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  1. #1
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    I haven't been posting much lately due to alot going on around here at home the last few weeks but I did want to get my two cents in on one particular issue that involves many others and probably some to come.

    With the recent trade of Moss (who has had obvious character issues since his early days...that is why he dropped so far in the draft after all), the arrest of Kelly Campbell on drug and weapon charges, and last year's suspension and supposed "dog house" status of O. Smith (for drug use and whatever else we fans do not know about...not once but three drug test failures by the league), I wanted to make the point that character does count in football.

    Getting rid of Moss for this very reason may be the best one any person can come up with. Campbell should not be resigned due to his recent problems. And additionally, O. Smith should be the one on the trading block, not Bennett. Smith can disappoint all of us with one stupid move on his part (and he has a history of doing this type of thing).

    We have guys with great character on our team. Look at Culpepper, Birk, Chavous, M. Moore and Michael Bennett...etc...These are the type of players we need to build a championship franchise around. Not trouble making, whinning, drug using, gun toting, thugs who are divisive and not team players.

    Character does count. We will not be champions until the team plays as one unit and we finally rid ourselves of the "me" type players that sour team chemistry every time they open thier mouths, get arrested or suspended. I've been a diehard fan of the Vikings and NFL football for over 25 years and have seen what these types of players can do to a team. We need something more than just talent on the field. We need character and heart.
    Even babies know the difference.

  2. #2
    ultravikingfan's Avatar
    ultravikingfan is offline Administrator
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    There is a "me" in team.

    No seriously, good post!

  3. #3
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    Great post Kramer, I totally agree. The only thing is, we are probably bringing in Charles Woodson and he is worse than Moss, but on the defensive side. Personally, I think Culpepper wanted to be the lone star on offense and so did Moss, and their conflicts are what brought about this trade ultimately. Bringing in Woodson would be good for our defense, but very hypocritical of Tice and the Vikings.

    Im also with you on the fact that we need to get rid of Kelly Campbell, and possibly Onterrio as well. We dont need Campbell enough to deal with his immaturity and Onterrio is on the edge.

    I was reading some statements from Randy Moss' agent and he was saying that Moss told him that during games in which the Vikings were losing, there would be players talking about what night clubs they wanted to go to after the game and things of that sort. That is just ridiculous.

    While the players are grown men and are responsible for how they carry themselves, I also point a big finger at Tice too. I personally think Tice is a horrible coach. A good friend, but bad coach. His lack of discipline and the way he tries to be buddy buddy with all the players and his "yeah I feel ya" attitude don't go very far as far as coaching goes. A good coach is a guy that the players hate at first, and then after they start winning, they appreciate their coach and RESPECT him. They dont have to LIKE him, but RESPECT him - thats what its all about. The players dont want Tice to leave, I wonder why? They dont want a real coach riding their asses, thats why.

    You basically hit it on the head in that post Kramer - we need to address that.

    Sig Created by MinnesotaFury

  4. #4
    cc21 is offline Ring of Fame
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    there aint no we either

  5. #5
    coreyd is offline Coach
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    Very good post! I applaud your opinion big time! I was in the military and one of the things that I was taught that has stayed with me is the "Tip of the iceberg" metod. That means that the tip of the iceberg is the smallest part you see, because underneath the water is the body of the icerberg. Now that means that all we see (as in character flaws) is the tip of the iceberg (Moss walking off the field, Campbell getting arrested, O. Smith popping piss tests all the time) and what we dont see is the bottom. Which turns out to be bigger than the tip.
    Anybody see what I am saying? I think I am confusing myself now, but I got all the pieces out......

  6. #6
    DemonicViking is offline Ring of Fame
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    http://leon.budweiser.com/leon_bio.html

    Is the legendary Leon a free agent? :evil4:

  7. #7
    RUSSELL27's Avatar
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    We need that Charater, but we also need Leadership to come with that, and from the whole team, we weren't getting enough leadership, look what Ray Lewis did with the Raven's Defence.

  8. #8
    Caine's Avatar
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    "ADubya26" wrote:
    ...The only thing is, we are probably bringing in Charles Woodson and he is worse than Moss, but on the defensive side.
    Woodsen was just franchised by Oakland. To get him we would have to up the ante on his contract, PLUS give the Raiders 2 1st rounders...not a wise choice.

    "ADubya26" wrote:
    Personally, I think Culpepper wanted to be the lone star on offense and so did Moss, and their conflicts are what brought about this trade ultimately. Bringing in Woodson would be good for our defense, but very hypocritical of Tice and the Vikings.
    I think Culpepper wants an Offense onj the same page, I seriously doubt that "Star Power" had anything to do with what happened. And, again, forget Woodsen.

    "ADubya26" wrote:
    Im also with you on the fact that we need to get rid of Kelly Campbell, and possibly Onterrio as well. We dont need Campbell enough to deal with his immaturity and Onterrio is on the edge.
    Campbell can go, Smith will stay.

    "ADubya26" wrote:
    I was reading some statements from Randy Moss' agent and he was saying that Moss told him that during games in which the Vikings were losing, there would be players talking about what night clubs they wanted to go to after the game and things of that sort. That is just ridiculous.
    Honestly, I am inclined to believe it to be true. Moss started developing an attitude when the Vikes stopped putting forth maximum effort to be competative. If we would have fielded a Defense and given our guys a chance to win, Moss wouldn't have been so disgruntled. Look at TO in San Fran versus TO in Philly. NO ONE likes to KNOW they are involved in a futile endeavor.

    "ADubya26" wrote:
    While the players are grown men and are responsible for how they carry themselves, I also point a big finger at Tice too. I personally think Tice is a horrible coach. A good friend, but bad coach. His lack of discipline and the way he tries to be buddy buddy with all the players and his "yeah I feel ya" attitude don't go very far as far as coaching goes. A good coach is a guy that the players hate at first, and then after they start winning, they appreciate their coach and RESPECT him. They dont have to LIKE him, but RESPECT him - thats what its all about. The players dont want Tice to leave, I wonder why? They dont want a real coach riding their asses, thats why.
    Tice is betwen a rock and a hard place. He knows - better than anyone else - how hamstrung his efforts are by having an owner who refuses to budge off the bottom line. I don't blame Tice, I blame Red *Chipmonk bordellos rock!!* McCombs for not being committed to WINNING.

    It's hard to play hardball with your players when your owner is screwing you over.

    Very few coaches are capable of playing tough with their players. Most have to dance the wire and hope they don't piss them off too much. How many coaches have been fired for taking a hard stance with a star player? Too many.

    No, it isn't Tice. It all comes back to the owner. If HE isn't willing to commit to winning, nothing anyone else does matters.

    Caine

  9. #9
    snowinapril's Avatar
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    "Caine" wrote:

    Tice is betwen a rock and a hard place. He knows - better than anyone else - how hamstrung his efforts are by having an owner who refuses to budge off the bottom line. I don't blame Tice, I blame Red *Chipmonk bordellos rock!!* McCombs for not being committed to WINNING.

    It's hard to play hardball with your players when your owner is screwing you over.

    Very few coaches are capable of playing tough with their players. Most have to dance the wire and hope they don't piss them off too much. How many coaches have been fired for taking a hard stance with a star player? Too many.

    No, it isn't Tice. It all comes back to the owner. If HE isn't willing to commit to winning, nothing anyone else does matters.

    Caine
    Is that a pun on how Randy had the hamstring injury this year.

    It is also hard for the team to take the coach seriously when he mucked things up on the sidelines all year.

    I agree about Red not putting forth. At times Red thought he was the coach and thought he could tell the guys you have to win it as the team stands, like that was going to motivate them to win. The season before this one it really seemed like Red was so upset with them going into that AZ game. He seemed to think that they had the pieces to win and didn't do it. Like Red gave up on the players.

    Remember the issues that Tice had with Red when he came in and chewed the team out. That was a big time problem and still is until Red is gone. But I still am not sure about Tice.

  10. #10
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    I have heard comment from Taylor, like Character is one of his important areas. It sounded like he would have cleaned some house if got a chance to own the team.

    Oh by the way Taylor if character counts, Sam and Spree, clean it up. You would think it would be a little bit easier to control 12 guys than 50 plus guys. It is hard to find 50 plus guys with great character. There are going to be a few bad seeds here and there.

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