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  1. #21
    NodakPaul's Avatar
    NodakPaul is offline Jersey Retired
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    1

    Re: Since I've been gone

    "Storm" wrote:
    Well, what you said doesnt really matter to me either. You can keep preaching that losing close games is great, but again, in NFL - no one cares how close that loss was.
    I think the point is that losing by 50 and losing by 5 represent very different types of problems with the team.
    Different problems require different solutions.
    I am not a coach, but my guess is that the solution for a team that consistently loses by 5 is less of a severe change than that of a team that is consistently losing by 50.
    Zeus wrote:
    When are you going to realize that picking out the 20 bad throws this year and ignoring the 300 good ones does not make your point?

    =Z=

  2. #22
    Storm's Avatar
    Storm is offline Pro-Bowler
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
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    492

    Re: Since I've been gone

    "Del" wrote:
    "Storm" wrote:
    "Del" wrote:
    "Storm" wrote:
    "Del" wrote:
    [quote author=Storm link=topic=29704.msg506942#msg506942 date=1165515764]
    [quote author=Del Rio link=topic=29704.msg506927#msg506927 date=1165515206]
    [quote author=Storm link=topic=29704.msg506920#msg506920 date=1165514947]
    The "we lose by close margin" tune is getting pretty old. Seriously, no one cares. Point differencials dont mean jack in NFL. They dont matter for standings, they dont matter for tiebreakers, they just plain dont matter. If you cant find a way to win you still suck, be it 14-13 or 41-0. The former just means more heartbreak for the fans.
    It makes a big difference. Maybe not to you which doesn't matter anyway. To the coaches and to the decisions it makes it is huge.

    If your losing by less then one score and you lead the league in offensive penalties (Which we do) then it is all but certain those penalties affected the outcome of the game. Which in turn is probably why you don't see all the players that aren't hanging on posters on some fans walls getting benched just because some random guy says so.

    If your losing by 30 your getting your jiggly butt handed to you, if your losing by 5 your making mistakes. Wheather it gets old or not it is relevant.
    Except for you're wrong and your logic is flawed. See, football is not math, and you wont win by just adding penalty numbers from total yards and saying "oh look, if we had +60 yards we would've won". Thats bull shizzle. If you cant find a way to win with penalties, you will find a way to lose without 'em. First you need some one who can call plays. Thats a good start. Then you can work on discipline and only after that you start winning games.
    No football is math, and it is science, and it is a lot more complicated then most care to look into. You have 11 guys on the field and every single one of them has a job to do. If even one of those people fails it could result in poor play by all. It is called a margin of error and it exsists in every aspect of the game. It is coached, it is reviewed and it is most definately a main factor in decision making. Obviously I have absolutely no experience in the NFL, I do however sit in meetings after a loss or a win of my team and get to go over the margin of error.

    What went wrong? Why? Who? What happened? How did it effect the game? What can we do to fix it?

    You can have every single guy do the right thing except one and have a total failure on the play. Coaches, and players single out the problem while fans spout off about football being about getting it done and not getting it done. In the end that is all that matters, but getting to that end takes isolating the problem.

    Teams do not get magically better. They get better by identifying errors and correcting them and I am sorry, if your losing by 50 points a game your team has a whole hell of a lot more margin of error then if you lose by 5, it isn't flawed it is a fact.
    Still doesnt make sense. Teams can get blown out in one game and come back strong in the next one and win. Those are inconsistent teams. We're different, we just keep losing consistently. The argument boils down to the point that we are not getting blown out. Well whoopdiedoo, but are not winning either. Whatever goes on during the analysis and error correction proccess is obviously not working. When we try to correct one problem, ten others pop out. We try to mix in some deep passes only to discover that BJ cant throw. We shake up the o-line and it does well in one game, then its absolutely horrible in the next match. We keep calling the plays that our players CAN NOT execute. Basically, this team cant get its crap together. The point margin only matters when you take heart and learn from that close loss and come back strong. We are not doing that, we just keep losing. Sorry but I cant be too optimistic about my team when its in such situation. Not in this season.
    Your optimism is not really my concern, all I said was it is relevent. I still say it is and I always will.
    [/quote]

    Well, what you said doesnt really matter to me either. You can keep preaching that losing close games is great, but again, in NFL - no one cares how close that loss was.
    [/quote]

    No one that matters does.
    You can keep putting words in my mouth all you want too. I never said losing close games is great, I said it is relevant. It is relevant to the development of our team and how close we are to being able to turn this around. Just because it doesn't make you feel all warm and fuzzy inside doesn't mean it isn't true.

    And from your ability to try and put words in my mouth it seems you have more of a problem with what you think people believe and what they actually told you they believe. Which is a pretty amazing feat considering everything is typed out for the world to see.
    [/quote]

    If people who run the league and set the rules dont matter to you, thats none of my problem. I'd however say that their opinion matters much more than yours when it comes to football.

    Losing close games doesnt mean you're neccessarily going to turn it around and have a great team. Thats nonsense. You might very well end up losing more tight games or even getting worse. The point was not that losing close games is better than getting blown out, thats obvious. The point was that your argument is old and tired. Just because we lose close ones doesnt mean we're getting better.

  3. #23
    Del Rio Guest

    Re: Since I've been gone

    "Storm" wrote:
    "Del" wrote:
    "Storm" wrote:
    "Del" wrote:
    "Storm" wrote:
    [quote author=Del Rio link=topic=29704.msg506949#msg506949 date=1165516360]
    [quote author=Storm link=topic=29704.msg506942#msg506942 date=1165515764]
    [quote author=Del Rio link=topic=29704.msg506927#msg506927 date=1165515206]
    [quote author=Storm link=topic=29704.msg506920#msg506920 date=1165514947]
    The "we lose by close margin" tune is getting pretty old. Seriously, no one cares. Point differencials dont mean jack in NFL. They dont matter for standings, they dont matter for tiebreakers, they just plain dont matter. If you cant find a way to win you still suck, be it 14-13 or 41-0. The former just means more heartbreak for the fans.
    It makes a big difference. Maybe not to you which doesn't matter anyway. To the coaches and to the decisions it makes it is huge.

    If your losing by less then one score and you lead the league in offensive penalties (Which we do) then it is all but certain those penalties affected the outcome of the game. Which in turn is probably why you don't see all the players that aren't hanging on posters on some fans walls getting benched just because some random guy says so.

    If your losing by 30 your getting your jiggly butt handed to you, if your losing by 5 your making mistakes. Wheather it gets old or not it is relevant.
    Except for you're wrong and your logic is flawed. See, football is not math, and you wont win by just adding penalty numbers from total yards and saying "oh look, if we had +60 yards we would've won". Thats bull shizzle. If you cant find a way to win with penalties, you will find a way to lose without 'em. First you need some one who can call plays. Thats a good start. Then you can work on discipline and only after that you start winning games.
    No football is math, and it is science, and it is a lot more complicated then most care to look into. You have 11 guys on the field and every single one of them has a job to do. If even one of those people fails it could result in poor play by all. It is called a margin of error and it exsists in every aspect of the game. It is coached, it is reviewed and it is most definately a main factor in decision making. Obviously I have absolutely no experience in the NFL, I do however sit in meetings after a loss or a win of my team and get to go over the margin of error.

    What went wrong? Why? Who? What happened? How did it effect the game? What can we do to fix it?

    You can have every single guy do the right thing except one and have a total failure on the play. Coaches, and players single out the problem while fans spout off about football being about getting it done and not getting it done. In the end that is all that matters, but getting to that end takes isolating the problem.

    Teams do not get magically better. They get better by identifying errors and correcting them and I am sorry, if your losing by 50 points a game your team has a whole hell of a lot more margin of error then if you lose by 5, it isn't flawed it is a fact.
    Still doesnt make sense. Teams can get blown out in one game and come back strong in the next one and win. Those are inconsistent teams. We're different, we just keep losing consistently. The argument boils down to the point that we are not getting blown out. Well whoopdiedoo, but are not winning either. Whatever goes on during the analysis and error correction proccess is obviously not working. When we try to correct one problem, ten others pop out. We try to mix in some deep passes only to discover that BJ cant throw. We shake up the o-line and it does well in one game, then its absolutely horrible in the next match. We keep calling the plays that our players CAN NOT execute. Basically, this team cant get its crap together. The point margin only matters when you take heart and learn from that close loss and come back strong. We are not doing that, we just keep losing. Sorry but I cant be too optimistic about my team when its in such situation. Not in this season.
    Your optimism is not really my concern, all I said was it is relevent. I still say it is and I always will.
    [/quote]

    Well, what you said doesnt really matter to me either. You can keep preaching that losing close games is great, but again, in NFL - no one cares how close that loss was.
    [/quote]

    No one that matters does.
    You can keep putting words in my mouth all you want too. I never said losing close games is great, I said it is relevant. It is relevant to the development of our team and how close we are to being able to turn this around. Just because it doesn't make you feel all warm and fuzzy inside doesn't mean it isn't true.

    And from your ability to try and put words in my mouth it seems you have more of a problem with what you think people believe and what they actually told you they believe. Which is a pretty amazing feat considering everything is typed out for the world to see.
    [/quote]

    If people who run the league and set the rules dont matter to you, thats none of my problem. I'd however say that their opinion matters much more than yours when it comes to football.

    Losing close games doesnt mean you're neccessarily going to turn it around and have a great team. Thats nonsense. You might very well end up losing more tight games or even getting worse. The point was not that losing close games is better than getting blown out, thats obvious. The point was that your argument is old and tired. Just because we lose close ones doesnt mean we're getting better.
    [/quote]

    I'm sorry that a topic that has been discussed a whole what 3 weeks is old and tired to you, but in regards to conversation if that's all you got is It's old and tired then I suggest you pass on by and don't even bother.

    People who run the league have nothing to do with coaching a team. So not it probably doesn't matter to them. The people that do not matter are you and I and every other fan that thinks a fundemental fact of any sport is old and tired.

  4. #24
    WisconsinSucks's Avatar
    WisconsinSucks is offline Asst. Coach
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    567

    Re: Since I've been gone

    "Del" wrote:
    "Storm" wrote:
    "Del" wrote:
    "Storm" wrote:
    "Del" wrote:
    [quote author=Storm link=topic=29704.msg506964#msg506964 date=1165517629]
    [quote author=Del Rio link=topic=29704.msg506949#msg506949 date=1165516360]
    [quote author=Storm link=topic=29704.msg506942#msg506942 date=1165515764]
    [quote author=Del Rio link=topic=29704.msg506927#msg506927 date=1165515206]
    [quote author=Storm link=topic=29704.msg506920#msg506920 date=1165514947]
    The "we lose by close margin" tune is getting pretty old. Seriously, no one cares. Point differencials dont mean jack in NFL. They dont matter for standings, they dont matter for tiebreakers, they just plain dont matter. If you cant find a way to win you still suck, be it 14-13 or 41-0. The former just means more heartbreak for the fans.
    It makes a big difference. Maybe not to you which doesn't matter anyway. To the coaches and to the decisions it makes it is huge.

    If your losing by less then one score and you lead the league in offensive penalties (Which we do) then it is all but certain those penalties affected the outcome of the game. Which in turn is probably why you don't see all the players that aren't hanging on posters on some fans walls getting benched just because some random guy says so.

    If your losing by 30 your getting your jiggly butt handed to you, if your losing by 5 your making mistakes. Wheather it gets old or not it is relevant.
    Except for you're wrong and your logic is flawed. See, football is not math, and you wont win by just adding penalty numbers from total yards and saying "oh look, if we had +60 yards we would've won". Thats bull shizzle. If you cant find a way to win with penalties, you will find a way to lose without 'em. First you need some one who can call plays. Thats a good start. Then you can work on discipline and only after that you start winning games.
    No football is math, and it is science, and it is a lot more complicated then most care to look into. You have 11 guys on the field and every single one of them has a job to do. If even one of those people fails it could result in poor play by all. It is called a margin of error and it exsists in every aspect of the game. It is coached, it is reviewed and it is most definately a main factor in decision making. Obviously I have absolutely no experience in the NFL, I do however sit in meetings after a loss or a win of my team and get to go over the margin of error.

    What went wrong? Why? Who? What happened? How did it effect the game? What can we do to fix it?

    You can have every single guy do the right thing except one and have a total failure on the play. Coaches, and players single out the problem while fans spout off about football being about getting it done and not getting it done. In the end that is all that matters, but getting to that end takes isolating the problem.

    Teams do not get magically better. They get better by identifying errors and correcting them and I am sorry, if your losing by 50 points a game your team has a whole hell of a lot more margin of error then if you lose by 5, it isn't flawed it is a fact.
    Still doesnt make sense. Teams can get blown out in one game and come back strong in the next one and win. Those are inconsistent teams. We're different, we just keep losing consistently. The argument boils down to the point that we are not getting blown out. Well whoopdiedoo, but are not winning either. Whatever goes on during the analysis and error correction proccess is obviously not working. When we try to correct one problem, ten others pop out. We try to mix in some deep passes only to discover that BJ cant throw. We shake up the o-line and it does well in one game, then its absolutely horrible in the next match. We keep calling the plays that our players CAN NOT execute. Basically, this team cant get its crap together. The point margin only matters when you take heart and learn from that close loss and come back strong. We are not doing that, we just keep losing. Sorry but I cant be too optimistic about my team when its in such situation. Not in this season.
    Your optimism is not really my concern, all I said was it is relevent. I still say it is and I always will.
    [/quote]

    Well, what you said doesnt really matter to me either. You can keep preaching that losing close games is great, but again, in NFL - no one cares how close that loss was.
    [/quote]

    No one that matters does.
    You can keep putting words in my mouth all you want too. I never said losing close games is great, I said it is relevant. It is relevant to the development of our team and how close we are to being able to turn this around. Just because it doesn't make you feel all warm and fuzzy inside doesn't mean it isn't true.

    And from your ability to try and put words in my mouth it seems you have more of a problem with what you think people believe and what they actually told you they believe. Which is a pretty amazing feat considering everything is typed out for the world to see.
    [/quote]

    If people who run the league and set the rules dont matter to you, thats none of my problem. I'd however say that their opinion matters much more than yours when it comes to football.

    Losing close games doesnt mean you're neccessarily going to turn it around and have a great team. Thats nonsense. You might very well end up losing more tight games or even getting worse. The point was not that losing close games is better than getting blown out, thats obvious. The point was that your argument is old and tired. Just because we lose close ones doesnt mean we're getting better.
    [/quote]

    I'm sorry that a topic that has been discussed a whole what 3 weeks is old and tired to you, but in regards to conversation if that's all you got is It's old and tired then I suggest you pass on by and don't even bother.

    People who run the league have nothing to do with coaching a team. So not it probably doesn't matter to them. The people that do not matter are you and I and every other fan that thinks a fundemental fact of any sport is old and tired.
    [/quote]


    Storm is right that if the car don't start it doesn't matter why, it still don't start.

    Del is right in if the engine is blown it will cost a boatload more than if just the starter is bad.

    BOTH RIGHT.

  5. #25
    snowinapril's Avatar
    snowinapril is offline Jersey Retired
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    13,404

    Re: Since I've been gone

    "VikemanX84" wrote:
    Bad Things.

    1. Brad Childress -

    2. Brad Johnson.


    Brad Johnson is bad.
    Bad things or did you mean to say BRAD things.
    LOL!

    Does bad = Brads?
    That is the question.

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