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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marrdro View Post
    LOL, well played. Well played indeed. Quick question.....did you think our secondary played better yesterday or do you think they looked better because of the DL play made them look better?

    As I watched the game, I sure saw alot of DB's and LB'rs dropping into zones/handing off players in zones than I did man to man coverage.

    Heck Cooks INT was a result of consistent pressure on the QB (making him hurry a throw) than it was from a DB providing man coverage. To tell the truth, Cook was doing just that. Standing back (way behind the receiver) waiting in his zone.
    I think even a broken clock is right twice a day and even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while. This was one game and even though I give them all of the credit in the world for playing a heck of a game, it will take a few more before I consider it a trend.
    At this point I am giving the benefit of the doubt to the changes at LB with Henderson being out. We also lost a starting Safety and IMHO depth is not at the point where that won't go unnoticed.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Purple Floyd View Post
    I think even a broken clock is right twice a day and even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while. This was one game and even though I give them all of the credit in the world for playing a heck of a game, it will take a few more before I consider it a trend.
    At this point I am giving the benefit of the doubt to the changes at LB with Henderson being out. We also lost a starting Safety and IMHO depth is not at the point where that won't go unnoticed.
    Fair enough. I for one don't think Jamarcus is a drop off at S. Kid did pretty good last year at times as one would expect from a kid learning on the field.

    And the replacement at LB was Brinkley, who most contend on here can't get deep enough in the zone on pass plays, which he did quite well yesterday, especially when he wasn't forced to cheat up on the line faking a sugar blitz.
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  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by tastywaves View Post
    Then why do you demand it from Winfield? Isn't he just the victim of a poor DL effort?
    But I don't demand it with Whinny. My issue with him has always been that he gets caught cheating up on the run which leaves to big of a hole between his zone and the S's zone (or LB'rs if he's dropping).

    Long story short, my issue with has nothing to do with man to man coverage.
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  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marrdro View Post
    But I don't demand it with Whinny. My issue with him has always been that he gets caught cheating up on the run which leaves to big of a hole between his zone and the S's zone (or LB'rs if he's dropping).

    Long story short, my issue with has nothing to do with man to man coverage.
    The overall point is that no matter how good your front 4 is performing, you still need to have adequate play in the secondary. When the secondary gets burned, quite often it is on them and not just the front 4. Do you think Seattle would have obtained 8 sacks on Rodgers if they didn't have decent play from the secondary? 3 of their DB's were pro bowler's last year.

    If the DL is under performing, obviously it puts more stress on the secondary. QB's and WR's in this league will beat any secondary given enough time. I just don't think you can simplify the defense down to one aspect. Great defenses are good across the board and not just at nose tackle.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marrdro View Post
    But I don't demand it with Whinny. My issue with him has always been that he gets caught cheating up on the run which leaves to big of a hole between his zone and the S's zone (or LB'rs if he's dropping).

    Long story short, my issue with has nothing to do with man to man coverage.
    When he's cheating on the run, do you have a problem with Winfield blowing past the LB (who happens to be standing still waiting for the RB to come to him) & nailing the RB for little gain or a loss?

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by tastywaves View Post
    The overall point is that no matter how good your front 4 is performing, you still need to have adequate play in the secondary. When the secondary gets burned, quite often it is on them and not just the front 4. Do you think Seattle would have obtained 8 sacks on Rodgers if they didn't have decent play from the secondary? 3 of their DB's were pro bowler's last year.

    If the DL is under performing, obviously it puts more stress on the secondary. QB's and WR's in this league will beat any secondary given enough time. I just don't think you can simplify the defense down to one aspect. Great defenses are good across the board and not just at nose tackle.
    +1

    Don't know why Marty can't see our point on getting a quality secondary that plays great man to man & zone. Having a secondary that plays well only when the DL does may be OK for him, but I prefer a secondary that plays great even when the DL doesn't & vice-versa.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by singersp View Post
    +1

    Don't know why Marty can't see our point on getting a quality secondary that plays great man to man & zone. Having a secondary that plays well only when the DL does may be OK for him, but I prefer a secondary that plays great even when the DL doesn't & vice-versa.
    But I can see your point. You just don't see the point that the ability to go out and find "Quality" like you want (Shut down CB's) is limited by the talent that comes out.

    You want to understand that point, go watch the jets this weekend and see how they do without theirs. Bet they run alot of C2......
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  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by singersp View Post
    When he's cheating on the run, do you have a problem with Winfield blowing past the LB (who happens to be standing still waiting for the RB to come to him) & nailing the RB for little gain or a loss?
    Nope, if its a running play. Do you have a problem when he cheats up on a run play that winds up being a pass play that allows the Jag receiver to cover the whole dang field?
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by tastywaves View Post
    The overall point is that no matter how good your front 4 is performing, you still need to have adequate play in the secondary. When the secondary gets burned, quite often it is on them and not just the front 4. Do you think Seattle would have obtained 8 sacks on Rodgers if they didn't have decent play from the secondary? 3 of their DB's were pro bowler's last year.

    If the DL is under performing, obviously it puts more stress on the secondary. QB's and WR's in this league will beat any secondary given enough time. I just don't think you can simplify the defense down to one aspect. Great defenses are good across the board and not just at nose tackle.
    Well said.

    I just happen to believe that we have decent enough DB's in the backfield. I just think that we need to give them a bit more time and our DL should help them out a bit by getting to the QB a bit more often.

    Problem is, around these parts, everyone still thinks we have the dominant DL from days gone past when we don't.

    Just saying.
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  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marrdro View Post
    Well said.

    I just happen to believe that we have decent enough DB's in the backfield. I just think that we need to give them a bit more time and our DL should help them out a bit by getting to the QB a bit more often.

    Problem is, around these parts, everyone still thinks we have the dominant DL from days gone past when we don't.

    Just saying.
    Good to see you coming around.

    I think we have upgraded this year and have the potential for adequate play this year, but you've been giving the secondary a free ride for the last several years when we were clearly one of the worst secondaries in the NFL. Always putting the blame on the DL.

    I would be thrilled if by the end of the season, we look at the greatest weakness on our defense being the interior of our defensive line.

    BTW: I'm not necessarily of the belief that you have to have shut down corners on your team to be an effective defense. It helps, but many times at too high of a cost. I think safety play has been the bigger issue for this team and am hopeful that Harrison will continue to develop into a long term quality starter for us.

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