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  1. #171
    Minniman's Avatar
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    I have seen nothing from Ponder in either college or the pros to suggest he will be at anywhere near the level of Manning, Brees, or Ryan.

    Griffin, on the other hand, had the best rookie season I have seen since I have seen rookie seasons. His YPA of 8.14 was the best in the league, his 20-5 TD-INT ratio was fantastic, and that was just throwing the ball. Wilson looked very good as well.

    Will Jennings help Ponder? Maybe, but Harvin is one of the best slot receivers in the NFL, and he did not do much to make Ponder even a second quartile quarterback. Harvin did allow Ponder to keep his job by getting insane YAC from throws behind the LOS with a cover guy right on him. Even then, Ponder had the second worst YPA of any starter in the NFL.

  2. #172
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    No excuses now! I love it. Christian has exactly one year to prove himself, or I honestly think we go another direction in the draft next year. Cassel isn't coming in for a stop gap. Not for more than one year anyways.

    Sorry Rick! Keep up the good work.

  3. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikinggreg View Post
    And this would bother you???
    Just stating facts.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  4. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevoncox View Post
    My god what is wrong with you people.....
    How many time must you get your hand burned by fire before you get it.
    No there isn't enough talent on offense. We have a good line but Jennings and Simpson is simply Percy and Simpson re wrapped. The only difference is connections to Jennings will be more typical. Our offense is paltry. The cupboard is bear. Forget last year and Peterson's DAMN NEAR RECORD BREAKING SEASON. It's not the norm. If Peterson goes back to being his regular...superhuman self (1400 yards 13 tds), we win 3 games. I am so sick of people saying if Simpson shows, we have a great offense. No we don't. We have 1 WR. The rest of them are terrible. If simpson shows us the best he has been, we have two WRs. Wright is at best average. We need 1 More WR. That's why a team like the packers can continue to generate WR corps after corps because they address the position. We on the other hand trade 1 star WR for an other and our fans think we are all set.
    I don't see how fans think we are set either.

    We needed a deep threat WR last year. Nothing about that has changed except Jennings is a better deep threat WR than Harvin was.

    This year, we lost 3 WR's and only added 1 & fans think we're fine?

    I agree with Kevin, Jennings was brought in to replace Harvin who was our slot receiver. Ideally one would think we'd see Jennings at WR & Wright in the slot with Simpson added if they ever run with 3 WR's. I think we're going to see Simpson & Jennings in their most of the time.

    Simpson is Simpson & I don't think we'll see this great emergence of him this year like some believe will happen. He caught 1/2 half of the passes he was targeted on. Part of that is on him, part of that is on Ponder.

    Childs is another name that keeps getting tossed out there & some have talked very highly of how good he looked, but the guy hasn't even played in a single preseason game yet & there is only a couple of nice passes the guy caught in practice/scrimmage they are basing it on. He hasn't proven anything on the field yet & I don't know if the guy can even run yet, much less play. There certainly hasn't been much, if anything about his rehab.

    With that said, there is still a need to take one of the better deep threat WR's in the draft. With the other holes created by the loss of a LB & Pro Bowl DB, there are other needs being pushed up to the top as well.

    Latest word is the Vikings might consider resigning Winfield. Sounded like Frasier is pushing for it & after fans showed displeasure with him getting cut, Spielman at least is saying a return is possible, possibly just as a means of damage control.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  5. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by singersp View Post
    I don't see how fans think we are set either.

    We needed a deep threat WR last year. Nothing about that has changed except Jennings is a better deep threat WR than Harvin was.
    Except, you know, we're four days into the offseason and we've traded a headache slot guy for a receiver who can play all positions, and secured another first round pick which will allow us to move if needed to get said deep threat WR if that's the direction Spielman wants to go.
    This year, we lost 3 WR's and only added 1 & fans think we're fine?
    We lost Aromashodu, Jenkins(that one we need to replace) and Harvin (replaced) We've got two first round picks to get WRs, and we may not be done in free agency either.
    Latest word is the Vikings might consider resigning Winfield. Sounded like Frasier is pushing for it & after fans showed displeasure with him getting cut, Spielman at least is saying a return is possible, possibly just as a means of damage control.
    It's probably up to winfield at this point. I think he's going to find out what other teams value him real quick, and IMO, about a 30% chance he comes back here at a reduced rate. There's just not a market for a 36 year old cornerback.

  6. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by i_bleed_purple View Post
    Except, you know, we're four days into the offseason and we've traded a headache slot guy for a receiver who can play all positions, and secured another first round pick which will allow us to move if needed to get said deep threat WR if that's the direction Spielman wants to go.

    We lost Aromashodu, Jenkins(that one we need to replace) and Harvin (replaced) We've got two first round picks to get WRs, and we may not be done in free agency either.


    It's probably up to winfield at this point. I think he's going to find out what other teams value him real quick, and IMO, about a 30% chance he comes back here at a reduced rate. There's just not a market for a 36 year old cornerback.
    Yep, we got those 2 first round picks that we could use on WR's. We definitely should be taking one of the top deep threat WR.

    You're missing the point though. There are those who think we are "set" right now the way we are & don't think we need to get another WR via FA or the draft. I beg to differ with that & that is what Kevon is trying to drive home.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  7. #177
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    I like Jennings as a team fit, and so I like him a lil bit more than Harvin at the moment, but I sure as hell don't think it fixes our WR situation!! His running before the catch will help, but we'll still miss Harvin's uncanny YAC. Basically a sideways move, right back to where we were as the 31st team in the league in passing yards per game, and average per completion. Sure, we are also 28th in attempts per game, limiting our chances, but with all the attention focused on Peterson, we should sure as hell have a lot better yards/catch average than 6.1, 2nd worst in the NFL.

    I still think we draft 2 WRs by the end of round 4. I don't think we have to reach in the 1st round anymore, because we do have Jennings as no.1, Wright as a developmental/slot guy and a gamble on Simpson that he has a healthier year with more focus since he's finished with suspension...but, by my math, that is about 2.5 WRs, and only one is a legit starter at this time. We still need 2 more, and I am way over hoping some undrafted guy from nowhere school is going to suddenly bust out as the next Victor Cruz! How many years has it been since that happened!??

    But, I am totally down with a situation like this NFL Mock Draft 2013 Picks 17-32

    where we land immediate starters at two positions on defense in the first, by taking Marcus Trufant at CB and Sly Williams at DT. And, then they have Tavon Austin falling to us in round 2!!!?!! I'd also be into looking at guys like Terrance Williams, maybe Justin Hunter or Robert Woods in the 2nd, and then again, at Ryan Swope, Stedman Bailey, Quinton Patton or maybe Marcus Wheaton somewhere in rounds 3-4.

    We simply cannot continue to hope guys like Aromashadu and Stephen Burton are going to suddenly blow up and fix our passing attack. We need more speed, better route-running and more reliable hands than what 2 years of that have shown or next year at this time we'll still be hearing all the same excuses for why our QB doesn't cut it because we never gave him a chance. At this point I think we have to put the weapons in place, prove one way or the other whether Ponder can get the job done, and either move on or move up depending on the results.
    Control the line, control the time, and give your D a chance to shine!!

    "Balance it on end and thats the third side of the coin!!" -wookiefoot

  8. #178
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    Quote Originally Posted by singersp View Post
    Yep, we got those 2 first round picks that we could use on WR's. We definitely should be taking one of the top deep threat WR.

    You're missing the point though. There are those who think we are "set" right now the way we are & don't think we need to get another WR via FA or the draft. I beg to differ with that & that is what Kevon is trying to drive home.
    Who?

    I don't think anyone feels that we are "set" and don't need to make any more moves this offseason, either in the draft or in FA. AFAIK, nobody has ever said that we can now ignore the WR position.

    I believe most people feel that we are making some great strides, and have done as much or more than expected at this point in the offseason. I think we have a better base WR corps right now than we did at the end of the season, and we still have the time, money, and draft picks to continue to improve it.

    For you and kevon and anyone else who seems to be so upset with the direction we are going, exactly what else would you like to see the Vikings do?
    Zeus wrote:
    When are you going to realize that picking out the 20 bad throws this year and ignoring the 300 good ones does not make your point?

    =Z=

  9. #179
    Flair Hay is offline Rookie
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    We're definitely not "set" at the WR position at all. Bit I do think its debatable if we need to address it in the first round.

    I think it would benefit the team as a whole just as much to go defense/unexpected BPA with both first rounders. Then use the extra fourth to either move up in the second a fair bit, or turn the 3rd into a 2nd to grab a reciever.

    We can add as many WR as our hearts desire, but for the first 58 mins of every game we're going to live and die by Adrian and our defense. With Wright as a capable #3, we really only need to draft one wide out in my eyes.

    If Childs/Simpson are both inadequate as a #4/injury replacement this year then we can look to draft a WR in the 2014 draft having already replenished the defense in 2013.

  10. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flair Hay View Post
    We're definitely not "set" at the WR position at all. Bit I do think its debatable if we need to address it in the first round.

    I think it would benefit the team as a whole just as much to go defense/unexpected BPA with both first rounders. Then use the extra fourth to either move up in the second a fair bit, or turn the 3rd into a 2nd to grab a reciever.

    We can add as many WR as our hearts desire, but for the first 58 mins of every game we're going to live and die by Adrian and our defense. With Wright as a capable #3, we really only need to draft one wide out in my eyes.

    If Childs/Simpson are both inadequate as a #4/injury replacement this year then we can look to draft a WR in the 2014 draft having already replenished the defense in 2013.
    I agree that you don't want to reach for a position or need and that you should use the BPA approach to put the best talent on your team. When your grades are similar for different players, then you factor need into it.

    It's very probably that a MLB, corner or DT are the best player's on the board in round 1. If that is the case, I have no issue in going in that direction. I would guess Spielman will do the same.

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