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  1. #11
    snowinapril's Avatar
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    Re: Souhan: Vikings could take lessons from Wolves

    Ya, I was surprised that the NFLN guys were nice enough to say TJ did good.

    BTW, back to the article and its title.
    The Wolves are setting no example of what to do.
    The Wolves screwed up by letting Flip go.
    Flip is in the top 10 coaches in the NBA, argue the order yourself he might even be in the top 5.
    The Wolves are like the Lions, they have a terrible GM.
    Right now, I am thinking they lack character from the top down.
    McHale and his under the table payment to Joe "avg fwd" Smith was the down fall of the KG era.
    It forced the team into a one good season scenario where we had to go out and get Spree and Sammy.
    When they left, we still didn't have first round draft picks to help rebuild.
    Souhan must be an idiot.

    As far as the Vikes being compared to the Wolves, it is a difficult comparison.
    Souhan say that basically, the Vikes should take a lesson from the Wolves.
    I think it is the Wolves that need to take the leson from the Vikes........

    The Wolves are rebuilding with a roster filled almost exclusively with promising young players and expiring contracts. They could remind us that the most underrated aspect of following a team is watching young players improve.
    I think we do have a lot of young talent on our team.
    We have had the most young talent on this team, the last few years than we have had in a long time.
    Plus in the NFL, you have a huge roster compared to the NBA.
    You can't just drop everyone and start over.
    You keep some experience and work the young guys up.


    The other thing that could happen if TJ doesn't pan out, we go buy a QB.
    The rest of the team (young talent) will mature and be ready to comete on a high level in the next couple of years.
    Our LBs = young talent.
    Take Sharper
    and AW (old talent) out of the mix, and we are talking about young talented DBs.
    Williams and Williams are old talent but the other guys are young talent.
    I could see Phat Pat gone after this year and the Vikes drafting a DT in the 1st or 2nd round depending on if we need to draft a OL for the right side.

    On offense, we have a TJ, AP, Shank, TW, Rice, Allison, Wade, Cook, and Johnson, all young talent.


    The Wolves only had KG, now they have a lot of NOBODY.
    You can't expect the Vikes to get rid of the quality players that are on this team at a fair market value.
    Corect me if I am wrong, but the only guy we have the is close to the highest paid guy is Hutch, who has probably been out done in pay 2 times by others since his deal went down, no longer the highest paid, I think.


    Anyways, Souhan has to be an idiot.
    His article may have been better just to include the Wolves and the Twins comparison.

    I like the Vikings because it is fun to watch the team develop.
    I can't say that I think the same of the Wolves.
    I am seriously considering cancelling the NBA Pass on DTV this year.
    I will be glad to see a few games this year, but I can't watch that team lose 55 games next year.
    I will probably go see the Wolves live in person at the Toyota center.
    Tickets should be cheap, who wants to see ?? play basketball.
    I will follow the team.
    I will root for the team but I am not going to watch 176 hours of basketball under the circumstances facing the young team.
    I also think this has something to do with the fact that the top down at the Wolves camp has disappointed me thuroughly.
    I feel they cheated me, not just the KG situation.


    Screw basketball, it is football season.
    Go Vikes!

  2. #12
    Braddock's Avatar
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    Re: Souhan: Vikings could take lessons from Wolves

    I guarantee that TJ will pan out better than a guy like Schaub. My proof: none. But those who are so high and mighty on matt don't really have any either. Schaub was a back up until now and is in a new team with different nuances to learn, so it's not like he's been around the same system for years, getting ready to jump right in. They both have the physical skills, just Schaub has more experience on the bench. So to say he will do better than TJ is lunacy, in my opinion, and as a Vikings fan, I can fully guarantee that TJ is prove to be better than he is.

    (i know this is out of left field, but i'm tired of the experts overlooking that fact about Schaub but pinning it on TJ)

    Rant off
    Trying to bring rationale to an irrational site

  3. #13
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
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    Re: Souhan: Vikings could take lessons from Wolves

    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    "COJOMAY" wrote:
    I feel Jackson would have been much better off sitting on the bench for a few years before being thrown to the wolves,
    Tell that to the Steelers who won the Super Bowl with a rookie. QB's should not have to sit on a bench for 3 years unless they have a quality QB in front of them.
    That is a poor comparison to make. The Steelers had a head coach that had been there since we hired Denny Green and had a stable coaching staff along with an established group of veteran players that knew their jobs and could take the pressure off of Ben.

    Compare that to Childress who was hired in the second year of Wilf's ownership having never been a head coach at any level and having never played at the collegiate or pro level and came in with a desire to completely retool the team and transform it into a totally different team mechanically,physically and mentally.

    With those differences there is no way you could use one to justify the other.

    Childress said himself when TJ was drafted that it was a 3 year project, so it is no stretch to say that he may be forcing the issue by starting him now instead of bringing in another vet to run the team while TJ gets prepared.

    I will admit to that, however, is it to far a stretch to admit that maybe TJ is a quicker learner that what the current staff (not just the Chiller) thought he was gonna be?

    Face it, the kid look good.
    gol 'darnit it he even looked better than I thought he was gonna during the game.
    Maybe just maybe, the QB coach did his job coaching the kid and getting him ready, the OC did his job and scripted some plays that fit his strength (a few role outs, a few in the pocket, a couple of runs) and the HC oversaw it all.

    Why is it so hard to grasp that this kid may be the answer and our coaches now a hellof alot more than we do?

    Give it a rest.
    gol 'darnit.

    Hey

    Never did I say he wan't going to pan out.

    But if you are going to call out every poster who says something you don't like and doesn't back it up with some fact or stat, you need to do the same for everyone and that comparison sucked. That is the only thing I was pointing out and I did provide a basis for why I thought the comparison sucked. None of it had anything to do with whether I thought Childress or TJ will work out.

    I don't call out every poster that says something I don't like.
    In most cases I like to entertain a bit of convo with someone who has a different opinion than I do.
    Its what makes this site great.
    You just happen to be one of the guys that I like to engage discussion with.

    You need to look at what I highlighted/bolded.
    I didn't call you out for saying the comparision sucked.
    I called you out for saying they were forcing the issue by brining him in and not bringing in a vet.

    gol 'darnit dude.
    Before you go off, read the thread and what the poster is saying.

    I still like most of your stuff my friend.

    ;D
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  4. #14
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    Re: Souhan: Vikings could take lessons from Wolves

    What he fails to mention is the abundance of young talent on the vikings at this time. If that talent develops into productive players, we won't need Sharper, Pat etc.

    It's good to have a mix of veteran leadership and rookie talent anyways. We have Williamson, Rice, Cook, Peterson, and Tarvaris all potentially making impacts on offense. With that we have Hutchinson and McKinnie both locked up long-term and if our free agents on offense fail we have a huge amount of cap room to go out and get more talent.

    On defense we have Greenway, Edwards, Udeze, Erasmus, Griffin, McCauley etc. potentially making an impact next season.. all young, raw players that you can build a franchise around if they break out.

    Maybe he's seeing something that i'm not but we have enough young talent on this team in my opinion.

  5. #15
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    Re: Souhan: Vikings could take lessons from Wolves

    "I feel Jackson would have been much better off sitting on the bench for a few years before being thrown to the wolves, "

    "Tell that to the Steelers who won the Super Bowl with a rookie. QB's should not have to sit on a bench for 3 years unless they have a quality QB in front of them. "

    ........This is an extremely poor comparison to make. You are comparing TJack to Hall of Famer Terry Bradshaw, which is pretty ridiculous. TJack doesn't have near the receivers or team that Bradshaw had when he broke in. Comparing the 2007 Vikings to the Steeler teams from the mid-70s is just a joke and I can't take your argument seriously.

    I think virtually anyone who knows anything about football (and on the internet that is probably hard) will tell you that ideally you want to break in your QB slowly so he has time to learn the game. The Packers have done a great job by breaking in QB Rodgers slowly. Rodgers is much farther along than TJack and you can ask anyone who knows anything about football and they will tell you the same thing.

    Exceptions to being ready right away are rare, but they do happen. Taking a QB in the top ten picks like a Leinart, Palmer or Cutler probably means that they should be ready sooner as they are very highly regarded, but that isn't always the case either. I think TJack could eventually become a good QB, but this is not the ideal situation for him. He also has very little experience at WR to help him out.

    You can really shatter a kid's confidence by rushing him in there too early, that's one of the reasons you don't do this. You can expect NFL defenses to mix it up on him, try to confuse him with different coverages and blitz packages and will be successful AT TIMES. TJack will learn a lot this year - he has to!! There are a lot of things that TJack has to learn and I do not know if he is ready yet.

    One thing I DO know..........he isn't Terry Bradshaw. Give him some time - a lot of his mistakes that he will make this year aren't really his fault - his lack of experience will be the blame for a lot of it....
    "SHOOT EM JIMMY!!"

  6. #16
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    Re: Souhan: Vikings could take lessons from Wolves

    "Angel_Martin" wrote:
    "I feel Jackson would have been much better off sitting on the bench for a few years before being thrown to the wolves, "

    "Tell that to the Steelers who won the Super Bowl with a rookie. QB's should not have to sit on a bench for 3 years unless they have a quality QB in front of them. "

    ........This is an extremely poor comparison to make. You are comparing TJack to Hall of Famer Terry Bradshaw, which is pretty ridiculous. TJack doesn't have near the receivers or team that Bradshaw had when he broke in. Comparing the 2007 Vikings to the Steeler teams from the mid-70s is just a joke and I can't take your argument seriously.

    I think virtually anyone who knows anything about football (and on the internet that is probably hard) will tell you that ideally you want to break in your QB slowly so he has time to learn the game. The Packers have done a great job by breaking in QB Rodgers slowly. Rodgers is much farther along than TJack and you can ask anyone who knows anything about football and they will tell you the same thing.

    Exceptions to being ready right away are rare, but they do happen. Taking a QB in the top ten picks like a Leinart, Palmer or Cutler probably means that they should be ready sooner as they are very highly regarded, but that isn't always the case either. I think TJack could eventually become a good QB, but this is not the ideal situation for him. He also has very little experience at WR to help him out.

    You can really shatter a kid's confidence by rushing him in there too early, that's one of the reasons you don't do this. You can expect NFL defenses to mix it up on him, try to confuse him with different coverages and blitz packages and will be successful AT TIMES. TJack will learn a lot this year - he has to!! There are a lot of things that TJack has to learn and I do not know if he is ready yet.

    One thing I DO know..........he isn't Terry Bradshaw. Give him some time - a lot of his mistakes that he will make this year aren't really his fault - his lack of experience will be the blame for a lot of it....
    um i think he meant ben roethlisberger

    Thanks josdin00

  7. #17
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    .......Mardanno

    "His approval rating only counts with the man who signs his checks.
    And if I'm not mistaken the owner has come out repeatedly saying how much confidence he has in this current HC and his staff.


    Additionally, as with all the players drafted, it wasn't just the ole Chiller up in the war room saying I want this guy and that guy and that guy.
    It was a combination of all people involved from the scout all the way up to the capologist with the HC and his assistants in there somewhere.

    With that said, this staff has done a good job with respect to selecting talented players who fit the scheme last year and again (even though they haven't played an NFL game yet) this year.

    Why would the Chiller loose his job if one player (i.e. TJ doesn't pan out)."

    ...

    ...........First off, never take what an owner says seriously, especially when they give their coach a "vote of confidence." That usually means the coach is on the hot seat. You don't see coaches at the top of their game get a vote of confidence.

    Why would "the Chiller" loose (haha yeah right) his job if one player doesn't pan out? I don't know.......don't ask me, ask all the Vikings fans who voted him at a 20 per cent approval rating last year when asked if they thought he was doing a good job, I didn't vote. Also ask the nearly 9,000 season ticket holders that did not renew their tickets for this season.

    Personally, I think you have to give the guy more time to implement his system but an owner who is desperately trying to gain public approval so he can build a new stadium might not be so patient if fans stop going to the games. I think the fellow Viking fans that I talk to are usually upset that the offense has been gutted of their skill players that enabled them to score so many points, but I personally do not think that can be blamed on Childress. It wasn't his fault that Moss/Culpepper etc are gone - he is trying to pick up the pieces on that. However, fans aren't too happy with the vanilla offensive schemes and really aren't too optimistic about this season, either.

    I am cautiously optimistic - we might have a very nice season if things pan out!!
    It will be an interesting season and I am excited to see another football season.
    Go Vikes!!

    "SHOOT EM JIMMY!!"

  8. #18
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    tb.........

    I think you are right!!! haha - well I don't think TJack was drafted as highly or is expected to be in Roethlisberger's league just yet, either.


    This guy needs some time, people......
    "SHOOT EM JIMMY!!"

  9. #19
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    Re: tb.........

    "Angel_Martin" wrote:
    I think you are right!!! haha - well I don't think TJack was drafted as highly or is expected to be in Roethlisberger's league just yet, either.


    This guy needs some time, people......
    We don't have any way of knowing yet, but he may well be a far more successful QB than Ben by the time they both hang up the cleats.

  10. #20
    Marrdro's Avatar
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    Re: .......Mardanno

    "Angel_Martin" wrote:
    "His approval rating only counts with the man who signs his checks.
    And if I'm not mistaken the owner has come out repeatedly saying how much confidence he has in this current HC and his staff.


    Additionally, as with all the players drafted, it wasn't just the ole Chiller up in the war room saying I want this guy and that guy and that guy.
    It was a combination of all people involved from the scout all the way up to the capologist with the HC and his assistants in there somewhere.

    With that said, this staff has done a good job with respect to selecting talented players who fit the scheme last year and again (even though they haven't played an NFL game yet) this year.

    Why would the Chiller loose his job if one player (i.e. TJ doesn't pan out)."

    ...

    ...........First off, never take what an owner says seriously, especially when they give their coach a "vote of confidence." That usually means the coach is on the hot seat. You don't see coaches at the top of their game get a vote of confidence.

    Why would "the Chiller" loose (haha yeah right) his job if one player doesn't pan out? I don't know.......don't ask me, ask all the Vikings fans who voted him at a 20 per cent approval rating last year when asked if they thought he was doing a good job, I didn't vote. Also ask the nearly 9,000 season ticket holders that did not renew their tickets for this season.

    Personally, I think you have to give the guy more time to implement his system but an owner who is desperately trying to gain public approval so he can build a new stadium might not be so patient if fans stop going to the games. I think the fellow Viking fans that I talk to are usually upset that the offense has been gutted of their skill players that enabled them to score so many points, but I personally do not think that can be blamed on Childress. It wasn't his fault that Moss/Culpepper etc are gone - he is trying to pick up the pieces on that. However, fans aren't too happy with the vanilla offensive schemes and really aren't too optimistic about this season, either.

    I am cautiously optimistic - we might have a very nice season if things pan out!!
    It will be an interesting season and I am excited to see another football season.
    Go Vikes!!
    You still think that the fans have to much say in things.
    I will take it one step further and say the politicians and lobbiest have a hell of alot more to say about it than Joe MN public does.

    Yes, I agree if the ticket sales aren't there then the owner will get a bit shaky with respect to coaching changes however changing the coach will only bring about more instability and scheme changes resulting in more losses.


    As for a vanilla offense.
    The WCO is nothing but vanilla.
    As a matter of fact it is a pretty exciting offense to watch if you know something about the game and what they are trying to do when running it.
    It just takes the right players to execute it.
    IMHO we have that in place now.
    They just need a bit of time to mature.

    The flip side of that is a lot of "So Called" "Football Fans" of today are sold on Madden like plays that we got used to with Moss around.
    The Randy ratio has left the building.
    This team will use the WCO to move the ball down the field taking what the D gives them.

    Winning fixes everything my friend.
    I think some things will be fixed this year.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

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