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  1. #11
    BloodyHorns82's Avatar
    BloodyHorns82 is offline Jersey Retired Feed The Frog Champion
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    Re:La Vikings Could you still be a Fan?

    Caine wrote:
    BloodyHorns82 wrote:
    Caine wrote:
    Purple Blood wrote:
    I was discussing with the Wife How much I think rides on this season and the rumored possibilty of the Vikings moving to La. I live in Ca now but was Born and raised On Da Range! She said well that would work out well for you, they would be closer and you could get season tickets and fly down for the Home Games.

    I told her with a profanity laced explanation that, that would never happen.

    Just curious on your thought? Could you still be a Vikings Fan? I went through this in 92 with the North Stars , I was living just North of Dallas back then and I have never liked the Stars since. I'm Now a Huge Sharks Fan.
    Said it before, I'll say it again. The day the Vikings organization leaves Minnesota is the day I cease being a fan of the Vikings. I will find another (Non-NFCN) team to cheer for, and happily buy up THEIR merchandise, haunt THEIR websites, and criticize THEIR coaches and players. But the Vikings will earn only hatred from that day forward.

    Truth is, Wilf could build the stadium with his own money - and the other truth is that the tax payers NEVER get back the value of the money they put into stadium deals. So if he elects to leavae he does so because HE chose to do so, not because he HAD to.

    Caine
    That is false.

    Second part is probably true though.

    That new Twins stadium sure is a hit. Too bad it wasn't funded entirely by the owner. Evil politicians spent tax payer dollars on a stadium! *gasp!
    Before you start throwing stones, have you EVER bothered to actually LOOK a the financing of Stadiums, and how it actually works out for the communities who do so?

    Fact of the matter is, the communities take out huge loans, push them waaaaaay back, then hope like hell inflation catches up so it doesn't hurt quite so much.

    Here's an interesting article about the Marlin's stadium in Miami: http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=jp-marlinsfinancials082410

    Go ahead and tell me how BS that one is...

    Truth is, Wilf and his owners group put up quite a large amount for the franchise...it stands to reason that they could obtain financing on their own, or at the very least, put up the major portion of the costs.

    But they don't. They, like every franchise before them, pushes it off on the public. And, sadly, the public never actually sees a return on their investment.

    Here's an article about THAT: http://www.newswise.com/articles/view/?id=35549

    and another: http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/25167

    and another: http://www.dailyrepublican.com/stadium-understated-cost.html

    and another: http://www.examiner.com/padres-in-san-diego/say-no-to-publicly-funded-stadiums

    and without even trying hard I can post link after link.

    Got anything to back up YOUR side?

    Caine
    Before you get your undies in a bunch I think you should reread my post. I agreed with the part about it not being a sound investment for tax payers.

    The only thing I argued was that you said Wilf could finance it himself...I said that was false because we don't know the truth. Reread my post. Thanks.

    LMFAO - and what exactly is MY side? Jeezus.

  2. #12
    Caine's Avatar
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    Re:La Vikings Could you still be a Fan?

    BloodyHorns82 wrote:
    vikinggreg wrote:
    BloodyHorns82 wrote:
    jmcdon00 wrote:
    We really don't know if Wilf could do it on his own or not.
    No we don't know. His net worth is estimated at 1.3 billion. A new stadium runs about 1 billion. Not looking promising for a self financed stadium, but again we really don't know the truth or all the details. For a scrub like you or I to stand back and declare one way or the other as fact is ridiculous.
    Wilf isn't the only owner of the Vikings and its hard to say what he would do if some of his partners chose to bailout on the venture if he would buy them out or just sell his portion of the team......to an interested party in LA
    That brings up another good point.

    Wilf partnered up with a group of people and ponied up a 600 million dollar investment on an NFL team. Some people think that this same group can double down on their investment now and throw another 1.2 Billion at it? That's not chump change for anybody. It's not like this 1.2B investment is going to increase their annual profits by 66 percent.
    If that's true, what makes you think that the investment will somehow pay off for the tax payers?

    Caine

  3. #13
    BloodyHorns82's Avatar
    BloodyHorns82 is offline Jersey Retired Feed The Frog Champion
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    Re:La Vikings Could you still be a Fan?

    Caine wrote:
    BloodyHorns82 wrote:
    vikinggreg wrote:
    BloodyHorns82 wrote:
    jmcdon00 wrote:
    We really don't know if Wilf could do it on his own or not.
    No we don't know. His net worth is estimated at 1.3 billion. A new stadium runs about 1 billion. Not looking promising for a self financed stadium, but again we really don't know the truth or all the details. For a scrub like you or I to stand back and declare one way or the other as fact is ridiculous.
    Wilf isn't the only owner of the Vikings and its hard to say what he would do if some of his partners chose to bailout on the venture if he would buy them out or just sell his portion of the team......to an interested party in LA
    That brings up another good point.

    Wilf partnered up with a group of people and ponied up a 600 million dollar investment on an NFL team. Some people think that this same group can double down on their investment now and throw another 1.2 Billion at it? That's not chump change for anybody. It's not like this 1.2B investment is going to increase their annual profits by 66 percent.
    If that's true, what makes you think that the investment will somehow pay off for the tax payers?

    Caine
    Caine...again, I did not say it was going to pay off for the tax payers. In fact I agreed with you that it probably doesn't generally pay off financially for the tax payers. Please take your time to read a post before you attack it. Thanks again.

  4. #14
    Erinnn is offline Starter
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    Re:La Vikings Could you still be a Fan?

    I don't even like thinking about them moving let alone discussing if I would continue to follow them or not.

    I was at the Vikings game in Tennessee when they officially unveiled the new Titans name and logo. I was next to some Oilers fans from TX who came to see the last game, it was very sad for them. I don't know if I could do it.

  5. #15
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    Re:La Vikings Could you still be a Fan?

    This topic makes me sick. Makes it seem like a horrible break up, how everyone will just move on. I don't really know anything about what happens when a team moves. If we keep all the same players, then yes, I will still have to cheer for them. Since I'm not from minnesota, I'm not as much tied to minnesota as I am the Vikings.
    I am NOT here to provide good football insight or rational observations. I am an emotional 19 year old Viking fan and I expect you to adjust your expectations from my posts.

  6. #16
    jmcdon00's Avatar
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    Re:La Vikings Could you still be a Fan?

    BloodyHorns82 wrote:
    vikinggreg wrote:
    BloodyHorns82 wrote:
    jmcdon00 wrote:
    We really don't know if Wilf could do it on his own or not.
    No we don't know. His net worth is estimated at 1.3 billion. A new stadium runs about 1 billion. Not looking promising for a self financed stadium, but again we really don't know the truth or all the details. For a scrub like you or I to stand back and declare one way or the other as fact is ridiculous.
    Wilf isn't the only owner of the Vikings and its hard to say what he would do if some of his partners chose to bailout on the venture if he would buy them out or just sell his portion of the team......to an interested party in LA
    That brings up another good point.

    Wilf partnered up with a group of people and ponied up a 600 million dollar investment on an NFL team. Some people think that this same group can double down on their investment now and throw another 1.2 Billion at it? That's not chump change for anybody. It's not like this 1.2B investment is going to increase their annual profits by 66 percent.
    Actually with a new collective bargaining agreement their profits could go up much more than 66%.
    Currently players recieve 60% of all revenue generated by the league(with a few exceptions for luxury boxes and such). Once the new collective bargaining deal is done that number could fall to about 40%.
    Say the vikes have 200million annual revenue. They pay 120million in salaries(60%), plus about another 60 million in stadium lease, operations, private jets, etc etc. So there profit end up about 20 million.
    Now if they pay the players less, about 80million(40% of revenue), there income stays the same but now instead of 180million in expenses they have 140 million in expenses. Now there profit is 60million, up 300% annually.

    Of course that doesn't change the argument that they could make more elsewhere, will leave without a publicly funded stadium.

  7. #17
    Caine's Avatar
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    Re:La Vikings Could you still be a Fan?

    BloodyHorns82 wrote:
    Caine wrote:
    BloodyHorns82 wrote:
    Caine wrote:
    Purple Blood wrote:
    I was discussing with the Wife How much I think rides on this season and the rumored possibilty of the Vikings moving to La. I live in Ca now but was Born and raised On Da Range! She said well that would work out well for you, they would be closer and you could get season tickets and fly down for the Home Games.

    I told her with a profanity laced explanation that, that would never happen.

    Just curious on your thought? Could you still be a Vikings Fan? I went through this in 92 with the North Stars , I was living just North of Dallas back then and I have never liked the Stars since. I'm Now a Huge Sharks Fan.
    Said it before, I'll say it again. The day the Vikings organization leaves Minnesota is the day I cease being a fan of the Vikings. I will find another (Non-NFCN) team to cheer for, and happily buy up THEIR merchandise, haunt THEIR websites, and criticize THEIR coaches and players. But the Vikings will earn only hatred from that day forward.

    Truth is, Wilf could build the stadium with his own money - and the other truth is that the tax payers NEVER get back the value of the money they put into stadium deals. So if he elects to leavae he does so because HE chose to do so, not because he HAD to.

    Caine
    That is false.

    Second part is probably true though.

    That new Twins stadium sure is a hit. Too bad it wasn't funded entirely by the owner. Evil politicians spent tax payer dollars on a stadium! *gasp!
    Before you start throwing stones, have you EVER bothered to actually LOOK a the financing of Stadiums, and how it actually works out for the communities who do so?

    Fact of the matter is, the communities take out huge loans, push them waaaaaay back, then hope like hell inflation catches up so it doesn't hurt quite so much.

    Here's an interesting article about the Marlin's stadium in Miami: http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=jp-marlinsfinancials082410

    Go ahead and tell me how BS that one is...

    Truth is, Wilf and his owners group put up quite a large amount for the franchise...it stands to reason that they could obtain financing on their own, or at the very least, put up the major portion of the costs.

    But they don't. They, like every franchise before them, pushes it off on the public. And, sadly, the public never actually sees a return on their investment.

    Here's an article about THAT: http://www.newswise.com/articles/view/?id=35549

    and another: http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/25167

    and another: http://www.dailyrepublican.com/stadium-understated-cost.html

    and another: http://www.examiner.com/padres-in-san-diego/say-no-to-publicly-funded-stadiums

    and without even trying hard I can post link after link.

    Got anything to back up YOUR side?

    Caine
    Before you get your undies in a bunch I think you should reread my post. I agreed with the part about it not being a sound investment for tax payers.

    The only thing I argued was that you said Wilf could finance it himself...I said that was false because we don't know the truth. Reread my post. Thanks.

    LMFAO - and what exactly is MY side? Jeezus.
    This was your side:

    That new Twins stadium sure is a hit. Too bad it wasn't funded entirely by the owner. Evil politicians spent tax payer dollars on a stadium! *gasp!

  8. #18
    midgensa's Avatar
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    Re:La Vikings Could you still be a Fan?

    I have often wondered this since I have no ties to Minnesota.

    I am a Vikings fan because the Cardinals left my home town and I had to pick a new team. But, I did not wait around and become a Rams fan. I latched on to the Purple and Gold.

    If the Vikings left Minnesota I think in all honesty I would be mostly done with football. I would watch. I would cheer for teams here and there, but my love an intensity for this game would be greatly diminished.

  9. #19
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    Re:La Vikings Could you still be a Fan?

    I've actually thought about this quite a bit as well. I just don't think it would feel right. Even though my mothers whole side of the family is from california and I don't have much ties to minnesota besides the anual travel down there to watch games. I just can't see myself rooting for anything in california or another nfl team. I would be lost.

  10. #20
    BloodyHorns82's Avatar
    BloodyHorns82 is offline Jersey Retired Feed The Frog Champion
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    Re:La Vikings Could you still be a Fan?

    Caine wrote:
    BloodyHorns82 wrote:
    Caine wrote:
    BloodyHorns82 wrote:
    Caine wrote:
    Purple Blood wrote:
    I was discussing with the Wife How much I think rides on this season and the rumored possibilty of the Vikings moving to La. I live in Ca now but was Born and raised On Da Range! She said well that would work out well for you, they would be closer and you could get season tickets and fly down for the Home Games.

    I told her with a profanity laced explanation that, that would never happen.

    Just curious on your thought? Could you still be a Vikings Fan? I went through this in 92 with the North Stars , I was living just North of Dallas back then and I have never liked the Stars since. I'm Now a Huge Sharks Fan.
    Said it before, I'll say it again. The day the Vikings organization leaves Minnesota is the day I cease being a fan of the Vikings. I will find another (Non-NFCN) team to cheer for, and happily buy up THEIR merchandise, haunt THEIR websites, and criticize THEIR coaches and players. But the Vikings will earn only hatred from that day forward.

    Truth is, Wilf could build the stadium with his own money - and the other truth is that the tax payers NEVER get back the value of the money they put into stadium deals. So if he elects to leavae he does so because HE chose to do so, not because he HAD to.

    Caine
    That is false.

    Second part is probably true though.

    That new Twins stadium sure is a hit. Too bad it wasn't funded entirely by the owner. Evil politicians spent tax payer dollars on a stadium! *gasp!
    Before you start throwing stones, have you EVER bothered to actually LOOK a the financing of Stadiums, and how it actually works out for the communities who do so?

    Fact of the matter is, the communities take out huge loans, push them waaaaaay back, then hope like hell inflation catches up so it doesn't hurt quite so much.

    Here's an interesting article about the Marlin's stadium in Miami: http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=jp-marlinsfinancials082410

    Go ahead and tell me how BS that one is...

    Truth is, Wilf and his owners group put up quite a large amount for the franchise...it stands to reason that they could obtain financing on their own, or at the very least, put up the major portion of the costs.

    But they don't. They, like every franchise before them, pushes it off on the public. And, sadly, the public never actually sees a return on their investment.

    Here's an article about THAT: http://www.newswise.com/articles/view/?id=35549

    and another: http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/25167

    and another: http://www.dailyrepublican.com/stadium-understated-cost.html

    and another: http://www.examiner.com/padres-in-san-diego/say-no-to-publicly-funded-stadiums

    and without even trying hard I can post link after link.

    Got anything to back up YOUR side?

    Caine
    Before you get your undies in a bunch I think you should reread my post. I agreed with the part about it not being a sound investment for tax payers.

    The only thing I argued was that you said Wilf could finance it himself...I said that was false because we don't know the truth. Reread my post. Thanks.

    LMFAO - and what exactly is MY side? Jeezus.
    This was your side:

    That new Twins stadium sure is a hit. Too bad it wasn't funded entirely by the owner. Evil politicians spent tax payer dollars on a stadium! *gasp!
    You said:

    and the other truth is that the tax payers NEVER get back the value of the money they put into stadium deals.
    I said:

    Second part is probably true though.
    (second part being your quote above of course)

    I stand by what I said about the new Twins stadium. It's been a huge hit and the community loves it. It may not be financially appealing or productive but either is buying a new car every three years...but people still do it because there is enjoyment value to be had.

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