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  1. #11
    marstc09's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevoncox View Post
    Everything he is saying I have already said....

    We don't need to draft a Cb. We can sign a street guy to play the 4th and eventually take over.
    Jefferson, Cook, Robinson, Winfield, Burton,.... How many more do we need.
    While I agree we don't need to draft a CB......we need better than a 4th slot guy. Burton and Jefferson are not good. Robinson is suspect and Cook needs to prove more. I am not comfortable with that group.

  2. #12
    i_bleed_purple's Avatar
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    To say CB isn't a concern is a concern in itself.

    We have a few things:

    Winfield: How long can we rely on him to play at a high level? He had a pretty good season, but any time now he could stop performing. I'm surprised he's held up as well as he has.

    Cook: Flashes of brilliance, combined with some "whatthefuckwereyouthinking". Fortunately, more of the former than the latter. He COULD be a good cover corner, I don't think ever elite, but good. He's inconsistent right now, I expect if he can actually stay on the field healthy for a year, he'll get there.

    Robinson: He's a rookie, so I don't ride him too hard. He's shown some good stuff, but makes rookie mistakes that I hope will get straightened out. Although not very big, he's shown he's not scared to get in there and make a hit. Learning stuff like that from one of the best hitting corners and a great hitting safety will help him. Once he works on his cover technique I'm confident he'll be pretty good.

    Jefferson. This guy is probably our best #4 corner we've had in a LONG, LONG time. Unfortunately that history includes such greats as: Asher Allen, Benny Sapp, Frank Walker, Karl Paymah, Charles Gordon, Marcus McCauley, Ronyel Whitaker, Ralph Brown, Laroni Gallishaw, Devonte Edwards, Ken Irvin and Denard Walker.... in fact, the only guys we had with depth chart positions above those guys outside players currently on the roster was Fred Smoot, Cedric Griffin and Brian Williams. That's how far back our history of ineptitude at that position goes.

    Beyond that..... Burton is awful.... and despite that, he's still not the worst corner that has had significant playing time. How Sherels manages to keep a roster spot baffles me. He's alright at punt returns, but he's horrible on defense.

  3. #13
    singersp's Avatar
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    While it would be nice to improve our CB situation, what people are overlooking is the fact that we have several CB's on the roster right now to choose from. At WR we do not.

    The only WR's we can honestly say will likely be on the roster this FA are Jenkins, Burton & Wright who in total, combined to catch 67 passes for 794 yards & 5 TD's in 2012.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  4. #14
    Purple Floyd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevoncox View Post
    While it is true that they lost talent on defense, it was not at the expense of the offense. What draft picks did they utilize on offense in 2007.
    The expense was in the dollars they spent on FA as well as draft picks. Why are you limiting the debate to 2007 when the roster began to shift as early as 2004?

    Welker, Randy and Co were all imported. There biggest issue was that they could not run the ball when needed and that feed into the Giants' hands as they had at that time the best pass rushing line. Take opinion out of it. Fact - they had 45 yards rushing in that game.
    They still had to pay them. Look at the defense they had for the first 3 SB's and then look at wo they have had on defense for the last 5 years or so. The talent drain has been tilted heavily to the defense. Most fans can name Brady, Welker, Gronk, Hernandez but I bet most outside of pats fans can name 2 defensive starters.

    I don't remember it coming down to a missed kick. I remember Brady driving and scoring to give the go ahead lead and ELi stealing it at the end. Vinatieri wouldn't have mattered. Now if you are trying to tell me that having a kicker is more important than a run game, i'm not listening.
    Do you remember the first SB they won? AV was key to their wins. The game you referenced he wasn't playing for them. When he kicked they won the SB. When he went to the colts they won a SB. Neither QB won a SB unless he was kicking for their team. Maybe it was because he changed the games or maybe he is like a rabbits foot. The point is as valid as easy to defend as your takes.

    We had no defense my friend and my point was all of these teams are struggling just to stay in the chase and they are way ahead of us offensively. If we continue to stay one sided, we will only continue to be in the back of the pack. We must improve our passing attack to match the quality of our run game. Make the sacrifices needed.
    You can't have it all though. If we make big improvements in the passing game then the run game will not be where it is now. I agree we need to improve the passing game though just like we need to be better at stopping the pass.

    As I explained above, I was explaining that if teams that are balanced are struggling, what the hell do we expect to do being 1 sided.
    What we need is better coaching than our opponents. The margin of talent on the field is not so hard to tweak when you have the right coaches in place. Next in importance is the QB position. If you get a great QB they make the WR's and the team look much better as evidenced by what out team looked like in 2009 with Brett under center with a marginal WR group.

    To win a superbowl, it takes a well balanced team and a lot of luck. Something the Ravens figured out after years of being run oriented. They went and brought in a tough WR, drafted another and got themselves a damn QB. They brought him along and then unleashed him.
    And usually great coaching, especially for teams that go multiple times Vs. one hit wonders.
    They also signed a darn goos LT and C from a team who thought they couldn't take them to the next level.

    You can't defend the pass my friend, you can only contain it. Its an idiotic way of thinking.
    Idiotic- Nice there man. What is idiotic to me is for a Vikings fan to look at the division and see that we have 3 really good QB's in the division and yet you think we can make do with marginal DB's. That is the kind of thinking that has Detroit going nowhere.

    The league has severely weakened defenses in contrast to offenses. A defense is no longer able to help and pathetic offense as well as a strong offense can help a pathetic defense.
    I never said it was one or the other but OTOH if you look at GB, hat good did their prolific offense do when their DB's got run over and run past in the big games?

    My example of this is the giants. They are a decent run defense, however, they are an excellent pass defense. Get them up big in games and they will wreck havok on the opposing team and look unstoppable. Keep them close in games and the defense looks mortal because they are unable to protect against the run and the pass. We are built quite the same way.
    As I stated there is no doubt we need to improve all over the place but I don't see us that much like the giants. And if you want to use examples, As I said above, GB is a top passing game but was 22nd in pass defense and they certainly didn't overcome that deficit in pass defense with passing.....

    At this point we have a better pass rushing line than run stopping and if our offense could get us an early lead, the defense will look way better. With that said, our defense was pretty damn good last year and would have been better playing with an average offense. They carried this team for much of the season. Playing with shortened field and holding a lot of teams to FGs or punts while or offense kicked FG after FG after FG. This defense is good enough to win a super bowl if given a top 15 QB.
    They are good enough to get to the playoffs, Once you get there the weaknesses in LB and secondary will be glaringly obvious.

    Your opinion my friend. Our LBs were decent and like I said our defense carried this team last year. There is a reason our rookie QB was an pro bowler. I think we have a top safety in Smith and the combo of Raymond and Sanford is a good one. I can point to 1 deep ball completed last season and that was early on in the season. Was there more than one, possible but teams weren't airing it out on us like before. An improved offense would make our defense take the next step. Imagine if all half of those FGs we kicked turned into TDs and then our defense was able to pin their ears back all game long. Sacks, picks and TOs would result my friend.
    Of course. It is my opinion just as what you post is opinion and not fact. I thought that was common knowledge on a message board.

    A run stuffing DT would help KW prolong his career and a pass rushing DT would eventually take his place.
    Funny, when we were the best run defense in the league for several years with a crappy secondary we never really seemed to be bringing home Lombardi trophies........

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