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  1. #11
    kevoncox's Avatar
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    Re: 49er Game 07 was the turning point...

    BB is not going to solve a damn thing. I like the guy and he is a good WR but his skill set won't defeat the defense we are facing. The defenses we are facing are basically giving us this look.

    CB



    FS



    CB


    They have the deep ball covered. What is available to us ar hooks, outs, ins, comebacks. We need our savior this year will be Rice, Shank and or Tjack. A burner is going to push the saftey and CBs deep with him. The defense is design to prevent the deep ball. Rice or Shank must develop into a consistant receiving threat. TJ must make the these throws while avoiding the deception of the underneath LBs and fake blitzs. He must make his reads quickly and find what area of the 5-12 yard
    box is uncovered.








    The 49ers weren't the first team to stack the box. What the 49ers did was run a slight version of spy with their Cbs. They ran what we called an umbrella. It was later ran to perfection by the Skins.
    Before the play started the 49ers defense looked like this





    S

    CB




    S

    CB

    We never adjusted and it's the biggest question mark facing the team. Some of you felt it was DE but I didn't. We have to find away to spread teams out and run the ball. We must now do to teams what they started to do to us since the 06 Pats game. We must get the extra Lbs off the field.

  2. #12
    dcboardr41 is offline Team Alumni
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    Re: 49er Game 07 was the turning point...

    "StillPurple" wrote:
    Just looked the stats up:

    - Peterson had only 3 yards rushing on 14 carries.
    - Chester had 101 yards on 8 carries, but that includes the 85 yard run.
    - Tarvaris was 16/25 for like 165 yards and a TD pass with no INTs.

    We won because the Niners turned the ball over 5 times...

    To me, what jumps out is the 3 yards for AP (obviously). For a QB to throw that yardage vs. a stacked box all day is very, very mediocre, too. Chester had a good day, but based on one run.

    Obviously, I hope that this does not continue, and I trust that Chilly has a better answer for this than to try to run AP off tackle 20 times in a row. I would expect more screen passes to AP and some slants to Wade, etc. to get us out of this. But my main point is that D-Coordinators around the NFL have found a way to slow AP down, and we need to counter that.

    Football is about adjustments...
    And it seems to me, that trend continued in the final games.
    dude, listen, this game was over in the 1st quarter, our D had i think 3 turnover and we were up 21-0 then, the game was over. Chilly was wasting time to get the game over, u act like we were in a close game and ur hating on Chilly, thats dumb

    Pissing on the Pack since 08'

  3. #13
    dcboardr41 is offline Team Alumni
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    Re: 49er Game 07 was the turning point...

    people once again need to realize BB will not be our savior. But will be a
    key addition in our passing and running offense. I actually believe Sidney Rice will have more production and a bigger role in our O than BB. People are giving BB way to much hype already, yes hes a good WR, but hes not gonna turn our passing game around himself. We need Rice to mature more, we need Wade to go back to his "slot" status, and we need to the younger WRs to have key plays during the year.

    Pissing on the Pack since 08'

  4. #14
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    Re: 49er Game 07 was the turning point...

    "StillPurple" wrote:
    Man, I don't recall the game going that way. I do recall the run by Chester now, though. But I think it was early in the game, no ? I was watching it in a sports bar and there were like 10 Vikings fans (I don't live in MN), and I recall us cheering maybe twice in that game.

    I will have to look up the numbers in that game (should have already done that before my post, I admit that).

    But I still maintain that the box got stacked against us in every game after that. BTW, the box was stacked and the linebackers were keying on AP, so I guess to me, that doesn't negate my point that they took AP out of that game if Chester broke one off. And after that,
    the Bears, Redskins, etc. all stacked the box with everyone keying on AP, and mostly took him out of those games.

    I am pretty sure that won't continue, but it seemed to me that Childress didn't find an answer to that yet. I am not sure what the answer is, but obviously, it has something to do with the QB throwing when they put 8 and 9 defenders in the box.
    What the hell is the guy supposed to do? Sidney was hurt for the end of the regular season so we had to rely on Wade and Williamson to break the 9 in the box?
    He addressed the problem you had immediately in the offseason by getting Bernard Berrian.
    As far as Adrian being stuffed ... we were ahead like 21-0 almost immediately in that game ... we did not even PRETEND to pass in the second half as both teams clearly just wanted the clock to run out. The games following ... Adrian went for two touchdowns in the win over the Bears. Against the Skins and Broncos we had to PASS the entire game because we were behind. That is actually pretty common in football.
    See, in the NFL, when you get behind ... you PASS to try and catch up because it does not chew up as much time and it breaks off longer chunks of yardage. Got it?
    Hate, hate, hate all you like, but Childress and the FO CLEARLY addressed the passing game in the offseason by picking up the BEST WR on the market ... now that that has been cleared up ... pick something else to bitch about.

  5. #15
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    Re: 49er Game 07 was the turning point...

    With TJack more comfortable in the offense and reading the field better, I think we'll see a lot more of the playbook open up.
    I fully expect several big play passes early as we prove to teams that we can pass against their zone CB blitz.


    I'm not calling on Berrian to be our savior (thanks AP ) but, I am counting on him to be a huge upgrade over TWill's stonehands!
    I can't wait to see some more 3 and 4 WR sets too...picture, Berrian and Rice on the outsides going deep, Wade doing a mid slant from on side and Ferguson or Allison running a short cross on the other...even if they cover deep and zone blitz, those mid routes will be pretty open, as long as TJack can hit the right guy quick, we'll be looking good.
    Then as we start making those plays consistently, watch out for AP to tear up spread out Defenses!!


    But, as already pointed out, that was a weird game that our defense pretty much won for us early.
    Lots of points up and lots of eat the clock running going on...which is pretty much expected and going nowhere.
    Add in a bit of the rookie wall for AP, and how comfortable he was in that brace after the injury, and I think lower numbers are expected late in the year.
    Control the line, control the time, and give your D a chance to shine!!

    "Balance it on end and thats the third side of the coin!!" -wookiefoot

  6. #16
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    Re: 49er Game 07 was the turning point...

    Jackson, Rice, Wade, Allison, Peterson and Ferguson all gained some experience points (as players, as players in the system, and as players working together) last season. Remember, all of these guys were working together for the first time last season. A couple were rookies and a couple were just new to the team. Give them another offseason and I guarantee we see a more gelled offense.

    We added Bernard Berrian.

    Taylor and Peterson are still awesome.

    I've got confidence. I really think any team who ignores the pass and focuses purely on the run will get torched. I do not believe the Vikings will be the same one-dimensional team they were in San Fran and later in the 2007 season.

    My biggest worries are injuries (goes without saying) and the Birk and Mckinnie situations.


    "There is good and there is evil. And evil must be punished. Even in the face of Armageddon I will not compromise."

  7. #17
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    Re: 49er Game 07 was the turning point...

    Someone correct me if I'm wrong. At that point, weren't there still questions about AD's pass blocking abilities? I don't think he was in the game for many pass plays, so when he was in, it was easier/less risky for the defenses to key on him. If that was the case, that is definitely an issue that can be cured with an off-season's worth of work.

  8. #18
    StillPurple is offline Hall of Famer
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    Re: 49er Game 07 was the turning point...

    kevancox, excellent post. Your post was the one I should have written, but I don't think I saw what you saw. Excellent. And it also shows why deep WRs and a relatively inexperienced QB won't get us out of the "jam", especially when our coaching staff is being outcoached too (as occured in the Redskins game).

    BTW, guys, I was not arguing that we played badly in the SF game. We won it, so in my book, we played it "right". But I was saying, if you look at every game after that, the defenses became WAY more effective at stopping our offense, and I think that they just copied what SF did to us. And kevancox explained way better than me, what was going on.

    As he mentioned, if you take the deep routes (using a Cover 2 or Cover 3 zone) away and jam the box, this offense is really, really weak. We need to get this fixed, too !! I was expecting us to take or trade for some underneath threat, a WR in the Keyshawn Johnson or Chris Carter mould, or a good TE. We didnt' do it, and I am worried about this issue going into '08. Maybe a running back will step up and become an underneath passing threat. I don't know. But it has to improve. If I were the Vikings staff, I would thow AP 100 screen passes a day, too in training camp.

  9. #19
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    Re: 49er Game 07 was the turning point...

    I think that's where another year for Allison helps, as well as having a better deep threat and putting Wade where he fits best.
    Of course, it will help even more if TJack really is, "reading the field better, and going through his progressions," cuz I think we'll see some nice YAC if he starts getting those 2nd and third options more involved.

    Allison is very shifty, and has a surprising burst to high gear that can leave those LBs liing on their faces in the middle zone.
    Control the line, control the time, and give your D a chance to shine!!

    "Balance it on end and thats the third side of the coin!!" -wookiefoot

  10. #20
    kevoncox's Avatar
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    Re: 49er Game 07 was the turning point...

    "midgensa" wrote:
    "StillPurple" wrote:
    Man, I don't recall the game going that way. I do recall the run by Chester now, though. But I think it was early in the game, no ? I was watching it in a sports bar and there were like 10 Vikings fans (I don't live in MN), and I recall us cheering maybe twice in that game.

    I will have to look up the numbers in that game (should have already done that before my post, I admit that).

    But I still maintain that the box got stacked against us in every game after that. BTW, the box was stacked and the linebackers were keying on AP, so I guess to me, that doesn't negate my point that they took AP out of that game if Chester broke one off. And after that,
    the Bears, Redskins, etc. all stacked the box with everyone keying on AP, and mostly took him out of those games.

    I am pretty sure that won't continue, but it seemed to me that Childress didn't find an answer to that yet. I am not sure what the answer is, but obviously, it has something to do with the QB throwing when they put 8 and 9 defenders in the box.
    What the hell is the guy supposed to do? Sidney was hurt for the end of the regular season so we had to rely on Wade and Williamson to break the 9 in the box?
    He addressed the problem you had immediately in the offseason by getting Bernard Berrian.
    As far as Adrian being stuffed ... we were ahead like 21-0 almost immediately in that game ... we did not even PRETEND to pass in the second half as both teams clearly just wanted the clock to run out. The games following ... Adrian went for two touchdowns in the win over the Bears. Against the Skins and Broncos we had to PASS the entire game because we were behind. That is actually pretty common in football.
    See, in the NFL, when you get behind ... you PASS to try and catch up because it does not chew up as much time and it breaks off longer chunks of yardage. Got it?
    Hate, hate, hate all you like, but Childress and the FO CLEARLY addressed the passing game in the offseason by picking up the BEST WR on the market ... now that that has been cleared up ... pick something else to beeyatch about.
    So your belief on the reasons we were behing in the Skins and Denver game had nothing to do with the facct that we were not able to run the ball sucessfully? They stopped us earlier and forced us to take the pass. They dictated what we could do. Our Qb was not able to make those passes and he threw INts. Our WRs caught the ball and then fumbled it to the defense. We could not run the ball because they took away the run.

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