Page 11 of 19 FirstFirst ... 910111213 ... LastLast
Results 101 to 110 of 184
  1. #101
    Purple Floyd's Avatar
    Purple Floyd is offline Jersey Retired
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    16,646
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by singersp View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Marrdro View Post
    But see, that isn't the case anymore......

    Ponder
    7/31/2011: Signed a four-year, $10.15 million contract. The deal is fully guaranteed, including a $5,888,144 signing bonus. 2013: $1,298,518, 2014: $1,760,277, 2015: Free Agent

    Kaep
    7/28/2011: Signed a four-year, $5.22 million contract. The deal contains $3.8 million guaranteed, including a $2.26 million signing bonus. 2013: $740,844, 2014: $973,766, 2015: Free Agent

    Dalton
    7/29/2011: Signed a four-year, $5.214 million contract. The deal included a $2.292 million signing bonus. 2013: $749,018 (+ $100,000 reporting bonus), 2014: $986,027 (+ $100,000 reporting bonus), 2015: Free Agent

    The madness is over. You can take a kid in the first round, and take him high, and let him grow the way he is supposed to, on the bench, making mistakes in practice instead of on the field.

    The only reason why teams are still doing it is because it does quicken the development process and it helps staff figure out if they have the right guy quicker. Believe it or not, a guy making mistakes on the field doesn't mean that he isn't their guy. He is just a kid making mistakes like all players do.

    Problem is, its at the position most fans watch or even think they understand.

    For instance, most fans think Smitty had a great year last year when the truth of the matter is he really struggled at times. If he wouldn't have graded out so well in the pass coverage area, they would have really picked up on his penalties (graded out as 78th worse out of 88) and run support (graded out as 71rst worse out of 88).

    Again, fans love the INT but don't have a clue what a S does or doesn't do right in run support.
    It's not about money & it's not that we are just seeing a bunch of anomalies at the QB level.

    Not so many years ago, you had to groom QB's a lot more than you do now. Back then college teams pounded the ball a lot more & passed less than they do now.

    Now that college football is becoming more of a passing league & play a more NFL style type of football, the college QB's are being groomed & prepared more, by better QB coaches at the college level. Thus, when they step onto an NFL field they are better prepared for the NFL than their predecessors were & a lot more is expected out of them. Especially those QB's taken in the first round. I.E. Ponder
    Interesting. When I think back 10-10 years it seemed to me the top QBs then were more traditional passers that stayed in the pocket. Now it seems the teams in college and the pros are trending towards the QB/RB types That can make 1 read and either pull it down and run or throw it to that first read.

  2. #102
    kevoncox's Avatar
    kevoncox is offline Jersey Retired
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    5,906
    Quote Originally Posted by Purple Floyd View Post
    Solder is a dumbass. His takes are as bad as McNabb's. face it- if was ever any good we would have signed him at the end of his career to try to squeeze one last season out of him before he was put out to pasture.
    Doesn't mean he isn't right. When given a perfect pocket Ponder is Montana. When he is flush...he is a machine..sent from the future... He can't bargained with, he can't be reasoned with...he doesn't feel pity or remorse or fear and it absolutely will not stop ever...until the drive is dead.

    The Terminator: 1984 - 22 second video. "And it absolutely will NOT stop! EVER! Until you are dead!" - YouTube

  3. #103
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    43,909
    Quote Originally Posted by Purple Floyd View Post
    Interesting. When I think back 10-10 years it seemed to me the top QBs then were more traditional passers that stayed in the pocket. Now it seems the teams in college and the pros are trending towards the QB/RB types That can make 1 read and either pull it down and run or throw it to that first read.
    None of them have won a SB yet. Last year one was beat by a traditional pocket passing (slow of foot) guy who was told to quit throwing it deep and dink dunk his way to his ring and a big payday.

    As I said earlier. I wonder if the move from one Harbrother to the other of Boldin is a sign the other will go back to the Dink Dunk approach.

    Sure have been a lot of SB's won running that variant.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  4. #104
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    43,909
    Quote Originally Posted by singersp View Post
    Here's a few more that I refered to.

    Christian Ponder at Florida State, have you gotten to spend much time with him? Have you broken down his film? What do you think of him as a quarterback and as a person?

    GRUDEN: I have not had a chance to individually work Christian Ponder out. I have had a chance to study his tape. Here's a guy that is a three-year starter. He's won 22 games at Florida State, Senior Bowl MVP. He's already graduated. There are a lot of upsides here. He's had some injuries, which are the big concern. He's a great leader. Two-time team captain of the Seminoles. Two years ago he threw for almost 70 percent. I think the injuries got to him a little bit this year. But you see a couple tremendous throws in the Florida game. One, a red zone post where you see the anticipation, the accuracy, the toughness in the pocket. There are a lot of guys I know that that like this guy because he's got the aptitude to learn. He's got the leadership traits that you want, and he's got a lot of playing experience. And Jimbo Fisher does some good things on offense. But I think he's an accurate, intermediate passer. People want to see him push the ball maybe a little more down the field. Like to see a little more arm strength. But I think those things will develop and come to Ponder when he gets healthy and continues to physically get stronger. He's a very good collegian. He's got good enough size, good enough mobility, and he's won a lot of games and shown tremendous toughness for the Seminoles.
    Jon Gruden breaks down draft - AFC West Blog - ESPN

    Billick, the former Vikings' offensive coordinator, offered this take on where the offense stands:
    "I think it's time to start holding Christian Ponder accountable. But only if they give him the proper weapons. Percy Harvin is a heck of a weapon. And when he was healthy, he was a great way to go. They don't have that big shot down the field. They were hoping Jerome Simpson could be that. They don't have that. That's got to be a top priority. For me, I've got to come out with a big play weapon down the field."
    Brian Billick says 'Time to start holding Christian Ponder accountable' | StarTribune.com

    I really liked this one, ........Multiple analysts....All saying the same thing.
    "Let me put it in context: Christian has done a nice job overall. He is very much what I thought he would be. He's a talented kid, a smart kid, who was trained a certain way in college. His quarterback DNA told me he was very good at the easy stuff. He's very good with space to work in the pocket. He's very good within the system. And that's not a knock. That is what most guys are. He handles the easy stuff, the clean stuff, very, very, very well.

    "His mistakes come when they take things away from the system, when they force him to make a play. Blitzing, cluttered pockets, tight coverage throws, those are kind of the graduate-level things he has not done very well to this point.
    "You can evolve if you're given the freedom to evolve and if you can change your mind-set. And Christian always has been a rather safe player. He's a very smart kid -- very, very smart. He sees the picture unfolding in front of him and he typically chooses the safe route because he's smart enough to get to the safe route. And I don't mean the passing route. It's the route to success.


    "It always goes back to this, and it blows my mind people won't talk about it more: When you are tailback-driven, you practice more run plays and more run-oriented schemes. When you are quarterback-driven, you practice more nuances of the passing game. You only get so many practice reps. As long as Adrian Peterson is the bell cow back and they are tailback-driven, the passing game will never have the nuance that the great passing games have. Now that's not a bad thing, but the expectations need to be shaped that way. You can't have both in today's football. There's not enough practice time.

    "You don't pick a guy 12th in (the) draft and think the guy is just going to be OK. Do I think he's a franchise QB? Not yet.
    "You've got to manage the game, play defense and run the ball. When you need more than that, you have to take off the governor. As long as Minnesota is a winning team, you can't work on developing Christian Ponder. It will come when he will eventually get enough snaps.


    "I don't think you can look at Christian Ponder from play to play and say it's a flub when you're winning the way they've won. They won in overtime against Jacksonville and had a great win over San Francisco.
    "The second half of the season is important for him. I think he's trending in the right direction. You've seen him cut down on poor decisions. I think he's got better footwork. Nobody questions his toughness, his arm strength.

    Ponder has got to handle blitzes better. The coordinator can help him with play calls. The group around him can do a better job. I'm talking about everybody.

    "I think sometimes we make assumptions before we have all the information in front of us. Because he played so well in the first five games of the season, you think, 'This is a guy who's figured it out.' I've seen steady improvement in a number of areas. Look at his completion percentage. You look at the command. He's playing faster.


    "They've got to get better as a team around him. Another thing, so many of the throws have been to Percy Harvin or the tight end or the back. They need another receiver to step up. I think they have a little bit of an imbalance now.


    "It's not just Ponder. It's the offensive line. It's the receivers.

    "Understanding situational football -- that's an area I think he can be better. That takes a while to really be good.
    "I've studied him. I just think everything is rushed. Everything is in a hurry. When you see pressure, that's when your feet need to be more calm. You don't want to be busy. His feet are real busy vs. pressure.

    "When I've watched him, I thought the Vikings were doing him a little bit of a disservice not letting him stretch the field out. If they took some more shots deep down the field, I think that would ease some of the pressure. I think the field has really shrunk. They're throwing so much stuff underneath. Percy Harvin is a stud. When he gets the ball underneath, he's really good. I'd like to see them be able to get something over the top outside. That will eliminate all these bodies and all this clutter he has to deal with underneath. "When you have a running back going as good as Peterson is going right now, that's a perfect combination. You want to be able to run the ball, (use) play action and go over the top. There should be a payoff for having that running game. Right now, there has been no payoff for as well as they're running it.


    "The reins are going to be handed to Ponder. At some point, that is going to take place. It's going to be his team, and they'll allow him to do more. As young as he is and as well as Peterson is playing, I just think that's the formula that works right now. I don't think I'd do it any differently than they're doing it.

    "Ponder is probably right about where I thought he'd be. Maybe even a little bit exceeding where I thought he'd be. He's always been very, very talented. He has all the tools you'd want. I think it's a matter of him putting it all together ... it's a matter of time. He's got all the ingredients. I do think he can be a franchise quarterback. He's not there right now, though.

    "The biggest thing is, just slow him down. Sometimes, with young quarterbacks, you're going to have fast feet and a fast mind. Once both those slow down, then you're going to have a really good player. I think right now he's thinking a little bit too much. His mind is racing, and his feet are flowing, too. Once that comes together, I think, he'll be fine.
    "I would just say to him, 'Don't be in such a hurry. At the end of the day, you're going to have a check down available to you. You don't need to be in a rush to get to it. Give the rest of your play a chance to develop.' Another thing I'd tell him is, 'You've got all this energy. If you want to use that energy and take off and run with the football, that's not a bad thing, either.' He can help with his legs, as well.
    "I think you're going to see progress as the season rolls along. It's not going to be dramatic. I think the most important thing is him getting back to what he was doing at the beginning of the year in terms of protecting the football. If he just protects the football, they're going to win a lot of games and have a chance to be a playoff team."

    Vikings' Christian Ponder can be fixed: The 70% Solution - TwinCities.com

    Not sure about you but thats alot more credible than the guy you stuckup there.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  5. #105
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    43,909
    Quote Originally Posted by singersp View Post
    It's not about money & it's not that we are just seeing a bunch of anomalies at the QB level.

    Not so many years ago, you had to groom QB's a lot more than you do now. Back then college teams pounded the ball a lot more & passed less than they do now.

    Now that college football is becoming more of a passing league & play a more NFL style type of football, the college QB's are being groomed & prepared more, by better QB coaches at the college level. Thus, when they step onto an NFL field they are better prepared for the NFL than their predecessors were & a lot more is expected out of them. Especially those QB's taken in the first round. I.E. Ponder
    Expected to what by whom?

    Look, the Vikings new they were going to take a QB high. My guess is they really wanted Locker (glad that didn't work out) and when he went higher than anticipated, and the Deadskins moving down just a bit to take Ponder, they had to take one there (even though they tried to move down just ahead of the deadskins).

    That doesn't mean they thought they would have to play him. They just knew that all of these kids were going to go high.

    They had every intent on letting Dnabb run this team for at least one year, possibly two, regardless of who they got and were they got him.

    Problem for all of us, including young Ponder is that Dnabb really did stink. It wasn't just a fluke.

    No team has to run a QB out there if they take one high anymore. The only people who think that way are the fans who haven't kept up with the change in "How much they cost".
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  6. #106
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    43,909
    Quote Originally Posted by Purple Floyd View Post
    Yeah, I can see your point but in the end what it boils down to is when the rubber meets the road and the ground game isn't working, can the QB under center step up and throw for the yards necessary ( insert whatever number you want here) to win the game .


    With the talent we have and brought in the past year we should be able to throw at will against pretty much anyone and for sure we should be able to get over the century mark in passing and if that isn't necessary then I would have to ask why we would go after one of the blue chip WR's in FA and burn picks to go up in the first and get another one because the guys we had are certainly capable of combining for 65-70 yards a game if that is all you want to put up.
    I think the answer is yes. Even though he had a 4 or 5 game stretch in the middle, he sure looked good doing it at the beginning and at the end of the season, unless of course you are someone who can't validate that statement because he did it but didn't put up huge yards when doing it.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  7. #107
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    43,909
    [QUOTE=Reignman;1141261]What if we lost AD for the season? /QUOTE]
    The offensive focus would shift back to what it was the first 8 weeks of last season. Lets not forget that Ponder had 6 games with over 200+ passing and one that was 2 yards shy during that timeframe and almost everyone was getting on the Ponder bandwagon.

    Or did you forget about that?
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  8. #108
    mountainviking's Avatar
    mountainviking is offline Team Alumni
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    2,835
    If ya'all care to remember ye ole Duh'knee Green offense, yeah sure, we put up tons of points, set the record even. But did we win a championship!? No. We couldn't stop anybody ever because whether that deep ball was caught for a 70 yard TD or dropped incomplete, either way it was only about 10 seconds off of the clock, and our defense was back out there, playing the whole freaking game, and tho they would start well, they would always let up some chunks of scoring late in the half and late in the game when they'd used up all the gas they could muster.

    That is where the dinky-dunky is better. It is an extension of the running game in many ways, because of the time that runs off the clock while the defense swarms to the receiver and that WR churns out some YAC. But, it can not be the only thing, or we get what Daniel Jeremiah talks about, the "shrinking of the field," and the loss of our "payoff for having a great RB who commands so much attention at the LOS."

    "When I've watched him, I thought the Vikings were doing him a little bit of a disservice not letting him stretch the field out. If they took some more shots deep down the field, I think that would ease some of the pressure. I think the field has really shrunk. They're throwing so much stuff underneath. Percy Harvin is a stud. When he gets the ball underneath, he's really good. I'd like to see them be able to get something over the top outside. That will eliminate all these bodies and all this clutter he has to deal with underneath.

    "When you have a running back going as good as Peterson is going right now, that's a perfect combination. You want to be able to run the ball, (use) play action and go over the top. There should be a payoff for having that running game. Right now, there has been no payoff for as well as they're running it.
    I'm not saying chuck it deep all the time by any means, just that we need to start connecting on some deeper passes because it will open up what we want to do underneath with Peterson and Rudolf.

    This may be more of a concern:

    Dilfer also suggested that Ponder will continue to have a high injury rate because of the way his shoulders are built and because his arm action puts pressure on his elbow.
    Ummm, just how did that elbow get injured last year!?
    Control the line, control the time, and give your D a chance to shine!!

    "Balance it on end and thats the third side of the coin!!" -wookiefoot

  9. #109
    Marrdro's Avatar
    Marrdro is offline Beware My Spreadsheet, Bitches!
    Join Date
    Dec 1969
    Posts
    43,909
    Quote Originally Posted by mountainviking View Post
    If ya'all care to remember ye ole Duh'knee Green offense, yeah sure, we put up tons of points, set the record even. But did we win a championship!? No. We couldn't stop anybody ever because whether that deep ball was caught for a 70 yard TD or dropped incomplete, either way it was only about 10 seconds off of the clock, and our defense was back out there, playing the whole freaking game, and tho they would start well, they would always let up some chunks of scoring late in the half and late in the game when they'd used up all the gas they could muster.

    That is where the dinky-dunky is better. It is an extension of the running game in many ways, because of the time that runs off the clock while the defense swarms to the receiver and that WR churns out some YAC. But, it can not be the only thing, or we get what Daniel Jeremiah talks about, the "shrinking of the field," and the loss of our "payoff for having a great RB who commands so much attention at the LOS."



    I'm not saying chuck it deep all the time by any means, just that we need to start connecting on some deeper passes because it will open up what we want to do underneath with Peterson and Rudolf.

    This may be more of a concern:



    Ummm, just how did that elbow get injured last year!?
    The deep balls come in this offense. They just aren't as prevalent as the Coryell variant. Something to remember, back in the day, Walsh ran the Coryell variant exclusively until he was stuck (due to injury to his starter) with a weak armed QB.

    Enter the offensive scheme that has won a hell of alot more SB's that the Coryell variant.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  10. #110
    C Mac D's Avatar
    C Mac D is offline Posting to P'own
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Brooklyn, NY
    Posts
    13,468
    Dilfer also suggested that Ponder will continue to have a high injury rate because of the way his shoulders are built and because his arm action puts pressure on his elbow.
    Dilfer is a moron.

    The only Super Bowl winning QB to EVER start as a backup for a different team the following year.
    Disclaimer: I'm an idiot.

Page 11 of 19 FirstFirst ... 910111213 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •