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  1. #1
    singersp's Avatar
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    Schemes could hurt Vikings

    [size=13pt]Schemes could hurt Vikings[/size]

    Monday, July 21, 2008

    Posted by John McMullen
    realfootball365.com



    If you follow the Minnesota Vikings, "zone" has become a dirty word....

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  2. #2
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    Re: Schemes could hurt Vikings

    Neither McKinnie nor Hutchinson is particularly comfortable with that system, which is better suited for undersized, quick offensive linemen.

    It's been even worse on the right side of the line where Artis Hicks, Anthony Herrera, Marcus Johnson and Ryan Cook have resided. Opposing teams have often overloaded that side of the line and each player has struggled to understand his assignments.

    Despite the problems, Childress and Morris have not wavered, continuing to employ the flawed scheme.
    I have hated that scheme ever since they instilled it here & have been a proponent of them changing it.

    Marrdro seems to think that once mastered, the scheme will be better. The question is when will that be? Hutch & McKinnie are veterans & they still have trouble with it after 2 years. Birk has too at times as well.

    I have heard it takes 5 years to learn it well. When you are on the verge of being a SB contender, I find it discouraging that we will struggle to do that because we have veteran players & rookies still trying to learn a complicated scheme.

    Meanwhile GB has installed just about a brand new line full of new players & in less than 1 years time & they have given Favre ample time to unload the ball. Not to mention finishing 13-3 & going to the playoffs. A lot of Favre's success can be attributed to that O-Line.

    With todays FA being what it is & players coming & going as often as they do, 5 years seems like too long of a time to wait for a return on the investment, especially if the player won't be around anymore afterwards.

    Don't believe me? How many players do we have on todays roster that were here 5 years ago?

    Nuff said.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  3. #3
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    Re: Schemes could hurt Vikings


    Dang I hope it doesn't take 5 years to master the zone blocking scheme. I was thinking that this being the third year we would have a comfort level with this system. I'm hoping we are ahead of the learning curve, and can execute this zone blocking with less thinking. Birk has had ample time to review what went wrong, and what worked last year against the different defensive fronts we've faced, and I think he'll make better calls at the line of scrimmage.

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    Re: Schemes could hurt Vikings

    oh yea its a horrible scheme it only allowed us to rush for 2400 yards and have the most 10,20 and 40 yard runs last season its also why we sent 2 linemen to the probowl and had herrera have a breakout season,Terible just terrible

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    Re: Schemes could hurt Vikings


    actually green bay also runs a zone blocking scheme
    "singersp" wrote:
    Neither McKinnie nor Hutchinson is particularly comfortable with that system, which is better suited for undersized, quick offensive linemen.

    It's been even worse on the right side of the line where Artis Hicks, Anthony Herrera, Marcus Johnson and Ryan Cook have resided. Opposing teams have often overloaded that side of the line and each player has struggled to understand his assignments.

    Despite the problems, Childress and Morris have not wavered, continuing to employ the flawed scheme.
    I have hated that scheme ever since they instilled it here & have been a proponent of them changing it.

    Marrdro seems to think that once mastered, the scheme will be better. The question is when will that be? Hutch & McKinnie are veterans & they still have trouble with it after 2 years. Birk has too at times as well.

    I have heard it takes 5 years to learn it well. When you are on the verge of being a SB contender, I find it discouraging that we will struggle to do that because we have veteran players & rookies still trying to learn a complicated scheme.

    Meanwhile GB has installed just about a brand new line full of new players & in less than 1 years time & they have given Favre ample time to unload the ball. Not to mention finishing 13-3 & going to the playoffs. A lot of Favre's success can be attributed to that O-Line.

    With todays FA being what it is & players coming & going as often as they do, 5 years seems like too long of a time to wait for a return on the investment, especially if the player won't be around anymore afterwards.

    Don't believe me? How many players do we have on todays roster that were here 5 years ago?

    Nuff said.

  6. #6
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    Re: Schemes could hurt Vikings

    "thevikingfan" wrote:
    oh yea its a horrible scheme it only allowed us to rush for 2400 yards and have the most 10,20 and 40 yard runs last season its also why we sent 2 linemen to the probowl and had herrera have a breakout season,Terible just terrible
    I don't agree, you have to give credit to AD and CT for that to. Also Birk got in by name ( i'm not 100% on that but i do agree with a big part of it ) The pass blocking is not good at all that is something that should be taken care of..
    Rosie O'Donnell is a dude!

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    Re: Schemes could hurt Vikings

    "Mr-holland" wrote:
    "thevikingfan" wrote:
    oh yea its a horrible scheme it only allowed us to rush for 2400 yards and have the most 10,20 and 40 yard runs last season its also why we sent 2 linemen to the probowl and had herrera have a breakout season,Terible just terrible
    I don't agree, you have to give credit to AD and CT for that to. Also Birk got in by name ( i'm not 100% on that but i do agree with a big part of it ) The pass blocking is not good at all that is something that should be taken care of..
    the vikes allowed 38 sacks or a little over 2 sacks a game considering our receiving core last year and the fact that we had holcomb and bollinger playing qb at times it seems reasonable

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    Re: Schemes could hurt Vikings

    good article! Does anyone knows if New England or other good o-lines in NFL use the same scheme as the Vikings.

    Maybe the zone scheme is bad when pass blocking...

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    Re: Schemes could hurt Vikings

    "HEY" wrote:
    good article! Does anyone knows if New England or other good o-lines in NFL use the same scheme as the Vikings.

    Maybe the zone scheme is bad when pass blocking...
    The zone blocking isn't a bad scheme when you have the right players in it. We just don't IMO.

    As Singer stated, you need to have smaller, more agile blockers and we don't have that type of player on the outside which is our biggest problem.

    Denver has had the system since Shanahan took over. They were average the first year, went 13-3 the next and then went on to win 2 SB's withing the first 5 years in the system. As was said, GB brought in several rookies in the past few years and still ran that system well enough to go to the playoffs the last 2 years and get 1 play from the SB.

    We either don't have the proper personnel to execute it, the wrong coaches teaching it, or my guess is a combination of both.

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    Re: Schemes could hurt Vikings

    "HEY" wrote:
    good article! Does anyone knows if New England or other good o-lines in NFL use the same scheme as the Vikings.

    Maybe the zone scheme is bad when pass blocking...
    The zone blocking scheme is essentially a run blocking scheme.
    Pass blocking is still about reading the defense, getting your assignments right, and then being more badass than the guy across from you.
    We struggled at times last year, and I think we're expecting/hoping for big improvements this year from Birk on the first part and our tackles on the last part.

    Anyway, the article seems a year too late.
    The fit of the zone blocking scheme was a concern all of 2006 and going into last year, but our top 3 running backs each averaged at least 5.4 yards/carry in 2007.
    I also took a look at the top running backs last year by average, and 5 of the top 6 run in zone blocking schemes (J. Norwood, A. Peterson, C. Taylor, S. Young, R. Grant - link).

    If I have one complaint with our zone blocking scheme it's that we don't seem to cut block enough.
    The cut blocking by the backside guys cuts off a lot of the pursuit and opens up some cut back lanes.
    I don't understand why about half the teams taking up the zone blocking scheme don't do it now, but I can only imagine that they're sensitive to the injury concerns.
    Rules haven't changed though, so I'm not a fan of that reasoning (if that is what they're thinking).
    When the age of the Vikings came to a close, they must have sensed it. Probably, they gathered together one evening, slapped each other on the back and said, "Hey, good job." - Jack Handey [Deep Thoughts]

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