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  1. #211
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    Re: The Official Christian Ponder Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by "Purple Floyd" #1096000
    It's going to be hard to compare the performance of Manning or Aikman in their first year compared to anything Ponder might do.

    The reason for that is they both went to terrible teams and did not have much around them during the first year.

    While I readily admit this team has lots of holes, it is not as devoid of talent as the colts were when Manning was drafted or The Cowboys when Aikman was drafted. Had both of those players been drafted to a more talented team I feel they could have had a much better first year.

    Back to Ponder and the offense-

    I have heard it said we will be running a dink and dunk offense because Ponder has no arm strength.

    I disagree with that notion and I will instead point to two times in the Vikings past when we used a similar offense that was not very dink and dunk IMO.


    Interestingly when Denny Green took ober the Vikings he installed very much the same offense the Vikings are talking about installing which is a blend of the WCO that Walsh ran and the Redskins offense from the 80's under Gibbs. That offense would run 2 TE's or a TE and an "H" back and if you look back we had some respectable numbers when Warren Moon was running it.

    The next time was when Tice took over as HC and if you look at the numbers put up under both coaches it really was not Dink and Dunk at all.
    Are you implying that Moon, Cunningham & Culpepper all had arm strengths/accuracies similar to Ponder?

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  2. #212
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    Re: The Official Christian Ponder Thread

    A bad pick? Compared to what? I will say it now that he will be at least as good as 2 of the 3 guys drafted ahead of him and he may end up better than all 3 of them.

    What makes taking Ponder at 12 such a bad thing while taking Newton at 1, Locker at 8 and Gabbert at ten worthwhile? Ponder was a 5 year player and started for what, 3 years and had success for the whole time.


    And while Fairley is a hell of an athlete he isn't a sure thing either considering he had only a 1 year track record in College, Amakamura had zero INT's and we needed a CB who can increase our INT rate and we have one high dollar LT and a 2nd year RT so taking another OT at that spot means we need to trade one of those in an uncertain market.

    I looked at Ponder a lot in the pre draft and had him rated higher than Newton, Gabbert and Locker and was the happiest fan in the great white north when Locker was taken at 8 and off the board.

    He may work out and he might be a bust but when looking at what we needed and what was available I like the pick more and more all the time.

  3. #213
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    Re: The Official Christian Ponder Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1095970
    Quote Originally Posted by "Culpepper_4717" #1095853
    Culpepper: Remove pressure to start Ponder

    http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/blogs/120989989.html
    Of course Pepp would say that. Hell, he never ever really did get the whole concept of reading the whole defense.

    Ponder, on the other hand, seems to be smart enough to figure that one out with some coaching.

    In the end, I think its a player by player decision based on how you feel the kid learns the best. By the books or by doing during real game situations.

    Peyton sucked his first 8 or 9 games (my memory Midge). Aikmen, same same. Heck even Sanchez sucked his first year. None of them were permanantly marred for going through the school of hard knocks.

    I think you can put Ponder on the field, with this team and win.
    I think Culpepper is right. Your comment on his ability to read or not read defenses has nothing to do with it.

    It's a lot of pressure to put on a kid. Not only to start but to carry a team without, so much as a veteran QB on the teams roster to learn from or that can come in and lead the team if Ponder can't. There's no one to back him up or give him advice or to learn from.

    This is what you want this year. This is your plan....

    Keep in mind there may be no OTA', minicamps & perhaps a limited TC &/or preseason.

    Start Ponder. Zero NFL experience/snaps

    Back him up with Webb. 2 career starts, 89 career regular season NFL pass attemps.

    Back Webb up with Bowmar. 2 partial years in the NFL. 0 regular season snaps, 0 passes.

    LOL! Great plan! AYFKM!!!!

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  4. #214
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    Re: The Official Christian Ponder Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by "Purple Floyd" #1096013
    He may work out and he might be a bust but when looking at what we needed and what was available I like the pick more and more all the time.
    And you should be able to tell us which after how many games? 6? 12?

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  5. #215
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    Re: The Official Christian Ponder Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by "singersp" #1096016
    Quote Originally Posted by "Purple Floyd" #1096013
    He may work out and he might be a bust but when looking at what we needed and what was available I like the pick more and more all the time.
    And you should be able to tell us which after how many games? 6? 12?
    Sooner than the 5 it takes you.:P

  6. #216
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    Re: The Official Christian Ponder Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by "skum" #1095857
    I want CP from day 1.. tired of vets that will only waste Adrians career with us..
    I don't. McKinnie will get him killed.

    =Z=

    Thanks to Josdin for the awesome sig!

  7. #217
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    Re: The Official Christian Ponder Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by "dfosterf" #1095614
    This pic looks bad on paper.
    Did you print it on your once used Charmin?

  8. #218
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    Re: The Official Christian Ponder Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by "singersp" #1096015
    Quote Originally Posted by "Marrdro" #1095970
    Quote Originally Posted by "Culpepper_4717" #1095853
    Culpepper: Remove pressure to start Ponder

    http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/blogs/120989989.html
    Of course Pepp would say that. Hell, he never ever really did get the whole concept of reading the whole defense.

    Ponder, on the other hand, seems to be smart enough to figure that one out with some coaching.

    In the end, I think its a player by player decision based on how you feel the kid learns the best. By the books or by doing during real game situations.

    Peyton sucked his first 8 or 9 games (my memory Midge). Aikmen, same same. Heck even Sanchez sucked his first year. None of them were permanantly marred for going through the school of hard knocks.

    I think you can put Ponder on the field, with this team and win.
    I think Culpepper is right. Your comment on his ability to read or not read defenses has nothing to do with it.

    It's a lot of pressure to put on a kid. Not only to start but to carry a team without, so much as a veteran QB on the teams roster to learn from or that can come in and lead the team if Ponder can't. There's no one to back him up or give him advice or to learn from.

    This is what you want this year. This is your plan....

    Keep in mind there may be no OTA', minicamps & perhaps a limited TC &/or preseason.

    Start Ponder. Zero NFL experience/snaps

    Back him up with Webb. 2 career starts, 89 career regular season NFL pass attemps.

    Back Webb up with Bowmar. 2 partial years in the NFL. 0 regular season snaps, 0 passes.

    LOL! Great plan! AYFKM!!!!
    Exactly. Say what you will about Culpepper, but the one hting he had going for him when he started, was he had confidence. He trusted himself and his team, he knew what to do and how to get it done.

    Sending Ponder out there, with no NFL experience at all, probably no mini-camps and probably different Training Camps than normal is NOT a good idea.

    with McNabb, at least he's up to speed with the NFL game. He knows the speed of the game, he can read defenses, play the position and be the leader in the huddle. Ponder has far too much work to do.

    He needs time to develop that rapport with his receivers and coaches. Time that the NFL is banning him from using. Ponder will need to earn the respect of teammates. He doesn't have any respect going in, he's not an established player. McNabb is one of the better players in the league, and has had a great career. it will be similar to when Favre showed up, and commanded the respect of his teammates.

    Just a whole bunch of htings like that are important, and no, Bomar doesn't cut it. He doesn't command the respect of a 7 year old.

  9. #219
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    Re: The Official Christian Ponder Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by "Purple Floyd" #1096013
    A bad pick? Compared to what? I will say it now that he will be at least as good as 2 of the 3 guys drafted ahead of him and he may end up better than all 3 of them.

    What makes taking Ponder at 12 such a bad thing while taking Newton at 1, Locker at 8 and Gabbert at ten worthwhile? Ponder was a 5 year player and started for what, 3 years and had success for the whole time.


    And while Fairley is a hell of an athlete he isn't a sure thing either considering he had only a 1 year track record in College, Amakamura had zero INT's and we needed a CB who can increase our INT rate and we have one high dollar LT and a 2nd year RT so taking another OT at that spot means we need to trade one of those in an uncertain market.

    I looked at Ponder a lot in the pre draft and had him rated higher than Newton, Gabbert and Locker and was the happiest fan in the great white north when Locker was taken at 8 and off the board.

    He may work out and he might be a bust but when looking at what we needed and what was available I like the pick more and more all the time.
    Excellent post. What a lot of fans don't seem to realize is that in an ideal situation we would have taken BPA in round one then taken Ponder in Round 2 (that is, the ideal situation involving drafting Ponder as your quarterback). Given the circumstances with no trade offers the Vikings did what they had to do to get their guy and when you get a new coach it doesn't take John Gruden to tell you your first pick is to draft your new starting quarterback. I also felt a huge sigh of relief when Locker's name was called as I honestly think he's going to be a bust just like Newton IMO.

    Another key point with the likely frustration of this pick amongst fans was how poorly we finished in 2010 and how many holes our team needed to fill. My feeling is what is the point of getting a stopgap quarterback like McNabb and taking BPA if you're just going to end up back here anyway next year when once again you're back in the same position of needing a franchise quarterback? "But McNabb could be our starter for the next three years while we groom Quarterback X!", they say. True, but then he's just sitting on the bench with a clipboard. Just because it worked with Rogers (who was sitting behind Brett Favre by the way) doesn't mean it's always going to work that way. I think when you look at the recent young Quarterback successes of Ryan, Flacco and Sanchez then you should know that putting Ponder under center Week 1 at San Diego is the right move IN THE LONG RUN. Rolling the dice each year with a veteran Quarterback in the hopes of getting to the Super Bowl has worked how many times? In recent memory all I can think of is Dilfer and Brad Johnson.

    My point Vikings fans is to give it time. It's a marathon, not a sprint, and trust me, Ponder is our guy. You just don't know it yet B)

  10. #220
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    Re: The Official Christian Ponder Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by "Dibbzz" #1096034
    Quote Originally Posted by "Purple Floyd" #1096013
    A bad pick? Compared to what? I will say it now that he will be at least as good as 2 of the 3 guys drafted ahead of him and he may end up better than all 3 of them.

    What makes taking Ponder at 12 such a bad thing while taking Newton at 1, Locker at 8 and Gabbert at ten worthwhile? Ponder was a 5 year player and started for what, 3 years and had success for the whole time.


    And while Fairley is a hell of an athlete he isn't a sure thing either considering he had only a 1 year track record in College, Amakamura had zero INT's and we needed a CB who can increase our INT rate and we have one high dollar LT and a 2nd year RT so taking another OT at that spot means we need to trade one of those in an uncertain market.

    I looked at Ponder a lot in the pre draft and had him rated higher than Newton, Gabbert and Locker and was the happiest fan in the great white north when Locker was taken at 8 and off the board.

    He may work out and he might be a bust but when looking at what we needed and what was available I like the pick more and more all the time.
    Excellent post. What a lot of fans don't seem to realize is that in an ideal situation we would have taken BPA in round one then taken Ponder in Round 2 (that is, the ideal situation involving drafting Ponder as your quarterback). Given the circumstances with no trade offers the Vikings did what they had to do to get their guy and when you get a new coach it doesn't take John Gruden to tell you your first pick is to draft your new starting quarterback. I also felt a huge sigh of relief when Locker's name was called as I honestly think he's going to be a bust just like Newton IMO.

    Another key point with the likely frustration of this pick amongst fans was how poorly we finished in 2010 and how many holes our team needed to fill. My feeling is what is the point of getting a stopgap quarterback like McNabb and taking BPA if you're just going to end up back here anyway next year when once again you're back in the same position of needing a franchise quarterback? "But McNabb could be our starter for the next three years while we groom Quarterback X!", they say. True, but then he's just sitting on the bench with a clipboard. Just because it worked with Rogers (who was sitting behind Brett Favre by the way) doesn't mean it's always going to work that way. I think when you look at the recent young Quarterback successes of Ryan, Flacco and Sanchez then you should know that putting Ponder under center Week 1 at San Diego is the right move IN THE LONG RUN. Rolling the dice each year with a veteran Quarterback in the hopes of getting to the Super Bowl has worked how many times? In recent memory all I can think of is Dilfer and Brad Johnson.

    My point Vikings fans is to give it time. It's a marathon, not a sprint, and trust me, Ponder is our guy. You just don't know it yet B)
    You just moved up my list of favorite posters.

    Unfortunately the fans have become so accustomed to failure by the Tjack experiment and the laundry list of guys that cycled under QB during the Chilly tenure that they have a hard time grasping that a QB can step in and play in year one if he has enough team support around him as evidenced by Ryan, Flacco, Sanchez, Bradford and even Rothlisberger who started very early in his rookie year and did just fine. If we tweak the starting OL and either keep Rice or add a vet like Ocho he will do just fine and we are not going to win the division or the SB this year anyway with the way our division is stacked so McNabb isn't going to come here anyway. And certainly not when he knows the fans will be calling for him to be benched when he makes his first INT.

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