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  1. #1
    singersp's Avatar
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    Kevin Williams laying it all on the line in contract year

    Kevin Williams laying it all on the line in contract year

    Vikings' Kevin Williams laying it all on the line in contract year - TwinCities.com

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  2. #2
    singersp's Avatar
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    But Minnesota's longest-tenured player isn't so sure he'll get to grow old with a young, rebuilding team.
    Unless he will play under a new contract worth virtually nothing next year, I doubt Spielman will keep him around. He will find some young player off another teams practice squad or an unwanted FA who will.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  3. #3
    Marrdro's Avatar
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    Kevin Williams Stats - Minnesota Vikings - ESPN

    Stats say it all. They should trade him this year while they can.
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  4. #4
    Mr Anderson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marrdro View Post
    Kevin Williams Stats - Minnesota Vikings - ESPN

    Stats say it all. They should trade him this year while they can.
    Really? Haven't you been "harping about [how the Vikings need a nose tackle who can demand the double team] for about 3 years now?"

    Williams had a 500% increase in sack production from 2010 to 2011, while against the trend of the past five years, or so, his numbers are on the rise.

    I believe Williams' set the bar extremely high for himself in his rookie and sophomore seasons, what led to those inflated numbers is unclear. It could be the production on the back end of the defense. Brian Russel and Corey Chavous created a lot of turnovers, Brian Williams was very productive as well, but I can't remember much else.

    I think the high bar he set gave everyone unrealistic expectations for his production. Since 2004 he hasn't put up more than 8 sacks in a season(which is still an incredible number for a defensive tackle) a 5-6 sack season for him is good, he produces elsewhere e.g. passes defended, disruptive against the run, can create a 1 on 1 for Allen.

    He may be past his prime, but that's unclear. Regardless, Kevin Williams is one of the best defensive linemen in football over the past decade. The team owes it to him to keep him around if this is where he wants to be.


    But like you, Marty, I'd love to see a nose-tackle type playing that 1 technique opposite of him.

  5. #5
    PackSux!'s Avatar
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    I would like him to stay in Minnesota to finish off his career. On the other hand I dont want to see us overpay to keep him here.

    I dont agree that the team owes him anything. If he wants to stay then he needs to agree to the contract we offer him, if we do offer him one. It works both ways.

  6. #6
    thorshammer is offline Asst. Coach
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    The dude is still a stud .... I think he will prove it this year .... He had a couple of injuries slow him down .... I remember how he came on the last five games and he looked like his old self.

  7. #7
    marshallvike's Avatar
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    He has always laid it all on the line.
    Why must you defend everything this FO does....to the point of making your self look like a yes man.

  8. #8
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    The fact that our 2 starting DEs got 30 sacks tells me he still attracts some attention...even without Phat Pat playing next to him. BUT, 8 mill/year does seem a bit expensive...I could definitely see him being a casualty of the youth movement next year. But, I'd hate to see him go with nothing at DT to speak of at the moment.
    Control the line, control the time, and give your D a chance to shine!!

    "Balance it on end and thats the third side of the coin!!" -wookiefoot

  9. #9
    Marrdro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Anderson View Post
    Really? Haven't you been "harping about [how the Vikings need a nose tackle who can demand the double team] for about 3 years now?"

    Williams had a 500% increase in sack production from 2010 to 2011, while against the trend of the past five years, or so, his numbers are on the rise.

    I believe Williams' set the bar extremely high for himself in his rookie and sophomore seasons, what led to those inflated numbers is unclear. It could be the production on the back end of the defense. Brian Russel and Corey Chavous created a lot of turnovers, Brian Williams was very productive as well, but I can't remember much else.

    I think the high bar he set gave everyone unrealistic expectations for his production. Since 2004 he hasn't put up more than 8 sacks in a season(which is still an incredible number for a defensive tackle) a 5-6 sack season for him is good, he produces elsewhere e.g. passes defended, disruptive against the run, can create a 1 on 1 for Allen.

    He may be past his prime, but that's unclear. Regardless, Kevin Williams is one of the best defensive linemen in football over the past decade. The team owes it to him to keep him around if this is where he wants to be.


    But like you, Marty, I'd love to see a nose-tackle type playing that 1 technique opposite of him.
    Thats what I've been harping for for the last 3 (actually 4) years now. Remember, I was getting down on Phat Pat a couple of years before they finally let him lose. I thought they should have drafted a cat to learn behind him like they did with K-dubb (Guion).

    Now they are going to force yet another 3 tech (Guion) into that spot and my guess is he won't succeed even though the kid has the talent to be a damn fine 3 tech.

    And my issue isn't about sack production. Its about stopping the run and collapsing the pocket which we have sucked at for about 2 years now and have declined in steadily for 4 years.

    As to what the team owes, they owe players nothing. This is a business. Just because you were good/great for 8 of the last 10 years, doesn't mean we need to keep you around for 2 more.

    What we should be watching this year (actually the past 2) is JA at RDE, K-Dubb at the 3 tech (Guion taking reps) a true 1 tech (who took rotations for Phat Pat) in at the base (coming out on 3rd and longs) with a Griff or a Rob dropping in there with a Griff or a Rob at LDE.

    Instead K-dubb will be worked to death because Guion will be starting next to him (out of position) and we won't have a DT/NT combination in there in when we are in our base because we have no one to rotate in except for a bunch of LDE's.

    Additionally, like last year, we will watch the defense fade in the second half of games because teams will exploit the middle, both in the run and by moving the QB up a few steps as our DE's are taken deep outside the pocket all because we have a shitty rotation and guys in the middle playing out of position.

    Back to K-dubb. As I said, stats say it all. Go and look at his compared to other DT's that play the 3 tech. 38 isn't even half of what those cats are getting.

    On a side note, you put to DT's in the middle of our defense that can collapse the pocket and JA and/or Rob will have at least 5-8 more sacks and we won't see RB's running freely up through the C gap as our DE's are taken wide and our DT's are lost in the shuffle in the middle.
    Last edited by Marrdro; 07-05-2012 at 07:50 AM.
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  10. #10
    Marrdro's Avatar
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    As a whole, the defensive tackle class is arguably the deepest in the draft, especially over the course of the first three rounds, and it will be interesting to see how much these teams covet an individual player over the sum of the group. Do you select Dontari Poe in the top 10 or do you think you can get better value in the second round with guys like Worthy or Still? Or will any of them even be available come the second round?
    Brian Billick breaks down the defensive tackles of the 2012 NFL Draft - NFL News | FOX Sports on MSN

    Not sure how much credence I put on a article about DT's done by Bilick, but it is about the same thing that was said about this class by most analysts.

    Deep at DT, nice value in the first 3 rounds, some to be had into the 5th and which one did we go after?

    Minnesota Vikings | 2012 Vikings Draft Picks

    None. Instead our plan is to put a 3 tech in at the 1 tech. I could almost buy into that if they would have at least picked up a guy to develop. Not sure Baker (6'1/292) quite fits the mold.

    Maybe Powell (6'3"/310) can add a few more pounds but by all accounts he plays way to high. Can our crack coaching staff coach that out of him? Maybe Phat Pat can teach him.....(oh wait, coaches coach and players play and he's not here anymore).
    Last edited by Marrdro; 07-05-2012 at 08:08 AM.
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