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  1. #61
    NodakPaul's Avatar
    NodakPaul is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Don't give up on Childress yet!!

    "davike" wrote:
    "ejdavis33" wrote:
    "davike" wrote:
    We gave Childress one year.
    How many times does a team that gets a brand new coach with a brand new system come in and make the playoffs the next year? Not many, it would be different if we brought in a coach with a relatively same system that we had before, because we would have a lot of the personal needed to run that system already.
    But Childress has a brand new system, and he needs a couple years to get the personal to run his form of WCO and the cover 2 defense.
    He brought in a bunch of new players last year, and most of them helped out the team.
    We questioned why he didn't bring in a big name RB, instead we got a no name Chestor Taylor, who out preformed any of the available free agent RBs last year.
    Many questioned McMullen, he turned out to be one of the bright spots in our offense and by the end of the year most wanted him to see more playing time.
    He brought in low mile vets that weren't well known because they were over shadowed by bigger players.
    I believe they got 3 out of the 4 free agents they pursued this year, he is waiting for the right players.
    To many teams make the mistake of picking players that are big names but wouldn't excell in their system, I think Childress is waiting for the right players that would work best for him.
    Just about every player he has brought in lived up to expectations or better.


    I am going to give Childress a couple years to get HIS team that he wants together.
    It may take longer but I think he has a long term plan and will stick to that.
    He can't throw together a team in 2 offseasons.
    He needs a little more time. . . . I haven't been impressed by some of his moves, but I think he knows what he is doing and what players are going to work best for him.
    Some times I gotta kick myself and remind myself that he knows about 100 times more about the game of football then I do and he knows building a winning team is not about keeping every fan happy.


    Also we need to remember that he is fairly new at this head coaching business, he is still learning too, it is unreasonable to expect him to come in and just know exactly how to do it, I'm sure he has had to make adjustments and will continue to do so.
    I think if we give him a year or two then the Vikings will start to come around and take shape.

    I realize that a lot of fans aren't giving up, and good for you, I just wasted my words on you, but I hope this will encourage everyone that the Vikes aren't doomed under Childress yet and don't give up!!

    Good point!
    I agree with you totally but you know the fans will pretty much give it this upcoming year before they start coming down on him pretty hard!
    Yeah if we don't show definite signs of improvement by the end of next year, even I will be a little bit unsure of Childress. I don't require a superbowl win or even a playoff berth, if his team isn't starting to mesh and come together then I will start to question him a little bit.
    Absolutely.
    I think Childress's job depends on the Vikings having a winning season next year.
    And I think he knows it too, which is why he will be giving it 110% this year.
    Zeus wrote:
    When are you going to realize that picking out the 20 bad throws this year and ignoring the 300 good ones does not make your point?

    =Z=

  2. #62
    Ltrey33 is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Don't give up on Childress yet!!

    I haven't given up on Childress, but I'm close.

    First of all, I have reservations (like everyone else) about his play calling. His play selection was bad at times this past year and I was really disappointed in the fact that he gave up on the run in so many games. That said, he did have us in position to win a few more games than we actually won, but some of the plays he called were boneheaded.

    Second, I think his "my way or the highway" attitude and the fact that he's not more like Tice (yeah, I said it) alienates him from the players. I'm not saying he shouldn't instill some discipline in them, because that's necessary and that's what Tice never did, but I think he is a little bit too strict.

    Third, I'm disappointed in our offseason so far. Not getting Daniel Graham and not going and getting a Wes Welker or Donte Stallworth was a shame, IMO. I know neither of them are great, but we have a lot of cap space and they're certainly better than what we've got!

    Fourth, I'm disappointed in our quarterback situation. I'm not sold on Tarvaris, and IMO he may never quite pan out and we're taking a huge risk in assuming that he will. We've had ample opportunities at Carr, Schaub, etc. and haven't taken a single one, not to mention we squandered our trading power in the draft last year and didn't draft Leinart or Cutler when we easily could have.

    If we don't address the quarterback position and have a great draft on the offensive side of the ball, I am going to lose all faith in Childress.

    The fan base is cranky, the legislature is dragging their feet on a stadium and Wilf is probably just a few years from moving the franchise. Not to mention the fact that we've been one of the most highly scrutinized organizations in recent years (see the Love Boat) and we've lost 2 heartbreaking NFC championship games in the last decade. The Vikes are also one of the teams with the lowest revenue in the league. All of this says we need to win NOW.

    I think we are going to be worse this year than we were last year if Tarvaris ends up starting and we don't draft a big time play making receiver. I think the other teams in the division have gotten better and we have stayed right where we were at (or maybe gotten worse without Napo and Travis Taylor). I just don't see us making the moves necessary to win this year or next, and that scares me.


  3. #63
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    Re: Don't give up on Childress yet!!

    "Ltrey" wrote:
    I haven't given up on Childress, but I'm close.

    First of all, I have reservations (like everyone else) about his play calling. His play selection was bad at times this past year and I was really disappointed in the fact that he gave up on the run in so many games. That said, he did have us in position to win a few more games than we actually won, but some of the plays he called were boneheaded.

    Second, I think his "my way or the highway" attitude and the fact that he's not more like Tice (yeah, I said it) alienates him from the players. I'm not saying he shouldn't instill some discipline in them, because that's necessary and that's what Tice never did, but I think he is a little bit too strict.

    Third, I'm disappointed in our offseason so far. Not getting Daniel Graham and not going and getting a Wes Welker or Donte Stallworth was a shame, IMO. I know neither of them are great, but we have a lot of cap space and they're certainly better than what we've got!

    Fourth, I'm disappointed in our quarterback situation. I'm not sold on Tarvaris, and IMO he may never quite pan out and we're taking a huge risk in assuming that he will. We've had ample opportunities at Carr, Schaub, etc. and haven't taken a single one, not to mention we squandered our trading power in the draft last year and didn't draft Leinart or Cutler when we easily could have.

    If we don't address the quarterback position and have a great draft on the offensive side of the ball, I am going to lose all faith in Childress.

    The fan base is cranky, the legislature is dragging their feet on a stadium and Wilf is probably just a few years from moving the franchise. Not to mention the fact that we've been one of the most highly scrutinized organizations in recent years (see the Love Boat) and we've lost 2 heartbreaking NFC championship games in the last decade. The Vikes are also one of the teams with the lowest revenue in the league. All of this says we need to win NOW.

    I think we are going to be worse this year than we were last year if Tarvaris ends up starting and we don't draft a big time play making receiver. I think the other teams in the division have gotten better and we have stayed right where we were at (or maybe gotten worse without Napo and Travis Taylor). I just don't see us making the moves necessary to win this year or next, and that scares me.


    Great post, I think your take is perfect

  4. #64
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    Re: Don't give up on Childress yet!!

    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "bigbadragz" wrote:
    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "bigbadragz" wrote:
    did childress watch film and get to know the players he had on his roster?
    so if you enter the year after being hired in january as head coach, with the players you put on the field aren't you to blame when you can't find answers at those positions.
    according to you, it's not his fault that all the players at the positions we struggled at, all stunk.
    according to all of you our system is so complex it prevents you from getting first downs or scoring td's.
    according to you childress just takes a backseat as a head coach when the pass defense is getting lit every week.


    you know you guys are jumping all over me cuz i blame him for certain things not all, you know being the head guy in charge and all.
    meanwhile you guys are blaming him for nothing.
    you claim that he can't be judged cuz hes done it for only one year.
    well i'll judge his one year and then combine it with his 2nd year and what that does is give you a sign of what is improved or not.
    with the way you guys look at it, if we look the same as last year you guys would be satisfied cuz we improved more than it appeared this past year and they will still be learning the system.
    it's all excuses guys.

    you think raider fans are saying they looked better than they did on offense.
    i doubt it, and we were in their league as it refers to ineffectiveness.

    I don't know of anyone, anyone, here who thinks that Childress is blameless for our record last season.
    He is, as you said, the head guy.
    So ultimately the responsibility to bring us winning seasons falls on him.
    If you look through many of my other posts about Childress, you will see that I am just as quick to criticize him for his mistakes as I am to reward him for his accomplishments.

    The difference here is that some posters (not singling you out Ragz, there are others too) simply can't accept the fact that Childress did some things well.
    In fact, a lot of things well.
    Overall, I think Childress brought more positives to the Vikings than negatives.
    Just because it is different than what we are used to, or what some would do if they were in charge, doesn't make it wrong.

    I'm not making excuses, but I don't think the sky is falling either.
    There is a happy medium between chicken little and homer that has more than enough room for all of us.
    that's fair.
    but alot of the criticisms i've made have been put aside based on bull donkey arguements.
    i may not point out his positives, cuz i'm a negative person,
    but i also don't discredit them just based on lame theories of the vikings being the only team ever to have a new system.
    and it will take him 3 years to get the right personel to fit this exclusive system, and get them to learn how complicated it is.
    brining in talent would help, and maybe dumbing things down would too.
    i dont want to hear how kick jiggly butt your offense is if you can't get first downs.
    as i continue to say how disappointing and discouraging the offense was in particular last year, i get excuses why.
    but if you have to make this excuse for 16 weeks, you are not gonna hang around long.
    and that's my only point.
    stop sugar coating it, we were bad last year and not much has changed personel wise so childress better be smarter than i think.

    While you may think of them as excuses, some people think of them as reasons.


    Yes, the offense was disappointing last year.
    The next step is to determine why so we know what needs to be done to fix it.
    People have tried to answer this, but you are dismissing the answers as "lame theories" and "bull donkey arguments."
    Stop and listen to what some people are saying, and you might just find some merit in their arguments.

    Bringing in talent would help.
    Any suggestions?
    By the way, the Vikings are primarily looking for young players who are just about to begin the best years of their career.
    Bringing in a older veteran is OK too, but we don't want to pay him more than he is worth.
    Not only would that be a waste of money, but it would affect our future cap and comp picks.
    This free agency was pretty much one of the crappiest I have seen in many years.
    But the offseason isn't done yet (why do so many people forget that?), we still have the draft and trades.

    Dumbing down the offense would really just give you a dumb offense... The problem wasn't the complexity (although the WCO can be complex).
    It has more to do with the amount of things that needed to be relearned with a new scheme.

    The Vikings are looking to build a team of young talent.
    One that will get us to the superbowl.
    We probably won't see instant gratification, but we can expect to see improvement each year.
    We were 6-10 last year, and I expect us to be above .500 and possibly in the playoffs this year.
    Ned and I are on the same page.
    If I was a betting man, my money would be on the Vikes to be in the Superbowl within 5 years.
    this is why i say lame arguments.
    first the system takes a while to learn, said by many.
    so then bringing in rookies with no experience in that systems helps us how and when?
    bringing in any vet according to most of you would have us spending too much money on guys not worthy.
    which guys are you talking about?
    since you asked who i would suggest i mentioned plenty in other post.
    most responded to that by saying it wasn't worth it like we couldnt use the help, or that maybe all the players just dont wanna come to minny.
    fine.


    my point is, this is his 2nd offseason, if the draft is our primary tool to get better than we better have a good draft, and the players he has left in place better make strides cuz we look very similar to the team that could not get first downs or td's last year.
    LET THAT WHICH DOES NOT MATTER, TRULY SLIDE

  5. #65
    NodakPaul's Avatar
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    Re: Don't give up on Childress yet!!

    "bigbadragz" wrote:
    this is why i say lame arguments.
    first the system takes a while to learn, said by many.
    so then bringing in rookies with no experience in that systems helps us how and when?
    bringing in any vet according to most of you would have us spending too much money on guys not worthy.
    which guys are you talking about?
    since you asked who i would suggest i mentioned plenty in other post.
    most responded to that by saying it wasn't worth it like we couldnt use the help, or that maybe all the players just dont wanna come to minny.
    fine.


    my point is, this is his 2nd offseason, if the draft is our primary tool to get better than we better have a good draft, and the players he has left in place better make strides cuz we look very similar to the team that could not get first downs or td's last year.
    I think that last point is pretty fair.
    Speilman and Childress have basically committed to the draft as this year's way to upgrade the offense.
    There will be more trades available after the draft, but you can't bank on it.
    Here's to a good draft this year.

    Are you going to the draft party ragz?
    Zeus wrote:
    When are you going to realize that picking out the 20 bad throws this year and ignoring the 300 good ones does not make your point?

    =Z=

  6. #66
    bigbadragz's Avatar
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    Re: Don't give up on Childress yet!!

    "NodakPaul" wrote:
    "bigbadragz" wrote:
    this is why i say lame arguments.
    first the system takes a while to learn, said by many.
    so then bringing in rookies with no experience in that systems helps us how and when?
    bringing in any vet according to most of you would have us spending too much money on guys not worthy.
    which guys are you talking about?
    since you asked who i would suggest i mentioned plenty in other post.
    most responded to that by saying it wasn't worth it like we couldnt use the help, or that maybe all the players just dont wanna come to minny.
    fine.


    my point is, this is his 2nd offseason, if the draft is our primary tool to get better than we better have a good draft, and the players he has left in place better make strides cuz we look very similar to the team that could not get first downs or td's last year.
    I think that last point is pretty fair.
    Speilman and Childress have basically committed to the draft as this year's way to upgrade the offense.
    There will be more trades available after the draft, but you can't bank on it.
    Here's to a good draft this year.

    Are you going to the draft party ragz?
    i live in florida, so i'll be judging the draft from my computer in my bedroom
    LET THAT WHICH DOES NOT MATTER, TRULY SLIDE

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