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  1. #8671
    PetersonsSkillz is offline Training Camp
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    Re: The Official Tarvaris Jackson Thread

    "Prophet" wrote:
    "PetersonsSkillz" wrote:
    "Prophet" wrote:
    "jmcdon00" wrote:
    "CCthebest" wrote:
    The TJoke lovers have to admit old man Farve did at least as good a job as TJoke could have done last week right?
    I mean a 95% QB rating for your first game with a team you barely got to practice for isnt bad. TJoke been here forever and would be lucky to get that.
    I think Tjack "could" have done better. Not saying he would or wouldn't have, but clearly he is capable. And let's keep in mind that Favre has had 18 years in this offense and Tjack had 3, so that argument can go both ways. The fairer way to decide is who's better right now, and I'd agree it's Favre.
    Yeah, he's really good at calling audibles and reading defenses.
    That's one of my favorite things about TJack.
    One of the things you have to remember or consider is that Jackson was trained to run things exactly the way Childress wants it done. If you go back to the Frerotte days of last year he clearly says there are no audibles in this offense, Jackson said they were built in... I don't know what Childress has force fed the rest of his QB's but I will say that Brett Favre will not allow this offense to operate without making the proper corrections at the line of scrimmage, it would be insane not too. I really would like a clear explanation from Childress on the matter, there is article where he practically denies it's handcuffed reality.

    As far as reading defenses we all know Jackson needs to get better and has gotten better and done some really nice things reading the defense and making plays. Favre's impact on this offense and I said it before, will live on past his days here, Jackson is getting first hand training from a veteran who will change plays and make adjustments during the game. Jackson must learn from this, add it to his game and make it become a factor in the future. We simply cannot just go out and run the play that's called every time, there absolutely has to be adjustments. You would also hope that as Jackson gets older and more savvy to NFL that those options become more available, maybe that's Childress's plan but as Brad Johnson and Frerotte have pointed out, it was what the Coaches called and Run it.
    Yes, have to agree with your spiel.
    When the coaches tossed him into the fire too early and consistently show a 'no confidence' with him we can't see what he has.
    Then again, he has been given chances to excel and has not done so consistently enough for them to have confidence in him.
    Given the reigns in '07 and seemed brittle and obviously not much experience, given the reigns in '08 and yanked after a couple games and replaced by a career hack, brought in competition for starter in '09 and eventually inked Favre.
    The good thing is that Favre is much more of a mentor than the media hacks have led on to.
    TJack is in a great position right now to either step it up or walk the plank.
    He has a lot of starts relative to his number of years in the league and is now in the #2 slot behind an HOFer.
    All the pieces are in place for him to excel and get over that hump into a legitimate starter in the future.
    Will he?
    I guess we'll find out in the not too distant future.
    Good post I have to agree with the majority but I disagree that he was given "legitimate" chances to succeed. He was obviously given opportunities but when your most starts on the season come with guys like Bobby Wade and Robert Furgeson as your primaries... not to mention the musical chairs at the position and the Oline with the pass protection issues that are still here... I don't know that's a legitimate opportunity but an opportunity to gain valuable experience to build on as a very young QB who was raw to begin with. I've seen just about what I expected out of TJack considering the circumstances, everything but getting benched last year, that was no good at all.

    Now if Loadholt is an upgrade and our Oline improves their pass protection beyond the sillyness we've seen in the past Childress Era, all while Percy Harvin becomes the dynamic player I knew he would, with Shancoe staying consistent, Berrian as a effective tool and most importantly Jackson's experience and TIME which we all new he would need. This is a LEGITIMATE opportunity to expect to see consistency and good football. As Childress says, you have to play well around the QB to be a successful offense and we have not exactly done that in Jackson's limited time and when we were decent he put good numbers. As Favre says and I love this "The QB goes as the team goes".

    With that said I don't exclude Jackson from improving himself and I think with the way he's wired he takes advantage of Favre's presence and integrates it into his own game to become a better player. He will learn allot if he's an observant kid which I think he is. He's got work to do to become a legit starter and has to prove that he's a Franchise Type QB who can win a game like Favre has so many times, or the way Rodgers did it the other night. I just think his opportunity to do that in the Future is superior to anything we have seen in the past, his confidence in himself and the players around him has to go up from previous years.

  2. #8672
    marstc09's Avatar
    marstc09 is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: The Official Tarvaris Jackson Thread

    "C" wrote:
    "marstc09" wrote:
    "jmcdon00" wrote:
    "Prophet" wrote:
    "jmcdon00" wrote:
    [quote author=CCthebest link=topic=47857.msg995762#msg995762 date=1253036177]
    The TJoke lovers have to admit old man Farve did at least as good a job as TJoke could have done last week right?
    I mean a 95% QB rating for your first game with a team you barely got to practice for isnt bad. TJoke been here forever and would be lucky to get that.
    I think Tjack "could" have done better. Not saying he would or wouldn't have, but clearly he is capable. And let's keep in mind that Favre has had 18 years in this offense and Tjack had 3, so that argument can go both ways. The fairer way to decide is who's better right now, and I'd agree it's Favre.
    Yeah, he's really good at calling audibles and reading defenses.
    That's one of my favorite things about TJack.
    If you are disgareeing with me using sarcasm you'll have to be a little more clear on what you are disagreeing with because I have no idea.
    You said that Favre has had 18 years in "this" offense. That is not really true. The west coast, yes, but not Chillys version, the KOA. Different terms and tendancies. That will come with time. This is just the begining and Favre is clearly ahead of TJ mentally with the game. That is were the audibles and reading Ds comes in that prophet is talking about. So to conclude, TJ is not as capable as Favre. Favre is light years ahead of TJ. You agree Favre is better but I disagree that TJ is as capable as Favre at some points of the game.
    He seemed to have the KAO down pretty well... I mean, when it was 3rd and 16 and Favre threw it 5 yards to Taylor.

    Or the 3-and-out with only two minutes left before the half with no running attempts.

    110 passing yards.

    Sounds like he's got the KAO down perfectly.
    [/quote]

    Who said he had it down?

  3. #8673
    C Mac D's Avatar
    C Mac D is offline Posting to P'own
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    Re: The Official Tarvaris Jackson Thread

    "marstc09" wrote:
    "C" wrote:
    "marstc09" wrote:
    "jmcdon00" wrote:
    "Prophet" wrote:
    [quote author=jmcdon00 link=topic=47857.msg995770#msg995770 date=1253038153]
    [quote author=CCthebest link=topic=47857.msg995762#msg995762 date=1253036177]
    The TJoke lovers have to admit old man Farve did at least as good a job as TJoke could have done last week right?
    I mean a 95% QB rating for your first game with a team you barely got to practice for isnt bad. TJoke been here forever and would be lucky to get that.
    I think Tjack "could" have done better. Not saying he would or wouldn't have, but clearly he is capable. And let's keep in mind that Favre has had 18 years in this offense and Tjack had 3, so that argument can go both ways. The fairer way to decide is who's better right now, and I'd agree it's Favre.
    Yeah, he's really good at calling audibles and reading defenses.
    That's one of my favorite things about TJack.
    If you are disgareeing with me using sarcasm you'll have to be a little more clear on what you are disagreeing with because I have no idea.
    You said that Favre has had 18 years in "this" offense. That is not really true. The west coast, yes, but not Chillys version, the KOA. Different terms and tendancies. That will come with time. This is just the begining and Favre is clearly ahead of TJ mentally with the game. That is were the audibles and reading Ds comes in that prophet is talking about. So to conclude, TJ is not as capable as Favre. Favre is light years ahead of TJ. You agree Favre is better but I disagree that TJ is as capable as Favre at some points of the game.
    He seemed to have the KAO down pretty well... I mean, when it was 3rd and 16 and Favre threw it 5 yards to Taylor.

    Or the 3-and-out with only two minutes left before the half with no running attempts.

    110 passing yards.

    Sounds like he's got the KAO down perfectly.
    [/quote]

    Who said he had it down?
    [/quote]

    I did.
    Disclaimer: I'm an idiot.

  4. #8674
    marstc09's Avatar
    marstc09 is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: The Official Tarvaris Jackson Thread

    "C" wrote:
    "marstc09" wrote:
    "C" wrote:
    "marstc09" wrote:
    "jmcdon00" wrote:
    [quote author=Prophet link=topic=47857.msg995831#msg995831 date=1253044535]
    [quote author=jmcdon00 link=topic=47857.msg995770#msg995770 date=1253038153]
    [quote author=CCthebest link=topic=47857.msg995762#msg995762 date=1253036177]
    The TJoke lovers have to admit old man Farve did at least as good a job as TJoke could have done last week right?
    I mean a 95% QB rating for your first game with a team you barely got to practice for isnt bad. TJoke been here forever and would be lucky to get that.
    I think Tjack "could" have done better. Not saying he would or wouldn't have, but clearly he is capable. And let's keep in mind that Favre has had 18 years in this offense and Tjack had 3, so that argument can go both ways. The fairer way to decide is who's better right now, and I'd agree it's Favre.
    Yeah, he's really good at calling audibles and reading defenses.
    That's one of my favorite things about TJack.
    If you are disgareeing with me using sarcasm you'll have to be a little more clear on what you are disagreeing with because I have no idea.
    You said that Favre has had 18 years in "this" offense. That is not really true. The west coast, yes, but not Chillys version, the KOA. Different terms and tendancies. That will come with time. This is just the begining and Favre is clearly ahead of TJ mentally with the game. That is were the audibles and reading Ds comes in that prophet is talking about. So to conclude, TJ is not as capable as Favre. Favre is light years ahead of TJ. You agree Favre is better but I disagree that TJ is as capable as Favre at some points of the game.
    He seemed to have the KAO down pretty well... I mean, when it was 3rd and 16 and Favre threw it 5 yards to Taylor.

    Or the 3-and-out with only two minutes left before the half with no running attempts.

    110 passing yards.

    Sounds like he's got the KAO down perfectly.
    [/quote]

    Who said he had it down?
    [/quote]

    I did.
    [/quote]

    LOL sorry I get it now. LMFAO!

  5. #8675
    jmcdon00's Avatar
    jmcdon00 is offline Jersey Retired Snake Champion, Moto Trial Fest 2: Mountain Pack Champion, LL City Truck 2 Champion, Arithmetic sequence Champion, Troops Tower Defense Champion
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    Re: The Official Tarvaris Jackson Thread

    "marstc09" wrote:
    "C" wrote:
    "marstc09" wrote:
    "C" wrote:
    "marstc09" wrote:
    [quote author=jmcdon00 link=topic=47857.msg995835#msg995835 date=1253044791]
    [quote author=Prophet link=topic=47857.msg995831#msg995831 date=1253044535]
    [quote author=jmcdon00 link=topic=47857.msg995770#msg995770 date=1253038153]
    [quote author=CCthebest link=topic=47857.msg995762#msg995762 date=1253036177]
    The TJoke lovers have to admit old man Farve did at least as good a job as TJoke could have done last week right?
    I mean a 95% QB rating for your first game with a team you barely got to practice for isnt bad. TJoke been here forever and would be lucky to get that.
    I think Tjack "could" have done better. Not saying he would or wouldn't have, but clearly he is capable. And let's keep in mind that Favre has had 18 years in this offense and Tjack had 3, so that argument can go both ways. The fairer way to decide is who's better right now, and I'd agree it's Favre.
    Yeah, he's really good at calling audibles and reading defenses.
    That's one of my favorite things about TJack.
    If you are disgareeing with me using sarcasm you'll have to be a little more clear on what you are disagreeing with because I have no idea.
    You said that Favre has had 18 years in "this" offense. That is not really true. The west coast, yes, but not Chillys version, the KOA. Different terms and tendancies. That will come with time. This is just the begining and Favre is clearly ahead of TJ mentally with the game. That is were the audibles and reading Ds comes in that prophet is talking about. So to conclude, TJ is not as capable as Favre. Favre is light years ahead of TJ. You agree Favre is better but I disagree that TJ is as capable as Favre at some points of the game.
    He seemed to have the KAO down pretty well... I mean, when it was 3rd and 16 and Favre threw it 5 yards to Taylor.

    Or the 3-and-out with only two minutes left before the half with no running attempts.

    110 passing yards.

    Sounds like he's got the KAO down perfectly.
    [/quote]

    Who said he had it down?
    [/quote]

    I did.
    [/quote]

    LOL sorry I get it now. LMFAO!
    [/quote]
    It was a good one.

  6. #8676
    Prophet's Avatar
    Prophet is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: The Official Tarvaris Jackson Thread

    "PetersonsSkillz" wrote:
    "Prophet" wrote:
    "PetersonsSkillz" wrote:
    "Prophet" wrote:
    "jmcdon00" wrote:
    [quote author=CCthebest link=topic=47857.msg995762#msg995762 date=1253036177]
    The TJoke lovers have to admit old man Farve did at least as good a job as TJoke could have done last week right?
    I mean a 95% QB rating for your first game with a team you barely got to practice for isnt bad. TJoke been here forever and would be lucky to get that.
    I think Tjack "could" have done better. Not saying he would or wouldn't have, but clearly he is capable. And let's keep in mind that Favre has had 18 years in this offense and Tjack had 3, so that argument can go both ways. The fairer way to decide is who's better right now, and I'd agree it's Favre.
    Yeah, he's really good at calling audibles and reading defenses.
    That's one of my favorite things about TJack.
    One of the things you have to remember or consider is that Jackson was trained to run things exactly the way Childress wants it done. If you go back to the Frerotte days of last year he clearly says there are no audibles in this offense, Jackson said they were built in... I don't know what Childress has force fed the rest of his QB's but I will say that Brett Favre will not allow this offense to operate without making the proper corrections at the line of scrimmage, it would be insane not too. I really would like a clear explanation from Childress on the matter, there is article where he practically denies it's handcuffed reality.

    As far as reading defenses we all know Jackson needs to get better and has gotten better and done some really nice things reading the defense and making plays. Favre's impact on this offense and I said it before, will live on past his days here, Jackson is getting first hand training from a veteran who will change plays and make adjustments during the game. Jackson must learn from this, add it to his game and make it become a factor in the future. We simply cannot just go out and run the play that's called every time, there absolutely has to be adjustments. You would also hope that as Jackson gets older and more savvy to NFL that those options become more available, maybe that's Childress's plan but as Brad Johnson and Frerotte have pointed out, it was what the Coaches called and Run it.
    Yes, have to agree with your spiel.
    When the coaches tossed him into the fire too early and consistently show a 'no confidence' with him we can't see what he has.
    Then again, he has been given chances to excel and has not done so consistently enough for them to have confidence in him.
    Given the reigns in '07 and seemed brittle and obviously not much experience, given the reigns in '08 and yanked after a couple games and replaced by a career hack, brought in competition for starter in '09 and eventually inked Favre.
    The good thing is that Favre is much more of a mentor than the media hacks have led on to.
    TJack is in a great position right now to either step it up or walk the plank.
    He has a lot of starts relative to his number of years in the league and is now in the #2 slot behind an HOFer.
    All the pieces are in place for him to excel and get over that hump into a legitimate starter in the future.
    Will he?
    I guess we'll find out in the not too distant future.
    Good post I have to agree with the majority but I disagree that he was given "legitimate" chances to succeed. He was obviously given opportunities but when your most starts on the season come with guys like Bobby Wade and Robert Furgeson as your primaries... not to mention the musical chairs at the position and the Oline with the pass protection issues that are still here... I don't know that's a legitimate opportunity but an opportunity to gain valuable experience to build on as a very young QB who was raw to begin with. I've seen just about what I expected out of TJack considering the circumstances, everything but getting benched last year, that was no good at all.

    Now if Loadholt is an upgrade and our Oline improves their pass protection beyond the sillyness we've seen in the past Childress Era, all while Percy Harvin becomes the dynamic player I knew he would, with Shancoe staying consistent, Berrian as a effective tool and most importantly Jackson's experience and TIME which we all new he would need. This is a LEGITIMATE opportunity to expect to see consistency and good football. As Childress says, you have to play well around the QB to be a successful offense and we have not exactly done that in Jackson's limited time and when we were decent he put good numbers. As Favre says and I love this "The QB goes as the team goes".

    With that said I don't exclude Jackson from improving himself and I think with the way he's wired he takes advantage of Favre's presence and integrates it into his own game to become a better player. He will learn allot if he's an observant kid which I think he is. He's got work to do to become a legit starter and has to prove that he's a Franchise Type QB who can win a game like Favre has so many times, or the way Rodgers did it the other night. I just think his opportunity to do that in the Future is superior to anything we have seen in the past, his confidence in himself and the players around him has to go up from previous years.
    [/quote]

    I understand your perspective, but, I have to go with he has been given a legitimate chance.
    I guess it goes back to the initial philosophy of the coaching staff of when to put in a young buck at QB.
    The dichotomy in fan's opinions were to toss him in and see what he has got versus let him learn on the bench, and I was in the latter camp.
    Given that he got plenty of starts and had one of the best running games in the NFL on his side he has been in a great situation.
    Yes, the o-line and the pass coverage has been questionable and there has been some musical chairs on the o-line with suspensions and asshats on the squad.
    The developing Hicks' of the world and the jumping offsides Cooks of the world and the slow-moving McKinnies of the world take time to develop.
    Now you toss the almost rookie Sullivan into the mix and the monster of the midway Loadholt into the mix and some more potentially porous cracks need to be filled.
    The bottom-line is can TJack progress to the point where he is capable of reading defenses and making audibles and getting a quick release on target when given more chances?
    He is at the beginning of his fourth year, a time where he should be ready by this year or next to grab the field general postion of the team and run with it.
    It will be interesting to see if he can cross that hurdle without getting his wang tangled up in the process.
    This paragraph had so many cliches that I'm not even sure what language it is anymore.

    Yes, his opportunity to succeed in the future is greater than any in the past, but, more will be expected of him too and the time-scale is shortened.
    He will not get the young'un nod for much longer.
    It's not easy to put the intangibles that it takes to be an NFL starter at QB into a statistical category, but, he will have to do well when given the opportunity and do that under pressure, not in meaningless games or during trash time.
    He will have to be a leader that the team respects in order to get the job done.
    I hope he does, it would be nice to have a QB on the squad that will be here for a while.
    I have my doubts it will be TJack.
    If it is, great.
    Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please. Mark Twain

  7. #8677
    CCthebest's Avatar
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    Re: The Official Tarvaris Jackson Thread

    Take TJokes rating from the first 2 games last year, and the playoff game he choked in.

    I really think the Farve haters and TJoke lovers want Farve (and the Vikes) to fail while hes QB. Thats crazy. I still dont like Childress but i dont want the Vikes to loose to prove my point hes a bad HC and play caller. Farve will never have big numbers here. He wont be asked to pass as much as Brady is. But he can read D's and make Audibles Tjoke would never have even seen. And he can mange the clock as well in the last few minutes of a half as well as anyone. If the coaching staff doesnt screw up

    And just think how much the packers will hate us if Farve brings us to the NFC Central Champs and beyond.

  8. #8678
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    Re: The Official Tarvaris Jackson Thread

    "CCthebest" wrote:
    Take TJokes rating from the first 2 games last year, and the playoff game he choked in.

    I really think the Farve haters and TJoke lovers want Farve (and the Vikes) to fail while hes QB. Thats crazy. I still dont like Childress but i dont want the Vikes to loose to prove my point hes a bad HC and play caller. Farve will never have big numbers here. He wont be asked to pass as much as Brady is. But he can read D's and make Audibles Tjoke would never have even seen. And he can mange the clock as well in the last few minutes of a half as well as anyone. If the coaching staff doesnt screw up

    And just think how much the packers will hate us if Farve brings us to the NFC Central Champs and beyond.
    CCthejoke

  9. #8679
    ultravikingfan's Avatar
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    Re: The Official Tarvaris Jackson Thread

    I think this thread has run its course.

    Not to mention the fact we have all the bickering and pissing matches in the Brett Favre thread as well.


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