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  1. #21
    Marrdro's Avatar
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    Re: Turnovers, Vikes have gotta stop it.

    "V4L" wrote:
    Ewww

    Too many penelties

    We have been better the last few weeks though
    You are correct, it is getting better, however, we are still worse than last year....

    http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stats/?cat=team&pan=15
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  2. #22
    V4L's Avatar
    V4L
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    Re: Turnovers, Vikes have gotta stop it.

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "V4L" wrote:
    Ewww

    Too many penelties

    We have been better the last few weeks though
    You are correct, it is getting better, however, we are still worse than last year....

    http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stats/?cat=team&pan=15

    Yup

    That is one of the knocks I have on Chilly

    Our guys still do the same thing.. I know he isn't the one doing it.. But it is undisaplined

  3. #23
    Prophet's Avatar
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    Re: Turnovers, Vikes have gotta stop it.

    "V4L" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "V4L" wrote:
    Ewww

    Too many penelties

    We have been better the last few weeks though
    You are correct, it is getting better, however, we are still worse than last year....

    http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stats/?cat=team&pan=15

    Yup

    That is one of the knocks I have on Chilly

    Our guys still do the same thing.. I know he isn't the one doing it.. But it is undisaplined
    This is where Marr says it is because of the fluffy training camp.
    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

  4. #24
    Marrdro's Avatar
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    Re: Turnovers, Vikes have gotta stop it.

    "Prophet" wrote:
    "V4L" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "V4L" wrote:
    Ewww

    Too many penelties

    We have been better the last few weeks though
    You are correct, it is getting better, however, we are still worse than last year....

    http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stats/?cat=team&pan=15

    Yup

    That is one of the knocks I have on Chilly

    Our guys still do the same thing.. I know he isn't the one doing it.. But it is undisaplined
    This is where Marr says it is because of the fluffy training camp.
    LOL, well played sir...... ;D

    I have a whole paragraph in my "Forgive me Letter" on that very subject.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  5. #25
    ejmat is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Turnovers, Vikes have gotta stop it.

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "Prophet" wrote:
    "V4L" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "V4L" wrote:
    Ewww

    Too many penelties

    We have been better the last few weeks though
    You are correct, it is getting better, however, we are still worse than last year....

    http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stats/?cat=team&pan=15

    Yup

    That is one of the knocks I have on Chilly

    Our guys still do the same thing.. I know he isn't the one doing it.. But it is undisaplined
    This is where Marr says it is because of the fluffy training camp.
    LOL, well played sir...... ;D

    I have a whole paragraph in my "Forgive me Letter" on that very subject.
    I'm not quite sure penalties are the direct result of that.
    Didn't have a lot of penalties over the past 2 seasons as well?
    I'm pretty sure they had hard training camps those two years.
    I am only going on memory here so blast away if I am wrong
    ;D

  6. #26
    Marrdro's Avatar
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    Re: Turnovers, Vikes have gotta stop it.

    "ejmat" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "Prophet" wrote:
    "V4L" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    [quote author=V4L link=topic=49859.msg887954#msg887954 date=1230664862]
    Ewww

    Too many penelties

    We have been better the last few weeks though
    You are correct, it is getting better, however, we are still worse than last year....

    http://www.teamrankings.com/nfl/stats/?cat=team&pan=15

    Yup

    That is one of the knocks I have on Chilly

    Our guys still do the same thing.. I know he isn't the one doing it.. But it is undisaplined
    This is where Marr says it is because of the fluffy training camp.
    LOL, well played sir...... ;D

    I have a whole paragraph in my "Forgive me Letter" on that very subject.
    I'm not quite sure penalties are the direct result of that.
    Didn't have a lot of penalties over the past 2 seasons as well?
    I'm pretty sure they had hard training camps those two years.
    I am only going on memory here so blast away if I am wrong
    ;D
    [/quote]
    Check the link.
    It gives you our average and ranking for the last 2 years.
    We are in fact, worse.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  7. #27
    V-Unit's Avatar
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    Re: Turnovers, Vikes have gotta stop it.

    "V4L" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    LMAO,

    I remember getting flamed for saying this as little as two weeks ago.

    Just play clean football guys and you'll get that win.

    Who flamed you?

    Anyone that knows anything about football knows whoever wins the TO battle more times then not wins the game
    "ragz" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    "ragz" wrote:
    "V" wrote:

    Of course I don't expect that out of TJ every week. TJ doesn't need to be 11-18 with 4 TDs for us to win. He really just needs above 60% completion and no turnovers and I'll be plenty happy with him.

    We have the 3rd best rushing game and are 11th in points scored. The biggest struggle our offense has had is not passing, but turnovers. Eliminating those mistakes would do much more for our offense than changing the scheme to be mroe pass effective. I'm 100% ok with the coaches using our offenses strengths. I don't need a complete offense where we are versatile and can do anything. If that is what you are looking for, you ain't going to find it in Minny. The strong running game has set up a deep passing threat and the dumpoffs to RBs underneath have worked very well.

    Eliminate the turnovers. In part I do blame Chilly for that, but talk about a new coach or better schemes are huge changes when we really just need to fix that one thing.
    well your not thinking long term, or looking at the whole picture when referring to your stats honestly in the 2nd half of the season what has the defense consistently done, set up the offense for points or scored them themselves.
    that very reason has been either what has kept us in games where ferrotte and the offense was doing nothing, or had us jump out to a lead where the defense has been able to pin back and get sacks and more turnovers.
    in teh games where ferrotte was throwing picks that were setting up tds for other teams, that was the only thing keeping them in games.
    i checked a couple of weeks back, but in ferrottes last five starts 37 points were scored off of his turnovers, and if not for a couple of 4th down stands, more could have.


    Note: I love how he accuses me of not looking long term/whole picture, then proceeds to refer to only the last six games when judging defensive performance and the last 5 games when judging Frerotte's performance
    What was our big offensive problem when we played Tampa? QB play? Nope. It was turnovers. Obviously, if a team if able to stop our run, we will probably lose, but that is no easy task. I say trust in the scheme, because we certainly are not going to win by airing it out, that is not how our team is built. For some reason you think we have the personnell, but we choose not to do it strategy-wise.

    The Bears are ranked 7th against the run and we shredded them, again only losing because of ST miscues and turnovers, we beat them soundly when those errors were fixed. Those two games and the TB game prove that we can run against solid defenses, we just have to eliminate mistakes.
    In other words, a recognize we will be going up against competition, but that doesn't scare me. I'm confident we'll still be able to run. The key is ZERO turnovers.
    [size=14pt]that is so so lame, eliminate turnovers.
    oh really?
    wow, thats never the difference in any game. [/size]

    problem is teams can overcome them if they can score.
    dont fool yourself into thinking our offense is this juggernaut that punches the ball in all year long cuz it hasn't.
    we are gonna need more than what everyone knows we are gonna do, or at least the proof that we can do it if asked too.
    i have no problem on relying on the things we are built around, but i do have a problem with the claim we dont have the personell to throw the football.
    shank obviously is a weapon that is underutilized, and what is berrian on pace to have 30 less catches than he had last year with rex grossman and kyle orten?
    i'm sorry, but averaging 1-2 catches a game for our big play reciever is not exactly something i think is a good gameplan.
    and lets not bs again and act as if we are at least targetting him alot cuz we know that thats not true.
    i dont know what your problem is with thinking somebody besides peterson should be involved on a more regular basis.
    we may very well be good enough to just run the football all the way to the super bowl, but i happen to think that we may have to do more than that just based on the raised level of play during palyoff time.
    you act as if i'm suggesting we have to overhaul, when in reality i'm suggesting what we do do is probably not gonna be good enough in the playoffs.
    maybe it is.

    and when did we turn the ball over in the tampa game, at the end when we were losing.
    its not exactly like our qb play had us going up and down the field.
    we scored one td.
    tampa pretty much made one big play all day long on offense, and even when your defense plays well, that one play and them slowing down our run lead to a loss.
    turnovers just finished off our day.
    "I hate when threads are destroyed by facts and logic."
    - Prophet


    Thanks Josdin!

  8. #28
    MaxVike's Avatar
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    Re: Turnovers, Vikes have gotta stop it.

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "SIUviking" wrote:
    "MaxVike" wrote:
    "gagarr" wrote:
    "MaxVike" wrote:
    [quote author=gagarr link=topic=49859.msg887156#msg887156 date=1230586659]
    Vikes have the worst turnover mark of playoff teams.

    Miami Dolphins




    +17
    Tennessee Titans



    +14
    Baltimore Ravens



    +13
    Indianapolis Colts



    +9
    New York Giants




    +9
    Carolina Panthers



    +6
    Pittsburgh Steelers


    +4
    San Diego Chargers

    +4
    Philadelphia Eagles


    +3
    Arizona Cardinals



    0
    Atlanta Falcons





    -3
    Minnesota Vikings



    -6

    It could even be considered a positive, that even though the Vikes have shot themselves in the foot many times they still have won games.

    If the Vikes don't turnover the ball, IMO the Eagles game is a lock for the Vikes
    Does your source indicate how many of the turnovers were in the redzone?
    Enemy Territory w/in field goal range?
    The INT in the EndZone yesterday almost sent me into orbit I was so pissed off.

    Also...IMO, it isn't a lock if we don't turn it over.
    It is the only chance we have to win.
    Jim Johnson and his defense are going to terrorize TJack.
    Our WR's will be man-to-man all day long.
    TJack must find Shiancoe early and often to neutralize the blitz.
    I'm just using the NFL.com stats, so breakdown is limited.

    I agree the WR's will be open, but I don't think Shiancoe is the guy to stop it.
    AD and CT need to step up, through blocking the blitzers, rushing to the next level and getting 20+ yd runs, and big yardage screen passes.

    CT should have a BIG day.
    Honestly, I think Shiancoe is a huge key for this game.


    The Eagles have had some difficulty with good TE's, primarily due to blitzing schemes and placing LBs 1-on-1 with them.
    There are several keys to this defense, but, it starts with Trent Cole's ability to pressure off the edge, Asante Samuel's lock down ability, and, BRIAN DAWKINS.
    Trent Cole is one of the most underrated players in the NFL, there is a reason the Eagle's paid Samuel all that cake, and, there is a reason Dawkins is being mentioned as "potential HOF" material.
    Dawkins can take over a game, Samuel can shut down virtually whomever he is covering and Cole brings it - hard.


    TJack is gonna have a split second to recognize where the weakness to attack is...and, it will not be pre-snap.
    He will need to keep an eye on these three players all day long.
    If they get pressure with no blitz, we are dead...unless AD has 150+ and CT also has a big day.
    IMO, Shiancoe has an opportunity to have another huge game here...TJack is the key.
    Shiancoe has proven that he can gain seperation from LBs and safeties...if they bring Dawkins, you gotta find him.
    I still disagree. I do not think Tjack is the key to the game. It will be the D. If they can rattle McNabb and shut down the run completely, get a freaking TO, then we should just be able to run the ball and wear them out.

    If the D allows big passes and we get behind early then it will be put on Tjack's shoulders to throw like Manning and we all know he will likely never be that type of QB not matter how much he progresses.
    I like the original post.
    Very enlightening......

    As to you two....I disagree with the both of you.

    ;D

    How well our O and D line play will be key.

    If our OL can protect TJ and open holes our offense will click especially in the passing scheme as Shanc can get in the seams and exploit that area.
    If he is in blocking, he isn't gonna make that big of an impact.

    If our DL can get pressure and stop the run without alot of help from our LB's and secondary blitzing we will be able to hold the zones and minimize any effor they have both in the passing but running attacks as well.
    [/quote]

    Line play is critically important, that's a given
    ;D.
    I don't believe our OLine alone will be able to handle the onslaught that Jim Johnson is going to bring at TJack.
    Therefore, Kleinny, CT, AD, Tahi, Dugan, and/or Shiancoe are all gonna be helping.
    My suggestion is that the coaching staff should figure out a way to protect with an extra guy (because, rest assured, Johnson is going to blitz the hell out of Jackson), and get Shiancoe matched up in the deep middle.
    If they can't do that, then the OLine will need to plow the way for 150+ for AD.

    Alternatively, I'm not convinced our DLine alone will be able to stop Westie.
    Remember, Reid looks at the short passing game to him as an extension of the running game.
    Stopping Westbrook will be impossible without a HUGE game from Greenway, possibly Winfield.
    I look for one of them to shadow Westie.
    As for pressuring McNabb, yep, completely agree.

    If the Vikes can neutralize Samuel, Cole, Dawkins, and Westie, they stand a very good chance.
    If not, lights out IMO.

    Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent
    ----------------------------------------------
    As a matter of fact, I do know

  9. #29
    V4L's Avatar
    V4L
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    Re: Turnovers, Vikes have gotta stop it.

    "V" wrote:
    "V4L" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    LMAO,

    I remember getting flamed for saying this as little as two weeks ago.

    Just play clean football guys and you'll get that win.

    Who flamed you?

    Anyone that knows anything about football knows whoever wins the TO battle more times then not wins the game
    "ragz" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    "ragz" wrote:
    "V" wrote:

    Of course I don't expect that out of TJ every week. TJ doesn't need to be 11-18 with 4 TDs for us to win. He really just needs above 60% completion and no turnovers and I'll be plenty happy with him.

    We have the 3rd best rushing game and are 11th in points scored. The biggest struggle our offense has had is not passing, but turnovers. Eliminating those mistakes would do much more for our offense than changing the scheme to be mroe pass effective. I'm 100% ok with the coaches using our offenses strengths. I don't need a complete offense where we are versatile and can do anything. If that is what you are looking for, you ain't going to find it in Minny. The strong running game has set up a deep passing threat and the dumpoffs to RBs underneath have worked very well.

    Eliminate the turnovers. In part I do blame Chilly for that, but talk about a new coach or better schemes are huge changes when we really just need to fix that one thing.
    well your not thinking long term, or looking at the whole picture when referring to your stats honestly in the 2nd half of the season what has the defense consistently done, set up the offense for points or scored them themselves.
    that very reason has been either what has kept us in games where ferrotte and the offense was doing nothing, or had us jump out to a lead where the defense has been able to pin back and get sacks and more turnovers.
    in teh games where ferrotte was throwing picks that were setting up tds for other teams, that was the only thing keeping them in games.
    i checked a couple of weeks back, but in ferrottes last five starts 37 points were scored off of his turnovers, and if not for a couple of 4th down stands, more could have.


    Note: I love how he accuses me of not looking long term/whole picture, then proceeds to refer to only the last six games when judging defensive performance and the last 5 games when judging Frerotte's performance
    What was our big offensive problem when we played Tampa? QB play? Nope. It was turnovers. Obviously, if a team if able to stop our run, we will probably lose, but that is no easy task. I say trust in the scheme, because we certainly are not going to win by airing it out, that is not how our team is built. For some reason you think we have the personnell, but we choose not to do it strategy-wise.

    The Bears are ranked 7th against the run and we shredded them, again only losing because of ST miscues and turnovers, we beat them soundly when those errors were fixed. Those two games and the TB game prove that we can run against solid defenses, we just have to eliminate mistakes.
    In other words, a recognize we will be going up against competition, but that doesn't scare me. I'm confident we'll still be able to run. The key is ZERO turnovers.
    [size=14pt]that is so so lame, eliminate turnovers.
    oh really?
    wow, thats never the difference in any game. [/size]

    problem is teams can overcome them if they can score.
    dont fool yourself into thinking our offense is this juggernaut that punches the ball in all year long cuz it hasn't.
    we are gonna need more than what everyone knows we are gonna do, or at least the proof that we can do it if asked too.
    i have no problem on relying on the things we are built around, but i do have a problem with the claim we dont have the personell to throw the football.
    shank obviously is a weapon that is underutilized, and what is berrian on pace to have 30 less catches than he had last year with rex grossman and kyle orten?
    i'm sorry, but averaging 1-2 catches a game for our big play reciever is not exactly something i think is a good gameplan.
    and lets not bs again and act as if we are at least targetting him alot cuz we know that thats not true.
    i dont know what your problem is with thinking somebody besides peterson should be involved on a more regular basis.
    we may very well be good enough to just run the football all the way to the super bowl, but i happen to think that we may have to do more than that just based on the raised level of play during palyoff time.
    you act as if i'm suggesting we have to overhaul, when in reality i'm suggesting what we do do is probably not gonna be good enough in the playoffs.
    maybe it is.

    and when did we turn the ball over in the tampa game, at the end when we were losing.
    its not exactly like our qb play had us going up and down the field.
    we scored one td.
    tampa pretty much made one big play all day long on offense, and even when your defense plays well, that one play and them slowing down our run lead to a loss.
    turnovers just finished off our day.


    He wasn't flaming you

    He HATED Gus and his turnovers..

    And he was being sarcastic in the second part


  10. #30
    Big C is offline Coordinator
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    Re: Turnovers, Vikes have gotta stop it.

    Do you think running the ball with Taylor a little bit more can limit the turnovers? I feel that we lost the balance between AP and CT over the last two games. CT is now used more as a 3rd down back instead of a change-of-pace back like Stewart (CAR), Ward (NYG) and Norwood (ATL).

    The 1780 yards are taking it's toll on AP. We have to keep him fresh by sharing the load with CT a little more. We have one of the best running tandems in the league, but we're starting to revert back to the one-trick-pony offense hoping AP can break a big one.

    CT has had a lot more success in the red zone than AP this year this year too. His ability to catch the ball makes him a bigger threat in the red zone. Isn't that what makes NYG running game tick? Batter the defense with the bruising hard runner and hit them with the shifty little guy that fits in smaller spaces.

    Halo 4. Start another fight.

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