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  1. #101
    jargomcfargo's Avatar
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    Re: Is T-Jack "The Guy?"

    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    ROTHFLMMFAO.

    I tried to tell you and now I am back involved in it again and I really am not a TJ supporter.

    ;D
    I know.
    I'm not a TJ supporter either.
    Hell, I am hoping that we do bring someone on in the offseason.
    I don't know why I am even trying to bring any objectivity into this...
    That's funny. That's why I'm trying to stay out of it. I tried to post but deleted it because I have troops on both sides of the fence.
    And where it really gets hairry is when one realizes both sides are sometimes saying the same thing in a different way.eg. we don't know if TJ will be the guy.
    I believe in TJ as the future qb.I just think he would benefit from a little time watching a decent vet.
    I know that isn't likely to happen and I'm ok with that.
    TJ had a bad game against the Skins. He'll have more of those type games. It's part of the learning process.
    He had a decent day at Denver if not for two key drops.

    He has definately improved but is yet to light it up.That gives me pause.

    Were I Childress(Lord forgive), I would come out with a passing game next season and pass,pass,pass in preaseason. If this offense doesn't develop the passing game, they will continue to struggle.
    It's hard to develop a passing game when you only pass occasionally.That goes for receiver performance as well as QB performance.

    Despite having the number one rushing team, it's time to pass.

    Then we will find out if TJ is going to be the man.

    And we better get at least one experienced backup on this roster.
    “What takes a quarterback to the next level is not arm strength or mobility or any of that stuff. It’s the ability to play on critical downs. Manage third downs, or red zones or four-minute or two-minute situations"
    Dilfer

  2. #102
    nikoli's Avatar
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    Re: Is T-Jack "The Guy?"

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "nikoli" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "nikoli" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    [quote author=olson_10 link=topic=41482.msg708671#msg708671 date=1200595411]
    theres absolutely no reason to have a guy out there that puts you at a horrible disadvantage when you can easily put him on the sidelines and go out and get a good veteran starter that gives you a chance to win..
    And that is where you lose credibility.
    You show that you absolutely are not objective.
    TJack DOESN'T put the Vikings at a horrible disadvantage.
    If he did, then he wouldn't be 8-4 as the starter.
    And exactly how do think we could "easily" go out and get a good veteran starter?
    What good veteran start did you have in mind?
    To the best of my knowledge, most good veteran starters are retained by the team that they are on.
    If a team doesn't renew or trades a veteran QB, it is done for a reason...

    Hey, if Derek Anderson falls into our lap, I won't complain.
    I wouldn't even mind McNabb or Losman.
    But I am not so deluded to think that it is as easy as saying "Hey, I want that QB," nor am I blind enough to think the season is wasted if we do start with TJack under center next year.

    Oh man, I totally disagree. How could you suggest that our offense isn't limited with him at the helm? Defenses stack the run and our pass plays are extremely limited. If the playbook is limited because of our QB's inexperience (to put it nicely) then our offense is most certainly at a disadvantage. There's really no question about it.
    I think the actual quote was "horrible disadvantage".
    That is where I disagree. Yes, the offense was limited due to TJack's lack of experience.
    But it isn't exactly like we cut our offense's Achilles tendon just because he is on the field.
    Funny you say that... I made post on a different board saying Chilly has cut his own balls off two years in a row by going with the QBs that he's gone with. Basically I was saying he was limiting what his "kick a$$ offense" could do because he QBs didn't have the ability. Brad Johnson didn't have the arm strength and TJax doesn't have the smarts (yet)... and I don't even want to get into the backups! Therefore the offense is limited. Of course there's going to be exaggeration both ways (lover and haters)... but the point remains. As long as Childress has to dumb down the playbook for TJax, our offense will suffer. Some games it struggle mightly.
    Don't take this the wrong way my friend cause it is an actual compliment even though it might not seem that way.......

    Of all the posts that I've read of yours, that is the best one that you have made.
    [/quote]

    Thanks


    Hope I didn't set the bar too high
    :P

    j/k
    The language and concepts contained herein are
    guaranteed not to cause eternal torment in the
    place where the guy with the horns and pointed
    stick conducts his business.

  3. #103
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re: Is T-Jack "The Guy?"

    "jargomcfargo" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    ROTHFLMMFAO.

    I tried to tell you and now I am back involved in it again and I really am not a TJ supporter.

    ;D
    I know.
    I'm not a TJ supporter either.
    Hell, I am hoping that we do bring someone on in the offseason.
    I don't know why I am even trying to bring any objectivity into this...
    That's funny. That's why I'm trying to stay out of it. I tried to post but deleted it because I have troops on both sides of the fence.
    And where it really gets hairry is when one realizes both sides are sometimes saying the same thing in a different way.eg. we don't know if TJ will be the guy.
    I believe in TJ as the future qb.I just think he would benefit from a little time watching a decent vet.
    I know that isn't likely to happen and I'm ok with that.
    TJ had a bad game against the Skins. He'll have more of those type games. It's part of the learning process.
    He had a decent day at Denver if not for two key drops.

    He has definately improved but is yet to light it up.That gives me pause.

    Were I Childress(Lord forgive), I would come out with a passing game next season and pass,pass,pass in preaseason. If this offense doesn't develop the passing game, they will continue to struggle.
    It's hard to develop a passing game when you only pass occasionally.That goes for receiver performance as well as QB performance.

    Despite having the number one rushing team, it's time to pass.

    Then we will find out if TJ is going to be the man.

    And we better get at least one experienced backup on this roster.
    Now you come out of the woodwork. ;D

    ;D
    ;D

    Remember when I tried to convince people that we passed in situations last year just so TJ and the rest of the team would get a benifit from the experience?

    Man did I get flailed with that approach.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  4. #104
    nikoli's Avatar
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    Re: Is T-Jack "The Guy?"

    All I know is that I absolutely HATE being in QB purgatory.

    We need to sign a vet, no matter what. And if a QB is the BPA at any point in the draft... don't hesitate. It's the most important position in football. We can't afford to be like the Phins and Bears... no QB for the next decade.
    The language and concepts contained herein are
    guaranteed not to cause eternal torment in the
    place where the guy with the horns and pointed
    stick conducts his business.

  5. #105
    jargomcfargo's Avatar
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    Re: Is T-Jack "The Guy?"

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "jargomcfargo" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    ROTHFLMMFAO.

    I tried to tell you and now I am back involved in it again and I really am not a TJ supporter.

    ;D
    I know.
    I'm not a TJ supporter either.
    Hell, I am hoping that we do bring someone on in the offseason.
    I don't know why I am even trying to bring any objectivity into this...
    That's funny. That's why I'm trying to stay out of it. I tried to post but deleted it because I have troops on both sides of the fence.
    And where it really gets hairry is when one realizes both sides are sometimes saying the same thing in a different way.eg. we don't know if TJ will be the guy.
    I believe in TJ as the future qb.I just think he would benefit from a little time watching a decent vet.
    I know that isn't likely to happen and I'm ok with that.
    TJ had a bad game against the Skins. He'll have more of those type games. It's part of the learning process.
    He had a decent day at Denver if not for two key drops.

    He has definately improved but is yet to light it up.That gives me pause.

    Were I Childress(Lord forgive), I would come out with a passing game next season and pass,pass,pass in preaseason. If this offense doesn't develop the passing game, they will continue to struggle.
    It's hard to develop a passing game when you only pass occasionally.That goes for receiver performance as well as QB performance.

    Despite having the number one rushing team, it's time to pass.

    Then we will find out if TJ is going to be the man.

    And we better get at least one experienced backup on this roster.
    Now you come out of the woodwork. ;D

    ;D

    ;D

    Remember when I tried to convince people that we passed in situations last year just so TJ and the rest of the team would get a benifit from the experience?

    Man did I get flailed with that approach.
    Yes and I agreed with you then. I guess it's my turn to get flailed!
    “What takes a quarterback to the next level is not arm strength or mobility or any of that stuff. It’s the ability to play on critical downs. Manage third downs, or red zones or four-minute or two-minute situations"
    Dilfer

  6. #106
    mountainviking's Avatar
    mountainviking is offline Team Alumni
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    Re: Is T-Jack "The Guy?"

    The vet QBs worth trading for or signing are slim pickens...that might not be a very viable option.

    I like the pass, pass, pass idea in preseason, but recall how that gameplan worked (NOT) against the Lions in week 2.
    Control the line, control the time, and give your D a chance to shine!!

    "Balance it on end and thats the third side of the coin!!" -wookiefoot

  7. #107
    tastywaves's Avatar
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    Re: Is T-Jack "The Guy?"

    So what's the answer?
    Is T-Jack "The Guy" or not?

    I was hoping I could go to the end of this thread and get the answer, but it doesn't seem to be available.
    Could someone summarize for me, because I would really like to know.

    Do you think the vikings org is as uncertain as the PPO faithful?




  8. #108
    olson_10's Avatar
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    Re: Is T-Jack "The Guy?"

    "tastywaves" wrote:
    So what's the answer?
    Is T-Jack "The Guy" or not?

    I was hoping I could go to the end of this thread and get the answer, but it doesn't seem to be available.
    Could someone summarize for me, because I would really like to know.

    Do you think the vikings org is as uncertain as the PPO faithful?



    it seems like childress himself has expressed some uncertainty, and the vikings have come up in a lot of rumors involving some QBs that are or could be available this offseason..where theres smoke, theres usually fire..
    People who see life as anything more than pure entertainment are missing the point.

  9. #109
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    Re: Is T-Jack "The Guy?"

    "olson_10" wrote:
    "tastywaves" wrote:
    So what's the answer?
    Is T-Jack "The Guy" or not?

    I was hoping I could go to the end of this thread and get the answer, but it doesn't seem to be available.
    Could someone summarize for me, because I would really like to know.

    Do you think the vikings org is as uncertain as the PPO faithful?



    it seems like childress himself has expressed some uncertainty, and the vikings have come up in a lot of rumors involving some QBs that are or could be available this offseason..where theres smoke, theres usually fire..
    I hope so, I would like to know that success in 2008 isn't solely on the shoulders of TJ.

  10. #110
    olson_10's Avatar
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    Re: Is T-Jack "The Guy?"

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "olson_10" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "olson_10" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    [quote author=olson_10 link=topic=41482.msg708667#msg708667 date=1200595243]
    [quote author=NodakPaul link=topic=41482.msg708661#msg708661 date=1200594750]
    [quote author=nikoli link=topic=41482.msg708657#msg708657 date=1200594522]
    Yeah dude, I don't think anyone can deny his accuracy issues. Seems like he has some really good throws here and there. But almost all of the routes are stop routes and I suspect it's because he can't hit anyone in stride very well. Think about how often you saw him hit a WR in motion. It wasn't very often.

    We'll see what happens. I think he could be decent next year but I'm positive we'll be losing games because of his inadequacies. I hate that we have to give him another year to find out for sure. We would've known better if he could've stayed healthy throughout the season.
    Hmmm.
    I didn't notice that, but then again I wasn't watching for it.
    I might have to go back and look - you could be on to something.
    Off the top of my head I know that he would hit Wade in crossing routes quite a bit, but other than that none really spring to mind.

    And we don't kow yet if he will get another year.
    Childress was noncommittal at best when asked about TJack being the starter next year, and he has made it clear that no position is a gimme.
    Every starter has to earn that spot in training camp.

    It all depends on who becomes available in the offseason, and whether or not the Vikings are in a position to get them.
    nikoli is right..jackson doesnt hit guys on timing routes, its mostly curls and stop routes

    also the lack if improvement gradually bothered me in terms of his decision making

    week 2: 4 INTs, 0 TDs

    week 15: 3 INTs, lost fumble, 0 TDs

    week 16: 2 INTs, 1 TD

    if only he couldve put together 3-4 games playing as well as he did against the lions to close out the season, then i wouldnt have anything to complain about, and id be happy with jackson starting at qb..unfortuantely he showed us all that game was a total fluke, and has left everybody wondering if hes capable of playing in this league, or just staying warm for a backup spot in the CFL (spergeon wynn?)
    Week 12: 10 for 12, 1 TD, 0 INTs
    Week 13: 18 for 24, 2 TDs, 1 INT
    Week 14: 16 for 25, 1 TD, 0 INTs

    I guess that three game winning streak didn't count?
    Picking and choosing certain games and then throwing the name "Spurgeon Wynn" in there is a pretty weak argument. Week 15 (MNF) and Week 16 (SNF) were pretty big pressure games.
    And TJack had a problem with the pressure IMHO.
    It was almost like this was his first year starting in the NFL or something.
    Weird...
    an athletic qb going out at the end of a season and looking terrible..looks like spergeon wynn to me

    fact remains, his decision making was as terrible at the end of the season as it was at the beginning, which clearly equals little to no improvemt

    Jesus.
    It's like talking to a wall.
    [/quote]
    if jackson comes out next season, leads us to the playoffs, comes out with a good TD/INT ratio, passes for at least 2800 yards, has over 65% in completions..thats how you have to look at it..can this guy put those numbers up next season?
    heck, people looked at brad johnson the year he won the superbowl and called him a great manager of the game..not explosive, but could always manage a game..people now look at jackson and say "all he has to do is manage the game", well heres the numbers on johnson that year

    3049 yards, 62 % completion, 22 TD, 6 INTs

    now we dont have anywhere near the defense that tampa had that year, which means you need jackson now to put up even better numbers than that

    weve got an elite running game, but as the end of the year showed us, its nothing without at least some sort of passing game..weve got a good defense, but its certainly not capable of carrying this team without some sort of consistent offense

    if jackson is going to be a success here, then hes going to have to become explosive in some way because the running game's success now rests on his abilities as a passer since defenses have changed their approach, and the defense (pathetic against the pass unfortunately) can only take the team so far

    [/quote]
    Wonder what all the Giant fans are saying now that the game has slowed down for Eli after beeeyatching about putting up with him learning on the field especially after the beloved Tiki left and was spewing his hate and discontent.

    Face it my friend.
    We are gonna live through this with this kid.
    All we can do is hope that the coaches can help flip the switch and the bulb comes on and he progresses to the point where there is more good than bad.

    [/quote]
    by saying that you would be implying that there is a key to him finding success..and this is really what the discussion is about..in my mind, i dont think he has it, and even if he did, hes still 2-3 more seasons away from finding it
    People who see life as anything more than pure entertainment are missing the point.

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