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  1. #21
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    Re: Chase Johnson - A big man to fill hole that McKinnie could leave

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "UffDaVikes" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    "Mr-holland" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Ohhhh Lord.
    I'm totally screwed and so is Chase if Mr. Powers believes that Chase is the guy to replace McKinnie.

    Everyone knows Tom Powers doesn't know pooh about football.
    :'(


    Seriously though, I really like the potential this kid has (I know he hasn't played yet Singer) and think there is nothing but room to grow with him.
    Hicks has no potential.
    He is as good as he is gonna get.

    With that said, I really would like to see Hicks gone to make room on the OL roster for either Mozes or Sullivan (both can play G and C) so they can be prepped to eventually take Birks spot if he doesn't come back next year.

    Even a clock is right twice a day.
    I'm worried if McKinnie can't play for the first 2?4? games.. Not because i have no trust in Chase it's just that i havn't seen him do anything yet...
    I like it.

    ;D
    ;D

    I also worry abit but I harken back to last year when a kid named Cook was thrust into the job of RT with no experience. He really didn't do that bad as the year wore on.

    Chase has had some time in the system and appears to have the talent.
    The question is have the coaches molded that talent to the point he could come in with little or no drop off...

    Truth be told, even McKinnie needed help last year so would it be that bad if they helped Chase a bit as well with a TE?
    Do I need to dig up that Denver footage or the game against the redskins where defenders were running right by him? ;D
    Go ahead. Never said he was perfect, I said he didn't do that bad.
    ;D
    ;D :P


    Heck, truth be told I really thought it was gonna be like a revolving door over there at RT last year which isn't what we saw.


    As with all of the kids that were thrown to the mix over the last two years and told to learn on the field, it was kindof expected to see some inconsistency at times.

    My guess, based on how he played last year the coaches should have him ready to go this year.
    Still gonna be some gaffs but I suspect there will be alot less.

    Quick question.......Did McKinnie play better than Cook?
    I would say that they both had the same issues last year.
    Cook IMHO will learn/get better wereas Big Mac has reached his potential.
    At some point the staff will have to make a change at LT (couple of years I would assume/hope) and I would rather see a guy like Cook (or someone new next year) be there ready and willing to step in instead of a guy like Hicks who has reached his potential as well.


    Do me a favor, when you pull up the tapes form those two games, pull up the tapes from the Giants game and SD game to offset them as well as to include the rushing stats for our RB's across the line.
    ;D
    ;D
    ;D
    ;D
    OK, I agree that Cook exceeded expectations, but McKinnie was clearly better last year. I really doubt that a change is needed at LT. McKinney is a bit overpaid, but even so he has been a solid LT for us and will be tough to replace. Keep the line exactly how it is. They had a good year last year and hopefully will get better with the same cast finally playing together. We had to insert Cook and Herrera to improve the right side. I would the left side also looked better in 2007 than in 06. The line is fine, they just need a QB that doesn't make them look horrible.

    Also, your desired analysis would prove very little:
    1. The posters who have a problem with our OL have frequently complained about the passing game, not the rushing game. We are an awesome running team in every facet.
    2. If the numbers do turnout even accross the line, That is because the TE was lined up on the right side more often. Or maybe it was because we pulled a guard more often when running to the right. Or maybe it was because Herrera played better than Hutch last year. I think you get my point.
    3. It smells a lot like the Mewelde Moore argument, which makes me want to puke.

    If Johnson can come in and give us solid games in McKinnie's absence, it doesn't mean he's a long term solution. It only means we now can depend on a viable backup to McKinnie. I can see us not resigning Mac when his contract is up, but at the same time he is repeatedly put down on this board for little reason.
    "I hate when threads are destroyed by facts and logic."
    - Prophet


    Thanks Josdin!

  2. #22
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    Re: Chase Johnson - A big man to fill hole that McKinnie could leave

    i will watch him close in pre-season. then make a call

  3. #23
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    Re: Chase Johnson - A big man to fill hole that McKinnie could leave

    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Ohhhh Lord.
    I'm totally screwed and so is Chase if Mr. Powers believes that Chase is the guy to replace McKinnie.

    Everyone knows Tom Powers doesn't know pooh about football.
    :'(

    Seriously though, I really like the potential this kid has (I know he hasn't played yet Singer) and think there is nothing but room to grow with him.
    Hicks has no potential.
    He is as good as he is gonna get.

    With that said, I really would like to see Hicks gone to make room on the OL roster for either Mozes or Sullivan (both can play G and C) so they can be prepped to eventually take Birks spot if he doesn't come back next year.

    I think that IF Chase shows that he can step in for Big Mac (and both Sullivan and Mozes show that they can play both G and C at an NFL level), then Hicks is as good as gone (especially if the Vikes also keep Marcus Johnson around).
    BANNED OR DEAD...I'LL TAKE EITHER ONE

  4. #24
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    Re: Chase Johnson - A big man to fill hole that McKinnie could leave

    "V" wrote:
    OK, I agree that Cook exceeded expectations, but McKinnie was clearly better last year. I really doubt that a change is needed at LT. McKinney is a bit overpaid, but even so he has been a solid LT for us and will be tough to replace. Keep the line exactly how it is. They had a good year last year and hopefully will get better with the same cast finally playing together. We had to insert Cook and Herrera to improve the right side. I would the left side also looked better in 2007 than in 06. The line is fine, they just need a QB that doesn't make them look horrible.

    Also, your desired analysis would prove very little:
    1. The posters who have a problem with our OL have frequently complained about the passing game, not the rushing game. We are an awesome running team in every facet.
    2. If the numbers do turnout even accross the line, That is because the TE was lined up on the right side more often. Or maybe it was because we pulled a guard more often when running to the right. Or maybe it was because Herrera played better than Hutch last year. I think you get my point.
    3. It smells a lot like the Mewelde Moore argument, which makes me want to puke.

    If Johnson can come in and give us solid games in McKinnie's absence, it doesn't mean he's a long term solution. It only means we now can depend on a viable backup to McKinnie. I can see us not resigning Mac when his contract is up, but at the same time he is repeatedly put down on this board for little reason.
    As always V, excellent post.
    Couple of comments....

    a.
    I want McKinnie to stay.
    I love continuity from the head coach all the way down to the water boy, however, at some point we might be without Big Macs services (is all I'm saying).

    Now you go ahead and throw the Benson deal in and I wonder if maybe we might be without him for good.
    Again, I am not advocating that, I am just reading betweens the lines of what the league is doing these days.
    Kindof a "Out with the bad"
    "In with the good" so as not to tarnish the leagues image.

    b.
    My analysis.
    The video's that I looked at were a analysis (best a yutz like me can do with youtube game tapes
    ;D) of what each of the OLmen were doing in as many cases as I could see with a specific focus on thier pass protection.
    Proof or not, Cook had some good games were he dealt with the DE one on one and he had some bad games were he needed help form Shanc and the RB/FB but he sure the hell didn't suck all year like alot of people try to say.

    Truth be told, what I saw was confusion on the OL in alot of instances were it appears TJ is audibling out of a running play to a passing play.
    Again, I lay blame on the feet of 2 people for that......C (OL/TE adjustment/blocking assignments) and QB (RB/FB and WR Adjustments/blocking assignments).

    Proof or not, from what I can tell from all the (grainy) youtube highlights.
    Take it for what its worth.
    Puke if you like.
    If I had access to real game tape (endzone and top view) I would be in heaven.
    ;D

    Again, excellent post my friend.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  5. #25
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    Re: Chase Johnson - A big man to fill hole that McKinnie could leave

    Let's just hope that he doesn't attempt to fill the hole left by Big Mac on the Love Boat.
    Sorry...but I had to go there. Hee hee hee
    BANNED OR DEAD...I'LL TAKE EITHER ONE

  6. #26
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    Re: Chase Johnson - A big man to fill hole that McKinnie could leave

    "cajunvike" wrote:
    "Marrdro" wrote:
    Ohhhh Lord.
    I'm totally screwed and so is Chase if Mr. Powers believes that Chase is the guy to replace McKinnie.

    Everyone knows Tom Powers doesn't know pooh about football.
    :'(

    Seriously though, I really like the potential this kid has (I know he hasn't played yet Singer) and think there is nothing but room to grow with him.
    Hicks has no potential.
    He is as good as he is gonna get.

    With that said, I really would like to see Hicks gone to make room on the OL roster for either Mozes or Sullivan (both can play G and C) so they can be prepped to eventually take Birks spot if he doesn't come back next year.

    I think that IF Chase shows that he can step in for Big Mac (and both Sullivan and Mozes show that they can play both G and C at an NFL level), then Hicks is as good as gone (especially if the Vikes also keep Marcus Johnson around).
    I can only hope.
    ;D

    Seriously though, I have nothing against Hicks other than the fact that I think he has reached his potential.
    Maybe that along with the fact that he can play almost every position on the line is good enough, however, I would like to see his roster spot used on a guy like Sullivan or Mozes who still have some percieved potential/room to grow.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  7. #27
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    Re: Chase Johnson - A big man to fill hole that McKinnie could leave

    Well You Never Know could this guy be finding his way on the O-Line Sure if he Works at it.........
    I should go look at the Madden Ratings and find out.
    IN THE PITS ON THE RIVER BEDS EVRY VIKING FAN WILL RISE & VAHALLA SHALL REJOICE WITH THE MOST GLORIOUS PRIZE LOMBARDI'S TROPHY

  8. #28
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    Re: Chase Johnson - A big man to fill hole that McKinnie could leave

    It sounds like Chase might have better feet than BigMac...perhaps, in time, could be a better pass blocker.
    He's got all the physical gifts...

    I am one who has been hard on McKinnie, and here is why:
    Sure, he's a great run blocker, the big guy can maul people.
    But, we've seen him get burnt time and time again by the league's speed rushers.
    What makes it stick in my craw, is that it often doesn't seem due to lack of talent, but lack of effort.
    Some games, Big Mac dominates, others he looks tired and uninterested.
    His contract year, he stepped up and played great pretty much all year, since then, we've seen a decline in his on field production.
    I don't know what the chances are, but I am hoping, that he has finally learned some lessons, grown up a bit if you will, and will come back from his suspension ticked off, focused, mostly sober and ready to prove to the NFL that he is one of the best tackles in the game!

    Otherwise, if we can find someone to pass protect better, I'm all for improving that aspect of the team anyway we can, and unfortunately for BigMac, it may be at his expense.
    IF that ends up being the case, I certainly hope we can recoup something for the former first round pick!
    Control the line, control the time, and give your D a chance to shine!!

    "Balance it on end and thats the third side of the coin!!" -wookiefoot

  9. #29
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    Re: Chase Johnson - A big man to fill hole that McKinnie could leave

    "mountainviking" wrote:
    It sounds like Chase might have better feet than BigMac...perhaps, in time, could be a better pass blocker.
    He's got all the physical gifts...

    I am one who has been hard on McKinnie, and here is why:
    Sure, he's a great run blocker, the big guy can maul people.
    But, we've seen him get burnt time and time again by the league's speed rushers.
    What makes it stick in my craw, is that it often doesn't seem due to lack of talent, but lack of effort.
    Some games, Big Mac dominates, others he looks tired and uninterested.
    His contract year, he stepped up and played great pretty much all year, since then, we've seen a decline in his on field production.
    I don't know what the chances are, but I am hoping, that he has finally learned some lessons, grown up a bit if you will, and will come back from his suspension ticked off, focused, mostly sober and ready to prove to the NFL that he is one of the best tackles in the game!

    Otherwise, if we can find someone to pass protect better, I'm all for improving that aspect of the team anyway we can, and unfortunately for BigMac, it may be at his expense.
    IF that ends up being the case, I certainly hope we can recoup something for the former first round pick!
    That is a great point. Elite speed rushers have the edge on McKinnie, but that does not mean he is garbage. Questioning his work ethic is fair. Much fairer than questioning Birk. It is hard to tell the difference though bewtween lack of talent and lack of effort for an LT. One thing the entire OL is better about is focus. They significantly reduced penalties.

    Are we really comparing McKinnie to Benson? IMO it is two totally different scenarios. McKinnie will be suspended 4 games max. It is not something we need to worry about. Actually, if he does get suspended and Chase struggles, maybe it is a good thing, as you all will realize how valuable a solid LT actually is and whine about how you can't wait to have McKinnie back. At that point you will see I was right all along.
    "I hate when threads are destroyed by facts and logic."
    - Prophet


    Thanks Josdin!

  10. #30
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    Re: Chase Johnson - A big man to fill hole that McKinnie could leave

    "V" wrote:
    "mountainviking" wrote:
    It sounds like Chase might have better feet than BigMac...perhaps, in time, could be a better pass blocker.
    He's got all the physical gifts...

    I am one who has been hard on McKinnie, and here is why:
    Sure, he's a great run blocker, the big guy can maul people.
    But, we've seen him get burnt time and time again by the league's speed rushers.
    What makes it stick in my craw, is that it often doesn't seem due to lack of talent, but lack of effort.
    Some games, Big Mac dominates, others he looks tired and uninterested.
    His contract year, he stepped up and played great pretty much all year, since then, we've seen a decline in his on field production.
    I don't know what the chances are, but I am hoping, that he has finally learned some lessons, grown up a bit if you will, and will come back from his suspension ticked off, focused, mostly sober and ready to prove to the NFL that he is one of the best tackles in the game!

    Otherwise, if we can find someone to pass protect better, I'm all for improving that aspect of the team anyway we can, and unfortunately for BigMac, it may be at his expense.
    IF that ends up being the case, I certainly hope we can recoup something for the former first round pick!
    That is a great point. Elite speed rushers have the edge on McKinnie, but that does not mean he is garbage. Questioning his work ethic is fair. Much fairer than questioning Birk. It is hard to tell the difference though bewtween lack of talent and lack of effort for an LT. One thing the entire OL is better about is focus. They significantly reduced penalties.

    Are we really comparing McKinnie to Benson? IMO it is two totally different scenarios. McKinnie will be suspended 4 games max. It is not something we need to worry about. Actually, if he does get suspended and Chase struggles, maybe it is a good thing, as you all will realize how valuable a solid LT actually is and whine about how you can't wait to have McKinnie back. At that point you will see I was right all along.
    Maybe not comparing them exactly but pointing out that repeat offenders seem to get on the short shit list of the commish rather quickly.

    DUI or Drunk Swinging a Pole? Both really are the type of things this commish doesn't want to see in the press.

    As to whinning, not sure if I would classify it as that either.
    Truth be told though if one were to take the time and look at the tapes that are avialable on the net you will see that he did struggle alot last year with pass protection and just might not be as dominant as you think.

    What happens if he is suspended and the run production doesn't go down with Chase in there and Chase does as good pass protecting?
    Would you be clamoring for him to be back?
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

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