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  1. #101
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    Re: Stadium issue to move forward in 2009 as economic stimulus

    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    "Zeus" wrote:
    To toss more logs onto the fire:

    With no roof, there is not a chance in hell that game sells out yesterday.

    Discuss.

    =Z=
    My log on the fire is if they put together a team that is exciting to watch they will sell out regardless of the weather. And if we can't sell out the game maybe the state doesn't deserve an NFL team. Cold weather teams all across the north can sell out outdoor stadiums. If we can't then maybe Wilf does need to rethink where the team is located.
    There is only one outdoor cold weather team that comes even close to the conditions of Minneapolis... and I think we can both agree that Green Bay enjoys a unique situation of supply an demand.
    At this point the demand is so high in Green Bay that regardless of performance the supply will never catch up.

    That isn't the case in any other city that I am familiar with.
    Chicago wasn't always selling out Soldier Field, Detroit is indoors, NE didn't sell out at all before Gillette (and a little thing like 3 SB rings helped that out).
    Buffalo is not selling out, Seattle wasn't before QWest (and likely won't anymore)...

    In this day and age of HDTV, people simply wont go to an outdoor stadium on a regular basis if the team is not performing.
    And EVERY team goes through periods of sub par performance.
    It was -20 with the wind chill yesterday and cold enough to make my beer freeze in the bottle WHILE I was drinking it (I have some great pics to post later).
    If the Vikings were playing outdoors, then we would not have sold out.
    Come on.

    We are talking about a state where fishermen get up at dawn and walk out to the middle of a lake to drop a tip-up into a hole and wait for a fish to bite. People go to the ski resort and spend all day out in the cold going fast down a hill. People buy snowmobiles and ride through the woods and over the lakes at high speed
    no matter what the temperature is. They cross country ski, play outdoor hockey at the local rink, go hunting in the snow, wind and freezing rain.They cut a hole in the ice and jump in the water for gods sake. Don't tell me that people won't go to an outdoor stadium and watch a football game in the elements if the product is good.

    If the product isn't good it doesn't matter where they play as indicated by last week.

    There is nothing that you can provide for me as evidence that Buffalo would sell out if they played indoors or that New England would have sold more tickets at an indoor stadium. It is pure speculation on your part.

  2. #102
    bleedpurple is offline Ring of Fame
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    Re: Stadium issue to move forward in 2009 as economic stimulus

    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    "Zeus" wrote:
    To toss more logs onto the fire:

    With no roof, there is not a chance in hell that game sells out yesterday.

    Discuss.

    =Z=
    My log on the fire is if they put together a team that is exciting to watch they will sell out regardless of the weather. And if we can't sell out the game maybe the state doesn't deserve an NFL team. Cold weather teams all across the north can sell out outdoor stadiums. If we can't then maybe Wilf does need to rethink where the team is located.
    There is only one outdoor cold weather team that comes even close to the conditions of Minneapolis... and I think we can both agree that Green Bay enjoys a unique situation of supply an demand.
    At this point the demand is so high in Green Bay that regardless of performance the supply will never catch up.

    That isn't the case in any other city that I am familiar with.
    Chicago wasn't always selling out Soldier Field, Detroit is indoors, NE didn't sell out at all before Gillette (and a little thing like 3 SB rings helped that out).
    Buffalo is not selling out, Seattle wasn't before QWest (and likely won't anymore)...

    In this day and age of HDTV, people simply wont go to an outdoor stadium on a regular basis if the team is not performing.
    And EVERY team goes through periods of sub par performance.
    It was -20 with the wind chill yesterday and cold enough to make my beer freeze in the bottle WHILE I was drinking it (I have some great pics to post later).
    If the Vikings were playing outdoors, then we would not have sold out.
    Come on.

    We are talking about a state where fishermen get up at dawn and walk out to the middle of a lake to drop a tip-up into a hole and wait for a fish to bite. People go to the ski resort and spend all day out in the cold going fast down a hill. People buy snowmobiles and ride through the woods and over the lakes at high speed
    no matter what the temperature is. They cross country ski, play outdoor hockey at the local rink, go hunting in the snow, wind and freezing rain.They cut a hole in the ice and jump in the water for gods sake. Don't tell me that people won't go to an outdoor stadium and watch a football game in the elements if the product is good.

    If the product isn't good it doesn't matter where they play as indicated by last week.

    There is nothing that you can provide for me as evidence that Buffalo would sell out if they played indoors or that New England would have sold more tickets at an indoor stadium. It is pure speculation on your part.
    Well, with the way the vikes have been playing... and disappointing for years, it wouldn't matter if they were giving tickets away... if this game was played outdoors, this playoff game, regardless of how tolerant the ppl of minny are of cold weather, ppl wouldn't have come... i just don't think they love them THAT MUCH!!!!

    the stadium needs to have a retractable roof therefore, they can close it and open it for homefield advantage... that's a win/win situation!!...

    besides, the stuff you mentioned an activity... where fishing provides food, ice hockey is fun, snowmobile riding provides entertainment, and cutting a hole in the lake to jump in proves your an idiot!!.. all viable forms of entertainment...

    watching the vikings in cold weather would not qualify as one of them.. esp. when they break your heart like they always do!!..

    hell, they had to get 2 extensions just to sell out this game...and it WAS INDOORS!!!

  3. #103
    NodakPaul's Avatar
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    Re: Stadium issue to move forward in 2009 as economic stimulus

    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    Come on.

    We are talking about a state where fishermen get up at dawn and walk out to the middle of a lake to drop a tip-up into a hole and wait for a fish to bite. People go to the ski resort and spend all day out in the cold going fast down a hill. People buy snowmobiles and ride through the woods and over the lakes at high speed
    no matter what the temperature is. They cross country ski, play outdoor hockey at the local rink, go hunting in the snow, wind and freezing rain.They cut a hole in the ice and jump in the water for gods sake. Don't tell me that people won't go to an outdoor stadium and watch a football game in the elements if the product is good.

    If the product isn't good it doesn't matter where they play as indicated by last week.

    There is nothing that you can provide for me as evidence that Buffalo would sell out if they played indoors or that New England would have sold more tickets at an indoor stadium. It is pure speculation on your part.
    I think it would be more accurate to say that if the product is good it doesn't matter if they play indoors or outdoors.
    If the product isn't good, then the venue matters very much.
    And as much as I would love to keep my purple shades on, even I know that the Vikings will have their ups and downs.
    And during those downs, I don't want to have the northern equivalent of the Jacksonville Jags, who have to cover up 1/3 of their seats and still don't sell out.

    Besides, how quickly people forget that during cold December games, we had problems selling out the Old Met back when the Vikings were perennial super bowl favorites.
    And the Met only had 48k seats...
    Now that watching from home is even better, why on earth would anyone think that we could sell out a 70k seat outdoor stadium?
    Zeus wrote:
    When are you going to realize that picking out the 20 bad throws this year and ignoring the 300 good ones does not make your point?

    =Z=

  4. #104
    Zeus's Avatar
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    Re: Stadium issue to move forward in 2009 as economic stimulus

    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    Come on.

    We are talking about a state where fishermen get up at dawn and walk out to the middle of a lake to drop a tip-up into a hole and wait for a fish to bite. People go to the ski resort and spend all day out in the cold going fast down a hill. People buy snowmobiles and ride through the woods and over the lakes at high speed
    no matter what the temperature is. They cross country ski, play outdoor hockey at the local rink, go hunting in the snow, wind and freezing rain.They cut a hole in the ice and jump in the water for gods sake. Don't tell me that people won't go to an outdoor stadium and watch a football game in the elements if the product is good.

    If the product isn't good it doesn't matter where they play as indicated by last week.

    There is nothing that you can provide for me as evidence that Buffalo would sell out if they played indoors or that New England would have sold more tickets at an indoor stadium. It is pure speculation on your part.
    I think it would be more accurate to say that if the product is good it doesn't matter if they play indoors or outdoors.
    If the product isn't good, then the venue matters very much.
    And as much as I would love to keep my purple shades on, even I know that the Vikings will have their ups and downs.
    And during those downs, I don't want to have the northern equivalent of the Jacksonville Jags, who have to cover up 1/3 of their seats and still don't sell out.

    Besides, how quickly people forget that during cold December games, we had problems selling out the Old Met back when the Vikings were perennial super bowl favorites.
    And the Met only had 48k seats...
    Now that watching from home is even better, why on earth would anyone think that we could sell out a 70k seat outdoor stadium?
    Let's face it - modern man is a pussy.
    That's the real truth here.
    The Metrodome sucks now because there aren't enough amenities for the 21st century softie.
    The football fan of the fifties would goggle at the stuff there is for INDOOR football!!!!!

    Three plus hours in -20 wind chills is a recipe for 60% capacity given the option of an HD broadcast and a click-on gas fire in the fireplace.

    =Z=

    Thanks to Josdin for the awesome sig!

  5. #105
    HoosierVike's Avatar
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    Re: Stadium issue to move forward in 2009 as economic stimulus

    "Zeus" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    Come on.

    We are talking about a state where fishermen get up at dawn and walk out to the middle of a lake to drop a tip-up into a hole and wait for a fish to bite. People go to the ski resort and spend all day out in the cold going fast down a hill. People buy snowmobiles and ride through the woods and over the lakes at high speed
    no matter what the temperature is. They cross country ski, play outdoor hockey at the local rink, go hunting in the snow, wind and freezing rain.They cut a hole in the ice and jump in the water for gods sake. Don't tell me that people won't go to an outdoor stadium and watch a football game in the elements if the product is good.

    If the product isn't good it doesn't matter where they play as indicated by last week.

    There is nothing that you can provide for me as evidence that Buffalo would sell out if they played indoors or that New England would have sold more tickets at an indoor stadium. It is pure speculation on your part.
    I think it would be more accurate to say that if the product is good it doesn't matter if they play indoors or outdoors.
    If the product isn't good, then the venue matters very much.
    And as much as I would love to keep my purple shades on, even I know that the Vikings will have their ups and downs.
    And during those downs, I don't want to have the northern equivalent of the Jacksonville Jags, who have to cover up 1/3 of their seats and still don't sell out.

    Besides, how quickly people forget that during cold December games, we had problems selling out the Old Met back when the Vikings were perennial super bowl favorites.
    And the Met only had 48k seats...
    Now that watching from home is even better, why on earth would anyone think that we could sell out a 70k seat outdoor stadium?

    Let's face it - modern man is a "meow".
    That's the real truth here.
    The Metrodome sucks now because there aren't enough amenities for the 21st century softie.
    The football fan of the fifties would goggle at the stuff there is for INDOOR football!!!!!

    Three plus hours in -20 wind chills is a recipe for 60% capacity given the option of an HD broadcast and a click-on gas fire in the fireplace.


    =Z=
    Sums it up perfectly

  6. #106
    Purple Floyd's Avatar
    Purple Floyd is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Stadium issue to move forward in 2009 as economic stimulus

    "Zeus" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    Come on.

    We are talking about a state where fishermen get up at dawn and walk out to the middle of a lake to drop a tip-up into a hole and wait for a fish to bite. People go to the ski resort and spend all day out in the cold going fast down a hill. People buy snowmobiles and ride through the woods and over the lakes at high speed
    no matter what the temperature is. They cross country ski, play outdoor hockey at the local rink, go hunting in the snow, wind and freezing rain.They cut a hole in the ice and jump in the water for gods sake. Don't tell me that people won't go to an outdoor stadium and watch a football game in the elements if the product is good.

    If the product isn't good it doesn't matter where they play as indicated by last week.

    There is nothing that you can provide for me as evidence that Buffalo would sell out if they played indoors or that New England would have sold more tickets at an indoor stadium. It is pure speculation on your part.
    I think it would be more accurate to say that if the product is good it doesn't matter if they play indoors or outdoors.
    If the product isn't good, then the venue matters very much.
    And as much as I would love to keep my purple shades on, even I know that the Vikings will have their ups and downs.
    And during those downs, I don't want to have the northern equivalent of the Jacksonville Jags, who have to cover up 1/3 of their seats and still don't sell out.

    Besides, how quickly people forget that during cold December games, we had problems selling out the Old Met back when the Vikings were perennial super bowl favorites.
    And the Met only had 48k seats...
    Now that watching from home is even better, why on earth would anyone think that we could sell out a 70k seat outdoor stadium?
    Let's face it - modern man is a pussy.
    That's the real truth here.
    The Metrodome sucks now because there aren't enough amenities for the 21st century softie.
    The football fan of the fifties would goggle at the stuff there is for INDOOR football!!!!!

    Three plus hours in -20 wind chills is a recipe for 60% capacity given the option of an HD broadcast and a click-on gas fire in the fireplace.

    =Z=
    So the future is the arena football league?

    Shit. Too bad the filed for bankruptcy last fall. I guess they are ahead of their time. I guess L.A is a better place for the franchise.

  7. #107
    Zeus's Avatar
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    Re: Stadium issue to move forward in 2009 as economic stimulus

    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    "Zeus" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    Come on.

    We are talking about a state where fishermen get up at dawn and walk out to the middle of a lake to drop a tip-up into a hole and wait for a fish to bite. People go to the ski resort and spend all day out in the cold going fast down a hill. People buy snowmobiles and ride through the woods and over the lakes at high speed
    no matter what the temperature is. They cross country ski, play outdoor hockey at the local rink, go hunting in the snow, wind and freezing rain.They cut a hole in the ice and jump in the water for gods sake. Don't tell me that people won't go to an outdoor stadium and watch a football game in the elements if the product is good.

    If the product isn't good it doesn't matter where they play as indicated by last week.

    There is nothing that you can provide for me as evidence that Buffalo would sell out if they played indoors or that New England would have sold more tickets at an indoor stadium. It is pure speculation on your part.
    I think it would be more accurate to say that if the product is good it doesn't matter if they play indoors or outdoors.
    If the product isn't good, then the venue matters very much.
    And as much as I would love to keep my purple shades on, even I know that the Vikings will have their ups and downs.
    And during those downs, I don't want to have the northern equivalent of the Jacksonville Jags, who have to cover up 1/3 of their seats and still don't sell out.

    Besides, how quickly people forget that during cold December games, we had problems selling out the Old Met back when the Vikings were perennial super bowl favorites.
    And the Met only had 48k seats...
    Now that watching from home is even better, why on earth would anyone think that we could sell out a 70k seat outdoor stadium?
    Let's face it - modern man is a pussy.
    That's the real truth here.
    The Metrodome sucks now because there aren't enough amenities for the 21st century softie.
    The football fan of the fifties would goggle at the stuff there is for INDOOR football!!!!!

    Three plus hours in -20 wind chills is a recipe for 60% capacity given the option of an HD broadcast and a click-on gas fire in the fireplace.
    So the future is the arena football league?

    Shit. Too bad the filed for bankruptcy last fall. I guess they are ahead of their time. I guess L.A is a better place for the franchise.
    Where was your tushie yesterday, Mr. Mayor?
    Didja go ice fishing this weekend?

    =Z=

    Thanks to Josdin for the awesome sig!

  8. #108
    Purple Floyd's Avatar
    Purple Floyd is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Stadium issue to move forward in 2009 as economic stimulus

    "Zeus" wrote:
    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    "Zeus" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    Come on.

    We are talking about a state where fishermen get up at dawn and walk out to the middle of a lake to drop a tip-up into a hole and wait for a fish to bite. People go to the ski resort and spend all day out in the cold going fast down a hill. People buy snowmobiles and ride through the woods and over the lakes at high speed
    no matter what the temperature is. They cross country ski, play outdoor hockey at the local rink, go hunting in the snow, wind and freezing rain.They cut a hole in the ice and jump in the water for gods sake. Don't tell me that people won't go to an outdoor stadium and watch a football game in the elements if the product is good.

    If the product isn't good it doesn't matter where they play as indicated by last week.

    There is nothing that you can provide for me as evidence that Buffalo would sell out if they played indoors or that New England would have sold more tickets at an indoor stadium. It is pure speculation on your part.
    I think it would be more accurate to say that if the product is good it doesn't matter if they play indoors or outdoors.
    If the product isn't good, then the venue matters very much.
    And as much as I would love to keep my purple shades on, even I know that the Vikings will have their ups and downs.
    And during those downs, I don't want to have the northern equivalent of the Jacksonville Jags, who have to cover up 1/3 of their seats and still don't sell out.

    Besides, how quickly people forget that during cold December games, we had problems selling out the Old Met back when the Vikings were perennial super bowl favorites.
    And the Met only had 48k seats...
    Now that watching from home is even better, why on earth would anyone think that we could sell out a 70k seat outdoor stadium?
    Let's face it - modern man is a pussy.
    That's the real truth here.
    The Metrodome sucks now because there aren't enough amenities for the 21st century softie.
    The football fan of the fifties would goggle at the stuff there is for INDOOR football!!!!!

    Three plus hours in -20 wind chills is a recipe for 60% capacity given the option of an HD broadcast and a click-on gas fire in the fireplace.
    So the future is the arena football league?

    Shit. Too bad the filed for bankruptcy last fall. I guess they are ahead of their time. I guess L.A is a better place for the franchise.
    Where was your tushie yesterday, Mr. Mayor?
    Didja go ice fishing this weekend?

    =Z=
    Nah,

    I was out hunting. It was the last weekend of the season.


  9. #109
    Formo's Avatar
    Formo is offline Team Alumni
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    Re: Stadium issue to move forward in 2009 as economic stimulus

    "Zeus" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    Come on.

    We are talking about a state where fishermen get up at dawn and walk out to the middle of a lake to drop a tip-up into a hole and wait for a fish to bite. People go to the ski resort and spend all day out in the cold going fast down a hill. People buy snowmobiles and ride through the woods and over the lakes at high speed
    no matter what the temperature is. They cross country ski, play outdoor hockey at the local rink, go hunting in the snow, wind and freezing rain.They cut a hole in the ice and jump in the water for gods sake. Don't tell me that people won't go to an outdoor stadium and watch a football game in the elements if the product is good.

    If the product isn't good it doesn't matter where they play as indicated by last week.

    There is nothing that you can provide for me as evidence that Buffalo would sell out if they played indoors or that New England would have sold more tickets at an indoor stadium. It is pure speculation on your part.
    I think it would be more accurate to say that if the product is good it doesn't matter if they play indoors or outdoors.
    If the product isn't good, then the venue matters very much.
    And as much as I would love to keep my purple shades on, even I know that the Vikings will have their ups and downs.
    And during those downs, I don't want to have the northern equivalent of the Jacksonville Jags, who have to cover up 1/3 of their seats and still don't sell out.

    Besides, how quickly people forget that during cold December games, we had problems selling out the Old Met back when the Vikings were perennial super bowl favorites.
    And the Met only had 48k seats...
    Now that watching from home is even better, why on earth would anyone think that we could sell out a 70k seat outdoor stadium?
    Let's face it - modern man is a pussy.
    That's the real truth here.
    The Metrodome sucks now because there aren't enough amenities for the 21st century softie.
    The football fan of the fifties would goggle at the stuff there is for INDOOR football!!!!!

    Three plus hours in -20 wind chills is a recipe for 60% capacity given the option of an HD broadcast and a click-on gas fire in the fireplace.

    =Z=
    While I agree that the game yesterday doesn't sell out if it was outdoors..

    Lets not forget that, yes, this is modern times.
    And I think there would be ways to keep fans somewhat warm in an open air stadium.
    Not sure if any current outdoor stadium does something like this, but probably isn't a bad idea.

    Either way, I would be at the game.

    Hell, the colder it would be, the better chance of me making the game.
    I'm a masochist.
    And tickets would probably be cheap.
    lol
    Vegans are eating the rainforests. =(

  10. #110
    josdin00's Avatar
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    Re: Stadium issue to move forward in 2009 as economic stimulus

    This is an article from Bill Simmons that was published back in November. I missed it the first time around. It talks about the loss of home field advantage in today's NFL, and he asserts that it has a lot to do with the new stadiums being built. It is an extremely well written article, and should be required reading for the folks Wilf is talking to about stadium plans. If we ever get a new one built in Minnesota, I want it designed with this article in mind.

    [size=14pt]Attention: Home-field advantage has left the building[/size]

    http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/partone/081121 wrote:
    Through 11-plus weeks (including Thursday night's Pittsburgh cover), the 14 teams that built SOTAS since 1999 (including Washington) are 29-44 against the spread.

    Yup, you read it correctly: 29-44.

    Week after week, those teams keep getting toppled at home or fail to cover big spreads, typified by three Week 10 games: New England losing in overtime to the Jets, the Colts winning but failing to cover an 8.5-point spread against lowly Houston, and Dallas handling the Redskins in Washington. Would you want Sage Rosenfels trying to cover eight points at the deafening Hoosier Dome? Could 30,000 Steelers fans have taken over a madhouse like RFK? Would Elway's Broncos have ever stumbled to an 0-4-1 record against the spread at Mile High? Could the Titans ever have prevailed in Soldier Field in cold weather without running the ball? Would I have picked last Thursday's game between evenly matched Jets and Pats teams by saying, "I'd like us if we were playing on the road, but since we're home, I'm taking the Jets?" The NFL has been flipped on its wealthy behind.

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