Thread: Detailed look at McNabb on third down

Here's a link looking at every single throw Donovan McNabb made on a third down this season. The summaries are in bold if you want to skip the mundane play-by-play stuff (courtesy of CBSSports.com).

Tiger Woods Fist Pump: Why McNabb Ultimately Failed

That post pretty much sums everything up about the problems so far this season on offense.

Originally Posted by sirweeze

Here's a link looking at every single throw Donovan McNabb made on a third down this season. The summaries are in bold if you want to skip the mundane play-by-play stuff (courtesy of CBSSports.com).

Tiger Woods Fist Pump: Why McNabb Ultimately Failed

Thanks. Nice work.
Ponder did quite well on third down in mop up duty. Should that trend continue, the Vikings will be a much better offensive team.

The 3rd down completion and attempt numbers are consistent. Consistently sucky that is. And he was surprised it cost him his job? Maybe he can get a job as an intern for Rush Limbaugh.

Are these numbers bad?

Not if you are backup QB on the team looking for playing time.

Several of those incompletions were drops by the receiver & not the fault of the QB. Most recently the drops by Shianco & Berrian in last Sundays game.

Not saying that McNabb did't suck, he did. But simply changing QB's doesn't fix those drop issues.

Originally Posted by smegmavike

Ponder did quite well on third down in mop up duty. Should that trend continue, the Vikings will be a much better offensive team.

He was 2-4 on 3rd downs, 0-2 on 4th downs (2-6, 33%) trying to get a fresh set of downs.

Not a big fan of the 3rd down conversion stat as a true measure of the QB, although some people love to use it.

For one, it doesn't take into account drops by the receiver. Secondly it faults the QB for a failed run attempt. Also, is it 3rd down & 4 yards or is it 3rd down & a mile & what play was called in?

Although someone snickered at it, a 4 yard pass is just fine if you only need 4 yards or less to get the first down, it's poor play calling when you need 4 yards & call a 2 yard pass play & hope the receiver does the rest (see Childress/Bevell). If a receiver can't get his ass open & a QB is forced to check down, is that the fault of the QB?

How many times did the QB & team convert on 1st down? On 2nd?

Several of those incompletions were drops by the receiver & not the fault of the QB. Most recently the drops by Shianco & Berrian in last Sundays game.

Agreed, and I mention that in the post. But they keep shoving Bernard Berrian out there as their "deep threat." As if every other team out there is saying in practice/meetings the week before playing the Vikings, "Guys, HOW DO WE STOP BERNARD BERRIAN???" It's absurd, why is he even on the roster?

Not a big fan of the 3rd down conversion stat as a true measure of the QB, although some people love to use it.

I wasn't saying its the be-all end-all, just an insight as to why he wasn't as successful as he could have been.

For one, it doesn't take into account drops by the receiver. Secondly it faults the QB for a failed run attempt. Also, is it 3rd down & 4 yards or is it 3rd down & a mile & what play was called in?

Good point.

Although someone snickered at it, a 4 yard pass is just fine if you only need 4 yards or less to get the first down, it's poor play calling when you need 4 yards & call a 2 yard pass play & hope the receiver does the rest (see Childress/Bevell). If a receiver can't get his ass open & a QB is forced to check down, is that the fault of the QB?

Again, I say this in the post but... why on earth are they throwing so often on third and short in the first place? Look again at how many shotgun 3rd and 3s there are in there. You really can't get 3 yards with Adrian Peterson when you need to? You're NOT fooling any defense, especially since they throw short so often in those situations.

And I realize those aren't criticisms exclusive to McNabb. But... the playcalling seems to indicate that Musgrave/Frazier/whoever seems to think they have Brady or Brees back there with so many short passes in critical scenarios.

I agree the WR situation shouldn't be understated, but it's a two way street. I'm curious as to what the consensus opinion is on Eli Manning these days. Most think he's average at best but I can't help but think of 2009, when he had The Other Steve Smith, Mario Manningham, rookie Hakeem Nicks and Kevin Boss as his main targets (a bunch of nobodies at the time)... and he still put up 4000+ yards, 27 TDs and only 14 picks. Even a DECENT quarterback can make chicken salad out of chicken crap. Hell, McNabb did it for years in Philly with guys like Todd Pinkston and FredEx Freddie Mitchell. Those days are long gone though.