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  1. #21
    Zeus's Avatar
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    Re:Why are we even playing with WEBB at QB?

    tarkenton10 wrote:
    Zeus wrote:
    tarkenton10 wrote:
    Zeus wrote:
    tarkenton10 wrote:
    Zeus wrote:
    tarkenton10 wrote:
    Zeus wrote:
    tarkenton10 wrote:
    I am just scratching my head at some of the moves this guy makes. We will have to wait at least three years to see if Webb can make it at QB. Draft a Qb next year that can play the next year and see what Webb can do at WR.
    What makes you think you can easily convert a college QB to WR? Because of the Matt Jones experiment?

    What makes you think it's just that easy to *snaps fingers* draft a QB and have him be a player?

    I trust the people who actually do football stuff for a living, but that's just me.
    I trust some football people but I don't trust Childress. He does not seem to know what he is doing compared to other people in the league, at least the teams that are elite IMO!

    He played some Wr in college. It is not like he was the starting QB the whole time he played College ball. Running a route tree is not rocket science, I know it would take a long time to learn the nuances of the game. But to run a route and see how his ball hawking skills are especially in preseason is not a strecth.

    How long would it take you to learn a 9 route? :blink:
    I wholeheartedly disagree with the first paragraph. Childress took a team with little to no talent and has built it in 4 years into an NFC Championship contender.

    As to Webb's WR experience - 30 catches in one season at the Div 1-AA level does not pump my nads on his future at the position. If playing WR were as easy as you suggest, there would be more Jerry Rices out there and fewer Aundrae Allisons.

    Darth Vader would kick the Terminators ass, BTW.
    Childress did not take this team to where it is bu trather has been riding on Speilman's good decisons. His only draft choice that I know he wanted was TJ. I am impressed!! I didn't suggest it was easy, I said put him out there and SEE if he can catch, if he has the COORINATION. I am talking about one person, one individual, one skill set that I think may be special at WR.

    I guess you love experiments with 1AA rookie QBs that have a strong arm and run alot. How has that TJ experiment worked out?

    You must have Napolean syndrome if you think Vader is a bad a$$! If he were that bad he would not be part machine anyway!! He got his ASS kicked by some little human Jedi!! The Terminator would rip out Darth's tiny little nads and stick in his mouth!!
    Why is it with the Childress haters that when anything bad happens, it's his fault but when good things happen, it's not because of him?

    Darth Vader would totally put the Force on the Terminator, stopping him in his tracks. No contest
    What is wrong with you? you can't use those jedi mind tricks on a machine. He will never stop don't you understand, never until you are dead! EVER! Sara.....ah I mean Zeus!
    Who said anything about Jedi mind tricks? The Force can be used on INANIMATE objects, dude! Freeze, Arnie. Whap. You're dead.
    What possibly could you throw at the terminator's alloy chasey that could even dent it. Heck they blew him up and the only thing that happened is he got pissed off. If Vader thorws an inanimate object at The Terminator the only thing that will happen is you will have an angry machine then Vader will be his Beyotch
    A light saber will slice him up into Terminator cutlets quicker than you can say "John Connor is my dad."

    =Z=

    Thanks to Josdin for the awesome sig!

  2. #22
    tarkenton10's Avatar
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    Re:Why are we even playing with WEBB at QB?

    Anyone may think what they will, I just don't think you take a flyer on Webb and then put him at QB. He has special qualities that would make him very hard to defend. Three to four years working on him at Qb is a long time especially since we are in the process of doing that with another D1AA QB prospect.

    If he does play QB some of the things that make him special will be lost. Do you think Childress is going to let him run? He has been trying to stop TJ from doing that for four years! I don't know if he will be great at WR but he has the tools to be. I don't know if he will be a great QB and I don't know if he has the tools- that is the difference.

    There s only two things stopping you - fear and common sense!! The Truth you CAN"T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!!!!!!

  3. #23
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    Re:Why are we even playing with WEBB at QB?

    Zeus wrote:
    tarkenton10 wrote:
    Zeus wrote:
    tarkenton10 wrote:
    Zeus wrote:
    tarkenton10 wrote:
    Zeus wrote:
    tarkenton10 wrote:
    Zeus wrote:
    tarkenton10 wrote:
    I am just scratching my head at some of the moves this guy makes. We will have to wait at least three years to see if Webb can make it at QB. Draft a Qb next year that can play the next year and see what Webb can do at WR.
    What makes you think you can easily convert a college QB to WR? Because of the Matt Jones experiment?

    What makes you think it's just that easy to *snaps fingers* draft a QB and have him be a player?

    I trust the people who actually do football stuff for a living, but that's just me.
    I trust some football people but I don't trust Childress. He does not seem to know what he is doing compared to other people in the league, at least the teams that are elite IMO!

    He played some Wr in college. It is not like he was the starting QB the whole time he played College ball. Running a route tree is not rocket science, I know it would take a long time to learn the nuances of the game. But to run a route and see how his ball hawking skills are especially in preseason is not a strecth.

    How long would it take you to learn a 9 route? :blink:
    I wholeheartedly disagree with the first paragraph. Childress took a team with little to no talent and has built it in 4 years into an NFC Championship contender.

    As to Webb's WR experience - 30 catches in one season at the Div 1-AA level does not pump my nads on his future at the position. If playing WR were as easy as you suggest, there would be more Jerry Rices out there and fewer Aundrae Allisons.

    Darth Vader would kick the Terminators ass, BTW.
    Childress did not take this team to where it is bu trather has been riding on Speilman's good decisons. His only draft choice that I know he wanted was TJ. I am impressed!! I didn't suggest it was easy, I said put him out there and SEE if he can catch, if he has the COORINATION. I am talking about one person, one individual, one skill set that I think may be special at WR.

    I guess you love experiments with 1AA rookie QBs that have a strong arm and run alot. How has that TJ experiment worked out?

    You must have Napolean syndrome if you think Vader is a bad a$$! If he were that bad he would not be part machine anyway!! He got his ASS kicked by some little human Jedi!! The Terminator would rip out Darth's tiny little nads and stick in his mouth!!
    Why is it with the Childress haters that when anything bad happens, it's his fault but when good things happen, it's not because of him?

    Darth Vader would totally put the Force on the Terminator, stopping him in his tracks. No contest
    What is wrong with you? you can't use those jedi mind tricks on a machine. He will never stop don't you understand, never until you are dead! EVER! Sara.....ah I mean Zeus!
    Who said anything about Jedi mind tricks? The Force can be used on INANIMATE objects, dude! Freeze, Arnie. Whap. You're dead.
    What possibly could you throw at the terminator's alloy chasey that could even dent it. Heck they blew him up and the only thing that happened is he got pissed off. If Vader thorws an inanimate object at The Terminator the only thing that will happen is you will have an angry machine then Vader will be his Beyotch
    A light saber will slice him up into Terminator cutlets quicker than you can say "John Connor is my dad."

    =Z=
    Where the terminator sticks that light saber would make vader look like a silly popsicle. Heck Vader can barely breath I almost feel sorry for that fat, old, out of shape wanna be jedi!!

    There s only two things stopping you - fear and common sense!! The Truth you CAN"T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!!!!!!

  4. #24
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    Re:Why are we even playing with WEBB at QB?

    I'm sorry guys, I just don't see it yet. At all, Maybe in five years, but I really see no positives in waiting that long for Joe Webb to "arrive".

    Even if we choose not to take the "Super Bowl or Bust" mindset, we could find 10 starting caliber QBs in the time it would take to develop Webb. Cut him. Start over if we must.

    -V-
    "I hate when threads are destroyed by facts and logic."
    - Prophet


    Thanks Josdin!

  5. #25
    Mr Anderson's Avatar
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    Re: Why are we even playing with WEBB at QB?

    gagarr wrote:
    tarkenton10 wrote:
    Mr Anderson wrote:
    "Moss-like skillset" and "if he can catch" really should never be used in the same paragraph, let alone the same sentence. Hand-eye coordination is a huge part of athleticism IMO, and without that coordination, Moss, Andre Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald, etc. Wouldn't be the players that they are.
    The guy is 6' 4" 220 and runs a 4.38 forty. Wouldn't it be worth it to find out if he DOES have the COORDINATION!! Why shouldn't they be in the same paragraph. He has the same skill set as moss how tal is Moss 6' 4". How much does Moss weigh 210. Moss ran a 4.28 forty; Webb a 4.38 forty. Webb has long rangy arms and eerily reminds me of Moss with his build.

    So if HE HAS THE HANDS he could be a very dangerous and Mosslike, IF HE HAS THE HANDS!!
    If he had anything close to "Moss-like" skills he would have been drafted in the 1st or 2nd round. Tall and fast doesn't make you "Moss-like". Dumbest comparison I've read in awhile.

    If he can learn to be a good receiver, he might also learn to be a good QB, since he's had tons more experience doing the later.
    Like he said, tall and fast does not Moss make.

    It's like calling Bruce Campbell "Orlando Pace-like" because he measures well.

    There's way more that goes into it than measurables, and frankly, no one has a "Moss-like skillset," yes I am a crotch sniffer, but it's also the truth. No one is comparable, not even Calvin Johnson.


    Despite that, I do believe Webb has greater upside for this team at WR than he does at QB. We're in a Super Bowl window at the moment and any weapon helps. Several years down the road if/when Webb is an NFL ready QB, we won't be in a position to win a championship.

    His measurables are freakish. He's big, he's fast, and he can jump out of the damn building, and has hands bigger than Favre. But if we wanted him on as a receiver, he would have stayed as a receiver. But that might be attributable to Childress. If Webb does show flashes of brilliance as a passer, combined with his athleticism you have a hell of an intriguing prospect, which may buy him more time as our coach when we inevitably fail in the playoffs this season.

  6. #26
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    Re:Why are we even playing with WEBB at QB?

    Childress's ego thinks he can make a QB out of anyone. I am sure we will try another D1AA QB in two seasons if Webb does not progress as planned. The problem is I don't think it is Chilly's DNA to make QBs he just has the ego part of that equation. Tj may have been a good QB had he been picked by the right coach.

    I am not keen on Webb's delivery but I haven't seen enough of him at QB to tell how good he is. I would love to see him at WR though.

    There s only two things stopping you - fear and common sense!! The Truth you CAN"T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!!!!!!

  7. #27
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    Re:Why are we even playing with WEBB at QB?

    V-Unit wrote:
    I'm sorry guys, I just don't see it yet. At all, Maybe in five years, but I really see no positives in waiting that long for Joe Webb to "arrive".

    Even if we choose not to take the "Super Bowl or Bust" mindset, we could find 10 starting caliber QBs in the time it would take to develop Webb. Cut him. Start over if we must.

    -V-
    Who says it will take 5 years to develop Webb?

    I don't want anyone jumping down my throat with this comparison, but Tom Brady was a 6th rounder out of Michigan with a QB rating of 84 playing only as a senior.

    Brady sat his rookie year behind Bledsoe and the rest is history.

    I couldn't find any stats on Brady's preseasons in 2000 or 2001.
    [size=12pt]
    Page 148.5 **Doleman 150.5 **Randle 137.5 **Allen 73+
    [/size]

  8. #28
    Mr Anderson's Avatar
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    Re:Why are we even playing with WEBB at QB?

    gagarr wrote:
    V-Unit wrote:
    I'm sorry guys, I just don't see it yet. At all, Maybe in five years, but I really see no positives in waiting that long for Joe Webb to "arrive".

    Even if we choose not to take the "Super Bowl or Bust" mindset, we could find 10 starting caliber QBs in the time it would take to develop Webb. Cut him. Start over if we must.

    -V-
    Who says it will take 5 years to develop Webb?

    I don't want anyone jumping down my throat with this comparison, but Tom Brady was a 6th rounder out of Michigan with a QB rating of 84 playing only as a senior.

    Brady sat his rookie year behind Bledsoe and the rest is history.

    I couldn't find any stats on Brady's preseasons in 2000 or 2001.
    There's a pretty big difference between an All-Big Ten QB, who set a big-ten completions record, and won 20 games in two seasons under Lloyd Carr in his hey-day than a guy coming out of University of Alabama at Birmingham and Conference USA. It's just a different level of play, especially at the QB position.

    Does Webb's college past mean he can't play QB in the NFL? No. But the fact that he projected to WR has to mean something, and it's probably not just because he's a great athlete, John Elway was too.

  9. #29
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    Re:Why are we even playing with WEBB at QB?

    I think he would be best suited to be a DB to be honest. He is too raw to transition to the NFL level as an offensive skill player but as a DB he could make the transition.

  10. #30
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    Re:Why are we even playing with WEBB at QB?

    Webb was drafted because, with our all star lineup, there was no one left in the draft that the Vikings felt could contribute to or make the team. Webb's athleticism made him hard to overlook, so he was brought in solely to see what he could do, and if he could do it well enough to be of value to the team. Listing him as a QB was stupid, because we already had 3 QBs. So they listed him as a WR for lack of another place to put him on the roster.

    I have to believe that if he showed legitimate WR skills on the level of Moss, Favre would have had a fit that he wasn't out there as Rice's replacement.

    So far, as a QB, Webb has demonstrated physical skills, the ability to allude a rush and break free from defenders, arm strength, and passing accuracy on a high enough level to make him a pro QB. We've yet to see how well he'll be able to read a defense, anticipate moving windows, and handle the intellectual challenge of memorizing defenses and the tendencies, strengths, and weaknesses of opponents.

    As it stands right now, our final WR core is likely going to be made up of (in no particular order):

    [ol][li]Bernard Berrian[/li]
    [li]Percy Harvin[/li]
    [li]Greg Camarillo[/li]
    [li]Javon Walker[/li]
    [li]Greg Lewis or Logan Payne[/li]
    [/ol]
    One of whom will likely be cut when Rice returns. As I said, if Webb was so good as a WR, Favre would have raised the roof that he wasn't being used as one. So, which of the above WRs should the Vikings cut to make room for him?

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