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  1. #61
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re:Unnamed Opponent Slams McKinnie, Other Vikings

    Caine wrote:
    IF I'm reading this right, Marrdro is claiming that the Defense without Winfield FELT more cohesive...is that accurate?

    See, the trouble here is that "felt" is subjective. Marrdro FELT more comfortable in the performance of the Defense WITHOUT Winfield on the field...even though the statistics don't support his FEELINGS, they also don't completely invalidate them.

    The fact is, I didn't notice a huge drop off in our performance defensively despite the loss of Winfield and Griffin. We didn't FEEL weaker...even though we may have statistically given up a bit more. My confidence level remained about teh same, despite the loss of our two starters.

    And isn't that sort of an indictment of the level of our secondary? I have stated numerous times that I think our secondary sucks...the only thing that saves us is the play of the front 4...and when they falter, we don't do so well.

    Bottom line, we need more production from our secondary. And honestly, as much as I personally like Winfield, I don't care WHO steps up and makes things happen back there as long as someone does.

    Caine
    I stand corrected, this is classic Caine. That funny shit about the lotion is a new Caine showing his funny side.

    I agree with everything you said my friend, especially the point on the front 4.

    the only thing that saves us is the play of the front 4...and when they falter, we don't do so well.
    Top shelf, top shelf indeed. Excellent post.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  2. #62
    MaxVike's Avatar
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    Re:Unnamed Opponent Slams McKinnie, Other Vikings

    i_bleed_purple wrote:
    You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

    “They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

    “Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

    “In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”
    That seems 100% accurate to me
    This is nothing more than a rant from a sour grapes player that the Vikes beat last year...my guess a defensive lineman. According to nfl.com, the Vikes had the 5th ranked offense in terms of yards, the 17th ranked offensive line, were #2 in touchdowns, and #2 in PPG. The Vikes had a great year and this cowardly, "unnamed player" can kiss my ass.

    Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent
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    As a matter of fact, I do know

  3. #63
    i_bleed_purple's Avatar
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    Re:Unnamed Opponent Slams McKinnie, Other Vikings

    MaxVike wrote:
    i_bleed_purple wrote:
    You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

    “They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

    “Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

    “In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”
    That seems 100% accurate to me
    This is nothing more than a rant from a sour grapes player that the Vikes beat last year...my guess a defensive lineman. According to nfl.com, the Vikes had the 5th ranked offense in terms of yards, the 17th ranked offensive line, were #2 in touchdowns, and #2 in PPG. The Vikes had a great year and this cowardly, "unnamed player" can kiss my ass.
    enlighten me then. What did he say you didn't agree with? He didn't say the Vikings were a bad team, or overrated. He pointed out the flaws on the team, which are fairly evident.

  4. #64
    MaxVike's Avatar
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    Re:Unnamed Opponent Slams McKinnie, Other Vikings

    i_bleed_purple wrote:
    MaxVike wrote:
    i_bleed_purple wrote:
    You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

    “They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

    “Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

    “In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”
    That seems 100% accurate to me
    This is nothing more than a rant from a sour grapes player that the Vikes beat last year...my guess a defensive lineman. According to nfl.com, the Vikes had the 5th ranked offense in terms of yards, the 17th ranked offensive line, were #2 in touchdowns, and #2 in PPG. The Vikes had a great year and this cowardly, "unnamed player" can kiss my ass.
    enlighten me then. What did he say you didn't agree with? He didn't say the Vikings were a bad team, or overrated. He pointed out the flaws on the team, which are fairly evident.
    To start, I should have deleted your comment, because it really had nothing to do with my point. Your post was the most brief that contained the Player's quote...so, I was not challenging you.

    With that said, his opening salvo states that the offensive line is "way overrated." Who is "overrating" the offensive line that is a part of the 5th ranked offense, and #2 scoring offense? I agree that they are not the best, just thought his point screams of sour grapes.

    Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent
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    As a matter of fact, I do know

  5. #65
    i_bleed_purple's Avatar
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    Re:Unnamed Opponent Slams McKinnie, Other Vikings

    MaxVike wrote:
    i_bleed_purple wrote:
    MaxVike wrote:
    i_bleed_purple wrote:
    You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

    “They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

    “Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

    “In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”
    That seems 100% accurate to me
    This is nothing more than a rant from a sour grapes player that the Vikes beat last year...my guess a defensive lineman. According to nfl.com, the Vikes had the 5th ranked offense in terms of yards, the 17th ranked offensive line, were #2 in touchdowns, and #2 in PPG. The Vikes had a great year and this cowardly, "unnamed player" can kiss my ass.
    enlighten me then. What did he say you didn't agree with? He didn't say the Vikings were a bad team, or overrated. He pointed out the flaws on the team, which are fairly evident.
    To start, I should have deleted your comment, because it really had nothing to do with my point. Your post was the most brief that contained the Player's quote...so, I was not challenging you.

    With that said, his opening salvo states that the offensive line is "way overrated." Who is "overrating" the offensive line that is a part of the 5th ranked offense, and #2 scoring offense? I agree that they are not the best, just thought his point screams of sour grapes.
    McKinnie: Incredibly overrated.
    Hutch was hurt
    Sullivan played mediocre at best
    Herrerra played poorly this year (aparantly he was hurt all eyar too)
    Load was a rookie

    We were given credit for line play, when really, our line play was quite bad. Only reason we did great is because we have superstars at skill positions.

  6. #66
    ndnorseman is offline Pro-Bowler
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    Re:Unnamed Opponent Slams McKinnie, Other Vikings

    Caine wrote:
    Bottom line, we need more production from our secondary. And honestly, as much as I personally like Winfield, I don't care WHO steps up and makes things happen back there as long as someone does.

    Caine
    That line right there could, for me anyway, be quoted like so:

    Bottom line, [strike]we need more production from our secondary. And honestly,[/strike] as much as I personally like [strike]Winfield[/strike] the players on our team, I don't care WHO steps up and makes things happen [strike]back there[/strike] as long as someone does.

    That especially goes for the QB position...

  7. #67
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re:Unnamed Opponent Slams McKinnie, Other Vikings

    ndnorseman wrote:
    Caine wrote:
    Bottom line, we need more production from our secondary. And honestly, as much as I personally like Winfield, I don't care WHO steps up and makes things happen back there as long as someone does.

    Caine
    That line right there could, for me anyway, be quoted like so:

    Bottom line, [strike]we need more production from our secondary. And honestly,[/strike] as much as I personally like [strike]Winfield[/strike] the players on our team, I don't care WHO steps up and makes things happen [strike]back there[/strike] as long as someone does.

    That especially goes for the QB position...
    I think you need to post more often.

    Good stuff my friend. Good stuff indeed. Consider yourself bumped a few columns on the ole spreadsheet.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  8. #68
    tastywaves's Avatar
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    Re:Unnamed Opponent Slams McKinnie, Other Vikings

    ndnorseman wrote:
    Caine wrote:
    Bottom line, we need more production from our secondary. And honestly, as much as I personally like Winfield, I don't care WHO steps up and makes things happen back there as long as someone does.

    Caine
    That line right there could, for me anyway, be quoted like so:

    Bottom line, [strike]we need more production from our secondary. And honestly,[/strike] as much as I personally like [strike]Winfield[/strike] the players on our team, I don't care WHO steps up and makes things happen [strike]back there[/strike] as long as someone does.

    That especially goes for the QB position...
    Very true, and most posters would no doubt agree with you. There is always love for certain players, but I doubt many people would put that above overall team play.

    The debates occur as to who gives us the best chance to perform on the field and then grading how well a player really did perform. Many different viewpoints on what determines good play by a player, especially in football where there are a large number of players with many responsibilities with causal effects and limited camera views for the casual spectator to watch from.

    Bottom line is we have no say in the matter anyways, so the best we can do is go by the coaches decisions on who to play and hope they know what they are doing. If people want verification of their viewpoints, IMO, that is as good as they'll get.

  9. #69
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    Re:Unnamed Opponent Slams McKinnie, Other Vikings

    Team Pass Protection Rankings - 12-1



    No. 8 -- Minnesota Vikings For all the Vikings' deficiencies as a group of run blockers (they have all the coherence of a bunch of 6-year-olds chasing the ball in a soccer game), as pass protectors they should have been at the head of this list. They have a tight end in Jimmy Kleinsasser who blocks about as well as most tackles; a QB who literally has seen more on a football field than any other; a beast named Adrian Peterson in the backfield who is just coming into his own in the field of punishing blitzers; and a group of linemen who have the potential to be as good as it gets. But they still only make No. 8. Why? It boils down to the fact that tackles Bryant McKinnie and Phil Loadholt have all the talent in the world but lack the consistency to be great very good. Though it's unfair to take Loadholt to task too much about this, McKinnie is another matter. Games like he had against the Panthers, or the Lions in Week 2, are unacceptable for a player of his stature and he really needs to sort out his act in order for this group to improve.

  10. #70
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    Re:Unnamed Opponent Slams McKinnie, Other Vikings

    slavinator wrote:
    Team Pass Protection Rankings - 12-1



    No. 8 -- Minnesota Vikings For all the Vikings' deficiencies as a group of run blockers (they have all the coherence of a bunch of 6-year-olds chasing the ball in a soccer game), as pass protectors they should have been at the head of this list. They have a tight end in Jimmy Kleinsasser who blocks about as well as most tackles; a QB who literally has seen more on a football field than any other; a beast named Adrian Peterson in the backfield who is just coming into his own in the field of punishing blitzers; and a group of linemen who have the potential to be as good as it gets. But they still only make No. 8. Why? It boils down to the fact that tackles Bryant McKinnie and Phil Loadholt have all the talent in the world but lack the consistency to be great very good. Though it's unfair to take Loadholt to task too much about this, McKinnie is another matter. Games like he had against the Panthers, or the Lions in Week 2, are unacceptable for a player of his stature and he really needs to sort out his act in order for this group to improve.
    Thats pretty funny!

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