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  1. #11
    tastywaves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevoncox View Post
    I don't think we did Ponder any service with some of the playcalling.
    I'm not saying that he is the QB for the Vikings. I am saying that I saw growth.
    I rather see him throwing some deep passes and getting shit picked off than sitting in awe of his 68% completion percentage on nothing but dumpoffs. he took 2 steps forward and 1 step back so far. It's still progress. He completed 2 Balls over 40 yards... How many did he complete all last season. It's progress. Again... I'll probably will be calling for his head week 5... but I have atleast deccided to give him a few more games to show and prove.
    If your a team that is trying to develop a vertical passing game with a young QB (like Luck last year), then I would agree your premise. It's like we were treating this as a pre-season game with a rookie QB and trying out a few new things that we are historically very bad at. Well turns out we are still pretty bad at it. Don't be surprised if Frazier and Musgrove don't go back in their shells and start calling ultra conservative games again. One thing this team absolutely cannot do is overcome a TO deficit. You'll probably have to go back to Favre to find a game that we won when we lost the TO battle.

  2. #12
    kingpin9995 is offline Starter
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    Quote Originally Posted by tastywaves View Post
    If your a team that is trying to develop a vertical passing game with a young QB (like Luck last year), then I would agree your premise. It's like we were treating this as a pre-season game with a rookie QB and trying out a few new things that we are historically very bad at. Well turns out we are still pretty bad at it. Don't be surprised if Frazier and Musgrove don't go back in their shells and start calling ultra conservative games again. One thing this team absolutely cannot do is overcome a TO deficit. You'll probably have to go back to Favre to find a game that we won when we lost the TO battle.
    The game plan is vanilla without high risk throws because Musgrave is handcuffed in that regard. He calls these games because he does not trust his qb to make those throws. The game plan is run run and dump and hope we can pull a game out , and hope even more Ponder does not fuk up. That's not how you win games consistently in the NFL today. It's not brain surgery. Most non homer Viking fans knew after one season that T Jack could not play at this level. Ponder is the same animal almosts. T Jack had the arm and the talent physically. The game just moved to fast for his brain. Ponder does not have an NFL adequate arm and HE KNOWS IT. Without that you have to have the other intangables like pocket presence, anticipation and guts to throw the ball to a spot before the receiver is there. Ponder has and wants nothing of that. After we lose badly to the Bears the inmates at the Prison Mall of America field will be calling for his head already. It's gonna get ugly..

  3. #13
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    purplehelmut is offline Pro-Bowler
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    There have been plenty of successful QBs with less than cannon arms, but if you don't have one you have to make up for it by reading defenses, escaping pressure, having a pocket presence, and being accurate. Ponder has shown no consistency in any of those areas. What chaps me is all these first and second year QBs lighting it up and here is Ponder in year three and looking the same as he did year one. It's depressing to watch.

  4. #14
    smegmavike is offline Coordinator
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    Ponder showed me enough. I'm sorry I held out hope as long as I did. Ponder is in a tailspin and taking the team with him.
    Sure, the defense couldn't stop anything, but It would be difficult to win even if they did.
    Ponder had more than a fair chance. Time for a change.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingpin9995 View Post
    Really? Are you two homers really being serious? If you can't see that Ponder is nowhere near a starting qb in the NFL, you really are the worst of homers. The guy has ZERO pocket presence. He has a not ready for the NFL arm. Defenses sit on the islands outside the hash marks waiting for him to throw one of his balloons to pick off. He should have had two pick sixes, one degated by that criminal Suh, and the other by a butterfingered corner. The guy has one quality that is good. He can run, and that is good because he needs to because he will not stand tall in a pocket and make throws. He's a dog who will be on the bench by week 5 when we are 1-4 or 0-5. Don't you get it fools? Ponder is living in a quarterbacks dream with Peterson in his backfield. He has the ideal situation that really good qb's lick their chops at. 8 or 9 in the box and open spaces to throw everywhere down the field. The excuse of no receivers is gone, and he STILL can't make the throws. He can't make a good throw on 3rd down. What was their 3rd down efficiency? Keep propping up this imposter. He'll be siting the pines in 4 weeks never to be heard from again. Right now our third stringer could outplay him. He at least has an NFL arm.
    I hear that name calling really helps drive your point home. Good job.
    Zeus wrote:
    When are you going to realize that picking out the 20 bad throws this year and ignoring the 300 good ones does not make your point?

    =Z=

  6. #16
    Minniman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevoncox View Post
    I don't think we did Ponder any service with some of the playcalling.
    I'm not saying that he is the QB for the Vikings. I am saying that I saw growth.
    I rather see him throwing some deep passes and getting shit picked off than sitting in awe of his 68% completion percentage on nothing but dumpoffs. he took 2 steps forward and 1 step back so far. It's still progress. He completed 2 Balls over 40 yards... How many did he complete all last season. It's progress. Again... I'll probably will be calling for his head week 5... but I have atleast deccided to give him a few more games to show and prove.
    I agree that Ponder did some things well enough to make his numbers look fine if not for the picks. I saw that last season too, and Ponder started without many picks early on. But watching this game was difficult because I do not recall Ponder throwing a single pass on-target. It was high and outside, low and behind, high and inside, too far, out of bounds, .... Simpson and Jennings bailed Ponder out by making great catches on poor throws. Simpson had an easy TD deep, but Ponder missed him in stride - forcing Simpson to lay out. All of those throws will get receivers injured.

    Ponder goes through his progressions slower than Culpepper ever did, and Daunte was known for being slow in his progressions. Ponder gets the ball out slowly. His motion is not compact as he puts touch on all of his throws.

    That wounded duck throw that was picked off look like Webb in the playoff game against the Packers, and Webb is now a wide receiver. I just watched that play unfold and shouted, "Don't throw that, Ponder!" Of course, he threw it.

    The Lions came to play. The team had good players and good coaches even during last season's dismal showing. They added Bush as an extra weapon. With the passing threats the Lions already had, Bush gave the offense the ability to make teams pay for deep coverage.

    The Vikings offensive line was outnumbered on many plays. There is no way five guys can block all of the guys the Lions used to take Peterson out of the game. With that, a good quarterback should have massive passing numbers.

    The Vikings had no similar answer for Bush because he was left uncovered out of the backfield on so many plays that I wondered if the Vikings were playing with ten guys. When the Vikings played Tampa 2 or blitzed, the Lions sent Bush into the vacated zone. The Vikings vanilla defense got manhandled; the defensive line got almost no pressure; the whole back seven were out of position or just beaten. That does not even factor in the bad angles and poor tackles.

    This was a team effort in a loss, but Ponder could not hit moving targets no matter what the stats say. Because of this, the Vikings have two choices: do not call plays that Ponder will miss on often, or suffer the interceptions.
    Last edited by Minniman; 09-09-2013 at 10:27 PM.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minniman View Post
    I agree that Ponder did some things well enough to make his numbers look fine if not for the picks. I saw that last season too, and Ponder started without many picks early on. But watching this game was difficult because I do not recall Ponder throwing a single pass on-target. It was high and outside, low and behind, high and inside, too far, out of bounds, .... Simpson and Jennings bailed Ponder out by making great catches on poor throws. Simpson had an easy TD deep, but Ponder missed him in stride - forcing Simpson to lay out. All of those throws will get receivers injured.

    Ponder goes through his progressions slower than Culpepper ever did, and Daunte was known for being slow in his progressions. Ponder gets the ball out slowly. His motion is not compact as he puts touch on all of his throws.

    That lame duck throw that was picked off look like Webb in the playoff game against the Packers, and Webb is now a wide receiver. I just watched that play unfold and shouted, "Don't throw that, Ponder!" Of course, he threw it.

    The Lions came to play. The team had good players and good coaches even during last season's dismal showing. They added Bush as an extra weapon. With the passing threats the Lions already had, Bush gave the offense the ability to make teams pay for deep coverage.

    The Vikings offensive line was outnumbered on many plays. There is no way five guys can block all of the guys the Lions used to take Peterson out of the game. With that, a good quarterback should have massive passing numbers.

    The Vikings had no similar answer for Bush because he was left uncovered out of the backfield on so many plays that I wondered if the Vikings were playing with ten guys. When the Vikings played Tampa 2 or blitzed, the Lions sent Bush into the vacated zone. The Vikings vanilla defense got manhandled; the defensive line got almost no pressure; the whole back seven were out of position or just beaten. That does not even factor in the bad angles and poor tackles.

    This was a team effort in a loss, but Ponder could not hit moving targets no matter what the stats say. Because of this, the Vikings have two choices: do not call plays that Ponder will miss on often, or suffer the interceptions.
    I know I complained about that a lot. He never hits his WRs in stride, Or he throws it in such a way that the player cannot run after the catch. I believe this was Harvin's beef with him. Wasted scoring drives.

  8. #18
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    I saw no growth and no improvement at all! In fact I think he regressed. He is a joke. He was a joke at FSU and we looked like a joke drafting him in the 1st round when in reality he would have went in the 5th round. He is garbage and we need to cut ties now.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingpin9995 View Post
    Really? Are you two homers really being serious? If you can't see that Ponder is nowhere near a starting qb in the NFL, you really are the worst of homers. The guy has ZERO pocket presence. He has a not ready for the NFL arm. Defenses sit on the islands outside the hash marks waiting for him to throw one of his balloons to pick off. He should have had two pick sixes, one degated by that criminal Suh, and the other by a butterfingered corner. The guy has one quality that is good. He can run, and that is good because he needs to because he will not stand tall in a pocket and make throws. He's a dog who will be on the bench by week 5 when we are 1-4 or 0-5. Don't you get it fools? Ponder is living in a quarterbacks dream with Peterson in his backfield. He has the ideal situation that really good qb's lick their chops at. 8 or 9 in the box and open spaces to throw everywhere down the field. The excuse of no receivers is gone, and he STILL can't make the throws. He can't make a good throw on 3rd down. What was their 3rd down efficiency? Keep propping up this imposter. He'll be siting the pines in 4 weeks never to be heard from again. Right now our third stringer could outplay him. He at least has an NFL arm.
    I totally agree. Not sure what game the first two posters were watching, but everytime he drops back he freezes with a deer in headlights kind of look. He made one good pass, the deep ball down the sideline to Simpson. Simpson's other deep catch he saved an overthrow, and did you see the throw that Jennings saved him on, my God. There will not be one defense afraid of this guy. They will play single coverage all year because he scares no one. It's gonna be a long year folks, unless Ponder is out.

    I get the most pissed off looks from people with my VKG 4 LFE Wisconsin license plate, and I LOVE IT!!

  10. #20
    Purple Floyd's Avatar
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    Ponder Showed Enough

    I think he regressed too. He just has no confidence, no fire in his belly and apparently the wrong mindset to fix what needs to be fixed.

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