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  1. #21
    purplepat is offline Hall of Famer
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    Pissed off by Tice's, Hovan's etc. comments.

    "LosAngelis" wrote:
    I'm gonna scare you right now:

    Packers vs. Vikings (talent)

    QB - Culpepper's an MVP candidate right now. Adv. Vikings
    RB - Green's been hot and cold this year. Usually, whoever the Vikings put back there is successful. Slight adv., Vikes
    WR - I love the Packer WR's, but Moss is tops in talent and Burleson is a year behind Walker. Adv. Vikes.
    TE - push for now, but Vikes have more depth.
    OL - slight adv. Packers
    DL - based on pure talent, probably a push
    LB - Claiborne and Henderson top Barnett and Diggs by a slight margin.
    DB - Both suck, so push
    K - Pack
    P - Vikes

    Now, based on PURE TALENT, the Vikes exceed what the Packers have. This is absolutely ridiculous that Tice has any support. He is frittering away years from Culpepper's and Moss's careers, and chances at championships.

    As Packer fans, we couldn't be happier that Tice is still in charge.
    I'll scare you right now. At RB, I'd call it a push. Davenport and Fisher have produced when called upon (and healthy). I haven't seen the Vikings LB produce anything much at all this year, at best it is a push and possibly a slight advantage for the Packers.

    I'll agree that offensively, the Vikings have awesome talent. To be fair, injuries to the OL (primarily Kleinsasser) have adversely impacted the offense somewhat this year. The offense really isn't the problem; the defense is. I believe that if the Vikings had even an average defense, they would be at least 11-4 right now. I can't say that the Vikings haven't tried to improve the defense. I think they have, but face it, any rookie or free agent you sign is still a crapshoot. The Eagles came up sevens on Kearse and Trotter (though Trotter was still hurt for half the year); others like Marcellus Wiley, Hugh Douglas and Ian Gold largely crapped out. The Vikings hired a DC with a reputation for building good defense; whether the defenses failings are a result of his schemes, his players and their lack of talent/skill/knowledge, or some combination of the two, are anyones guess.

    Surely, Tice could take a "kinder and gentler" attitude towards Vikings fans who expect the world and expect it now. An adversarial tone is not going to win him any friends. Likewise, fans can't expect Tice to take a fan poll before he makes any decision on or off the field. As was seen last season in Oakland, I don't think Tice ripping his players or coaches in the public or press is a good thing to do either. I'm sure Tice is fully aware that there are massive shortcomings on this team in several areas. If he could wave a magic wand and make them disappear tomorrow, he would. As it is, he and Vikings fans will have to suffer through some growing pains, make changes as the need/opportunity presents, and improve the team incrementally. I would venture to guess that a return to full health, along with dramatically improved play in two positions on defense (one LB, one S) could improve the team enough next year to win the NFC North easily. I don't think the team's failures this season are because of poor decision making or lack of leadership by Tice.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm disappointed in the Vikings record this season, and by the play of the defense in particular. That said, the Vikings glass is far from half empty. It is much closer to overflowing.
    SKOL VIKINGS!

  2. #22
    Caine's Avatar
    Caine is offline Jersey Retired
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    Pissed off by Tice's, Hovan's etc. comments.

    My take (As a Viking fan in Wisconsin)

    QB: Culpepper is a better QB right now, but Favre is still Favre - slight advantage Vikes.

    RB: Ahman Green fumbles too often, and the Vikes are too deep here. Advantage Vikes.

    WR: Driver drops a lot of passes, Fergusson hasn't performed as expected - Walker is the bright spot there. Moss is still Moss, Burleson is on a tear, and Campbell and Robinson occassionally show up. Advantage Vikes (Depth)

    TE: Kleinsasser (When healthy) and Wiggins...'nuff said. Advantage Vikes.

    OL: Push. Both are talented. Slight advantage Vikes as we get Rosenthal back to solidify the situation NEXT YEAR.

    DL: A healthy Grady Jackson is the ONLY bright spot on the Packer front 4. Meanwhile Williams and Udeze are getting a nice rythym going...if only we had two more. Healthy it's a push...minus Jackson, advantage Minnesota.

    LB: Slight advantage Packers. They get more consistant play from the position, and that has been the GLARING hole in the Vikes "D".

    DB: Winfield over Harris (By a LOT), Sharper over Russell (Although Sharper is aging)..the rest are a wash. Push.

    K: Green Bay
    P: Push

    Offensive Play Calling: Green Bay
    Defensive PLay calling: Green Bay
    Front Office: Green Bay

    Best looking and most intelligent fans: MINNESOTA (By a MILE)

    So, as you can see, I view the Vikes as the better team ON PAPER. The swing factor comes from coaching and front office. Minnesota has a ways to go in those departments.

    Caine

  3. #23
    Vikings Fan At MSU is offline Training Camp
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    Pissed off by Tice's, Hovan's etc. comments.

    Vikings Fans are doing there part..........i hate that it seems like their are more packer fans then Vikings fans in MN sometimes but when your in the dome and 60000 vikings fans are there with you there isnt anything to do but scream for MOSSY..........The Packer ambassader is correct on talent scale for the vikes versus pack....we should be winning more then the pack.......we get out coached all the time.
    Make Derrick Johnson the 7th pick in the 2005 NFL Draft

  4. #24
    Vikings Fan At MSU is offline Training Camp
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    Pissed off by Tice's, Hovan's etc. comments.

    For everyone to hear THE GREEN BAY O LINE IS MUCH BETTER THE VIKES.............before the eagles pack game favre had only been sacked 5 times all year then he got sacked five times in that game now the green bay sack total is at 14 total sacks..............Dante has been sacked 42 times this year adavantage huge to GB............look at how many times Dante eludes sacks too


    Sorry guys huge advantage GREEN BAY
    Make Derrick Johnson the 7th pick in the 2005 NFL Draft

  5. #25
    Vikestand's Avatar
    Vikestand is offline Coordinator
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    Pissed off by Tice's, Hovan's etc. comments.

    Packman is the jackass of the boards....


    By Pack93z

    "Success is the ability to go from one failure to the other with no loss of enthusiasm"-Sir Winston Churchill

  6. #26
    dan3ski's Avatar
    dan3ski is offline Coordinator
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    Pissed off by Tice's, Hovan's etc. comments.

    Well it looks like we fans are on Tice's list....hmmmmmmmm naughty or nice......naughty!

    Welcome to Tice's DOG HOUSE!
    can we clone Bud Grant?

  7. #27
    Packerguy is offline Rookie
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    Pissed off by Tice's, Hovan's etc. comments.

    "Vikings Fan At MSU" wrote:
    For everyone to hear THE GREEN BAY O LINE IS MUCH BETTER THE VIKES.............before the eagles pack game favre had only been sacked 5 times all year then he got sacked five times in that game now the green bay sack total is at 14 total sacks..............Dante has been sacked 42 times this year adavantage huge to GB............look at how many times Dante eludes sacks too


    Sorry guys huge advantage GREEN BAY
    good debate and point taken

    One could argue that culpepper tends to hold and is more willing to hold the ball longer than favre. I think this is a fact but again its just my opinion. That would lead to more sacks of culpepper obviously.

    Also pass blocking is only 1/2 of the equation as far as o- lines are concerned. Run blocking is a big part of it. The vikings have a pretty darn good yards per carry avg if I remember correctly. Losing flanagan hurt the packers alot but I know the vikings have had injuries there also. Thats why I said push. Either way both O-lines are good lines.

  8. #28
    bleedpurple is offline Ring of Fame
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    Pissed off by Tice's, Hovan's etc. comments.

    Favre makes the packers receives good....you can stick anybody in there and Favre will make them good...

    pepp has more talent than favre but Favre's intangibles are better....

    and the wr's? is that even a comparison.....Minnesota's receivers by FAR are better than the Packers....it's not even close

  9. #29
    Packerguy is offline Rookie
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    Pissed off by Tice's, Hovan's etc. comments.

    "bleedpurple" wrote:
    Favre makes the packers receives good....you can stick anybody in there and Favre will make them good...

    pepp has more talent than favre but Favre's intangibles are better....

    and the wr's? is that even a comparison.....Minnesota's receivers by FAR are better than the Packers....it's not even close
    I definitely disagree with u here. U cannot throw just anyone in at wr for the packers and say that they will have success. IF that was true why didnt walker and driver have 1000yard seasons last year? Ill tell u why

    1. This is Walkers 3rd season. As we all know most wrs take 3 seasons(except for moss) to get into the groove and have breakout years. Walker is a much better reciever now than he was his first two season and he almost never drops anything.

    2.Driver wasnt the same last year after his scary neck injury and never played well. HE has been the man down the stretch this year. The recievers are playing better so they are getting the ball. If they werent then u would see favre revert back to dumping it too ahman and franks and henderson all the time as the did a few years ago.

    Finally, I am not going to argue with u about moss. He is the best hands down. But he can be shut down at times also.

    If u think I wouldnt take driver and walker over the rest of the viking recievers your mistaken. I would. So with that being said, If that makes the viking recievers way better than the packers so be it. I just dont see it or agree.

  10. #30
    PacNWVike's Avatar
    PacNWVike is offline Team Alumni
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    Pissed off by Tice's, Hovan's etc. comments.

    "SKOL" wrote:
    Yeah he's a little fickle when it comes to loyalty to the fans. He's the first to praise us when it comes to vocally supporting the team at home games, but he's very quick to turn on us if he gets a little peaved.
    I think Tice may be too focused on his job and then gets defensive when the fans question his efforts. I'm sure he's doing the best he can with what he has, and yes, he and his assistants make mistakes. But on the whole, I believe a few more of our players need to step up and do the job. On the other hand, he's paid a lot of money (well, maybe not by NFL coach scale) to do the job and take the heat, so he should show some compassion to the fans for getting pissed. As far as the media... screw them. A bunch of moronic imbeciles who pray upon others misfortunes...
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."
    Edmund Burke

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