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  1. #101
    tb04512's Avatar
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    Re: Vikings-Chiefs Postgame Thread [R]

    "Braddock" wrote:
    "marstc09" wrote:
    "tb04512" wrote:
    "marstc09" wrote:
    "tb04512" wrote:
    [quote author=marstc09 link=topic=52864.msg986952#msg986952 date=1251046092]
    [quote author=tb04512 link=topic=52864.msg986938#msg986938 date=1251044749]
    [quote author=BleedinPandG link=topic=52864.msg986821#msg986821 date=1251000251]
    Oofta... people are still TJ bashing... lets remember 1 thing... it doesn't have to be pretty, it has to be caught... the TD pass to Shank was caught.

    TJ seems to go through a lot more progressions, takes a lot longer in the pocket to throw... frankly, if he has the time there's nothing wrong with that but I don't believe he'd have that time with our normal pass blocking.
    He has to gain confidence throwing to marginally covered primary receivers.

    What I was disappointed in was our WRs hot reads.
    The Chiefs were blitzing like crazy.
    Our WRs also need to recognize that and cut off their routes so a QB has a chance to make a throw before getting planted.
    Blame our O Line all you want, when their are more defenders coming then linemen to block, the QB is going to get hit.
    That's simply 2nd grade math.
    Even with that, Favre didn't take a single sack.
    That speaks to his decision making and quick release.
    TJ would have been sacked no question, I believe Sage would have as well.
    Ours WRs need to learn to anticipate those blitzes, get the quick pass, and beat the 1 guy they'll need to in order to score.

    2 and 0... marked improvement in several areas... potential in a few more... going to be a fun year.
    exactly he got the job done, had a perfect qb rating and he still isn't good enough for some people
    What is the definition of consistency?
    did i say anything about that? no i said he got the job done, and it still isn't good enough.. and consistency is throwing over 15 picks every year
    Yes you did. You said it still isn't good enough. It is not good enough until we see this every Sunday.
    no i did not, he had a great game and still people are complaining about the passes and the footwork.. people just hate to hate
    [/quote]

    They complain cause he is inconsistent. What are you not understanding? Sometimes his passes and footwork are good and sometimes they are not.
    [/quote]

    And tb is saying that when TJ does well, he doesn't get the kudos he deserves, yet gets more than enough criticism when he does poorly. What don't YOU understand about that?
    [/quote]
    well put!

    Thanks josdin00

  2. #102
    marstc09's Avatar
    marstc09 is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Vikings-Chiefs Postgame Thread [R]

    "Braddock" wrote:
    "marstc09" wrote:
    "tb04512" wrote:
    "marstc09" wrote:
    "tb04512" wrote:
    [quote author=marstc09 link=topic=52864.msg986952#msg986952 date=1251046092]
    [quote author=tb04512 link=topic=52864.msg986938#msg986938 date=1251044749]
    [quote author=BleedinPandG link=topic=52864.msg986821#msg986821 date=1251000251]
    Oofta... people are still TJ bashing... lets remember 1 thing... it doesn't have to be pretty, it has to be caught... the TD pass to Shank was caught.

    TJ seems to go through a lot more progressions, takes a lot longer in the pocket to throw... frankly, if he has the time there's nothing wrong with that but I don't believe he'd have that time with our normal pass blocking.
    He has to gain confidence throwing to marginally covered primary receivers.

    What I was disappointed in was our WRs hot reads.
    The Chiefs were blitzing like crazy.
    Our WRs also need to recognize that and cut off their routes so a QB has a chance to make a throw before getting planted.
    Blame our O Line all you want, when their are more defenders coming then linemen to block, the QB is going to get hit.
    That's simply 2nd grade math.
    Even with that, Favre didn't take a single sack.
    That speaks to his decision making and quick release.
    TJ would have been sacked no question, I believe Sage would have as well.
    Ours WRs need to learn to anticipate those blitzes, get the quick pass, and beat the 1 guy they'll need to in order to score.

    2 and 0... marked improvement in several areas... potential in a few more... going to be a fun year.
    exactly he got the job done, had a perfect qb rating and he still isn't good enough for some people
    What is the definition of consistency?
    did i say anything about that? no i said he got the job done, and it still isn't good enough.. and consistency is throwing over 15 picks every year
    Yes you did. You said it still isn't good enough. It is not good enough until we see this every Sunday.
    no i did not, he had a great game and still people are complaining about the passes and the footwork.. people just hate to hate
    [/quote]

    They complain cause he is inconsistent. What are you not understanding? Sometimes his passes and footwork are good and sometimes they are not.
    [/quote]

    And tb is saying that when TJ does well, he doesn't get the kudos he deserves, yet gets more than enough criticism when he does poorly. What don't YOU understand about that?
    [/quote]

    Show me a post that is not giving TJ any credit at all? I bet you can't find one. Understand yet?

  3. #103
    grpape is offline Asst. Coach
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    Re: Vikings-Chiefs Postgame Thread [R]

    "gagarr" wrote:
    JDB's play:

    I really didn't see a darn thing wrong with his play!
    Someone said he threw off his back foot.
    He did it twice, once when it was a screen and another when he was under pressure.

    The rest of the time he stood tall in the pocket and delivered the ball fluidly.

    I would have loved to see him be able to do something on the final drive, but in classic Chilly fashion, IN A DARN playoff game, he gets ultra conservative and won't let a QB that is 6 of 8 for 61 yds throw the ball.
    He runs the ball 6 times in a row, even after penalties makes it 1st and 20, 2nd and 18, and 3rd and 18.
    Jeez... does he even want to evaluate what the guy can do under pressure?
    At least call a safe screen pass!

    I can sort of understand trying to protect a lead, but it's a preseason game?
    Where you want to evaluate and give guys reps in a game situation.
    I think it did a serious disservice to JDB.
    I think Chilly might not be sold on what to do with Ian Johnson. This is probably why he is running more than letting JDB pass.

  4. #104
    grpape is offline Asst. Coach
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    Re: Vikings-Chiefs Postgame Thread [R]

    "Caine" wrote:
    "skum" wrote:
    "Yfz01" wrote:
    I cant believe some of you are only "okay" with T-Jacks performance.
    He played great last night.
    We would be lucky to have a QB play anywhere near that good in the regular season.
    Sure, he held on to the ball too long but he went through progressions and hit the open man.
    He had only one bad throw!
    That play to Shancoe is caught almost every time.
    Shanc is a mis match for almost anyone on the field.
    About him throwing it 5 yards over the line of scrimmage, I remember Favre doing that same thing against us in the 04 playoffs.
    Also loved the way T-Jack avoided pressure.

    This performance >> Sage performance last week.
    This post is futile because Favre will start no matter what happens and everyone will continue to ride his jock.
    +1
    It's not a question of one performance....it's a question of consistancy.

    We've all seen Jackson have a good game...he's had a couple of them.
    But we've also all seen him surround those good games with a lot of mediocre preformances and some downright craptacular ones.
    And, when you take it all as a whole, his bad has far and away outdistanced his good.

    Now, the question of "WHY" Jackson is the way he is has been debated over and over...and most of us agree that he was put in too soon, and I have gone so far as to say that Chiller ruined him by doing so.


    But at the end of the day none of that matters.
    What matters is our need for consistant play from the QB position...and most of us don't believe that Jackson will give us that.

    Jackson looked good last night.
    A few flaws, but a solid overall performance.
    Sadly, too many factors conspire to make that irrelevant.
    And the chief among those is his lack of consistancy.
    Especially when we only have to look back 1 week to remind us of what we usually see...

    Caine
    So who do you let go? According to you all of our QBs (other than Favre) are crap. Do you keep Sage as the primary #2 and TJ as the #3 and try and sneak JDB to the practice squad? Do you try and trade TJ and get something for him? What would you do?

    I personally think that there is no way Chilly tries to trade or cuts TJ. He still shows that there could be a QB in there if given the chance to learn without being pressured to take this team to the dance. Some on this site wanted to trade for Cambell (sp). Did you see his last game? Peew! It won't cost much to keep TJ as #2 or #3, and try and sneak JDB on the practice squad. Favre might not even make it past game six if we can't protect him.

  5. #105
    grpape is offline Asst. Coach
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    Re: Vikings-Chiefs Postgame Thread [R]

    "gagarr" wrote:
    "kevoncox" wrote:
    Not sure why people felt Tj looked good last night. He looked great.
    If he can do this on a weekly basis, He would be our started. It's the one thing that drives me crazy about this guy. Just when you start to throw dirt on him, he pulls himself out of the hole.
    I think TJ played a ver good game, what's even scarier is there were lots of easy ways he could have played even better.
    i.e. instead of running over the LOS, throw the ball to the wide open AD, 9 yards in front of him before he crossed the LOS.

    Instead of staring down and throwing at B. Williams for wild incompletion, go throught the progression and look back to his right to see a WIDE open Broughton, his check down guy, who was waiting for the ball.

    I'm not trying to trash TJ, I'm just saying if he was a bit more composed, he could have been even better.
    I'm sure he's looking at film, saying "How couldn't I see that guy?"
    "I could or should have done that too"

    In Favre's few plays, I didn't see one open guy that he could have hit in the small amount of time KC gave him.
    Next week I will be going through frame by frame on my TIVO, disecting Favre's game.
    If I see open receivers, I will let you all know.
    And even missing these reads, what was his QB rating for that night (believe it or not, it was perfect)? I know it's pre-season and all, but......I'm not saying, I'm just saying. Can't cut this guy just yet.

  6. #106
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    Re: Vikings-Chiefs Postgame Thread [R]

    "gagarr" wrote:
    In Favre's few plays, I didn't see one open guy that he could have hit in the small amount of time KC gave him.
    Next week I will be going through frame by frame on my TIVO, disecting Favre's game.
    If I see open receivers, I will let you all know.
    And that is key. Watch for teams to be doing exactly that on a consistent basis throughout the year. For those of us who have watched Favre for several years, once the O-line allows the defense to get to Favre too often, he gets rattled & makes mistakes. His quick release is nice, but a quick release is only as good as our receivers ability to quickly get open to catch them. Quite frankly, I don't think our receivers are that good when it comes to then getting open quickly. As you saw on Friday, it wasn't happening.

    The ones that I think can pull it off are Shiancoe & Harvin if they get sent on routes that allow them to do so.

    I hope to see a lot of Harvin coming full throttle across the middle & being hit in stride. I've been hoping to see that play called a lot more than I have since Childress took over, but he hasn't done it enough.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  7. #107
    singersp's Avatar
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    Re: Vikings-Chiefs Postgame Thread [R]

    "kevoncox" wrote:

    I don't blame our Oline. People on this board have a heard time under standing that 5 cannot block 7. I guess they don't understand that on third down, most DCs send the house and leave man on man on the outside.
    5 lineman can't block 7, but 5 linemen, a RB & a FB &/or TE should be able to. This is why it is imperative that AD learns how to pass block.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  8. #108
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    Re: Vikings-Chiefs Postgame Thread [R]

    "snowinapril" wrote:

    # Shiancoe continues to rise up people’s fantasy boards with every catch.
    Duh!
    His numbers last season were pretty darn good.
    Rank up there in the top TEs for TDs.
    He was just lacking in the number of receptions, which I think will go up this season.
    You listen to him talk in interviews, and he seems to be a leader on this team.
    He says the right stuff.
    He has elevated his offseason and his knowledge of the game and his position year after year being here.
    Not bad for a TE that many threw under the bus last year & wanted cut from the team.

    :P


    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  9. #109
    Ranger's Avatar
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    Re: Vikings-Chiefs Postgame Thread [R]

    "singersp" wrote:
    "snowinapril" wrote:

    # Shiancoe continues to rise up people’s fantasy boards with every catch.
    Duh!
    His numbers last season were pretty darn good.
    Rank up there in the top TEs for TDs.
    He was just lacking in the number of receptions, which I think will go up this season.
    You listen to him talk in interviews, and he seems to be a leader on this team.
    He says the right stuff.
    He has elevated his offseason and his knowledge of the game and his position year after year being here.
    Not bad for a TE that many threw under the bus last year & wanted cut from the team.

    :P

    I chucked him under the bus big time when he first got here and had all of those drops.
    I thought he was an overpaid backup tightend in a system that would demand a skilled player at that position.

    I was completely stupid and wrong, and I most humbly beg the forgiveness of V. "The Meat Hammer" Shank and those who stood by their man.

  10. #110
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    Re: Vikings-Chiefs Postgame Thread [R]

    "tb04512" wrote:
    "marstc09" wrote:
    "tb04512" wrote:
    "BleedinPandG" wrote:
    Oofta... people are still TJ bashing... lets remember 1 thing... it doesn't have to be pretty, it has to be caught... the TD pass to Shank was caught.

    TJ seems to go through a lot more progressions, takes a lot longer in the pocket to throw... frankly, if he has the time there's nothing wrong with that but I don't believe he'd have that time with our normal pass blocking.
    He has to gain confidence throwing to marginally covered primary receivers.

    What I was disappointed in was our WRs hot reads.
    The Chiefs were blitzing like crazy.
    Our WRs also need to recognize that and cut off their routes so a QB has a chance to make a throw before getting planted.
    Blame our O Line all you want, when their are more defenders coming then linemen to block, the QB is going to get hit.
    That's simply 2nd grade math.
    Even with that, Favre didn't take a single sack.
    That speaks to his decision making and quick release.
    TJ would have been sacked no question, I believe Sage would have as well.
    Ours WRs need to learn to anticipate those blitzes, get the quick pass, and beat the 1 guy they'll need to in order to score.

    2 and 0... marked improvement in several areas... potential in a few more... going to be a fun year.
    exactly he got the job done, had a perfect qb rating and he still isn't good enough for some people
    What is the definition of consistency?
    did i say anything about that? no i said he got the job done, and it still isn't good enough.. and consistency is throwing over 15 picks every year
    LOL. Burned!

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

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