OFFICIAL COLTS vs VIKINGS POSTGAME DISCUSSION

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Originally Posted by purplehelmut

Bad front office, bad coaching, bad players equals a bad record. I'm hunkering down, again, for another woeful campaign. This team isn't even fun to watch. The defense can't play and the offense is just plain Jane boring and unimaginative. Look at the teams that have recently succeed- NYG, SF, GB, NE, and NO. Guess what? They have excellent coaches. We do not. I'm officially off the Leslie bandwagon. I've seen nothing exceptional so far. I hope I'm wrong. BTW, you can see what the loss of Sean Peyton has done to NO. Even Brees can't carry them.

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So we've played a woeful Jacksonville team, and another bad team in Indy that had three starters on the o line out. Can you imagine our team with three starting o lineman out? No Freeney, hello. No Collie, and about 4 rooks playing, and we can't beat THEM. I see Joe Montana Gabbert against us, threw for 50 yards yesterday. That shows how bad this team really is. We pay 5 mil a year to a tight end who's name has not been called yet in a game, while we needed playmaking receivers or a d back that can actually intercept a ball. It's going to be one long year boys. Ponder has happy feet and refuses to stand in the pocket for more than a blink.

This team needed to deal Allen for draft picks. He's useless on this team that is not going to win more than 4 games. Winfield can't cover my mom, and Cook is a head case, but goofy Frasier, who only has a head coaching job because of the Rooney rule will refuse to put in the young guys on a regular basis because he knows he has to win at least 6 to keep his job.

This team is paper thin as far as depth and as soon as we lose a Harvin, Peterson, it's going to get really ugly. I'm sure glad I went golfing yesterday instead of watching the same old boring Vikings. They truly are a waste of a beautiful fall day. Face facts, this team is in the bottom three in the league. It won't win one Central game which will extend our great record in the division for straight losses.

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Originally Posted by purplehelmut

Bad front office, bad coaching, bad players equals a bad record. I'm hunkering down, again, for another woeful campaign. This team isn't even fun to watch. The defense can't play and the offense is just plain Jane boring and unimaginative. Look at the teams that have recently succeed- NYG, SF, GB, NE, and NO. Guess what? They have excellent coaches. We do not. I'm officially off the Leslie bandwagon. I've seen nothing exceptional so far. I hope I'm wrong. BTW, you can see what the loss of Sean Peyton has done to NO. Even Brees can't carry them.

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I am happy with the front office so far, and I see a lot of good players on our team - Ponder, AD, Harvin, JA, Smith, Kalil, Simpson, etc... But your point of bad coaching rings true...

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Originally Posted by kingpin9995

So we've played a woeful Jacksonville team, and another bad team in Indy that had three starters on the o line out. Can you imagine our team with three starting o lineman out? No Freeney, hello. No Collie, and about 4 rooks playing, and we can't beat THEM. I see Joe Montana Gabbert against us, threw for 50 yards yesterday. That shows how bad this team really is. We pay 5 mil a year to a tight end who's name has not been called yet in a game, while we needed playmaking receivers or a d back that can actually intercept a ball. It's going to be one long year boys. Ponder has happy feet and refuses to stand in the pocket for more than a blink.

This team needed to deal Allen for draft picks. He's useless on this team that is not going to win more than 4 games. Winfield can't cover my mom, and Cook is a head case, but goofy Frasier, who only has a head coaching job because of the Rooney rule will refuse to put in the young guys on a regular basis because he knows he has to win at least 6 to keep his job.

This team is paper thin as far as depth and as soon as we lose a Harvin, Peterson, it's going to get really ugly. I'm sure glad I went golfing yesterday instead of watching the same old boring Vikings. They truly are a waste of a beautiful fall day. Face facts, this team is in the bottom three in the league. It won't win one Central game which will extend our great record in the division for straight losses.

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I actually doubt that the Rooney rule has anything to do with the fact that Frazier is our head coach.

But your statement about dealing Allen isn't a bad one. I don't think it would happen, but it would benefit both Allen and the Vikings.

I want to see them play 4 strong quarters of football. It's lik they swapped what was done last year. Starting the first half completely slow and cold then wake up and play hot the second half.

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Originally Posted by NodakPaul

Before the season started, I thought we would probably go 6-10. And I still think so. We are going to lose a couple we should have won, like yesterday. But we will also win a couple we should probably lose. So it will even out.

Bottom line - we are playing like the 6-10 team I expected us to be. I have my reservations as to whether or not Frazier can get us past that, but I am going to do my best to give him more of the season...

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Paul

I too thought we would 6 games, but that was beating the teams we were supposed to beat. Indy was one of those teams. At this point I have no idea how we double our win total from last year.

The one thing that really frustrated me yesterday, because it is something that the average eye can see and relate to, is the complete lack of urgency when we were down to scores. Walking to the huddle, slow to get plays in, etc, etc. That pissed me off.

I don't know everything about schemes, why we do what we do, personnel packages, etc, etc, etc. But I do know hustle, and we lacked it. I put that right on the coaching staff.

I do not like the coaching carousel we may be becoming, but I am not sure I can handle Frazier and Musgrave all season long. They may be the nicest guys in the world, and maybe in a different time/location they will be better than what they have shown, but now may not be their time.

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Originally Posted by NodakPaul

I am happy with the front office so far, and I see a lot of good players on our team - Ponder, AD, Harvin, JA, Smith, Kalil, Simpson, etc... But your point of bad coaching rings true...

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I too think we have done OK with some of our draft choices and signings, but not perfect. I really do not know where that blame lies. Yes, this year Rick is the go to guy, but what kind of input do the coaches have in that process. Some, I am sure. On top of that, what part is coaching, and what part is just poor/great athletes?

If we have good players, why are we a bad team?

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Originally Posted by NodakPaul

I am happy with the front office so far, and I see a lot of good players on our team - Ponder, AD, Harvin, JA, Smith, Kalil, Simpson, etc... But your point of bad coaching rings true...

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The players you listed- All but Simpson either were picked in the first round or we gave up 1st round picks plus to get. I agree that at least with the 1st round picks we have done very well, better than in the past even. But after the first round we have been very very bad at getting quality role playing starters. Those second, third and later picks are the bread and butter that build the depth in the roster and all of the misses have really taken a toll on the depth of our roster and that is something we cannot afford to continue and we cannot fix quickly which leaves us in a situation where we will need some time to get out of the mess.

With the right personnel dept and the right coaching staff we could shorten that and make the most out of what we have but I just don't see these guys as the ones to make that happen. Hopefully I am wrong because if I am right the stadium will be a few years old before we are in a position to contend.

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Originally Posted by Purple Floyd

The players you listed- All but Simpson either were picked in the first round or we gave up 1st round picks plus to get. I agree that at least with the 1st round picks we have done very well, better than in the past even. But after the first round we have been very very bad at getting quality role playing starters. Those second, third and later picks are the bread and butter that build the depth in the roster and all of the misses have really taken a toll on the depth of our roster and that is something we cannot afford to continue and we cannot fix quickly which leaves us in a situation where we will need some time to get out of the mess.

With the right personnel dept and the right coaching staff we could shorten that and make the most out of what we have but I just don't see these guys as the ones to make that happen. Hopefully I am wrong because if I am right the stadium will be a few years old before we are in a position to contend.

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I see what you're saying, and I agree that we haven't seen the talent we need out of 2, 3, and 4th rounders. I am hoping that this years draft pans out better, but it is too early to tell. Robinson looks promising, for a start.

But you are right, it is going to take us some time to get out of the mess that the TOA put us in. I think that Spielman has IMHO earned his place for another year or two at least. Frazier has not done that yet.

By saying that then are you blaming all of the low to mid round misses on Childress and giving Spielman a pass on that era?

Who are the guys in this draft after the first round that you are seeing as players that are going to become solid role players? I will give you Walsh, he looks like a keeper but Wright, Robinson and co. don't look any different than what we have seen in the past.

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Originally Posted by tarkenton10

Did you lose a girl to Marrdro or something? You seem to hammer his analysis no matter what. Marrdro makes some very good points (my friend, Marrdroese) and they are:

1. We need a warpig-Our D-line has gone down hill since when, what happened that you can actually markedly see, Fhat Pat's departure. Since that has happened our D whether it be run D or pass D has gone down hill.

2. We need a Mike linebacker in the worst way. I take that back we one in the worst way.

3. We need some ball hawing safeties!!

If you want the T2 to work you have to be strong up the middle on D IMO! That pretty much goes for any sport.

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So, if in order for the T2 to work at all it requires this beast of a warpig, which we don't have & a speedy MLB with great tackling abilities, which we don't have, then why are we trying to run it?

Clearly, you're both saying we haven't got the players to run it & if that's the case, we shouldn't be running a scheme we don't have the players to run it.

Teams don't try to win ball games with a running attack, continually pounding the ball, if they haven't got a decent RB.

Even if we had said warpig & got even more pressure on the QB than we already are, it doesn't change the fact that the QB's will still complete passes on the run to his intended receivers because our DB's are often times leaving them way too much room.

And when our safties are playing prevent defense to avoid giving up the big play, it's hard for them to be "ball hawking". We had a ball hawking safety a few years back on our team, incidentally Marrdro wanted him gone, but our defensive coach hand cuffed his ball hawking abilities in the name of the T2.

That D-coach was Frazier.