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  1. #21
    midgensa's Avatar
    midgensa is offline Jersey Retired Free Kick Specialist 3 Champion
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    Re: Winfield prefers being positioned inside in slot

    This really makes sense when you think about it. As stated by some others, Winfield is as good a tackling corner as there is in the NFL, so you can run those short slot routes and he will take them down before much of a gain if any. Also, it is tougher to burn the slot-corner on a deep route than it is the outside corner, and we all know that Winfield has a little trouble with downfield-coverage.
    He also would be very effective in the run-blitz or a straight pass-rush spot from the slot-corner. Not a bad spot if McCauley, Griffen and/or Gordon can hold up their ends of the bargain.

  2. #22
    V-Unit's Avatar
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    Re: Winfield prefers being positioned inside in slot

    "C" wrote:
    "Potus2028" wrote:
    "C" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    We have a corner to loves to blitz and tackle running backs! He doesn't fit the scheme at all! He is old! Release him!

    Griffin and McCauley are much better in coverage! They are young! That makes Winfield very replacable!
    I realize you're being sarcastic... I think....

    But you certainly did express my thoughts in your first sentence. We can use him more for blitzing and tackling, like almost a CB/Safety position...

    I don't know... I'm an idiot.
    But if you think about it.. Are there any CB's that don't like to Blitz? Most secondary players would love a chance to get back at the QB or Run Blitz (see John Lynch).

    So does that make him different that any other veteran player in the secondary?
    I must be a little confused... of course everyone WANTS to get to the QB, but they have to fit a certain role in our defensive scheme.

    I don't care what he WANTS to do, I'm saying that because his strengths are his hits and his tackles, and his weakness is his coverage, let's put him in the slot and keep the offense guessing the whole game.
    The only problem with that theory is that Winfield is also our best coverage CB. I trust him against a primary receiver more than I do any other CB on the team. I think he is very solid in coverage in general, but that's a different argument.

    We already have a DL and LBs who can shutdown the run game, and hopefully get to the QB as well with the addition of Allen. Put our best DB on the outside, let him cover primary receivers, and shutdown runs to the outside. That seems obvious to me.
    "I hate when threads are destroyed by facts and logic."
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    Thanks Josdin!

  3. #23
    Potus2028 is offline Hall of Famer
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    Re: Winfield prefers being positioned inside in slot

    "V" wrote:
    "C" wrote:
    "Potus2028" wrote:
    "C" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    We have a corner to loves to blitz and tackle running backs! He doesn't fit the scheme at all! He is old! Release him!

    Griffin and McCauley are much better in coverage! They are young! That makes Winfield very replacable!
    I realize you're being sarcastic... I think....

    But you certainly did express my thoughts in your first sentence. We can use him more for blitzing and tackling, like almost a CB/Safety position...

    I don't know... I'm an idiot.
    But if you think about it.. Are there any CB's that don't like to Blitz? Most secondary players would love a chance to get back at the QB or Run Blitz (see John Lynch).

    So does that make him different that any other veteran player in the secondary?
    I must be a little confused... of course everyone WANTS to get to the QB, but they have to fit a certain role in our defensive scheme.

    I don't care what he WANTS to do, I'm saying that because his strengths are his hits and his tackles, and his weakness is his coverage, let's put him in the slot and keep the offense guessing the whole game.
    The only problem with that theory is that Winfield is also our best coverage CB. I trust him against a primary receiver more than I do any other CB on the team. I think he is very solid in coverage in general, but that's a different argument.

    We already have a DL and LBs who can shutdown the run game, and hopefully get to the QB as well with the addition of Allen. Put our best DB on the outside, let him cover primary receivers, and shutdown runs to the outside. That seems obvious to me.
    I think there is a safe compromise here:

    Can't he be jack of all traits? Put him in certain places in certain situations? Instead of reserving him specifically...

    I think we can play him all over the field... I like this idea now more guys. Why don't we put Winfield in the slot?
    i m better than you, so just give up...

  4. #24
    VikingsTw is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Winfield prefers being positioned inside in slot

    "Overlord" wrote:
    Just wanted to put some stats to what people are voicing here.
    Basically, Winfield is a good (but not great) cover corner and elite when it comes to stopping the run.
    I'm getting my stats from the book 'Pro Football Prospectus,' so I can't post a link.

    With respect to the running game, opposing teams averaged 2.6 yards on running plays when Winfield made the tackle.
    That was second among all NFL corners and compares very favorably to Griffin (5.9 yards) and McCauley (10.5 yards).
    They show stats for stops as well, which refer to preventing big gains on first or second down or giving up first downs on third or fourth down.
    Winfield's tackles in the running game were stops 84% of the time, which was also second among NFL corners.

    In the passing game, Winfield came up with stops on 52% of the balls thrown towards him.
    That ranked 30th among corners.
    The best corners were around 60% in that category, while Griffin (39%) and McCauley (41%) were not so good.
    Winfield gave up an average of 6.2 yards on pass plays targeted toward him, which ranked 16th among corners.
    Griffin (9.7) and McCauley (8.5) also struggled here.

    Based on these statistics, it looks like Winfield is a solid #1 corner in the passing game, but he's certainly not at a Pro Bowl level.
    He's as good as anybody at the position against the run, as we all pretty much knew.
    It's our second corner spot that is really weak, because neither Griffin nor McCauley have performed at the level of an average starting corner back.

    Hopefully that improves this year.
    I like the post and I think those numbers can be driven closer to zero with more pass rush provided by our front four, this could possibly put winfield higher in terms of those rankings.

  5. #25
    VikingsTw is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Winfield prefers being positioned inside in slot

    "i_bleed_purple" wrote:
    "VikingsTw" wrote:
    "C" wrote:
    Again... because he has no coverage skills. He's a tackler... and a gol 'darnit good one.
    I would argue that and consider it a major overstatement direct toward his coverage. Granted Winfield isn't Champ Bailey he's a good cover corner. I think this year is extremely exiting because for the first time in a long while our CB's should have some pass rush to work with. Being a Vikings fan the past decade I've had the opportunity to watch our corners get torched when the QB has ample time to pass the ball and regardless of who the CB's are they are gonna be unsucesful in there attempts to defend that long.

    I think for the first time for exept maybe his rookie season Winfield will have a good pass rush to match what he can do, personally Winfield is one of many players I want to see quiet the coverage critics. Big season for him as long as he can stay healthy I expect him to finally get the Pro Bowl vallet that he has deserved in previous seasons.
    I still remember the bears game where he fell down and let up a TD to either Muhammid or Berrian.


    Anyway, Winfield may be good in the slot, maybe not.
    He is not a good enough in pass coverage to stick with guys like Welker.
    On the outside, all he has to do is bump the reciever, then cover the flat, which he is pretty good at.
    But really, the thing I don't like about it is having McCauley on the outside.
    I don't want to hear about how some of you think he might possibly have a chance at being good when is 85 degrees out and the sun isn't in his eyes, and has Chad Pennington throwing it deep to his reciever.
    He is not good enough yet, and probably won't be this year right away either.
    For now, i'd rather keep the proven guy on the outside, and let the inexperienced guys play in the slot, where there's more help from the LB's/S's.
    I still remeber when Bernard Berrian beat Champ Bailey in a huge victory to catapolt them into the postseason.

    Berrian is tuff matchup for Winfield because he has such elite speed or for any corner. Winfield had an off season last year but still its rare to see him give up scores and when he does its so close. I would have to consider the Berrian TD the most blown play by Winfield in his few years here.

    Winfield is good at any CB position, but like he said being in the slot gives him more an opportunity to make plays and thats what he's always done.

    By the way for those of you discussing McCauley should be discussing Gordon as he is the #3 while McCauley is the #4.

  6. #26
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    Re: Winfield prefers being positioned inside in slot

    Also, the way our ball-hawking safety works.
    Winfield in the slot would give Sharper more opportunities for picks.


    Why you ask.
    Winfield gives you a lot more versatility in the slot defender spot.
    It’s like having an extra safety in there the way he hits.
    He can help with run-support if needed.
    He can also get to the QB very quickly while also laying the wood.
    And he can drop back into coverage.
    So, the QB would always have to be checking off on him to make a decision.
    Thus giving the defenders more time to get to the QB and worst passes that can be more easily picked.


    Gordon is definitely a good enough athlete to jump out there and cover a wideout.


  7. #27
    DaunteHOF is offline Coach
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    Re: Winfield prefers being positioned inside in slot

    winny is the best blitzing corner in the league, play him slot
    Its not braggin if you can do it!!!

  8. #28
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    Re: Winfield prefers being positioned inside in slot

    another thing is on third down most QB's look to there slot guys to get the ball out quickly to and with the pressure that our front four is gonna produce this year, the opposing QB's are gonna want to get rid of it as quickly as possible.

    With Winny in the slot on those types of plays it give us a guy who doesnt have great long speed but has a quick burst and solid tackling ability to cover that slot guy who usually are slower but bigger WRs to contend with LBs on the play.

    Winny can take those guys he has done it for years for us why change that now you but gordon or Mccauley or sapp whoever wins the nickel corner spot on the outside should be able to hold there own for the time that our D line is giving there QB.

    and just to mess with the heads of the O coordinator you can even sneak in Griff on a few plays where you want Winny playing a zone on the outside. cause yes Griff has shown some lack of focus but it will be just another look to give the opposing O. and Griff is a pretty decent tackler also.

  9. #29
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    Re: Winfield prefers being positioned inside in slot

    "DaunteHOF" wrote:
    winny is the best blitzing corner in the league, play him slot
    Hard to believe that when he has one career sack.
    He's great close to the line playing the run, but I don't think he has a resume as a blitzing corner.

    Anyway, thinking about this more I find that I agree with V's comment for the most part.
    The trade-off is do you want your best corner on their best receivers or where there is going to be the most action (both against the run and since a lot of passes are thrown over the middle).
    I would hope that Tyrell Johnson is as good as the team hoped when we drafted him so that we could keep Winfield outside and still be tough and athletic inside.
    When the age of the Vikings came to a close, they must have sensed it. Probably, they gathered together one evening, slapped each other on the back and said, "Hey, good job." - Jack Handey [Deep Thoughts]

  10. #30
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    Re: Winfield prefers being positioned inside in slot

    Winfield just makes plays...like Sharper does.
    End of story.
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