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  1. #11
    bsmithberkley is offline Pro-Bowler
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    Re:Pass-Rush Profile: Jared Allen

    Marrdro wrote:
    bsmithberkley wrote:
    Marrdro wrote:
    i_bleed_purple wrote:


    "Edwards generated 24.24 percent of his total pressure unblocked, compared to the league average of just under 15 percent. By contrast, Allen only recorded 12.5 percent of his pressure unblocked, lending weight to the idea that Edwards benefits plentifully from the other players on the Minnesota defensive line."

    Interesting bit of info here.
    Didn't I post that?

    What about this?

    Allen beat a block to get pressure on the passer once every 10.02 plays, Edwards every 10.2 plays. Compared to the rest of the league, both of these marks are good, but neither is amongst the elite.
    And this....

    Interestingly, Allen's teammate Edwards was one of the players able to bring more total pressure than Allen. Despite only 9 sacks, Edwards led the league among defensive ends in hits on the quarterback last season, and was able to match Allen in pressures.
    Would could almost make those two into a good discussion that after his showing in the playoffs (not part of these stats) that the number of double teams will go up a bit next year.

    Not me of course, but someone could.
    I think we have established that there are two sides to this discussion. No need to beat a dead horse.

    Interesting side note, Leslie Frazier in this months Sporting News describes the responsibilities of both Ends:

    RDE (Allen): The prerequisite is running fast off that edge rushing the passer. Height and weight are not as important as the burst he has.

    LDE (Edwards): We count on him to handle tight ends and offensive tackles and set the tone for us in our run defense as well as be in position to rush the passer.

    Some posters gave me a hard time about emphasizing Ray's contribution stopping the run, but, I have to give credit to Ray was for his run defense, just saying, I am impressed he was able to do that and put up good numbers as a Pass Rusher.
    We have had several good discussions with respect to the difference between the RDE and a LDE in our base 4-3 defensive sets.

    As to being impressed, I was against moving him over at LDE, but much to my suprise, he has held up to the extra weight and rigors associated with that side.

    On a side note, I was pleasantly suprised to see the staff draft a true LDE this year and think that how he does this year will drive Rays future with this team.
    With Griffen's speed it will be interesting to see how he can handle dropping back in coverage. Gotta love his speed.

    There aren't many "wrinkles" you can introduce with our 4 man front. If we are going to play "prevent defense" so much when we get ahead it would be nice to have two DEs who can slip back into coverage and be effective (Allen and Griffen).

    Maybe RE turns into a "2 down" end this year to get some snaps for Griffen. It will be interesting to see how they handle so many quality DE's in the mix. Last year was bad enough, adding Griffen to the mix only makes it more interesting.
    None

  2. #12
    i_bleed_purple's Avatar
    i_bleed_purple is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re:Pass-Rush Profile: Jared Allen

    bsmithberkley wrote:
    If we are going to play "prevent defense" so much when we get ahead it would be nice to have two DEs who can slip back into coverage and be effective (Allen and Griffen).
    If we do that, i will book a flight, fly down to Minny and punch Fraizer in the temple.

  3. #13
    Marrdro's Avatar
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    Re:Pass-Rush Profile: Jared Allen

    i_bleed_purple wrote:
    bsmithberkley wrote:
    If we are going to play "prevent defense" so much when we get ahead it would be nice to have two DEs who can slip back into coverage and be effective (Allen and Griffen).
    If we do that, i will book a flight, fly down to Minny and punch Fraizer in the temple.
    The way he rotates them, mixed in with his play calls, makes me want to send you some money for airfare so you can do it now.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  4. #14
    i_bleed_purple's Avatar
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    Re:Pass-Rush Profile: Jared Allen

    Marrdro wrote:
    i_bleed_purple wrote:
    bsmithberkley wrote:
    If we are going to play "prevent defense" so much when we get ahead it would be nice to have two DEs who can slip back into coverage and be effective (Allen and Griffen).
    If we do that, i will book a flight, fly down to Minny and punch Fraizer in the temple.
    The way he rotates them, mixed in with his play calls, makes me want to send you some money for airfare so you can do it now.
    throw in bail money and we've got a deal

  5. #15
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    Re:Pass-Rush Profile: Jared Allen

    "Something often talked about is how Allen is regarded as a very intelligent pass-rusher. He has pointed that he can read a quick pass from a QB by the opening step of the OT, break off his pass rush, and try to disrupt the ball in the air; that is reflected by his four batted passes last year. To put that in perspective, the other pass rushers we have featured so far (Ware and John Abraham) plus the next two upcoming (Freeney and Robert Mathis) didn't combine for four batted balls last season, and Edwards could only manage one."

    From site:

    this shows the difference between a rusher who is just a physical rusher and not a mental rusher. And why Edwards got more Pressures than Allen its cause Allen would read the Oline and if he read Quick pass would cut his technique and get his hands up, getting four batted balls and who knows how many that the corners got from that for the Qb would have to throw over him and lose a little velocity.

  6. #16
    Marrdro's Avatar
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    Re: Pass-Rush Profile: Jared Allen

    Was looking for an old thread I did on the difference between a LDE and a RDE in our base defense and came across this little nugget. :laugh:

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1056656
    The third player to get the PFF treatment in our Pass-Rush Profile series is the Vikings' Jared Allen. Sam Monson takes a look at the impact the star player has had on the Vikings' pass rush, and how his 2009 season stacks up against the league's elite...
    Pass-Rush Profile: Jared Allen
    A few interesting stats from our good friends at Profootball focus.
    Here is some ammo for all of you who tout that Ray gets his only because of the other 3.....

    Interestingly, Allen's teammate Edwards was one of the players able to bring more total pressure than Allen. Despite only 9 sacks, Edwards led the league among defensive ends in hits on the quarterback last season, and was able to match Allen in pressures.

    Where the two players differ, however, is in the percentage of pressure each player recorded without being blocked. dwards generated 24.24 percent of his total pressure unblocked, compared to the league average of just under 15 percent. By contrast, Allen only recorded 12.5 percent of his pressure unblocked, lending weight to the idea that Edwards benefits plentifully from the other players on the Minnesota defensive line.

    Allen beat a block to get pressure on the passer once every 10.02 plays, Edwards every 10.2 plays. Compared to the rest of the league, both of these marks are good, but neither is amongst the elite.
    The criticism that was levelled at Allen at times last season is that he would disappear in some games and explode in others, and looking at his numbers on a game-by-game basis, that criticism has some merit to it. Though Allen consistently brought pressure (he was shut out in only two out of 18 games including the playoffs -- once by Joe Thomas), he did generate a massive 8 of his sacks in the two games against Green Bay, which accounted for 23.4 percent of his total pressure on the season.
    On a side note.....

    In both seasons since Allen has topped 15 sacks, and with the emergence of Ray Edwards on the opposite side, the Vikings' front four is now one of the most feared pass-rushing units in the NFL.
    Notice the word "Four" and not the word "Three".....
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  7. #17
    Marrdro's Avatar
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    Re:Pass-Rush Profile: Jared Allen

    Quote Originally Posted by "bsmithberkley" #1056695
    Marrdro wrote:
    i_bleed_purple wrote:


    "Edwards generated 24.24 percent of his total pressure unblocked, compared to the league average of just under 15 percent. By contrast, Allen only recorded 12.5 percent of his pressure unblocked, lending weight to the idea that Edwards benefits plentifully from the other players on the Minnesota defensive line."

    Interesting bit of info here.
    Didn't I post that?

    What about this?

    Allen beat a block to get pressure on the passer once every 10.02 plays, Edwards every 10.2 plays. Compared to the rest of the league, both of these marks are good, but neither is amongst the elite.
    And this....

    Interestingly, Allen's teammate Edwards was one of the players able to bring more total pressure than Allen. Despite only 9 sacks, Edwards led the league among defensive ends in hits on the quarterback last season, and was able to match Allen in pressures.
    Would could almost make those two into a good discussion that after his showing in the playoffs (not part of these stats) that the number of double teams will go up a bit next year.

    Not me of course, but someone could.
    I think we have established that there are two sides to this discussion. No need to beat a dead horse.

    Interesting side note, Leslie Frazier in this months Sporting News describes the responsibilities of both Ends:

    RDE (Allen): The prerequisite is running fast off that edge rushing the passer. Height and weight are not as important as the burst he has.

    LDE (Edwards): We count on him to handle tight ends and offensive tackles and set the tone for us in our run defense as well as be in position to rush the passer.

    Some posters gave me a hard time about emphasizing Ray's contribution stopping the run, but, I have to give credit to Ray was for his run defense, just saying, I am impressed he was able to do that and put up good numbers as a Pass Rusher.
    What ever happened to our good friend Bsmitberk?
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  8. #18
    12purplepride28's Avatar
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    Re:Pass-Rush Profile: Jared Allen

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1097153
    Quote Originally Posted by "bsmithberkley" #1056695
    Marrdro wrote:
    i_bleed_purple wrote:


    "Edwards generated 24.24 percent of his total pressure unblocked, compared to the league average of just under 15 percent. By contrast, Allen only recorded 12.5 percent of his pressure unblocked, lending weight to the idea that Edwards benefits plentifully from the other players on the Minnesota defensive line."

    Interesting bit of info here.
    Didn't I post that?

    What about this?

    Allen beat a block to get pressure on the passer once every 10.02 plays, Edwards every 10.2 plays. Compared to the rest of the league, both of these marks are good, but neither is amongst the elite.
    And this....

    Interestingly, Allen's teammate Edwards was one of the players able to bring more total pressure than Allen. Despite only 9 sacks, Edwards led the league among defensive ends in hits on the quarterback last season, and was able to match Allen in pressures.
    Would could almost make those two into a good discussion that after his showing in the playoffs (not part of these stats) that the number of double teams will go up a bit next year.

    Not me of course, but someone could.
    I think we have established that there are two sides to this discussion. No need to beat a dead horse.

    Interesting side note, Leslie Frazier in this months Sporting News describes the responsibilities of both Ends:

    RDE (Allen): The prerequisite is running fast off that edge rushing the passer. Height and weight are not as important as the burst he has.

    LDE (Edwards): We count on him to handle tight ends and offensive tackles and set the tone for us in our run defense as well as be in position to rush the passer.

    Some posters gave me a hard time about emphasizing Ray's contribution stopping the run, but, I have to give credit to Ray was for his run defense, just saying, I am impressed he was able to do that and put up good numbers as a Pass Rusher.
    What ever happened to our good friend Bsmitberk?
    He's still tripping over himself in the ray edwards is a jackass thread.
    I am NOT here to provide good football insight or rational observations. I am an emotional 19 year old Viking fan and I expect you to adjust your expectations from my posts.

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