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  1. #21
    purplehelmut's Avatar
    purplehelmut is offline Pro-Bowler
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    Quote Originally Posted by i_bleed_purple View Post
    Not anymore. Rookie cap limits this.

    To compare, Sam Bradford had the last big contract for a rookie QB, 6-year, $78 million with incentives up to $86 million. Cam Newton's contract was 4 year, $22 million guaranteed, just one year later, still #1 overall.

    Ponder was a first-round QB and he's the lowest paid QB on our roster (MBT doesn't count)
    You made my argument for me. Newton's 4-year 22 million dollar contract is a helluva lot more than the one year three million to take a chance on Freeman. Ponder didn't get a big contract because he was a reach. For every first round QB that excels there's one (or more) that don't. My point is rather than waste another year of Peterson's career it's a good move to take a chance now on Freeman rather than draft a first round qb that will be iffy at best. AD is 28 and he'll slow down after 30. We simply don't have time to take another Ponderlike chance.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by purplehelmut View Post
    You made my argument for me. Newton's 4-year 22 million dollar contract is a helluva lot more than the one year three million to take a chance on Freeman. Ponder didn't get a big contract because he was a reach. For every first round QB that excels there's one (or more) that don't. My point is rather than waste another year of Peterson's career it's a good move to take a chance now on Freeman rather than draft a first round qb that will be iffy at best. AD is 28 and he'll slow down after 30. We simply don't have time to take another Ponderlike chance.
    This pretty much means we will not go get Winfield, which saddens me. We need a leader on our defense, and he would have fit the bill.

    Hell, at this point I would have taken Tebow over freeman. Even the Patriots were amazed at how inspiring that guy is, even when he stunk up the field. I really don't think we are too far away, but the our beloved team needs some fire, and I don't think Freeman has any left.

    Boy I hope I am wrong, I would LOVE to be wrong, since it doesn't matter anymore.

  3. #23
    i_bleed_purple's Avatar
    i_bleed_purple is offline Jersey Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by purplehelmut View Post
    You made my argument for me. Newton's 4-year 22 million dollar contract is a helluva lot more than the one year three million to take a chance on Freeman.
    Hardly. Newton was a 1st overall pick. we're not picking 1st overall, we probably will be outside the top-ten. To compare, Ponder's contract, as the 12th overall pick was 4 years, 10 million. If we're picking in the first round, we'll spend about that much on a quarterback unless we trade up.
    Ponder didn't get a big contract because he was a reach.
    Oh? So when negotiating the contract, how did that conversation go?

    Ponder's Agent: My client will take no less than 15 millions
    Spielman: Hell no, we shouldn't have even taken him that early, he's not nearly talented enough to be a top-15 pick, we'll pay him not a dime more than 9 mil over 4 years.
    Agent: No deal, you picked him in the top-15, pay him
    Spielman: Ok, we'll give you 10 mil, but I don't like it. We really reached, did this guy a favour, we really shouldn't pay this much.

    Give me a break. They liked their guy, they went and got him. Doesn't matter if it's a reach or not. But playing that game:
    #1 overall: Newton: 4 year, 22 million
    #8 overall: Locker: 4 year, 12 million
    #10 overall: Gabbert; 4 year, 12 million
    #12 overall: Ponder: 4 year, 10.25 million
    #35 Overall: Dalton: 4 year, 5.25 Million
    #36 overall: Kaepernick: 4 year, 5.2 million

    2012:
    #1 Luck 4 year, $22 million
    #2 Griffin 4 year, $21 million
    #8 Tannehill 4 year, $12.66 million
    #22 Weeden 4 year, $8.03 million

    2013
    #16 EJ Manuel 4 year, $8.9 Million
    #39 Geno Smith 4 year, $5.09 Million


    Ponder was paid about on par with that position in the draft.
    For every first round QB that excels there's one (or more) that don't. My point is rather than waste another year of Peterson's career it's a good move to take a chance now on Freeman rather than draft a first round qb that will be iffy at best. AD is 28 and he'll slow down after 30. We simply don't have time to take another Ponderlike chance.
    Well, the only thing is to not reach. Take a guy only if he's worth the spot you take him in.

    In 2011, I honestly don't think any of those QBs were top-15 talents, with the exception of Newton, and POSSIBLY Locker. Ponder and Gabbert were lacking too much to be high picks.

    in 2012, there were a few real good looking prospects. Luck, Griffin were too good to pass up. Tannehill is arguable, but has been doing pretty good. He's got the physical tools AND the intangibles. Something Ponder and Gabbert were missing. Weeden was a reach.

    I'm not as familiar with this years draft class, but if we'r edrafting in the mid-round, we won't get a day 1 starter. Unfortunately that's just how the draft works. The elite players are gone, Anyone picked after as a QB will have a development period. Could be short like Russel Wilson, could be long like Ponder. Even Kaepernick is being exposed as still a development project.

  4. #24
    kingpin9995 is offline Starter
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    You guys are missing the point of this trade.

    Item.... Ponder is hurt and the brass is doing everything in their power to make it last as long as possible because they now know they made a reach. Ponder will probably go on injured reserve.

    Item... Freeman becomes available. Speilman loved him coming out of college. He sees his new starter, knowing that in his mind Cassel is not the long term answer for the Vikings, but a capable back up.

    Item... Speilman signs Freeman for 3 million, a one year deal, NOT TWO. There is all you need to know who is going to be the starting qb for the Vikings very very soon.
    Speilman will be crucified by the media if he does not get Freeman up to speed quickly and on the field. Freeman is a FREE AGENT after the season. He's going to be the starter and see if it is worth offering him a big contract at season end. YOU CAN'T DETERMINE THAT IF HE DOES NOT PLAY THE MAJOR PART OF THE REMAINING OF THE SEASON.

    Item,,,,, Greg Shitano is a clown. Note when you started hearing any negatives on Freemans character. It was after this goof head coach came in. He's the dummy that was attacking oppsosing offenses in the victory formation.

    Freeman has to be the starter sooner than later or this deal will get Speilman fired . You don't bring in a qb making more than both your quaterbacks on the team combined and not play him..

  5. #25
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    MaxVike is offline Team Alumni
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    Our new QB Josh Freeman

    Here is a reasonable column from a real writer, who makes his living covering the NFL. Argue away folks.

    http://mmqb.si.com/2013/10/08/josh-freeman-minnesota-vikings/

    Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent
    ----------------------------------------------
    As a matter of fact, I do know

  6. #26
    purplehelmut's Avatar
    purplehelmut is offline Pro-Bowler
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    Great stats ibleedpurple, but again, you have made my point, which you may have missed. If we draft a qb in the first round next year, even late, we're on the hook for about 4 years and 8 million or so (according to your stats). And rookie qbs are a crapshoot. My point is we get a first round talent now that has proven he can play for 3 mil and a one year contract. Given AP is 28, his window of opportunity is rapidly shrinking so we have to win NOW. We simply don't have time to draft and groom another rookie qb who may easily wind up like Ponder. If Freeman bombs he's out the door and we're back where we are now. Drafting qbs is rolling the dice, except for maybe guys like like Luck or Peyton Manning. Sometimes you'll get one that can play, most times you won't. The side of the NFL highway is littered with highly drafted "can't miss" qbs while the diamonds in the rough like Rogers and Kapaernick are extremely rare.

  7. #27
    Randy Moss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by purplehelmut View Post
    Great stats ibleedpurple, but again, you have made my point, which you may have missed. If we draft a qb in the first round next year, even late, we're on the hook for about 4 years and 8 million or so (according to your stats). And rookie qbs are a crapshoot. My point is we get a first round talent now that has proven he can play for 3 mil and a one year contract. Given AP is 28, his window of opportunity is rapidly shrinking so we have to win NOW. We simply don't have time to draft and groom another rookie qb who may easily wind up like Ponder. If Freeman bombs he's out the door and we're back where we are now. Drafting qbs is rolling the dice, except for maybe guys like like Luck or Peyton Manning. Sometimes you'll get one that can play, most times you won't. The side of the NFL highway is littered with highly drafted "can't miss" qbs while the diamonds in the rough like Rogers and Kapaernick are extremely rare.
    This is what I've been saying. Chances are we'll pick in the 12-16 area, which would mean we could maybe get the third best qb in the draft. Does anyone honestly think the third quarterback taken has a better chance to be successful than Freeman? Maybe he doesn't work out, but then we're in the same position we were on Saturday.

    This gives us options. Maybe a qb we really like falls to where we pick, then we can still take him. If not, we don't have to reach and get a quarterback like when we picked Ponder. We can take the best player available. QB is the worst position to draft for need. The chances of even two QBs being very good is pretty low.

  8. #28
    Abe Froman's Avatar
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    If Freeman helps us enough so we are drafting 12 - 16, I don't really know that I would consider that a bad thing. I mean, I hope we actually do better than that, but if we don't and are looking at drafting the 3rd best QB in the draft, it could work out nearly perfectly for us in the long run. If that's the case, we resign or franchise Freeman, and groom our drafted QB for a year or two.

    In this draft, the 3rd best QB can still end up being a very good QB.
    Trying out some new forums since I got my ip banned on Purple Chat 2 weeks ago...

  9. #29
    vikesrgreat2 is offline Starter
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    Quote Originally Posted by swardsooner View Post
    Mike Green says the doctors worry that a further injury could puncture the heart...fwiw.
    If that's the case, then they should put Ponder on injured reserve for his own well-being - NOW!

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abe Froman View Post
    In this draft, the 3rd best QB can still end up being a very good QB.
    It could. But based on past drafts, the chances of that happening are very, very low.

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