being tired of people pointing fingers....your gonna have to learn to deal with it...cuz the fact is that our country's a p.o.s. compared to what it was back in the Clinton era....gas is expensive....people are getting killed oversees for something that doesn't involve our country...our troops are spread out and we are vulnerable....the gov't almost succeeded in putting all of our B-1 bombers in 1 place.....and what can we do about it....nothing, for the next 4 years.....and dod gammit I'm gonna vent and point fingers and express my displeasure.....and he deserves the blame cuz he's the head guy in charge, and its his responsibility to ensure that everything goes swimmingly....and when it doesn't, HE gets the blame, if he doesn't like us hating him for his bonehead decisions he shouldn't have ran for a second term.....thats just the way it is....
    This is the perfect example of the lack of brain function that is rampant.
    Revenge at it's core, blame as it's main menu, hatred as it's spice.
    And you have earned the asshole song.

    Sing it Dave!!

    Your just a jiggly hole.
    and everywhere you go,
    people know the part
    your playing.

    Writing useless rants,
    talking through your pants,
    Oh what did you say?

    Today has become the day,
    your brains have passed away.
    (BabBa-Babba-doo)
    Oh will they say about you?

    When this thread ends ya know
    your just a jiggly hole
    Life goes on without you.

    Cause you aint got no brains.
    (no brains, no brains!)
    cuz nobody cares for you
    (Babba-Babba-doo)
    Your so sad and lonely
    sad and lonely, sad and lonely
    Won't somebody
    come and have a thought for you
    cause you aint so bad.

    When the thread ends ya know,
    your just a jiggly hole.
    Life goes on without you.

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