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  1. #11
    Del Rio Guest

    Re: cop killers of st paul...........kelly cambell

    In my state a background check is done when you purchase the gun anyway. And there is a waiting period on hand guns. This includes pawn shops. I have taken the weapons permit course here, it is a cake walk and I honestly do not believe it weeds out idiots.

    I just do not make the connection.

    You give stats. How many people have guns no permit that do NOT commit crimes with them? I am guessing far more then have permits.

  2. #12
    Caine's Avatar
    Caine is offline Jersey Retired
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    Dec 1969

    Re: cop killers of st paul...........kelly cambell

    Someone who has a license to carry versus someone who carries that the distinction?

    Beyond that, I would also add, "WHY are you carrying".

    The SPPD Officer's killer carried because he was a criminal...plain and simple. He regularly engaged in activities which are prohibited by law, and felt that a weapon was needed due to his life choices. Now, why was Campbell carrying? What lead him to believe that a firearm was required/needed? Once THOSE questions are answered (And they never will be), we would better know how to decide on his issue.

    As for idiots with weapons - I have seen too many. Many of them licensed. I have a low (read that as "ZERO") tolerance for idiots with firearms. I believe that the criteria should be a LOT higher than it is...unfortunately, it isn't in my power to make that change.

    I'm not disagreeing with you Del Rio - just on the one element. The majority of your comments I'm in line with. The ONLY element I differed on was the idea that people carry for no reason. If they believe that they are, then they are an accident waiting to happen. Carrying a firearm - legally or illegally - does not form intent to commit homicide/manslaughter/ simply provides the means. Unfortunately, intent can be formed a split-second prior to the act (unwanted discharge, heat of the moment, or Crime of Passion).

    Anyone carrying a firearm had best be prepared to use it. If not, when the moment arrives, you will likely do the wrong thing (like shoot a police officer, your kid, your best friend, or whomever). Being prepared to use it means knowing WHEN to use it...and when not to.

    As I said, I used to carry (as part of my job). There were several times where Deadly Force was a split second away. I was fortunate in that I was never forced to cross that line, but I was also prepared and trained. Because the question of willingness was already answered, I was able to approach each situation calmly...and able to deescallate them and gain control of them.

    I am willing to bet that KC never had my training (no brainer there). I am also willing to bet that he never answered the "Am I prepared to use it" question that I did every day. That means that he was never completely in control of himself, or the weapon...the situation was. And, under the wrong circumstances, could have lead to a tragedy.

    In every situation I was involved in, there was always a gun present. In every situation I was involved in, I had to be very aware of that fact. The fact that it was MY gun didn't change the equation.


  3. #13
    zimtwister is offline Coach
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    Dec 1969

    Re: cop killers of st paul...........kelly cambell

    criminals probablly do not ----pay income taxes, have a current drivers license, pay for health insurance and car insurance, etc. in general they do not follow the rules of society.
    "you dream of beating me, its time you wake up and apologize."

  4. #14
    ultravikingfan's Avatar
    ultravikingfan is offline Administrator
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    Sep 2004
    NE Ohio

    Re: cop killers of st paul...........kelly cambell

    "zimtwister" wrote:
    criminals probablly do not ----pay income taxes, have a current drivers license, pay for health insurance and car insurance, etc. in general they do not follow the rules of society.
    I think that is an incorrect rationalization.

  5. #15
    Del Rio Guest

    Re: cop killers of st paul...........kelly cambell

    wow! the one has at least 5 kids, he must have a awesome job! neither had permits for their hand guns. been arrested over 20 times- nice stand up guy. minnesota needs more people like this, oops wait, we have kelly cambell!

    This is all I am refering too. A guy gets caught with a gun, and drugs. You are implying he is just as bad as the people who killed police officers.

    Caine: I didn't mean for it to sound like I was defending him. I was merley trying to show that not everyone who carries a gun without a permit is going to kill someone.

    Do people carry guns around to feel cool...probably, should they? Obviously the only right answer is no. I agree ANYONE licenced or not if you are carrying that gun you could shoot someone. But you cannot judge people by what they might do, only what they have done.

    Read his original post. I really had no clue what he was talking about I was trying to make some sense of it. What I came up with was some cops got shot and killed. Just so happened that the people that shot the cops had no he thinks people with no license to carry a firearm are going to commit crime. I do not feel that is true. Then I interpreted that somehow he is trying to equate the charges against KC to the charges against these guys that shot cops. I did not make the connection.

    That is all.

  6. #16
    zimtwister is offline Coach
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    Dec 1969

    Re: cop killers of st paul...........kelly cambell

    the connection is-criminals commit most crimes these guys have been ARRESTED 37 times combined. kc was charged with 1. a kilo of pot 2. illegal possecion of a fire arm. he to is a criminal. i do not care where he "came" from he should have stopped that behavior by now. just because he grew up poor does not mean he grew up stupid. he's just a immature rich athelete who has been told his whole life he is a "victim" of our current society. dump him, or lets wait for him to commit another crime. KC "itiswhatitis"
    "you dream of beating me, its time you wake up and apologize."

  7. #17
    Del Rio Guest

    Re: cop killers of st paul...........kelly cambell

    I stole a pack of basketball cards when I was 12 does that make me a cop killer?

    Criminals commit crime?? :grin: :grin:

    Like I said dump him who cares I don't think anyone will lose any sleep over it, but there is a distinction between crimes that has to be made. And that gap is huge given your two examples.

    My brother in law was in trouble with the law. He was in and out of jail for 3 years. He moved in with us last month. Great guy, has been clean and crime free damn near a year. Goes to meetings daily. He can't get a job now. How the hell is he supposed to break the cycle? Luckily he did land a job and he is excited about it a fresh start.

    Point being, there is a cycle that real people have a hard time getting out of because our society doesn't really care much about the criminal as a person, but only what they did and how bad it was. Repeat offenders? What you thought locking them up 2 years...then throwing them back in the ghetto with a record now and no ability to get a job was going to magically make them model citizens.

    Look I know that was a huge stretch and a serious tangent on my part.

    As far as KC goes he broke the laws he broke, nothing more. I stole some batteries once but now I am crime free. :grin: Just because the means is there doesn't guarantee a crime.

    O.Smith---> Broke the law he should be gone
    R.Moss----> Broke the law he should have been gone.

    Honestly if this was Culpepper who had some weed and a gun, would all this talk be this serious? Nope. If Tim Duncan gets caught with weed is he hated? NOPE. But is Allen Iverson gets caught with it bring the pitch forks.

    I don't know the guy so I save my judgement. He has a history I don't know where he came from what friends he had/has. But maybe his gansta friends got him through some tough times back in the day. Friendships do not die so easily.

    Or maybe he is just a jackass. Who knows.

  8. #18
    Del Rio Guest

    Re: cop killers of st paul...........kelly cambell

    Because those poverty strickin kids grow up in the best schools. Repeating something that is flawed doesn't make it more clear.

    Those guys were arrested 37 times KC once so what is your point? What connection are you trying to make between someone who KILLS COPS has a huge RECORD and KC?

    So basically you think you can take someone who is has been raised in a tough spot, poor education if he even has any, bad neighborhood. Hell for all you know carrying a gun could have been common place. Plop him down with a lot of money, and he will be a changed man? I do not think so. How was his family? Did he have a father?

    I mean damn I usually keep pro atheletes on a level of "I could give a shit what they do," but you are actually comparing KC's charges with some cop killer with a record as long as your arm.

    I think if you are so inclined to dish out judgements you should take the time to learn a bit about the person you are condeming. What do you know about the case other then what ESPN told you?

  9. #19
    Del Rio Guest

    Re: cop killers of st paul...........kelly cambell

    Played under Vikings Defensive Coordinator George O'Leary and alongside LB Nick Rogers at Georgia Tech...Management major...Active in the Twin Cities community through the African American Adoption Agency and Viking Victory Hospital

    Visits...Participates in many United Way events, including the Vikings/UW Hometown Huddle at St. David's in 2003. Played tailback at Mays High (Atlanta, Ga.) ...Rushed for 615 yards on 35 carries, caught 3 passes for 85 yards, returned 7 kickoffs for 239 yards, scored 15 TDs and 22 two-point conversions as a senior...Georgia 4A state champion in the triple jump (46-7 1/4 feet) and the 4x400 meter relay while finishing 2nd in the 200 and 400 meters as a senior...Won region titles in the 400 and 4x400 relay as a junior...Lettered 4 times in football, 3 times in track, and once in baseball...Management major...Son of Belinda Campbell.

    Sounds like a cop killer to me.

  10. #20
    Ltrey33 is offline Jersey Retired
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    Dec 1969

    Re: cop killers of st paul...........kelly cambell

    Yeah dude, I'm not gettin the whole cop killer connection. I understand what he did was wrong and he shouldn't have done it, but I'd much rather have him get high and hurt his own body than kill someone. They're really not the same thing at all.

    And what's with the wave of cop killer threads all of a sudden?

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