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  1. #1
    singersp's Avatar
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    'More predictability' with Toby Gerhart on field


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    More predictability in what Gerhart will do once he gets the ball & the defense knows it, perhaps, but more importantly the Vikings offense will be less predictable before the snap.

    I highly doubt defenses will be stacking the box, anticipating the run with a high assurance of probability with Gerhart in there, the way the do when AD is in there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by singersp View Post
    More predictability in what Gerhart will do once he gets the ball & the defense knows it, perhaps, but more importantly the Vikings offense will be less predictable before the snap.

    I highly doubt defenses will be stacking the box, anticipating the run with a high assurance of probability with Gerhart in there, the way the do when AD is in there.
    The whole "Stacking the Box" cliche is a bit old on here. Like it or not, all teams stack the box and do it for RB's with alot less talent than AD.

    So, if you think they won't stack the box anymore with Toby in there you are mistaken. Heck, you might just see a lot more of it because of his size and the perception that he won't spread it sideline to sideline and will stay inside the "B' gaps.

    I, on the other hand think that Toby is more than capable of getting it to the outside. We have seen him do it several times over his short career.

    On a side note, when they mentioned predictability, I think they were just talking about what gaps he will run to and not predicting run vs pass based on offensive packages on the field. Kind of sounds like you got that, but I wasn't sure based on your post.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marrdro View Post
    The whole "Stacking the Box" cliche is a bit old on here. Like it or not, all teams stack the box and do it for RB's with alot less talent than AD.

    So, if you think they won't stack the box anymore with Toby in there you are mistaken. Heck, you might just see a lot more of it because of his size and the perception that he won't spread it sideline to sideline and will stay inside the "B' gaps.

    I, on the other hand think that Toby is more than capable of getting it to the outside. We have seen him do it several times over his short career.

    On a side note, when they mentioned predictability, I think they were just talking about what gaps he will run to and not predicting run vs pass based on offensive packages on the field. Kind of sounds like you got that, but I wasn't sure based on your post.
    Could you link me to the video? I'm having a hard time finding which thread you're talking about.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marrdro View Post
    The whole "Stacking the Box" cliche is a bit old on here. Like it or not, all teams stack the box and do it for RB's with alot less talent than AD.

    So, if you think they won't stack the box anymore with Toby in there you are mistaken. Heck, you might just see a lot more of it because of his size and the perception that he won't spread it sideline to sideline and will stay inside the "B' gaps.

    I, on the other hand think that Toby is more than capable of getting it to the outside. We have seen him do it several times over his short career.

    On a side note, when they mentioned predictability, I think they were just talking about what gaps he will run to and not predicting run vs pass based on offensive packages on the field. Kind of sounds like you got that, but I wasn't sure based on your post.
    I know what THEY meant by predictability, I addressed that with the first sentence of my post.

    I don't feel "stacking the box" is cliche. We all know other teams do it when they feel it's going to be a run, they just don't do it as much against passing offenses as they do against us.

    If AD is on the field, there's a high chance of probability he's getting the ball.

    If they continue to try and always pound the ball with Toby & be a run first team, then yes, they'll stack the box more with him in there, but if they rifle the ball deep more, you're not going to see that boxed stacked nearly as much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by singersp View Post
    I know what THEY meant by predictability, I addressed that with the first sentence of my post.
    I read your first sentence and as I said, I assumed thats what you meant, just wanted to make sure.

    I don't feel "stacking the box" is cliche. We all know other teams do it when they feel it's going to be a run, they just don't do it as much against passing offenses as they do against us.
    Nope all teams do it, especially on first downs when they are in their base. In the end, this isn't something teams just do to us. It happens all the time......All the time.

    If AD is on the field, there's a high chance of probability he's getting the ball.

    If they continue to try and always pound the ball with Toby & be a run first team, then yes, they'll stack the box more with him in there, but if they rifle the ball deep more, you're not going to see that boxed stacked nearly as much.
    Stacked boxes don't apply to just teams with the RB thats name is AD. All teams stack the box regardless of the RB.

    Don't believe, go back and watch games against the Steelers and the Bus (big bruiser needed the extra S) or the Rams (with Marshall) fast little scat back that was more of a receiver than runner.

    An extra S in the box helps in both areas my friend.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Anderson View Post
    Could you link me to the video? I'm having a hard time finding which thread you're talking about.
    This is the one I like to use the most.

    Toby Gerhart Vikings Rookie - YouTube

    First run to the outside was amazing. Lots of demonstrations of him getting to the right spot on passing, and the last play is a key play were it shows the S in the box especially for Toby. I like how Toby used his blockers to negate him.

    The second one I like to post really shows alot of his stuff working the inside as well. Take a look how many times there are 8 (and several 9) guys in the box and AD isn't even on the field.

    Toby Gerhart WFO!!!.mpg - YouTube

    Again, I don't think having Toby on the field this year is going to be as big an issue as most on here want to think and oh by the way, is a perfect example of drafting someone when you don't think we should (i.e. Wright).

    Why not have a damn good backup to one of your most important positions?

    In the end, Toby is no AD, but he is sure a nice option to have, and Wright is no Percy, but I think he will be a nice compliment as well.

    Damn I'm getting excited to see this team come together on the field. Even with this coaching staff.
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    'More predictability' with Toby Gerhart on field

    They stack the box on us more than average though since we have no receiving threat. Bottom line.

    Cliches become cliches because they are repeatably true in the Vikings

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    Quote Originally Posted by Webby View Post
    They stack the box on us more than average though since we have no receiving threat. Bottom line.

    Cliches become cliches because they are repeatably true in the Vikings
    I agree Webby. AD drives that. No team wants to see him break a long one. That is a different discussion all together. This one is whether or not we will still see stacked boxes (or not) with Toby.

    My contention is that we will and if Toby does what I thin he will do this year, it might be even more.

    Very interesting article on BR today that has some interesting stats on Toby that some on here might find quite interesting regardless of the source. Of course a few will automatically dismiss the discussion points because of the source. (They are just silly).

    His 2011 statistics alone speak to the fact that he outpaces a number of other running backs in the league—he ranked 13th in the NFL in yards per carry, at 4.9, and ninth in yards after contact, with 2.97.
    Some of the more obscure statistics pop out, too: He's forced 23 missed tackles, making him the second best in the league in missed tackles per carry at 0.21. Toby has been asked to pass-block 80 times, and in that time, he's only given up one sack. With only one fumble to his name, Gerhart jumps off the page.
    The data show that he is a passing threat as well and caught a staggering 89 percent of passes thrown his way—the second most of any running back with over 25 targets. His yards per reception is about league average, and he's a viable checkdown option on every play.
    Again and again, he finds himself among top starters in key stats. He finished 2011 with higher yards per carry than Matt Forte, Ryan Mathews and LeSean McCoy and more yards after contact than Darren McFadden, LeGarrette Blount and Maurice Jones-Drew.
    Minnesota Vikings' 4 Backups Who Would Start for Other Teams | Bleacher Report
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marrdro View Post
    I agree Webby. AD drives that. No team wants to see him break a long one. That is a different discussion all together. This one is whether or not we will still see stacked boxes (or not) with Toby.
    So you agree with Webby, but not me even though we are saying the same thing?

    This one is NOT whether we will still see stacked boxes (or not) with Toby, it's about us not seeing stacked boxes nearly as much with Toby in there as we would have with AD in there.

    Thus the less predictability.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

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