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  1. #1001
    VikingMike's Avatar
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    Re: Pat and Kevin Williams possible suspension?

    What I look for in the NFL commissioner are 2 relatively simple things, i.e. fairness and consistency. IMO, Goodell and his office are woefully lacking in both areas.
    Any man who afflicts the human race with ideas must be prepared to see them misunderstood. - H.L. Mencken

    Come from the land of the ice and snow...

  2. #1002
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    Re: Pat and Kevin Williams possible suspension?

    Chilly's chances of being here next year are far better if he makes the playoffs.

    His players seem to like him, and that could have played in to their decision to appeal to get a few games in before the suspension(s) hit...

    NOT saying it's the truth, just a possibility.


    Trust me, I'm a doctor.

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  3. #1003
    VikingMike's Avatar
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    Re: Pat and Kevin Williams possible suspension?

    "ThorSPL" wrote:
    Chilly's chances of being here next year are far better if he makes the playoffs.

    His players seem to like him, and that could have played in to their decision to appeal to get a few games in before the suspension(s) hit...

    NOT saying it's the truth, just a possibility.

    Hard to say if they truly like him, because players hate to have coaching changes. But I think the players do genuinely like him. Did you hear Jared Allen on ESPN's Pardon the Interruption? Pretty interesting about the fans booing Chilly earlier in the season.
    Any man who afflicts the human race with ideas must be prepared to see them misunderstood. - H.L. Mencken

    Come from the land of the ice and snow...

  4. #1004
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    Re: Pat and Kevin Williams possible suspension?

    this is dumb!

    how does shaun ellis not get suspended and the 5 players who took starcaps without beign told they held a banned substance gets suspended?

    this goes to show that goodell is just a tyant!

  5. #1005
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    Re: Pat and Kevin Williams possible suspension?

    "ThorSPL" wrote:
    Chilly's chances of being here next year are far better if he makes the playoffs.

    His players seem to like him, and that could have played in to their decision to appeal to get a few games in before the suspension(s) hit...

    NOT saying it's the truth, just a possibility.
    as much as i hate to say it, I have a feeling Chilly will be back.
    The team is getting better, and there's been some pretty decently coached games as of late.
    As long as the team doesn't self destruct (AKA lose to the lions)
    I have a feeling he'll be back, but if that is the case, I'm fine with it, because that means that Chilly is getting better as a coach.
    Over the last 5 weeks or so, he's actually started to grow on me, I no longer hate him with the passion I had after that titans game.

  6. #1006
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    Re: Pat and Kevin Williams possible suspension?

    "VikingMike" wrote:
    "ThorSPL" wrote:
    Chilly's chances of being here next year are far better if he makes the playoffs.

    His players seem to like him, and that could have played in to their decision to appeal to get a few games in before the suspension(s) hit...

    NOT saying it's the truth, just a possibility.

    Hard to say if they truly like him, because players hate to have coaching changes. But I think the players do genuinely like him. Did you hear Jared Allen on ESPN's Pardon the Interruption? Pretty interesting about the fans booing Chilly earlier in the season.
    Yeah, it's a tough call to make - ultimately we don't know jack shit and we have to realize that.

    I haven't had a chance to watch that PTI clip yet, but did read some of the clippings from it.
    I'm typing away at the library and do not have headphones....
    Actually I am going to Target to get some after this, now that I am thinking about it.


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  7. #1007
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    Re: Pat and Kevin Williams possible suspension?

    anyone have a link to the pti clip?

  8. #1008
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    Re: Pat and Kevin Williams possible suspension?

    "i_bleed_purple" wrote:
    as much as i hate to say it, I have a feeling Chilly will be back.
    The team is getting better, and there's been some pretty decently coached games as of late.
    As long as the team doesn't self destruct (AKA lose to the lions)
    I have a feeling he'll be back, but if that is the case, I'm fine with it, because that means that Chilly is getting better as a coach.
    Over the last 5 weeks or so, he's actually started to grow on me, I no longer hate him with the passion I had after that titans game.
    This is the attitude I have currently. I've actually started to appreciate him a bit more...

    ... Over the past few games, it's seems to me that he's been waking up to the fact that he should build gameplans around players not the other way round.

    Overall, I reserve my judgement until the season is over.

  9. #1009
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    Re: Pat and Kevin Williams possible suspension?

    Here is the latest from PFT its a good read

    http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/12/06/cornwell-clarifies-key-aspects-of-starcaps-case/





    In a recent interview with Adam Schein and John Riggins of Sirius NFL Radio, attorney David Cornwell addressed two key aspects of the current legal brouhaha between the NFL and the NFL Players Association regarding the suspensions of players who took an over-the-counter supplement that had been spiked with a banned substance.

    Cornwell confirmed in the interview that the player who initially tested positive for Bumetanide, a prescription diuretic, said that he had only taken StarCaps, a supposedly all-natural supplement.
    The player was not suspended.

    “In November of 2006, an NFL Player tested positive for the diuretic Bumetanide,” Cornwell said.
    “He claimed that he used StarCaps and that was the source of the diuretic.
    The NFL then, through their toxicologist, Dr. Finkel, ordered its lab in Utah to test StarCaps.
    That investigation indeed confirmed that StarCaps contained this diuretic.
    The NFL, despite what they said in the case for the Saints and the Vikings, did not suspend that player.”

    If that’s true, then wow.

    “It was the first time that anyone knew StarCaps contained a diuretic because it is not listed on the label,” Cornwell added.
    “The NFL, through Dr. Lombardo [the administrator of the NFL’s steroid policy], did not advise players that StarCaps was a dangerous product.
    In 2004, Deuce McAllister used the NFL Hotline and in ‘06 two other players contacted the NFL Hotline.
    Despite the knowledge that NFL Players were using StarCaps and the knowledge that it contained a prohibited substance, the NFL did not notify NFL players of the danger of this product.”

    As to the vague contention that the NFL notified the union about the problem with StarCaps, Cornwell offered his take on the issue.

    “Classic C.Y.A.,” Cornwell said of the letter from the league to the NFLPA. “This is the first time in the 21-year history of the steroid policy where the National Football League has asserted or relied on this type of notice as being sufficient to players.
    The notice that the management council sent to the union and the clubs identified Balanced Health Products as the manufacturer of StarCaps and as a banned company.
    Under the policy the significance of banning a company means that a player cannot endorse that company.
    It does not and has never operated as notice of a specific prohibited substance.”

    Responded Riggins, showing that he still has his “loosen up, Sandy baby” fastball despite essentially working for the league:
    “So basically it is a little bit of subterfuge here, they’re trying to mislead the public?”

    “You reached the conclusion as you think is appropriate about their motivation,” Cornwell said.
    “What I will tell you is Dr. Lombardo sent out notice to players in July of 2007 and he didn’t mention the manufacture of Star Caps nor did he tell the players that StarCaps contained this diuretic.
    If they were so open and notorious with their notification, why did they withhold it in the actual notice to players?”

    And, as we’ve said before and likely will say again, that’s what this one boils down to.
    Setting aside the legal arguments and the CBA and the plain text of the steroids policy and the notion that players are responsible for anything that is in their bodies, if the players and the union can prove that Dr. Lombardo knew that an over-the-counter product had been spiked with a drug and did nothing to specifically warn the players or the union about it, then the NFL might find itself at the end of the day writing a series of checks much larger than the $3 piece of negotiable paper that was once made out to the United States Football League.

    Here’s the thing that keeps gnawing at us, quite frankly.
    John Lombardo is a doctor.
    He knew that StarCaps had been spiked with Bumetanide.
    He knew, or at least he had at his fingertips, information regarding the potential side effects and risks of taking Bumetanide.

    A simple Google search for Bumetanide reveals all sorts of things about which someone taking it needs to know.
    It can cause problems for persons with kidney disease, liver disease, gout, lupus, diabetes, or an allergy to sulfa drugs.
    The Yahoo! Health site has this to say about Bumetanide:
    “To be sure this medication is not causing harmful effects, your blood will need to be tested on a regular basis.”

    And because Bumetanide also is used to treat high blood pressure, it can create serious problems for folks who already have low blood pressure.
    Though it might be a bit much to assume that someone would drop dead from taking Bumetanide, fainting while, say, driving a car could be a problem . . . both for the driver and for those in the path of his vehicle.

    So how can a doctor (other than, say, Dr. J) carry around the knowledge that Bumetanide has been secretly added to a supposedly all-natural substance and not specifically warn the players?
    How can a doctor know this and not immediately alert any and all relevant federal authorities?

    Thus, while we disagree with many aspects of the style and strategies of NFLPA outside counsel Jeffrey Kessler, he apparently was technically accurate when he described Bumetanide as a ”potentially killing substance.”

    Another guy with whom we don’t often agree, Warren Sapp, summed up the situation on WQAM radio on Friday when commenting on the allegation that Dr. Lombardo knew the truth about StarCaps, but did nothing to specifically warn players about that product:
    “If that’s the case, then somebody in the league office is either dirty, nasty or both.”



  10. #1010
    ejmat is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Pat and Kevin Williams possible suspension?

    "Mjölnir" wrote:
    "i_bleed_purple" wrote:
    as much as i hate to say it, I have a feeling Chilly will be back.
    The team is getting better, and there's been some pretty decently coached games as of late.
    As long as the team doesn't self destruct (AKA lose to the lions)
    I have a feeling he'll be back, but if that is the case, I'm fine with it, because that means that Chilly is getting better as a coach.
    Over the last 5 weeks or so, he's actually started to grow on me, I no longer hate him with the passion I had after that titans game.
    This is the attitude I have currently. I've actually started to appreciate him a bit more...

    ... Over the past few games, it's seems to me that he's been waking up to the fact that he should build gameplans around players not the other way round.

    Overall, I reserve my judgement until the season is over.
    Nothing wrong with that.
    I have reserved judgement the entire year.
    It doesn't mean I am for or against him.
    It means right now I am going with the flow and will base my decision on him when Wilf makes his.
    Since we have no way of knowing what decisions are made and for what reason I will reserve my position till the end of the season.
    I do disagree with some of his play calling every now and then but for the most part I like the way he takes risks.
    It doesn't always pay off but sometimes it does (i.e. 99 yard TD play).
    I know poeople get mad when they pass on 4th and 1 or 3rd and 2 but that is what keep defenses honest in the long run.
    If you run it everytime what do you think defenses will focus on?

    Chilly has done a good job this year whether people want to realize it or not.
    He has made some good calls in different situations.
    The Vikings are in first place without a good starting QB.
    At this point they can focus on getting to the playoffs.
    I think it is crap that people say if he doesn't get to the superbowl he sucks.
    Only 2 of 32 teams get there 1x/yr.
    12 teams of 32 make the playoffs.
    That is the top 33% of the league and never anything to downgrade.
    Especially in this era of parity.

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