Thread: A Look At Ponder’s First 17 Starts

Originally Posted by singersp

I know they took a couple in the draft. They didn't draft Childs until their 6th pick though, which was in the 4th round, and he was a big drop off from the cream of the crop WR's much further up the chain. He was the 21st WR taken in the draft. He had the height, not sure of the speed, but the big knock on him was his inconsistency & that he was "gun shy" running routes in 2011 because of his 2010 torn Patella injury. Makes you wonder how afraid to run routes he's going to be next year after this years injuries.

Wright was drafted 2 picks earlier, but at 5'10" wasn't going to be the deep threat, go up & get the ball type WR we needed. If height didn't matter, we'd be sending Harvin deep.

I understand that and it was my opinion that spending that high of a pick on a LT when we needed skill players was not the way to go, but popular rube opinion was that kalil was going to make the OL so good and give ponder so much time in the pocket that we didn't need great WR's to make the offense work.

Now, I would have rather traded back even farther in the first, git more picks and taken one of the second tier LT's and a WR like Stephen Burton or Floyd. But that is in the past. The fact once they decided to go the way they did, it was a terrible choice to not at least bring in some of the FA talent that was on the market. But now we are left sleeping in the bed that we made and to be honest, even if we had taken a WR higher in the draft than we did, there is no guarantee that the coaching staff would be good enough to train them to excel at the NFL level anyway.

Originally Posted by Purple Floyd

To be fair they drafted the dynamic Duo in the draft and it is hard to know how different things might be if Batman (Childs) didn't blow out his kneecaps in training camp and Robin didn't end up a total bust without him.

That aside I am not convinced jerry Rice in his prime would fix the problems ponder is having. He is apparently a smart guy but he is not showing it on the field. He is not recognizing coverages, he is not exploiting the stacked fronts and he is making very bad mental errors with where he is putting or trying to put the ball under pressure.

I will concede that much of it can be directed back at the coaches not preparing the team and having them know what to do against certain looks, but it is appearing that Ponder may not have it in him even in that case.

My greatest concern with Ponder so far is how he reacts to pressure. When he has time to throw he does well, but when pressured he turns into Christian Flounder.
Hopefully he will learn to deal with pressure better as he gains experience, but so far his decision making under pressure is pathetic.

Originally Posted by Purple Floyd

To be fair they drafted the dynamic Duo in the draft and it is hard to know how different things might be if Batman (Childs) didn't blow out his kneecaps in training camp and Robin didn't end up a total bust without him.

That aside I am not convinced jerry Rice in his prime would fix the problems ponder is having. He is apparently a smart guy but he is not showing it on the field. He is not recognizing coverages, he is not exploiting the stacked fronts and he is making very bad mental errors with where he is putting or trying to put the ball under pressure.

I will concede that much of it can be directed back at the coaches not preparing the team and having them know what to do against certain looks, but it is appearing that Ponder may not have it in him even in that case.

He's had one off-season. I'm not expecting him to be Peyton Manning after 17 games and one off-season.

Originally Posted by singersp

Just to refresh you're memory, we were winning with Jackson in his second year. In fact, he was 8-2 in his first 10 starts that year, so to say it didn't happen with Jackson, is a false statement.

No it isn't. TJack might have been 8-2, but the team over all struggled in 2007. By this point in 2007 (week 8) we were 2-5. Now you and I both know that TJack only started two of those losses, but the fact still remains that team was losing and there was a lot of general negativity. The fact that TJack was playing very inconstantly didn't help his case.

Originally Posted by singersp

Trust me, there is enough ammunition for people to bitch & moan about and they may come out, but don't confuse legitimate concerns with bitching & moaning. I expect there will be a fair share of Ponder apologists as well.

Did I call it or what? Yes there are legitimate concerns, but I think we have passed all forms of legitimacy in the post game discussion thread. I'm not even bothering to follow that thread anymore, the BS is getting too thick for me.

Originally Posted by singersp

No matter how many upcoming losses we will have, my stance will still be to keep Ponder in there the rest of the season to see how he pans out & take it from there afterwards. It would be fool-hardy to knee-jerk & bench him mid-season & play the QB carousel game again for the next 3 years before making a decision. We've been there, done that & it only drags things out.

Agreed. And I am right there with you (just like I was in 2007 with TJack).

Originally Posted by singersp

I still believe Spielman, Frazier & Musgrave need to do something to get Ponder into a better position to succeed, which will help build confidence. There's got to be some happy medium between the 5 yard dumps & deep sideline passes & a better mixture of the 3. Doing the same thing over & over again expecting better results isn't working.

Probably the best thing I have seen written here for a while by anybody. It bears repeating:

Originally Posted by singersp

[b]I still believe Spielman, Frazier & Musgrave need to do something to get Ponder into a better position to succeed, which will help build confidence. There's got to be some happy medium between the 5 yard dumps & deep sideline passes & a better mixture of the 3. Doing the same thing over & over again expecting better results isn't working.[b]

Amen.

Originally Posted by singersp

They need to get the TE's involved more, especially K-Rud. I don't know if there's any WR worth a shit unemployed at the moment, but perhaps there's someone that's an improvement over what we have. Perhaps give Jarius Wright a shot. I'm sure they miss having a great blocking TE like Jimmy K. to help protect Ponder & they need a coach who can actually teach AD to pick up blitzes & pass block better.

Simpson is worthless as a deep threat, and we don't have anyone else who is capable of getting open deep. I don't know of anybody on the market who is worth a look, so I suspect we will be drafting a WR in the upcoming draft.

Originally Posted by NodakPaul

I don't know of anybody on the market who is worth a look, so I suspect we will be drafting a WR in the upcoming draft.

Follow Dwayne Bowe and bring your own pot of gold.

Very pricey and not sure he would consider MN an upgrade to his current team, but undoubtedly would be a huge upgrade to our WR corps.

Originally Posted by Purple Floyd

I understand that and it was my opinion that spending that high of a pick on a LT when we needed skill players was not the way to go, but popular rube opinion was that kalil was going to make the OL so good and give ponder so much time in the pocket that we didn't need great WR's to make the offense work.

Now, I would have rather traded back even farther in the first, git more picks and taken one of the second tier LT's and a WR like Stephen Burton or Floyd. But that is in the past. The fact once they decided to go the way they did, it was a terrible choice to not at least bring in some of the FA talent that was on the market. But now we are left sleeping in the bed that we made and to be honest, even if we had taken a WR higher in the draft than we did, there is no guarantee that the coaching staff would be good enough to train them to excel at the NFL level anyway.

I think popular rube opinion was that Kalil was too good to pass up when we had a glaring need at the position. I don't think anyone thought he could solve all the problems of a 3-13 team. So far he has done exactly what most fans hoped for, locked down the left tackle position.

Originally Posted by jmcdon00

I think popular rube opinion was that Kalil was too good to pass up when we had a glaring need at the position. I don't think anyone thought he could solve all the problems of a 3-13 team. So far he has done exactly what most fans hoped for, locked down the left tackle position.

That isn't exactly the way it went. I heard everything right up the someone actually saying that he would even make the defense better.

At any rate he wasn't too good to pass up. He is a great player, don't get me wrong, but he didn't fix the problems with the offense and as time goes by he will take away from what we can do with skill players after his contract comes up and he wants skill player money.Of course the way the FO is doing things we still may not be looking for any skill players to use that money for anyway.

Originally Posted by Purple Floyd

That isn't exactly the way it went. I heard everything right up the someone actually saying that he would even make the defense better.

At any rate he wasn't too good to pass up. He is a great player, don't get me wrong, but he didn't fix the problems with the offense and as time goes by he will take away from what we can do with skill players after his contract comes up and he wants skill player money.Of course the way the FO is doing things we still may not be looking for any skill players to use that money for anyway.

Didn't you want the Vikings to draft Blackmon or was it Claiborne?

Or according to a post above we should have traded down far enough to draft Burton or Floyd and then draft a second tier LT?

Thank god you don't control the Vikings draft.

Originally Posted by PackSux!

Originally Posted by Purple Floyd

That isn't exactly the way it went. I heard everything right up the someone actually saying that he would even make the defense better.

At any rate he wasn't too good to pass up. He is a great player, don't get me wrong, but he didn't fix the problems with the offense and as time goes by he will take away from what we can do with skill players after his contract comes up and he wants skill player money.Of course the way the FO is doing things we still may not be looking for any skill players to use that money for anyway.

Didn't you want the Vikings to draft Blackmon or was it Claiborne?

Or according to a post above we should have traded down far enough to draft Burton or Floyd and then draft a second tier LT?

Thank god you don't control the Vikings draft.

Not Blackmon . I was and still would be in favor of trading back over drafting a LT that high. You may differ and that is fine, like a holes everyone has an opinion.

Originally Posted by Purple Floyd

Not Blackmon . I was and still would be in favor of trading back over drafting a LT that high. You may differ and that is fine, like a holes everyone has an opinion.

Even in hindsight? Kalil is one of the top LTs in the league through the first half of the season. We drafted two players who are playing at a probowl level in the first round. What more could you want? If one could pick literally any two players after pick 2 of the 1st round, Kalil would for sure be one of the two and I certainly wouldn't call anyone crazy for taking the best safety in the draft as well.