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  1. #11
    ejmat is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Special teams work to Vikings' advantage

    "Overlord" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Anyone notice who was in on all the ST's tackles and who wasn't?

    Loved watching the guys get down there and be in place waiting for the ball to get there.
    Long story short, hang time vs "Kick it as fricken far as you can" will be the key to our success this year, not one ST's player.

    Case in point.....

    Minnesota - 2:23

    1st-10, MIN15 2:23 B. Favre incomplete pass to the right
    2nd-10, MIN15 2:19 B. Favre sacked by B. Pool
    3rd-16, MIN9 2:00 B. Favre passed to C. Taylor to the right for 10 yard gain
    4th-6, MIN19 1:30 C. Kluwe punt. J. Cribbs returned punt for 67 yard touchdown
    http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/boxscore...005&page=plays

    Kluwe clearly outkicked his coverage on this. Cribbs had time to field it and survey the field and select the land not covered.

    Result, TD........

    I wonder if the coaching staff asked him to kick it like that or if they told him to give it hang time?
    Nahh... The kick wasn't booming distance wise - 48 yards.
    And the hang-time wasn't good, but wasn't terrible - 4.4 seconds.
    I think that average hang-time across the NFL is something like 4.6 seconds (not positive on that).

    What happened is that Onatolu got sucked inside, giving up his lane and allowing the return.
    Kluwe took a bad angle too, because he's a punter that thinks he's an athlete, but he's not.
    So mostly it was Onatolu.

    Here's a first screen shot with Onatolu circled in red:
    [img width=450 height=250]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2432/3928913457_774cb3a1b3.jpg[/img]

    The red line is the path he's going to take.
    The blue path is the lane he should have taken.

    Here it is a few frames later:
    [img width=450 height=252]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2469/3928913495_41fcc87c9e.jpg[/img]

    Now he's caught up in a block and realizes that Cribbs is cutting back where he should have been.

    And here it is just a bit later:
    [img width=450 height=250]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2474/3928913547_ecb0a8e532.jpg[/img]

    Onatolu is taking a dive at Cribbs, just missing.

    Childress mentioned 2 guys getting out of their lanes at the press conference Monday (link).
    At 2:58, he talks about the return:
    We had two unblocked guys that jumped out of a lane, and... you know, the same coverage the next time and those two guys get in their lane and it's a minus three return back there.
    I'm not sure who the other guy is, and who might have had a shot at getting him for a loss or instant stop, but Onatolu was the most obvious guy that missed.
    Nice work Overload.
    Beautifully scripted and presented.
    Impressive my friend.

  2. #12
    V-Unit's Avatar
    V-Unit is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Special teams work to Vikings' advantage

    "Overlord" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Anyone notice who was in on all the ST's tackles and who wasn't?

    Loved watching the guys get down there and be in place waiting for the ball to get there.
    Long story short, hang time vs "Kick it as fricken far as you can" will be the key to our success this year, not one ST's player.

    Case in point.....

    Minnesota - 2:23

    1st-10, MIN15 2:23 B. Favre incomplete pass to the right
    2nd-10, MIN15 2:19 B. Favre sacked by B. Pool
    3rd-16, MIN9 2:00 B. Favre passed to C. Taylor to the right for 10 yard gain
    4th-6, MIN19 1:30 C. Kluwe punt. J. Cribbs returned punt for 67 yard touchdown
    http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/boxscore...005&page=plays

    Kluwe clearly outkicked his coverage on this. Cribbs had time to field it and survey the field and select the land not covered.

    Result, TD........

    I wonder if the coaching staff asked him to kick it like that or if they told him to give it hang time?
    Nahh... The kick wasn't booming distance wise - 48 yards.
    And the hang-time wasn't good, but wasn't terrible - 4.4 seconds.
    I think that average hang-time across the NFL is something like 4.6 seconds (not positive on that).

    What happened is that Onatolu got sucked inside, giving up his lane and allowing the return.
    Kluwe took a bad angle too, because he's a punter that thinks he's an athlete, but he's not.
    So mostly it was Onatolu.

    Here's a first screen shot with Onatolu circled in red:
    [img width=450 height=250]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2432/3928913457_774cb3a1b3.jpg[/img]

    The red line is the path he's going to take.
    The blue path is the lane he should have taken.

    Here it is a few frames later:
    [img width=450 height=252]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2469/3928913495_41fcc87c9e.jpg[/img]

    Now he's caught up in a block and realizes that Cribbs is cutting back where he should have been.

    And here it is just a bit later:
    [img width=450 height=250]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2474/3928913547_ecb0a8e532.jpg[/img]

    Onatolu is taking a dive at Cribbs, just missing.

    Childress mentioned 2 guys getting out of their lanes at the press conference Monday (link).
    At 2:58, he talks about the return:
    We had two unblocked guys that jumped out of a lane, and... you know, the same coverage the next time and those two guys get in their lane and it's a minus three return back there.
    I'm not sure who the other guy is, and who might have had a shot at getting him for a loss or instant stop, but Onatolu was the most obvious guy that missed.
    BINGO!

    To answer your question in purple. The other guy is right next to Onatolu, on his left. He also pinches way too far inside and is actually in the hashes when Cribbs makes his break outside. I can't get his number but he is totally out of position. He should have been on the other side of the two blockers, outside of the hashes as Cribbs makes his cut.

    This also means that Onatolu is WAY left of his lane. He should have been hitting Cribbs' left side, keeping contain. The "other guy should have finished the play when/if Cribbes was forced back inside.

    In the end, we totally agree.
    "I hate when threads are destroyed by facts and logic."
    - Prophet


    Thanks Josdin!

  3. #13
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re: Special teams work to Vikings' advantage

    "Overlord" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Anyone notice who was in on all the ST's tackles and who wasn't?

    Loved watching the guys get down there and be in place waiting for the ball to get there.
    Long story short, hang time vs "Kick it as fricken far as you can" will be the key to our success this year, not one ST's player.

    Case in point.....

    Minnesota - 2:23

    1st-10, MIN15 2:23 B. Favre incomplete pass to the right
    2nd-10, MIN15 2:19 B. Favre sacked by B. Pool
    3rd-16, MIN9 2:00 B. Favre passed to C. Taylor to the right for 10 yard gain
    4th-6, MIN19 1:30 C. Kluwe punt. J. Cribbs returned punt for 67 yard touchdown
    http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/boxscore...005&page=plays

    Kluwe clearly outkicked his coverage on this. Cribbs had time to field it and survey the field and select the land not covered.

    Result, TD........

    I wonder if the coaching staff asked him to kick it like that or if they told him to give it hang time?
    Nahh... The kick wasn't booming distance wise - 48 yards.
    And the hang-time wasn't good, but wasn't terrible - 4.4 seconds.
    I think that average hang-time across the NFL is something like 4.6 seconds (not positive on that).

    What happened is that Onatolu got sucked inside, giving up his lane and allowing the return.
    Kluwe took a bad angle too, because he's a punter that thinks he's an athlete, but he's not.
    So mostly it was Onatolu.

    Here's a first screen shot with Onatolu circled in red:
    [img width=450 height=250]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2432/3928913457_774cb3a1b3.jpg[/img]

    The red line is the path he's going to take.
    The blue path is the lane he should have taken.

    Here it is a few frames later:
    [img width=450 height=252]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2469/3928913495_41fcc87c9e.jpg[/img]

    Now he's caught up in a block and realizes that Cribbs is cutting back where he should have been.

    And here it is just a bit later:
    [img width=450 height=250]http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2474/3928913547_ecb0a8e532.jpg[/img]

    Onatolu is taking a dive at Cribbs, just missing.

    Childress mentioned 2 guys getting out of their lanes at the press conference Monday (link).
    At 2:58, he talks about the return:
    We had two unblocked guys that jumped out of a lane, and... you know, the same coverage the next time and those two guys get in their lane and it's a minus three return back there.
    I'm not sure who the other guy is, and who might have had a shot at getting him for a loss or instant stop, but Onatolu was the most obvious guy that missed.
    Were was the great Farwell on this?
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  4. #14
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re: Special teams work to Vikings' advantage

    "V" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Anyone notice who was in on all the ST's tackles and who wasn't?

    Loved watching the guys get down there and be in place waiting for the ball to get there.
    Long story short, hang time vs "Kick it as fricken far as you can" will be the key to our success this year, not one ST's player.

    Case in point.....

    Minnesota - 2:23

    1st-10, MIN15 2:23 B. Favre incomplete pass to the right
    2nd-10, MIN15 2:19 B. Favre sacked by B. Pool
    3rd-16, MIN9 2:00 B. Favre passed to C. Taylor to the right for 10 yard gain
    4th-6, MIN19 1:30 C. Kluwe punt. J. Cribbs returned punt for 67 yard touchdown
    http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/boxscore...005&page=plays

    Kluwe clearly outkicked his coverage on this. Cribbs had time to field it and survey the field and select the land not covered.

    Result, TD........

    I wonder if the coaching staff asked him to kick it like that or if they told him to give it hang time?
    OutKicked his coverage?????????????????????????????? [size=10pt]Come on Marrdro you are better than this.[/size]

    Cribbs TD

    Watch this again.

    1. Kluwe's total punt distance: 48 yards past the line of scrimmage. It's not like he kicked it 60 some yards. Either our guys are slow, or being blocked
    2. Our left runner can't get back his blocker AT ALL.
    3. Watch seconds 10-12. Three Vikings collapse on the ball instead of staying in their lanes. Cribbs makes one move and Bye Bye.

    I agree that Kluwe has made some mistakes in the past, but this is not one of them.
    I am a bit off my game lately.
    I blame the Chiller, LNAD and Heath.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  5. #15
    V-Unit's Avatar
    V-Unit is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Special teams work to Vikings' advantage

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Anyone notice who was in on all the ST's tackles and who wasn't?

    Loved watching the guys get down there and be in place waiting for the ball to get there.
    Long story short, hang time vs "Kick it as fricken far as you can" will be the key to our success this year, not one ST's player.

    Case in point.....

    Minnesota - 2:23

    1st-10, MIN15 2:23 B. Favre incomplete pass to the right
    2nd-10, MIN15 2:19 B. Favre sacked by B. Pool
    3rd-16, MIN9 2:00 B. Favre passed to C. Taylor to the right for 10 yard gain
    4th-6, MIN19 1:30 C. Kluwe punt. J. Cribbs returned punt for 67 yard touchdown
    http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/boxscore...005&page=plays

    Kluwe clearly outkicked his coverage on this. Cribbs had time to field it and survey the field and select the land not covered.

    Result, TD........

    I wonder if the coaching staff asked him to kick it like that or if they told him to give it hang time?
    OutKicked his coverage?????????????????????????????? [size=10pt]Come on Marrdro you are better than this.[/size]

    Cribbs TD

    Watch this again.

    1. Kluwe's total punt distance: 48 yards past the line of scrimmage. It's not like he kicked it 60 some yards. Either our guys are slow, or being blocked
    2. Our left runner can't get back his blocker AT ALL.
    3. Watch seconds 10-12. Three Vikings collapse on the ball instead of staying in their lanes. Cribbs makes one move and Bye Bye.

    I agree that Kluwe has made some mistakes in the past, but this is not one of them.
    I am a bit off my game lately.
    I blame the Chiller, LNAD and Heath.

    That's funny, because two pages ago, you were blaming Kluwe for over kicking the coverage...

    One thing is clear. With Sharper and Birk gone, you need new scapegoats, and you are having an extremely hard time finding them.

    You can't pick any of the young guys, because you would be contradicting yourself. You have spoken for Sullivan, Rice, Griffin, and Tyrell. Loadholt played well, as did Edwards.

    You can't pick any of the vets, because they are playing too well. Longwell kicked a touchback, Kluwe had good punts. Favre showed zip and no INTs.

    Stirring an empty pot just isn't any fun, is it?
    "I hate when threads are destroyed by facts and logic."
    - Prophet


    Thanks Josdin!

  6. #16
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re: Special teams work to Vikings' advantage

    "V" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Anyone notice who was in on all the ST's tackles and who wasn't?

    Loved watching the guys get down there and be in place waiting for the ball to get there.
    Long story short, hang time vs "Kick it as fricken far as you can" will be the key to our success this year, not one ST's player.

    Case in point.....

    Minnesota - 2:23

    1st-10, MIN15 2:23 B. Favre incomplete pass to the right
    2nd-10, MIN15 2:19 B. Favre sacked by B. Pool
    3rd-16, MIN9 2:00 B. Favre passed to C. Taylor to the right for 10 yard gain
    4th-6, MIN19 1:30 C. Kluwe punt. J. Cribbs returned punt for 67 yard touchdown
    http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/boxscore...005&page=plays

    Kluwe clearly outkicked his coverage on this. Cribbs had time to field it and survey the field and select the land not covered.

    Result, TD........

    I wonder if the coaching staff asked him to kick it like that or if they told him to give it hang time?
    OutKicked his coverage?????????????????????????????? [size=10pt]Come on Marrdro you are better than this.[/size]

    Cribbs TD

    Watch this again.

    1. Kluwe's total punt distance: 48 yards past the line of scrimmage. It's not like he kicked it 60 some yards. Either our guys are slow, or being blocked
    2. Our left runner can't get back his blocker AT ALL.
    3. Watch seconds 10-12. Three Vikings collapse on the ball instead of staying in their lanes. Cribbs makes one move and Bye Bye.

    I agree that Kluwe has made some mistakes in the past, but this is not one of them.
    I am a bit off my game lately.
    I blame the Chiller, LNAD and Heath.

    That's funny, because two pages ago, you were blaming Kluwe for over kicking the coverage...

    One thing is clear. With Sharper and Birk gone, you need new scapegoats, and you are having an extremely hard time finding them.

    You can't pick any of the young guys, because you would be contradicting yourself. You have spoken for Sullivan, Rice, Griffin, and Tyrell. Loadholt played well, as did Edwards.

    You can't pick any of the vets, because they are playing too well. Longwell kicked a touchback, Kluwe had good punts. Favre showed zip and no INTs.

    Stirring an empty pot just isn't any fun, is it?
    Twist twist.
    No I did not blame Kluwe, in fact, if you would have read one line further you would have seen that I believed the coaches had him kick it that way....

    Besides, Birk and Sharp weren't scapegoats.
    I just pointed out, as I do with all players when they played bad or good.
    Problem was, there wasn't much "Good" play out of either of them.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  7. #17
    snowinapril's Avatar
    snowinapril is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Special teams work to Vikings' advantage

    BTW, when 82 tried to slide over to get at Cribbs one of the Browns grabbed his shoulder pads in the neckline and held him.
    He would have had a difficult time getting to Cribbs, but it was a hold.
    Oh well that happens on every play doesn't it.
    LOL!

  8. #18
    snowinapril's Avatar
    snowinapril is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Special teams work to Vikings' advantage

    "V" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Anyone notice who was in on all the ST's tackles and who wasn't?

    Loved watching the guys get down there and be in place waiting for the ball to get there.
    Long story short, hang time vs "Kick it as fricken far as you can" will be the key to our success this year, not one ST's player.

    Case in point.....

    Minnesota - 2:23

    1st-10, MIN15 2:23 B. Favre incomplete pass to the right
    2nd-10, MIN15 2:19 B. Favre sacked by B. Pool
    3rd-16, MIN9 2:00 B. Favre passed to C. Taylor to the right for 10 yard gain
    4th-6, MIN19 1:30 C. Kluwe punt. J. Cribbs returned punt for 67 yard touchdown
    http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/boxscore...005&page=plays

    Kluwe clearly outkicked his coverage on this. Cribbs had time to field it and survey the field and select the land not covered.

    Result, TD........

    I wonder if the coaching staff asked him to kick it like that or if they told him to give it hang time?
    OutKicked his coverage?????????????????????????????? [size=10pt]Come on Marrdro you are better than this.[/size]

    Cribbs TD

    Watch this again.

    1. Kluwe's total punt distance: 48 yards past the line of scrimmage. It's not like he kicked it 60 some yards. Either our guys are slow, or being blocked
    2. Our left runner can't get back his blocker AT ALL.
    3. Watch seconds 10-12. Three Vikings collapse on the ball instead of staying in their lanes. Cribbs makes one move and Bye Bye.

    I agree that Kluwe has made some mistakes in the past, but this is not one of them.
    I am a bit off my game lately.
    I blame the Chiller, LNAD and Heath.

    That's funny, because two pages ago, [size=12pt]You[/size] were blaming Kluwe for over kicking the coverage...

    One thing is clear. With Sharper and Birk gone, [size=12pt]You[/size] need new scapegoats, and you are having an extremely hard time finding them.

    [size=12pt]You[/size] can't pick any of the young guys, because you would be contradicting yourself. [size=12pt]You[/size] have spoken for Sullivan, Rice, Griffin, and Tyrell. Loadholt played well, as did Edwards.

    [size=12pt]You[/size] can't pick any of the vets, because they are playing too well. Longwell kicked a touchback, Kluwe had good punts. Favre showed zip and no INTs.

    Stirring an empty pot just isn't any fun, is it?
    Please refrain from using YOU statements.
    Your argument alone is enough, calling out others is not necessary to make a point..

    This goes for everyone, not just this post!

    [size=12pt]You[/size] statement become too personal.

  9. #19
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re: Special teams work to Vikings' advantage

    "snowinapril" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Anyone notice who was in on all the ST's tackles and who wasn't?

    Loved watching the guys get down there and be in place waiting for the ball to get there.
    Long story short, hang time vs "Kick it as fricken far as you can" will be the key to our success this year, not one ST's player.

    Case in point.....

    Minnesota - 2:23

    1st-10, MIN15 2:23 B. Favre incomplete pass to the right
    2nd-10, MIN15 2:19 B. Favre sacked by B. Pool
    3rd-16, MIN9 2:00 B. Favre passed to C. Taylor to the right for 10 yard gain
    4th-6, MIN19 1:30 C. Kluwe punt. J. Cribbs returned punt for 67 yard touchdown
    http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/boxscore...005&page=plays

    Kluwe clearly outkicked his coverage on this. Cribbs had time to field it and survey the field and select the land not covered.

    Result, TD........

    I wonder if the coaching staff asked him to kick it like that or if they told him to give it hang time?
    OutKicked his coverage?????????????????????????????? [size=10pt]Come on Marrdro you are better than this.[/size]

    Cribbs TD

    Watch this again.

    1. Kluwe's total punt distance: 48 yards past the line of scrimmage. It's not like he kicked it 60 some yards. Either our guys are slow, or being blocked
    2. Our left runner can't get back his blocker AT ALL.
    3. Watch seconds 10-12. Three Vikings collapse on the ball instead of staying in their lanes. Cribbs makes one move and Bye Bye.

    I agree that Kluwe has made some mistakes in the past, but this is not one of them.
    I am a bit off my game lately.
    I blame the Chiller, LNAD and Heath.

    That's funny, because two pages ago, [size=12pt]You[/size] were blaming Kluwe for over kicking the coverage...

    One thing is clear. With Sharper and Birk gone, [size=12pt]You[/size] need new scapegoats, and you are having an extremely hard time finding them.

    [size=12pt]You[/size] can't pick any of the young guys, because you would be contradicting yourself. [size=12pt]You[/size] have spoken for Sullivan, Rice, Griffin, and Tyrell. Loadholt played well, as did Edwards.

    [size=12pt]You[/size] can't pick any of the vets, because they are playing too well. Longwell kicked a touchback, Kluwe had good punts. Favre showed zip and no INTs.

    Stirring an empty pot just isn't any fun, is it?
    Please refrain from using YOU statements.
    Your argument alone is enough, calling out others is not necessary to make a point..

    This goes for everyone, not just this post!

    [size=12pt]You[/size] statement become too personal.
    Thanks my friend.
    Truth be told, ole V and I have it that way.
    I have thick skin and for some reason, love to get him going........

    Probably deserved all the YOU's......
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  10. #20
    kevoncox's Avatar
    kevoncox is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Special teams work to Vikings' advantage

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "snowinapril" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "V" wrote:
    [quote author=Marrdro link=topic=53250.msg996501#msg996501 date=1253211537]
    Anyone notice who was in on all the ST's tackles and who wasn't?

    Loved watching the guys get down there and be in place waiting for the ball to get there.
    Long story short, hang time vs "Kick it as fricken far as you can" will be the key to our success this year, not one ST's player.

    Case in point.....

    Minnesota - 2:23

    1st-10, MIN15 2:23 B. Favre incomplete pass to the right
    2nd-10, MIN15 2:19 B. Favre sacked by B. Pool
    3rd-16, MIN9 2:00 B. Favre passed to C. Taylor to the right for 10 yard gain
    4th-6, MIN19 1:30 C. Kluwe punt. J. Cribbs returned punt for 67 yard touchdown
    http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/boxscore...005&page=plays

    Kluwe clearly outkicked his coverage on this. Cribbs had time to field it and survey the field and select the land not covered.

    Result, TD........

    I wonder if the coaching staff asked him to kick it like that or if they told him to give it hang time?
    OutKicked his coverage?????????????????????????????? [size=10pt]Come on Marrdro you are better than this.[/size]

    Cribbs TD

    Watch this again.

    1. Kluwe's total punt distance: 48 yards past the line of scrimmage. It's not like he kicked it 60 some yards. Either our guys are slow, or being blocked
    2. Our left runner can't get back his blocker AT ALL.
    3. Watch seconds 10-12. Three Vikings collapse on the ball instead of staying in their lanes. Cribbs makes one move and Bye Bye.

    I agree that Kluwe has made some mistakes in the past, but this is not one of them.
    I am a bit off my game lately.
    I blame the Chiller, LNAD and Heath.

    That's funny, because two pages ago, [size=12pt]You[/size] were blaming Kluwe for over kicking the coverage...

    One thing is clear. With Sharper and Birk gone, [size=12pt]You[/size] need new scapegoats, and you are having an extremely hard time finding them.

    [size=12pt]You[/size] can't pick any of the young guys, because you would be contradicting yourself. [size=12pt]You[/size] have spoken for Sullivan, Rice, Griffin, and Tyrell. Loadholt played well, as did Edwards.

    [size=12pt]You[/size] can't pick any of the vets, because they are playing too well. Longwell kicked a touchback, Kluwe had good punts. Favre showed zip and no INTs.

    Stirring an empty pot just isn't any fun, is it?
    Please refrain from using YOU statements.
    Your argument alone is enough, calling out others is not necessary to make a point..

    This goes for everyone, not just this post!

    [size=12pt]You[/size] statement become too personal.
    Thanks My Farvish Friend.
    Truth be told, ole V and I have it that way.
    I have thick skin and for some reason, love to get him going........

    Probably deserved all the YOU's......
    [/quote]
    Yous Youth!
    What is a Yoot?

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