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  1. #21
    WildViking3030 is offline Training Camp
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    Re: Vikings Leaving Fate in Jackson’s Hands

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    You know, I really struggled with my support of TJ to begin with.

    I wanted Cutler and then when they didn't move up to get him I wanted Clemens.
    When that looked like it was gonna happen and then didn't I was very upset at the selection the staff made when they took TJ.

    I really felt like the staff was setting the team back by taking a young raw kid (even though he had loads of talent) even to sit on the bench and learn at that point.
    I just didn't see much life left in BJ and thought the kid would never be ready in time.

    Then when the staff let BJ go (or BJ said he didn't want to stay) I was really down on the whole QB issue/situation and thought the Chiller and the rest of the organization had lost thier mind.
    Even though a few QB's have suceeded, I just didn't think it was wise to throw him to the wolves and let him learn on the field.
    Probably for two primary reasons...

    1.

    We were gonna lose most of the time.
    2.

    He would/could be emotionally messed up from that kindof pressure.

    Low and behold, he started to win games and seemed to deal with the pressure pretty well.
    Because he has done nothing but work pretty gol 'darnit hard to get himself NFL ready and I don't see any negative impact from his reps he got under center/learning on the field I am now a huge fan of the kid.

    What does that all mean in the grand scheme of things?
    I am not sure, but I am pretty confident that he will be a better QB than he was last year (he was way better last year than I thought he was gonna be even though he had some pretty low moments) and the team around him is better.

    I am pretty sure he will have some really good games this year but I also believe he will have a couple that will cause us to cry in our beers this year as well.

    Long story short, highs and lows again this year but I really think we have the guy under center that will give us more highs than lows.

    Heres to a great year TJ and the rest of the 52 men that will don the Vikings uniform this year.

    Definitely with you on this.
    I think TJ will be fine, although anymore jump passes from the pocket are liable to give me a heart attack.

  2. #22
    VikingsTw is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Vikings Leaving Fate in Jackson’s Hands

    Yeah good post Marr. It didn't make the most sense at the time. I have always supported TJ and liked the athletic pic, though there was a time last year early on where I felt he wasn't gonna be able to succeed in this league. What reversed my thinking was his ability to shrug off the rookie mistakes and improve throughout the year.

    One thing that has always been present in the Childress era is a poor passing game, even Brad Johnson was horrible, he was seeing the end of his carear and was very weak armed and slow in the pocket. I was SCREAMING to see what Tarvaris had. All in all Tarvaris has looked best at QB then anybody in the Childress era, I think he will continue to improve with his new teamates helping him along the way.

  3. #23
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    Re: Vikings Leaving Fate in Jackson’s Hands

    I hope he improves..
    have a bet oing that he will have a better Qb rating that Jason Campbell this year
    :'( :'( :'(

  4. #24
    VikingsTw is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Vikings Leaving Fate in Jackson’s Hands

    "kevoncox" wrote:
    I hope he improves..
    have a bet oing that he will have a better Qb rating that Jason Campbell this year
    :'( :'( :'(
    If the offensive line can provide good protection for him and let him get in a comfort zone he will probably exeed expectations. So much depends on the guys up front, our pass blocking needs to be shored up, guys like McKinnie, Cook, and Birk really need to play well. AP needs to become a better all-around back.

    Hopefully with the addition of Berrian and keeping Rice on the field those guys can create more in the passing game and we can become a much better all-around offense. This would take much needed pressure off the offesive line, when we became so preidictable last year the defense had a big advantage and the O-Line was asked to block very heavy fronts wether we were running or passing.

    Good balance will bring about easier jobs for every unit, no one unit doing to much or picking up the slack for the other.

    I've been criticle of Matt Birk but I do realize his job was tuff last year, even he should have a better season.

  5. #25
    Purple Floyd's Avatar
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    Re: Vikings Leaving Fate in Jackson’s Hands

    "VikingsTw" wrote:
    "kevoncox" wrote:
    I hope he improves..
    have a bet oing that he will have a better Qb rating that Jason Campbell this year
    :'( :'( :'(
    If the offensive line can provide good protection for him and let him get in a comfort zone he will probably exeed expectations. So much depends on the guys up front, our pass blocking needs to be shored up, guys like McKinnie, Cook, and Birk really need to play well. AP needs to become a better all-around back.

    Hopefully with the addition of Berrian and keeping Rice on the field those guys can create more in the passing game and we can become a much better all-around offense. This would take much needed pressure off the offesive line, when we became so preidictable last year the defense had a big advantage and the O-Line was asked to block very heavy fronts wether we were running or passing.

    Good balance will bring about easier jobs for every unit, no one unit doing to much or picking up the slack for the other.

    I've been criticle of Matt Birk but I do realize his job was tuff last year, even he should have a better season.
    Of course TJ will exceed expectations if the line becomes solid. That has been our problem for the past 2 years. Hell, if the line was providing adequate protection on pass plays Brad Johnson would have remained the starter and we would have been in the playoffs the past 2 years while jackson developed his skills.

  6. #26
    VikingsTw is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Vikings Leaving Fate in Jackson’s Hands

    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    "VikingsTw" wrote:
    "kevoncox" wrote:
    I hope he improves..
    have a bet oing that he will have a better Qb rating that Jason Campbell this year
    :'( :'( :'(
    If the offensive line can provide good protection for him and let him get in a comfort zone he will probably exeed expectations. So much depends on the guys up front, our pass blocking needs to be shored up, guys like McKinnie, Cook, and Birk really need to play well. AP needs to become a better all-around back.

    Hopefully with the addition of Berrian and keeping Rice on the field those guys can create more in the passing game and we can become a much better all-around offense. This would take much needed pressure off the offesive line, when we became so preidictable last year the defense had a big advantage and the O-Line was asked to block very heavy fronts wether we were running or passing.

    Good balance will bring about easier jobs for every unit, no one unit doing to much or picking up the slack for the other.

    I've been criticle of Matt Birk but I do realize his job was tuff last year, even he should have a better season.
    Of course TJ will exceed expectations if the line becomes solid. That has been our problem for the past 2 years. Hell, if the line was providing adequate protection on pass plays Brad Johnson would have remained the starter and we would have been in the playoffs the past 2 years while jackson developed his skills.
    Maybe, we havn't had alot of play making ability at the WR position untill now. Brad Johnson's arm was very weak, the defense knew this and played around the line of scrimage. Better protection would have been nice but it doesn't take long for a WR to outrun Brad Johnson's arm. Johnson was accurate on short passes but dropped passes by WR's was just as big of an issue as they have been.

  7. #27
    Frostbite is offline Coach
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    Re: Vikings Leaving Fate in Jackson’s Hands

    Leaving the fate in any one players hands seems defeatest and non-unified to me: Assessing T-Jack for 08 must take into account the following areas.

    1. What has he brought in to 08 through his own dedication to be better? We really won't know that answer until we see his conditioning in camp and his play.

    2. Has he learned from past mistakes? Again...we can only hope so....but it seems logical to me that he's smart enough to remember what works, why it works, and to stay away from areas that don't.

    3. How much support will he have from the players? Will they rally around him and has he matured enough to be seen as a leader? An inmportant quality in any starting NFL QB that expects to have success.

    4. Will the coaching staff open things up for him (When Necessary) and allow him to try to use more of his athletic ability as needed? The play book seemed to closed last season, with an almost un-willingness/reluctance to explore more potential for the young QB.

    5. Durability. Can T-Jack stay healthy for the entire season? He's taken some licks and had some issues with this in the past. Did he trane hard and work on hardening up as much as possible in the off-season? Again...only time will tell.

    As with every season there will be a few plays (Do or Die) that will make or break a game, that will fall directly on the shoulders (Peformance) of the QB. We saw this happen last season and you can bet 08 will have that scenario as well. These will be the defining moments of T-Jacks 08 season. Silly errors, poor judgement, lack of execution, and mistakes in key situations will be lurking to trip him and the team up throughout 08. To me...this is the defining season for T-Jack and for the franchise to come to terms with each other. A lot is riding on T-Jack to show he's ready to lead this squad to a Championship. Owner, Coaches, Players, and Fans will be watching very closely.

    A team effort with T-Jack showing he's matured in all of the above mentioned areas most likely gets a Championship run. Excited!!! You bet I am. Hope you are too!


    Here's looking forward to the 08 Regular Season. Cheers!
    Where is Frostbite Falls Minnesota?

  8. #28
    StillPurple is offline Hall of Famer
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    Re: Vikings Leaving Fate in Jackson’s Hands

    Ok, here is just my little list of attributes an NFL QB has to have, and to what degree I think Tarvaris has that attribute or not, and if he can develop it:

    a. Accuracy: not really. I don't like his accuracy at all. Can he develop it ? Who knows.

    b. Leadership: yes, he seems to have this.

    c. Toughness: yes, he seems to be tough enough.

    d. Arm strength: yes. He has a strong arm

    e. Mechanics: bad mechanics. He doesn't get "set up" fast, in my opinion, and his throwing motion is "a-typical" for an NFL passer. Can he develop this ? Who knows...

    f. Ability to read a defense: to be honest, I don't see that.

    g. Decision-making on the field: at times, it is there. At times, not.

    h. Poise: he panics too much. I think this will improve. I am hoping that T-Jacks, IF he is the starter this year, relaxes enough to let his abilities come out. He flees the pocket WAY too early. He needs to learn to hang in long enough for his receivers to actually release from coverage, otherwise, he is basically a running back [i.e. he will flee the pocket and get hit a lot downfield]...

    To be honest (and I always am on this site
    ;D), I think it is a tall order for a QB to develop: mechanics, accuracy, ability to read a defense, and poise, all at the same time. On the other hand, if you get one or two of those, the others might follow. In other words, if he chills out and stops panicking, his accuracy might improve. And if that happens, he might be able to be more relaxed and have better mechanics. Time will only tell, but I think it is a tall order for a young QB.

  9. #29
    seaniemck7's Avatar
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    Re: Vikings Leaving Fate in Jackson’s Hands

    "StillPurple" wrote:
    Ok, here is just my little list of attributes an NFL QB has to have, and to what degree I think Tarvaris has that attribute or not, and if he can develop it:

    a. Accuracy: not really. I don't like his accuracy at all. Can he develop it ? Who knows.

    b. Leadership: yes, he seems to have this.

    c. Toughness: yes, he seems to be tough enough.

    d. Arm strength: yes. He has a strong arm

    e. Mechanics: bad mechanics. He doesn't get "set up" fast, in my opinion, and his throwing motion is "a-typical" for an NFL passer. Can he develop this ? Who knows...

    f. Ability to read a defense: to be honest, I don't see that.

    g. Decision-making on the field: at times, it is there. At times, not.

    h. Poise: he panics too much. I think this will improve. I am hoping that T-Jacks, IF he is the starter this year, relaxes enough to let his abilities come out. He flees the pocket WAY too early. He needs to learn to hang in long enough for his receivers to actually release from coverage, otherwise, he is basically a running back [i.e. he will flee the pocket and get hit a lot downfield]...

    To be honest (and I always am on this site
    ;D), I think it is a tall order for a QB to develop: mechanics, accuracy, ability to read a defense, and poise, all at the same time. On the other hand, if you get one or two of those, the others might follow. In other words, if he chills out and stops panicking, his accuracy might improve. And if that happens, he might be able to be more relaxed and have better mechanics. Time will only tell, but I think it is a tall order for a young QB.
    Allow me to retort...

    a. Accuracy: I am not sure what you mean when you say you don't like his accuracy at all.
    How are you assessing his accuracy, because he had a 58.2 completetion percentage?
    You frequently comment on TJ's "bad" accuracy like its something you have or not.
    Its actually a sliding scale with many factors, including someone actually catching a ball.
    Peyton Manning has a carreer completion percentage of 64.2.
    Do you realize that if TJ completes just 18 more passes last year (adding to his 171 completions out of 294 attempts), which equates to exactly 1.5 completions per game, he would have had a 64.2% completion rate?
    With better line play and receivers, I think he could easily have completed 1 or 2 more of his passes per game last year.
    So, yeah, I think he can develop his accuracy better
    :

    b. Leadership:
    Agree.
    I think he leads by example and his work ethic.

    c. Toughness:
    Agree, but needs improvement. He is tough, but sometimes being tougher means being smarter.
    Favre and Manning didn't post record setting starting streaks because they were taking on LBs and Safeties down the field.

    d. Arm Strength.
    Areed.
    Cannon, but needs to develop touch on the ball as well.

    e. Mechanics.
    I think you are off somewhat in your assesment of TJs mechanics.
    I posted this in another thread http://www.purplepride.org/forums/index.php?topic=45135.msg782205;topicseen

    But here is the sumation: TJ's Throwing mechanics are good, actually very good.
    He has a tight, fairly quick release that comes over the top from ear. Its actally ideal for the NFL. Where he needs to improve his mechanics is his footwork.
    Better drop mechanics and footwork, along with his comfortability in the offense and with the speed of the game will guess what.... improve his Accuracy
    ;D ;D ;D

    f. Ability to read a defense.
    This remains to be seen.
    I wouldn't call him a pinball wizard or anything yet, but his dedication to film study can help develop this.
    I don't think many, if any, young QBs know how to read NFL defenses at first, if nothing more because they have not seen them.
    Besides, right now, we don't need him to be Manning or Brady.
    We need him to beat 8/9 in the box.
    Those D's I believe he can read.


    g. Decision-making.
    I believe he has improved.
    Every QB makes poor decisions at times.
    The key is to learn from them.
    Over the last half of the year, TJ improved his QB rating by a lot.
    That to me means he was making better decisions with the football. Still needs to improve though.

    h. Poise.
    I pretty much agree with you there.
    But again, comfortability with the offense, speed of the game, confidence in knowing where he should or should not be going with the football will help his presence in the pocket.



    Now keep in mind, TJ was learning on the job last year and will continue to do so.
    TJ may be working on all these at the same time, but so is every young QB in the league.
    You can count on one hand the the Qbs in the league that would get A grades in all of those categories.


  10. #30
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    Re: Vikings Leaving Fate in Jackson’s Hands

    fantastic physical tools, but no smarts..thats tarvaris right now, and we dont have any chance of winning anything if he cant learn to process the game mentally
    People who see life as anything more than pure entertainment are missing the point.

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