Unnamed Opponent Slams McKinnie, Other Vikings

**slavinator** · 06-23-2010, 11:17 AM

Marrdro wrote:

i_bleed_purple wrote:

Marrdro wrote:

i_bleed_purple wrote:

You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

“They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

“Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

“In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”

That seems 100% accurate to me

Other than maybe the Winfield comment about being the best guy back there along with the Chester Taylor loss will hurt us comment, yes, I agree.

So you think that TJ, MW and Sheppard are better than Winny?

Based on what? (Last I checked, Griffen wasn't back there, and isn't expected to be)

Last time I checked, Whinny isn't either.

As to the crop, I was talking about Griff so you make a good point. As I think about it now that you made that point, I think Lito is better. Sapp and AA seemed to fit in well last year, especially in the pass protection area.

I will give you run support in Whinny lane, but again, I want my CB to pass defend first, help in the run second.

I agree with where you are both coming from. Here is my take:

Winfield is about the most physical run support corner in the league and was hampered by injuries last year. He was exploited a bit in pass coverage. One of my favorite memories of this year was Gruden gushing over Winfield's physical line play.

Whats important to me is that we addressed the secondary in the draft and FA. Jamarcus and Asher filled in pretty well and they all seem to be focused on being a more physical secondary.

I like the moves we made to address the stuff in the secondary. Losing Chester is going to hurt us FAR more than any of us want to acknowledge. I like the young and old mix on the team and hope we can get a couple new guys to step up and put their print on an otherwise stacked roster.

**Marrdro** · 06-23-2010, 11:26 AM

slavinator wrote:

Marrdro wrote:

i_bleed_purple wrote:

Marrdro wrote:

i_bleed_purple wrote:

You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

“They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

“Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

“In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”

That seems 100% accurate to me

Other than maybe the Winfield comment about being the best guy back there along with the Chester Taylor loss will hurt us comment, yes, I agree.

So you think that TJ, MW and Sheppard are better than Winny?

Based on what? (Last I checked, Griffen wasn't back there, and isn't expected to be)

Last time I checked, Whinny isn't either.

As to the crop, I was talking about Griff so you make a good point. As I think about it now that you made that point, I think Lito is better. Sapp and AA seemed to fit in well last year, especially in the pass protection area.

I will give you run support in Whinny lane, but again, I want my CB to pass defend first, help in the run second.

I agree with where you are both coming from. Here is my take:

Winfield is about the most physical run support corner in the league and was hampered by injuries last year. He was exploited a bit in pass coverage. One of my favorite memories of this year was Gruden gushing over Winfield's physical line play.

Whats important to me is that we addressed the secondary in the draft and FA. Jamarcus and Asher filled in pretty well and they all seem to be focused on being a more physical secondary.

I like the moves we made to address the stuff in the secondary. Losing Chester is going to hurt us FAR more than any of us want to acknowledge. I like the young and old mix on the team and hope we can get a couple new guys to step up and put their print on an otherwise stacked roster.

Ole Slav, bringing the "A" game to the table......

Excellent post my friend.

One comment/discussion point. I just don't see CT's absence being that big of a deal, other than what he will do for the Bores.

We have a nice bunch of guys competing for the 2nd and 3rd string duties were I think you will see the two that win, bring a nice mix of what CT used to do on his own.

**slavinator** · 06-23-2010, 11:38 AM

Marrdro wrote:

slavinator wrote:

Marrdro wrote:

i_bleed_purple wrote:

Marrdro wrote:

i_bleed_purple wrote:

You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

“They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

“Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

“In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”

That seems 100% accurate to me

Other than maybe the Winfield comment about being the best guy back there along with the Chester Taylor loss will hurt us comment, yes, I agree.

So you think that TJ, MW and Sheppard are better than Winny?

Based on what? (Last I checked, Griffen wasn't back there, and isn't expected to be)

Last time I checked, Whinny isn't either.

As to the crop, I was talking about Griff so you make a good point. As I think about it now that you made that point, I think Lito is better. Sapp and AA seemed to fit in well last year, especially in the pass protection area.

I will give you run support in Whinny lane, but again, I want my CB to pass defend first, help in the run second.

I agree with where you are both coming from. Here is my take:

Winfield is about the most physical run support corner in the league and was hampered by injuries last year. He was exploited a bit in pass coverage. One of my favorite memories of this year was Gruden gushing over Winfield's physical line play.

Whats important to me is that we addressed the secondary in the draft and FA. Jamarcus and Asher filled in pretty well and they all seem to be focused on being a more physical secondary.

I like the moves we made to address the stuff in the secondary. Losing Chester is going to hurt us FAR more than any of us want to acknowledge. I like the young and old mix on the team and hope we can get a couple new guys to step up and put their print on an otherwise stacked roster.

Ole Slav, bringing the "A" game to the table......

Excellent post my friend.

One comment/discussion point. I just don't see CT's absence being that big of a deal, other than what he will do for the Bores.

We have a nice bunch of guys competing for the 2nd and 3rd string duties were I think you will see the two that win, bring a nice mix of what CT used to do on his own.

CT was absolutely huge on 3rd downs for us, even when the whole world knew he was going to catch a little screen pass.

While Moats, Toby, Albert, Reynaud, and Percy bring something to the table, I think that CT's contributions last year were overshadowed by so many other stars on the team.

I just think it is tough to bottle up Chester and facing him 2x per year instead of Forte, with Martz as the OC our defense will be tested.

**jmcdon00** · 06-23-2010, 01:45 PM

i_bleed_purple wrote:

You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

“They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

“Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

“In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”

That seems 100% accurate to me

Some good points in there, but alot of rubbish too. Fact is this team has as much talent as any in the league.

The offensive line is not that good, but I really don't recall anyone saying they were. McKinnie shouldn't have made the pro-bowl that is true, but everyone already knows that.

Our recievers are more than just fast. Rice has great hands. Harvin is great after the catch. Berrian brings alot of leadership and experience. One of the most complete groups in the NFL, IMHO.
Adrian Peterson is very rarely famine, most of the time he's feast. Over 1800 hundred yards and 18 tds. He scored TD's in 12 of 16 games last year. In the 4 that he didn't score a TD he had 99yds, 166yds, 98yds, 65yds rushing/recieving. No back has been more consistant over the last 3 years.

Defense, yeah I agree they are stacked up the wazoo with talent.

Secondary, I agree. Not as good as the best defensive line in the NFL. That's really not saying much. Probably the area the team improved the most in the off-season.

**marshallvike** · 06-23-2010, 03:56 PM

Marrdro wrote:

i_bleed_purple wrote:

You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

“They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

“Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

“In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”

That seems 100% accurate to me

Other than maybe the Winfield comment about being the best guy back there along with the Chester Taylor loss will hurt us comment, yes, I agree.

come on marr. how more proof do you need. stated right here in black and white by an oppoonent who doesn't have the stones to put his name to his comments.
I'm going with it.

Winfield is the best!!!

**i_bleed_purple** · 06-23-2010, 04:05 PM

jmcdon00 wrote:

i_bleed_purple wrote:

You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

“They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

“Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

“In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”

That seems 100% accurate to me

Some good points in there, but alot of rubbish too. Fact is this team has as much talent as any in the league.

The offensive line is not that good, but I really don't recall anyone saying they were. McKinnie shouldn't have made the pro-bowl that is true, but everyone already knows that.

Our recievers are more than just fast. Rice has great hands. Harvin is great after the catch. Berrian brings alot of leadership and experience. One of the most complete groups in the NFL, IMHO.
Adrian Peterson is very rarely famine, most of the time he's feast. Over 1800 hundred yards and 18 tds. He scored TD's in 12 of 16 games last year. In the 4 that he didn't score a TD he had 99yds, 166yds, 98yds, 65yds rushing/recieving. No back has been more consistant over the last 3 years.

Defense, yeah I agree they are stacked up the wazoo with talent.

Secondary, I agree. Not as good as the best defensive line in the NFL. That's really not saying much. Probably the area the team improved the most in the off-season.

They never say the Vikings aren't good.

They point out:
Our OL isn't very good (True)
McKinnie was a joke (True)
Favre bailed us out (True)
Speed at WR (True, I take that to mean more than just a team of Williamson's)
Shanks good(True)
Jimmy K Isn't as good as he was (True)
Dugan's solid (not the word I'd choose, but servicable)
We're good at stopping the run (True)
We can apply pressure (True)
RE, JA and KW are good to great players (True)
LB is a question without EJ (True)
AD is up and down at time (He struggles vs. certain fronts)
Winfield is a beast (True)
Our Secondary is the weak point (True)

What part there did I miss?

**jmcdon00** · 06-23-2010, 04:45 PM

i_bleed_purple wrote:

jmcdon00 wrote:

i_bleed_purple wrote:

You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

“They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

“Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

“In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”

That seems 100% accurate to me

Some good points in there, but alot of rubbish too. Fact is this team has as much talent as any in the league.

The offensive line is not that good, but I really don't recall anyone saying they were. McKinnie shouldn't have made the pro-bowl that is true, but everyone already knows that.

Our recievers are more than just fast. Rice has great hands. Harvin is great after the catch. Berrian brings alot of leadership and experience. One of the most complete groups in the NFL, IMHO.
Adrian Peterson is very rarely famine, most of the time he's feast. Over 1800 hundred yards and 18 tds. He scored TD's in 12 of 16 games last year. In the 4 that he didn't score a TD he had 99yds, 166yds, 98yds, 65yds rushing/recieving. No back has been more consistant over the last 3 years.

Defense, yeah I agree they are stacked up the wazoo with talent.

Secondary, I agree. Not as good as the best defensive line in the NFL. That's really not saying much. Probably the area the team improved the most in the off-season.

They never say the Vikings aren't good.

They point out:
Our OL isn't very good (True)
McKinnie was a joke (True)
Favre bailed us out (True)
Speed at WR (True, I take that to mean more than just a team of Williamson's)
Shanks good(True)
Jimmy K Isn't as good as he was (True)
Dugan's solid (not the word I'd choose, but servicable)
We're good at stopping the run (True)
We can apply pressure (True)
RE, JA and KW are good to great players (True)
LB is a question without EJ (True)
AD is up and down at time (He struggles vs. certain fronts)
Winfield is a beast (True)
Our Secondary is the weak point (True)

What part there did I miss?

They were not wrong on much, but they left alot out.

The one part I'll disagree with is Peterson being Feast or Famine. He's as consistant a back as any in the nfl.

So I'll agree 95% with the rant.

**Purple Floyd** · 06-23-2010, 06:10 PM

i_bleed_purple wrote:

jmcdon00 wrote:

i_bleed_purple wrote:

You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

“They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

“Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

“In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”

That seems 100% accurate to me

Some good points in there, but alot of rubbish too. Fact is this team has as much talent as any in the league.

The offensive line is not that good, but I really don't recall anyone saying they were. McKinnie shouldn't have made the pro-bowl that is true, but everyone already knows that.

Our recievers are more than just fast. Rice has great hands. Harvin is great after the catch. Berrian brings alot of leadership and experience. One of the most complete groups in the NFL, IMHO.
Adrian Peterson is very rarely famine, most of the time he's feast. Over 1800 hundred yards and 18 tds. He scored TD's in 12 of 16 games last year. In the 4 that he didn't score a TD he had 99yds, 166yds, 98yds, 65yds rushing/recieving. No back has been more consistant over the last 3 years.

Defense, yeah I agree they are stacked up the wazoo with talent.

Secondary, I agree. Not as good as the best defensive line in the NFL. That's really not saying much. Probably the area the team improved the most in the off-season.

They never say the Vikings aren't good.

They point out:
Our OL isn't very good (True)
McKinnie was a joke (True)
Favre bailed us out (True)
Speed at WR (True, I take that to mean more than just a team of Williamson's)
Shanks good(True)
Jimmy K Isn't as good as he was (True)
Dugan's solid (not the word I'd choose, but servicable)
We're good at stopping the run (True)
We can apply pressure (True)
RE, JA and KW are good to great players (True)
LB is a question without EJ (True)
AD is up and down at time (He struggles vs. certain fronts)
Winfield is a beast (True)
Our Secondary is the weak point (True)

What part there did I miss?

That Childress sucks. I know it is in there somewhere :woohoo:

**Tad7** · 06-23-2010, 10:55 PM

interesting

**12purplepride28** · 06-24-2010, 12:46 AM

i_bleed_purple wrote:

jmcdon00 wrote:

i_bleed_purple wrote:

You know what, their offensive line is not that good. They’re way overrated. It’s unbelievable. If they didn’t have Brett Favre, the number of times he gets them out of trouble is amazing. Left tackle Bryant McKinnie, it’s a joke that he made the Pro Bowl. A joke. …

“They have excellent speed at receiver. They have good balance at tight end—Visanthe Shiancoe can make big plays down the field, and Jimmy Kleinsasser isn’t what he used to be but still gives you a good day’s work. Jeff Dugan is solid. … Adrian Peterson is a little bit feast or famine. I think it will hurt them that they lost Chester Taylor because that was an excellent 1-2 punch. …

“Defensively, they’re solid. They do a good job stopping the run, and they get after the quarterback. Ray Edwards is a good player; Jared Allen is an excellent pass rusher. But Kevin Williams, he’s the best guy they have up front. At linebacker, I don’t know what’s going to happen with E.J. Henderson and his injury. Chad Greenway is a playmaker. …

“In the secondary, Antoine Winfield is a tough, physical tackler and by far their best guy back there. They don’t have a weak defense, but the lowest part of their defense is their secondary. That’s not to say they’re bad. I just don’t think they’re at the same level as the front.”

That seems 100% accurate to me

Some good points in there, but alot of rubbish too. Fact is this team has as much talent as any in the league.

The offensive line is not that good, but I really don't recall anyone saying they were. McKinnie shouldn't have made the pro-bowl that is true, but everyone already knows that.

Our recievers are more than just fast. Rice has great hands. Harvin is great after the catch. Berrian brings alot of leadership and experience. One of the most complete groups in the NFL, IMHO.
Adrian Peterson is very rarely famine, most of the time he's feast. Over 1800 hundred yards and 18 tds. He scored TD's in 12 of 16 games last year. In the 4 that he didn't score a TD he had 99yds, 166yds, 98yds, 65yds rushing/recieving. No back has been more consistant over the last 3 years.

Defense, yeah I agree they are stacked up the wazoo with talent.

Secondary, I agree. Not as good as the best defensive line in the NFL. That's really not saying much. Probably the area the team improved the most in the off-season.

They never say the Vikings aren't good.

They point out:
Our OL isn't very good (True)
McKinnie was a joke (True)
Favre bailed us out (True)
Speed at WR (True, I take that to mean more than just a team of Williamson's)
Shanks good(True)
Jimmy K Isn't as good as he was (True)
Dugan's solid (not the word I'd choose, but servicable)
We're good at stopping the run (True)
We can apply pressure (True)
RE, JA and KW are good to great players (True)
LB is a question without EJ (True)
AD is up and down at time (He struggles vs. certain fronts)
Winfield is a beast (True)
Our Secondary is the weak point (True)

What part there did I miss?

He never said winfield was a beast, he said he was the best. I don't think he's the best, I think griffen is better than him in the secondary.