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  1. #11
    jessejames09's Avatar
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    Re: Antoine Winfield eager to be injury-free

    "El" wrote:
    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "El" wrote:
    http://www.startribune.com/sports/vi..._refer=Vikings

    Winfield is becoming an oldie and I don´t think ,at least rite now, Griffith is a total
    reliable player for us,last season had 0 I mean 0 INt starting all 16 games.


    Our CB performances are muck likely to improve with the pass-rusher adittion of Jared Allen.0 Int this year again for C.G with this kind of defense
    would be unaceptable.I guess some moves next off-season or Draft on CB.

    Since when is a corners sole duty to get int's?
    I got a big Hang-over to think about it
    Steve ,rite is not a corner sole duty to get INTS , it is important too not to allow many pass yards per game ,do you know which place in NFL we reached last season
    in yards/per game allowed? Yes sure you know

    Do you know how many yards per game? That is possible you don´t it yet,264.


    Don´t make think again
    please Stevie ,damn Tequila ...
    We gave up more pass yards than anyone else because teams abandoned the run against our D. It's only logical that they passed more against us than anyone else. Look at points given up per game.

    That exact thing has been said about 28 000 times on here, but I'll kick that dead horse one more time.

  2. #12
    singersp's Avatar
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    Re: Antoine Winfield eager to be injury-free

    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "singersp" wrote:
    "El" wrote:
    http://www.startribune.com/sports/vi..._refer=Vikings

    Winfield is becoming an oldie and I don´t think ,at least rite now, Griffith is a total
    reliable player for us,last season had 0 I mean 0 INt starting all 16 games.

    Our CB performances are muck likely to improve with the pass-rusher adittion of Jared Allen.0 Int this year again for C.G with this kind of defense
    would be unaceptable.I guess some moves next off-season or Draft on CB.

    How does the addition of Allen all of a sudden improve Griffith's ability to tackle ot knock the ball down?
    Griffin!

    Griffin can't tackle? Seriously? It seemed he had a hard time week 1 or 2. Then after that he was a beast in the run game! Did you watch the Chargers replay 2 weekends ago?
    Yes I did. He's had some solid games & he's had some mediocre games. The guy is not consistant when it comes to tackling. I've seen him slip off plenty of tackles last year.

    I've also seen him make some nice tackles, but how many times have you seen him bat a ball away & deny the WR the catch? Most times he simply allows the receiver to catch the ball & then tackles him. Sure some of those are between 5-10 yards, but how many 5-10 yard passes that are caught does it take to give our opponents a fresh set of downs & keep our defense on the field longer?

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  3. #13
    El Vikingo's Avatar
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    Re: Antoine Winfield eager to be injury-free

    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "El" wrote:
    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "El" wrote:
    http://www.startribune.com/sports/vi..._refer=Vikings

    Winfield is becoming an oldie and I don´t think ,at least rite now, Griffith is a total
    reliable player for us,last season had 0 I mean 0 INt starting all 16 games.


    Our CB performances are muck likely to improve with the pass-rusher adittion of Jared Allen.0 Int this year again for C.G with this kind of defense
    would be unaceptable.I guess some moves next off-season or Draft on CB.

    Since when is a corners sole duty to get int's?
    I got a big Hang-over to think about it
    Steve ,rite is not a corner sole duty to get INTS , it is important too not to allow many pass yards per game ,do you know which place in NFL we reached last season
    in yards/per game allowed? Yes sure you know

    Do you know how many yards per game? That is possible you don´t it yet,264.


    Don´t make think again
    please Stevie ,damn Tequila ...
    We gave up more pass yards than anyone else because teams abandoned the run against our D. It's only logical that they passed more against us than anyone else. Look at points given up per game.

    That exact thing has been said about 28 000 times on here, but I'll kick that dead horse one more time.
    GriffiN,struggled last season man ,always 5 yards away from the receiver ,no Int in 16 games,adding NOTHING to the team numbers ,besides
    in YAC I am not sure of it but I think we also ranked last ,not sure of that one and
    too lazy to find out ,so don´t pull trigger .

    I am not an NFL expert at all , but I know when something is rite or not.

    What performance would you ask then for a bad season for GriffiN?

    Being caugth in the locker-room on his knees with
    the Chiller in front of him?

    I have a bad day Steve,sorry If I have been too ironic


    I think I should go back to the Clubhouse and 2 beers,the Vikes forum makes me anxious about the season to begin and this fucking off season has still 107 days of life....
    El underdog.

  4. #14
    NodakPaul's Avatar
    NodakPaul is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: Antoine Winfield eager to be injury-free

    I didn't think Griffin had a bad season at all.
    Playing 5 yards off the receiver is a result of the scheme, not the corner.
    People said the same thing all the time about Smoot when he was here.
    For the record, AW plays off the receiver too.
    Zeus wrote:
    When are you going to realize that picking out the 20 bad throws this year and ignoring the 300 good ones does not make your point?

    =Z=

  5. #15
    El Vikingo's Avatar
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    Re: Antoine Winfield eager to be injury-free

    Like one member ´d say ,you guys crack me up.
    El underdog.

  6. #16
    jessejames09's Avatar
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    Re: Antoine Winfield eager to be injury-free

    "El" wrote:
    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "El" wrote:
    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "El" wrote:
    http://www.startribune.com/sports/vi..._refer=Vikings

    Winfield is becoming an oldie and I don´t think ,at least rite now, Griffith is a total
    reliable player for us,last season had 0 I mean 0 INt starting all 16 games.


    Our CB performances are muck likely to improve with the pass-rusher adittion of Jared Allen.0 Int this year again for C.G with this kind of defense
    would be unaceptable.I guess some moves next off-season or Draft on CB.


    Since when is a corners sole duty to get int's?
    I got a big Hang-over to think about it
    Steve ,rite is not a corner sole duty to get INTS , it is important too not to allow many pass yards per game ,do you know which place in NFL we reached last season
    in yards/per game allowed? Yes sure you know

    Do you know how many yards per game? That is possible you don´t it yet,264.


    Don´t make think again
    please Stevie ,damn Tequila ...
    We gave up more pass yards than anyone else because teams abandoned the run against our D. It's only logical that they passed more against us than anyone else. Look at points given up per game.

    That exact thing has been said about 28 000 times on here, but I'll kick that dead horse one more time.
    GriffiN,struggled last season man ,always 5 yards away from the receiver ,no Int in 16 games,adding NOTHING to the team numbers ,besides
    in YAC I am not sure of it but I think we also ranked last ,not sure of that one and
    too lazy to find out ,so don´t pull trigger .

    I am not an NFL expert at all , but I know when something is rite or not.

    What performance would you ask then for a bad season for GriffiN?

    Being caugth in the locker-room on his knees with
    the Chiller in front of him?

    I have a bad day Steve,sorry If I have been too ironic


    I think I should go back to the Clubhouse and 2 beers,the Vikes forum makes me anxious about the season to begin and this fucking off season has still 107 days of life....
    I don't look for specific stat milestones. I watch every game, personally I think he is a beast in the run game and after the catch, if his ball skills improve he will be a top corner in the NFL. Griffin gets way too much flak on here mainly because people look at the stats and say.

    some moran
    Gee those vikings are really bad agianst the pass. They must have a terrible secondary... Hey! They have Darren Sharper (OMFG INTS!), Madieu Williams and Antoine Winfield! Those guys are pretty good. Who's this Cedric Griffin guy starting?? 0 Ints. He sucks. Why didn't we draft a CB. ARRRG.
    The fact that Winfield and Griffin generally do the same thing, hit well (it's called the cover 2) and both are leaving something to be desired in ball skills. Yet Griffin is our problem .: Bend but don't break, we're damn good at it.

  7. #17
    singersp's Avatar
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    Re: Antoine Winfield eager to be injury-free

    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "El" wrote:
    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "El" wrote:
    "jessejames09" wrote:
    [quote author=El Vikingo link=topic=45196.msg783435#msg783435 date=1211642045]
    http://www.startribune.com/sports/vi..._refer=Vikings

    Winfield is becoming an oldie and I don´t think ,at least rite now, Griffith is a total
    reliable player for us,last season had 0 I mean 0 INt starting all 16 games.


    Our CB performances are muck likely to improve with the pass-rusher adittion of Jared Allen.0 Int this year again for C.G with this kind of defense
    would be unaceptable.I guess some moves next off-season or Draft on CB.


    Since when is a corners sole duty to get int's?
    I got a big Hang-over to think about it
    Steve ,rite is not a corner sole duty to get INTS , it is important too not to allow many pass yards per game ,do you know which place in NFL we reached last season
    in yards/per game allowed? Yes sure you know

    Do you know how many yards per game? That is possible you don´t it yet,264.


    Don´t make think again
    please Stevie ,damn Tequila ...
    We gave up more pass yards than anyone else because teams abandoned the run against our D. It's only logical that they passed more against us than anyone else. Look at points given up per game.

    That exact thing has been said about 28 000 times on here, but I'll kick that dead horse one more time.
    GriffiN,struggled last season man ,always 5 yards away from the receiver ,no Int in 16 games,adding NOTHING to the team numbers ,besides
    in YAC I am not sure of it but I think we also ranked last ,not sure of that one and
    too lazy to find out ,so don´t pull trigger .

    I am not an NFL expert at all , but I know when something is rite or not.

    What performance would you ask then for a bad season for GriffiN?

    Being caugth in the locker-room on his knees with
    the Chiller in front of him?

    I have a bad day Steve,sorry If I have been too ironic


    I think I should go back to the Clubhouse and 2 beers,the Vikes forum makes me anxious about the season to begin and this fucking off season has still 107 days of life....
    I don't look for specific stat milestones. I watch every game, personally I think he is a beast in the run game and after the catch, if his ball skills improve he will be a top corner in the NFL. Griffin gets way too much flak on here mainly because people look at the stats and say.

    some moran
    Gee those vikings are really bad agianst the pass. They must have a terrible secondary... Hey! They have Darren Sharper (OMFG INTS!), Madieu Williams and Antoine Winfield! Those guys are pretty good. Who's this Cedric Griffin guy starting?? 0 Ints. He sucks. Why didn't we draft a CB. ARRRG.
    The fact that Winfield and Griffin generally do the same thing, hit well (it's called the cover 2) and both are leaving something to be desired in ball skills. Yet Griffin is our problem .: Bend but don't break, we're damn good at it.
    [/quote]

    You don't see Winfield missing a tackle very often.

    As to the bend don't break philosophy, we've lost too many ball games by bending.

    Hopefully with the newly improved pass rushing attack, Frazier will allow the DB's to be a little more agressive & bat some balls away instead of conceding catches.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

  8. #18
    jessejames09's Avatar
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    Re: Antoine Winfield eager to be injury-free

    "singersp" wrote:
    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "singersp" wrote:
    "El" wrote:
    http://www.startribune.com/sports/vi..._refer=Vikings

    Winfield is becoming an oldie and I don´t think ,at least rite now, Griffith is a total
    reliable player for us,last season had 0 I mean 0 INt starting all 16 games.

    Our CB performances are muck likely to improve with the pass-rusher adittion of Jared Allen.0 Int this year again for C.G with this kind of defense
    would be unaceptable.I guess some moves next off-season or Draft on CB.

    How does the addition of Allen all of a sudden improve Griffith's ability to tackle ot knock the ball down?
    Griffin!

    Griffin can't tackle? Seriously? It seemed he had a hard time week 1 or 2. Then after that he was a beast in the run game! Did you watch the Chargers replay 2 weekends ago?
    Yes I did. He's had some solid games & he's had some mediocre games. The guy is not consistant when it comes to tackling. I've seen him slip off plenty of tackles last year.

    I've also seen him make some nice tackles, but how many times have you seen him bat a ball away & deny the WR the catch? Most times he simply allows the receiver to catch the ball & then tackles him. Sure some of those are between 5-10 yards, but how many 5-10 yard passes that are caught does it take to give our opponents a fresh set of downs & keep our defense on the field longer?
    I think that's the cover 2 you may be complaining about right there. We play off, allow them to have their dump offs, and rely on our speedy, sure tackling lbers and cbs to stop them. AW lets guys catch the ball too, he's just such a good tackler no one really cares, because they go no where.

    I agree he missed hits last year, but that was his first year holding down his own side, and he made strides as the year went on. He's young, he fits the scheme, he survived his first year as a starter,and made some big plays along the way. I just think CB is a non-issue right now.

  9. #19
    jessejames09's Avatar
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    Re: Antoine Winfield eager to be injury-free

    "singersp" wrote:
    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "El" wrote:
    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "El" wrote:
    [quote author=jessejames09 link=topic=45196.msg783437#msg783437 date=1211642320]
    [quote author=El Vikingo link=topic=45196.msg783435#msg783435 date=1211642045]
    http://www.startribune.com/sports/vi..._refer=Vikings

    Winfield is becoming an oldie and I don´t think ,at least rite now, Griffith is a total
    reliable player for us,last season had 0 I mean 0 INt starting all 16 games.


    Our CB performances are muck likely to improve with the pass-rusher adittion of Jared Allen.0 Int this year again for C.G with this kind of defense
    would be unaceptable.I guess some moves next off-season or Draft on CB.


    Since when is a corners sole duty to get int's?
    I got a big Hang-over to think about it
    Steve ,rite is not a corner sole duty to get INTS , it is important too not to allow many pass yards per game ,do you know which place in NFL we reached last season
    in yards/per game allowed? Yes sure you know

    Do you know how many yards per game? That is possible you don´t it yet,264.


    Don´t make think again
    please Stevie ,damn Tequila ...
    We gave up more pass yards than anyone else because teams abandoned the run against our D. It's only logical that they passed more against us than anyone else. Look at points given up per game.

    That exact thing has been said about 28 000 times on here, but I'll kick that dead horse one more time.
    GriffiN,struggled last season man ,always 5 yards away from the receiver ,no Int in 16 games,adding NOTHING to the team numbers ,besides
    in YAC I am not sure of it but I think we also ranked last ,not sure of that one and
    too lazy to find out ,so don´t pull trigger .

    I am not an NFL expert at all , but I know when something is rite or not.

    What performance would you ask then for a bad season for GriffiN?

    Being caugth in the locker-room on his knees with
    the Chiller in front of him?

    I have a bad day Steve,sorry If I have been too ironic


    I think I should go back to the Clubhouse and 2 beers,the Vikes forum makes me anxious about the season to begin and this fucking off season has still 107 days of life....
    I don't look for specific stat milestones. I watch every game, personally I think he is a beast in the run game and after the catch, if his ball skills improve he will be a top corner in the NFL. Griffin gets way too much flak on here mainly because people look at the stats and say.

    some moran
    Gee those vikings are really bad agianst the pass. They must have a terrible secondary... Hey! They have Darren Sharper (OMFG INTS!), Madieu Williams and Antoine Winfield! Those guys are pretty good. Who's this Cedric Griffin guy starting?? 0 Ints. He sucks. Why didn't we draft a CB. ARRRG.
    The fact that Winfield and Griffin generally do the same thing, hit well (it's called the cover 2) and both are leaving something to be desired in ball skills. Yet Griffin is our problem .: Bend but don't break, we're damn good at it.
    [/quote]

    You don't see Winfield missing a tackle very often.

    As to the bend don't break philosophy, we've lost too many ball games by bending.

    Hopefully with the newly improved pass rushing attack, Frazier will allow the DB's to be a little more agressive & bat some balls away instead of conceding catches.
    [/quote]

    Griffin isn't AW. In fact if we could find another AW he would be the perfect cover 2 corner, opposite AW. Griffin has potential give him a chance.

    Isn't the cover 2 designed to keep the play in front of the defender and minimize risk? I don't think our CBs (under chilly) will ever be diving for screen passes, or taking the big gamble for the int, because they are taught not to.

    I think Allen will defiantly create more Ints though with all that pressure, but he's not going to make our defenders leave their feet more or start playing bump and run.

  10. #20
    singersp's Avatar
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    Re: Antoine Winfield eager to be injury-free

    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "singersp" wrote:
    "jessejames09" wrote:
    "singersp" wrote:
    "El" wrote:
    http://www.startribune.com/sports/vi..._refer=Vikings

    Winfield is becoming an oldie and I don´t think ,at least rite now, Griffith is a total
    reliable player for us,last season had 0 I mean 0 INt starting all 16 games.

    Our CB performances are muck likely to improve with the pass-rusher adittion of Jared Allen.0 Int this year again for C.G with this kind of defense
    would be unaceptable.I guess some moves next off-season or Draft on CB.

    How does the addition of Allen all of a sudden improve Griffith's ability to tackle ot knock the ball down?
    Griffin!

    Griffin can't tackle? Seriously? It seemed he had a hard time week 1 or 2. Then after that he was a beast in the run game! Did you watch the Chargers replay 2 weekends ago?
    Yes I did. He's had some solid games & he's had some mediocre games. The guy is not consistant when it comes to tackling. I've seen him slip off plenty of tackles last year.

    I've also seen him make some nice tackles, but how many times have you seen him bat a ball away & deny the WR the catch? Most times he simply allows the receiver to catch the ball & then tackles him. Sure some of those are between 5-10 yards, but how many 5-10 yard passes that are caught does it take to give our opponents a fresh set of downs & keep our defense on the field longer?
    I think that's the cover 2 you may be complaining about right there. We play off, allow them to have their dump offs, and rely on our speedy, sure tackling lbers and cbs to stop them. AW lets guys catch the ball too, he's just such a good tackler no one really cares, because they go no where.

    I agree he missed hits last year, but that was his first year holding down his own side, and he made strides as the year went on. He's young, he fits the scheme, he survived his first year as a starter,and made some big plays along the way. I just think CB is a non-issue right now.
    I just want to see him improve & he does deserve the chance. I would like nothing better than to see him succeed. Just as much as Jackson, McCauley & the other new starters & rookies do.

    I also know playing off the ball is part of the Tampa 2. Smoot was crucified for it by fans here when the scheme called for it for all CB's.

    I just feel Frazier needs to cut them a litlle more freedom & let them be a little more agressive, especially with the addition of Allen.

    Otherwise we'll be nickel & dimed to death again this year with quick releases from our opponents QB's.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

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