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  1. #11
    drewlovs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Anderson View Post
    Anyone who defends this guy better not have even thought about criticizing Kluwe.
    I defend BOTH for their ability to say what they feel without the threat of being personally destroyed by their opinions. We live in America still, right? How is it that we see this crap every day, where if even ONE of your opinions falls outside of what the mainstream thoughts of the day are, your life needs to be destroyed??

    There were people after Pearl Harbor who were SURE FDR was behind the whole thing to suck us into WWII. There were people who had this weird idea that African Americans should be allowed to eat anywhere they wanted to if they followed the rules and paid for the service. BOTH these ideas were outside the mainstream, in their day.

    Do I think Sandy Hook was a false flag? HELL NO. I think it was politicized to the extreme, but that is something different in its entirety. Something tells me this young man will be embarrassed about these comment someday; I can think of a few things I said when I was in my early 20's that make me thank GOD I was not famous, and no one was writing my words down.

    All this aside, if he continues to show ignorance of thought and action, he might need to do some growing before he fits with ANY team. There isn't a single organization that will want the type of negative publicity he will bring them. I worry more about the drug use and the bad decisions that could end up killing people than what words he strings together.
    Men are moved by two levers only: fear and self interest.

    ~Napoleon Bonaparte on Politics

  2. #12
    Chazz is offline Coordinator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rage4Order View Post
    Really, blackball a man for exercising his right of freedom of speech. How bout we blackball all the sheeple who believe everything that idiot box in ur living room is telling you. If you think the mainstream media tells any truth. Then I have some oceanfront property for ya in Nevada. Before you criticize someone for what they say, study the subject for yourself. Lots of fishy things about Sandy Hook and many other things.
    +1 Mainstream media is state run, nothing more nothing less. Its shocking how anti-freedom American's have become.

  3. #13
    Chazz is offline Coordinator
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    Quote Originally Posted by midgensa View Post
    Look ... I am not a conspiracy idiot. It is clear that some people need to occupy their time with craziness instead of the facts. Sandy Hook was a tragedy and a horrible thing that happened ... BUT

    This is just a dumb kid. He is not necessarily a bad person (he might be, but this doesn't make him one 100%). He might just be stupid. I don't see this as a red flag. There are plenty of idiots out there that believe crap like this.

    You mean like idiots who believe the federal reserve is private, or perhaps those that didn't believe there were wmd's in Iraq, or maybe those that say the gulf of tonkin was a false flag...its probably the ones that have read the operation Northwoods document.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chazz View Post
    +1 Mainstream media is state run, nothing more nothing less. Its shocking how anti-freedom American's have become.
    There is a difference between something being influenced by outside agencies and something being 'state run'. Mainstream media isn't run by any state or even centralized agency. It IS run by the mass market - meaning that it caters to the advertisers who cater to the targeted viewing audience. While that means that different networks will spin their stories to satisfy their specialized market, it does not mean that they are being directed to by the government.

    The problem with the vast majority of conspiracy nuts is that while they are more than willing to believe that the accepted history is not true, they seem unable to understand that finding a degree of inaccuracy does not invalidate the entire premise out of hand.

    Sandy Hook is a great example. There were a lot of inaccuracies reported as the story was being broken out. From getting the name of the suspect wrong to not knowing how many shooters there were. As someone who has first hand experience in a large scale emergency event, I can tell you that the information is wild and loose and very, very few people know everything that is going on. In the military we often refer to this as the fog of war, as conflicting reports and misinformation come in from many angles. But to extrapolate from incidents like that the idea that somehow Sandy Hook didn't actually happen, or it did but was carried out by government officials, all in the name of passing gun legislation (Not making this up - these are the two most common conspiracy theories) is beyond just ignorant. It is irresponsible and disrespectful. It is taking confirmation bias to an art form, cherry picking only the specific reports that support your belief and seek to discredit any others.

    In short, being a conspiracy nut is usually the exact opposite of being open minded, despite claims to the contrary. Because they are only 'open' to views that support their predetermined belief.

    Does he have freedom of speech. Of course he does. But freedom of speech does not mean freedom of consequences. When he says that all the parents who claimed that their kids were killed at Sandy Hook are liars, he is showing more than just his ignorance. He is showing a blatant disregard for the families of the victims. If he even felt that there was a chance - a chance - that Sandy Hook was real, then he should know that statements like that are insensitive at best, and purely evil at worst. So either he did not think that there was even a chance, which makes him more closed minded than the "sheeple" as another poster chose to call people, or he did recognize it as a possibility and he is just a piece of shit who feels like he can say anything he wants without regard to effect.

    Either way, I don't want someone like that on the Vikings. And I truly don't think that he deserves to be in a spotlight or a roll model. I don't care what his on field performance was, there are some thing that you just don't do, and insulting the parents of dead children is definitely one of them.
    Last edited by NodakPaul; 02-28-2014 at 02:28 PM.
    Zeus wrote:
    When are you going to realize that picking out the 20 bad throws this year and ignoring the 300 good ones does not make your point?

    =Z=

  5. #15
    Rage4Order is offline Rookie
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    If any of you think conspiracies don't exist, then you need to go back to school and learn your history. This country was founded via a conspiracy. Every great nation or civilization was felled by a conspiracy. And if you really think that Lee Harvey Oswald shot Kennedy, then you do NOT pay attention. Zapruder film is rock solid evidence that shot came from front right. So don't call people conspiracy nuts, which is a mainstream media thing to call people. Conspiracy' s do exist. Go read about standard oil and Prescott Bush. Tell me they weren't conspiring to do bad things to this country. Standard Oil was dissolved because of national security issues. Its all out there for people to see and read. But all the sheeple have no time, too entertained by their idiot box.

  6. #16
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    Having twice stood with my friends as they barred their children I can not imagine anyone verbally attacking someone in their position. I was fiscally ill for days from the grief I felt for them.
    What he said was just wrong very wrong and even the ignorance of youth and drugs does not excuse it. Any contribution he would make to a team, especially the Viking, would be distasteful to applaud. Free speech can have consequences and I hope he finds that out.
    Go ahead back up your to close away.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rage4Order View Post
    If any of you think conspiracies don't exist, then you need to go back to school and learn your history. This country was founded via a conspiracy. Every great nation or civilization was felled by a conspiracy. And if you really think that Lee Harvey Oswald shot Kennedy, then you do NOT pay attention. Zapruder film is rock solid evidence that shot came from front right. So don't call people conspiracy nuts, which is a mainstream media thing to call people. Conspiracy' s do exist. Go read about standard oil and Prescott Bush. Tell me they weren't conspiring to do bad things to this country. Standard Oil was dissolved because of national security issues. Its all out there for people to see and read. But all the sheeple have no time, too entertained by their idiot box.
    Of course some conspiracies exist. However...

    Some conspiracies exist != everything is a conspiracy.

    I will give you Standard Oil. I personally don't think that Kennedy was a conspiracy (and the Zapruder film has been used as 'evidence' on both sides), but I can at least accept the possibility that something else was in play. I don't label people who look at either as conspiracy nuts, even if I don't agree with some of their assertions.

    People who think we didn't actually land on the moon are conspiracy nuts. People who think that the US Government used explosives to bring down the Twin Towers are conspiracy nuts.

    People who think that the mass murder of 20 children and 6 adults at Sandy Hook Elementary was contrived by political parties who want to further gun control legislation are conspiracy nuts. Especially when their primary 'evidence' is a mixture of inaccurate media reports that surfaced in the first two hours of the event.

    So basically the term conspiracy nut doesn't refer to anyone who believes in conspiracies. It refers to people who look for conspiracies and believe them regardless of the plausibility of their 'evidence'. It refers to people who only accept information that supports their view as fact, labeling all other information as 'mainstream media lies.'

    Labeling people who disagree with you as sheeple, and accusing them of being uneducated or too entertained by their idiot box shows closed mindedness and an unwillingness to give credit to a disagreeing viewpoint.
    Zeus wrote:
    When are you going to realize that picking out the 20 bad throws this year and ignoring the 300 good ones does not make your point?

    =Z=

  8. #18
    rockymtdan's Avatar
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    +1
    Go ahead back up your to close away.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by NodakPaul View Post
    Of course some conspiracies exist. However...

    Some conspiracies exist != everything is a conspiracy.

    I will give you Standard Oil. I personally don't think that Kennedy was a conspiracy (and the Zapruder film has been used as 'evidence' on both sides), but I can at least accept the possibility that something else was in play. I don't label people who look at either as conspiracy nuts, even if I don't agree with some of their assertions.

    People who think we didn't actually land on the moon are conspiracy nuts. People who think that the US Government used explosives to bring down the Twin Towers are conspiracy nuts.

    People who think that the mass murder of 20 children and 6 adults at Sandy Hook Elementary was contrived by political parties who want to further gun control legislation are conspiracy nuts. Especially when their primary 'evidence' is a mixture of inaccurate media reports that surfaced in the first two hours of the event.

    So basically the term conspiracy nut doesn't refer to anyone who believes in conspiracies. It refers to people who look for conspiracies and believe them regardless of the plausibility of their 'evidence'. It refers to people who only accept information that supports their view as fact, labeling all other information as 'mainstream media lies.'

    Labeling people who disagree with you as sheeple, and accusing them of being uneducated or too entertained by their idiot box shows closed mindedness and an unwillingness to give credit to a disagreeing viewpoint.
    Look up JFK smoking gun, its a documentary that alleges a secret service agent in the car behind JFK got knocked over when the car came to an stop, his AR-15 went off and THAT was the shot that took JFK's head off. The first 2 shots were, in fact, made by Oswald.

    It explains why the angles the Warren Commission stood by are off, why there was indeed a cover up (the secret service had NO intention of telling the world they shot the guy they were supposed to protect), and just makes sense.

    The Documentary takes you through it step by step, and the people involved in explaining it are NOT wackos, but instead men of great repute.

    After I watched that on the History channel, followed by a discussion show, I felt for the first time I understood ALL the discrepancies that surrounded the assassination...right down to why people on the ground smelled gun powder, when they should not have if Oswald was the only shooter.
    Men are moved by two levers only: fear and self interest.

    ~Napoleon Bonaparte on Politics

  10. #20
    Chazz is offline Coordinator
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    Quote Originally Posted by NodakPaul View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Chazz View Post
    +1 Mainstream media is state run, nothing more nothing less. Its shocking how anti-freedom American's have become.
    There is a difference between something being influenced by outside agencies and something being 'state run'. Mainstream media isn't run by any state or even centralized agency. It IS run by the mass market - meaning that it caters to the advertisers who cater to the targeted viewing audience. While that means that different networks will spin their stories to satisfy their specialized market, it does not mean that they are being directed to by the government.

    The problem with the vast majority of conspiracy nuts is that while they are more than willing to believe that the accepted history is not true, they seem unable to understand that finding a degree of inaccuracy does not invalidate the entire premise out of hand.

    Sandy Hook is a great example. There were a lot of inaccuracies reported as the story was being broken out. From getting the name of the suspect wrong to not knowing how many shooters there were. As someone who has first hand experience in a large scale emergency event, I can tell you that the information is wild and loose and very, very few people know everything that is going on. In the military we often refer to this as the fog of war, as conflicting reports and misinformation come in from many angles. But to extrapolate from incidents like that the idea that somehow Sandy Hook didn't actually happen, or it did but was carried out by government officials, all in the name of passing gun legislation (Not making this up - these are the two most common conspiracy theories) is beyond just ignorant. It is irresponsible and disrespectful. It is taking confirmation bias to an art form, cherry picking only the specific reports that support your belief and seek to discredit any others.

    In short, being a conspiracy nut is usually the exact opposite of being open minded, despite claims to the contrary. Because they are only 'open' to views that support their predetermined belief.

    Does he have freedom of speech. Of course he does. But freedom of speech does not mean freedom of consequences. When he says that all the parents who claimed that their kids were killed at Sandy Hook are liars, he is showing more than just his ignorance. He is showing a blatant disregard for the families of the victims. If he even felt that there was a chance - a chance - that Sandy Hook was real, then he should know that statements like that are insensitive at best, and purely evil at worst. So either he did not think that there was even a chance, which makes him more closed minded than the "sheeple" as another poster chose to call people, or he did recognize it as a possibility and he is just a piece of shit who feels like he can say anything he wants without regard to effect.

    Either way, I don't want someone like that on the Vikings. And I truly don't think that he deserves to be in a spotlight or a roll model. I don't care what his on field performance was, there are some thing that you just don't do, and insulting the parents of dead children is definitely one of them.
    Mainstream media is the government mouth piece, in other words, state run. There is a lot more to Sandy Hook then media discrepancies.

    Go read the Operation Northwoods document if you think are government wouldn't do such things.

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