Re: Is it Tices fault or is it Mcombs'?
Most of Red's deals were structured in the same way that MOST contracts are structured in the NFL...back-loaded. And that includes BOTH Daunte's AND Randy's...so to place blame on Red for doing what most other team also do is foolish. The fact of the matter is that we couldn't have kept Randy AND rebuild the defense...which was your original premise, and I quote:
If you want to talk about the cap fine. How about the way Red structured Daunte's deal. Pep wasn't supposed to make anything this season. It was all coming later in the contract when McCombs wouldn't have to pay it. WE WERE WAY UNDER THE CAP WITH MOSS!!!! FACT! WE COULD HAVE BEEN WITH HIM. FACT. What simply isn't true? It wasn't Moss that was screwing us in the future with the cap. It was the way Red structured the deals for everyone We could have signed guys with Moss. You are right that we would have been in trouble in the future but getting rid of Randy was not the answer. Red screwed us in a lot of ways including our future cap trouble and by trading Moss. It wasn't one or the other. Quit calling me out when you are "simply wrong." McCombs dropped the ball and traded Randy because he is cheap. He made the bed we're sleeping in now and will be in for years to come. We could have the same mess of a cap with the best plpayer in the game. Have you ever seen how it would play out? Read the paper once in awhile. Look at the way the deals are structured before you insinuate that I'm wrong or lying. Nothing personal with you but I am not wrong on this one. The deals have been done so irresponsibly and its Red's fault. Not mine for pointing it out.
We were so far under the cap before the trade, we could have kept him and signed all the defensive guys. - MensaMensaTice
THAT is what I was calling you out on...not the fact that Red had set up the contracts that way. Yeah, Red is a jerkwad...but he was a jerkwad for much more important reasons than how the contracts were set up (again, like most other teams do it). And as far as Red being responsible for trading Moss...rest assured, he had the FULL approval of the new ownership group (which has ALWAYS included the Wilfs) on ALL of the moves that he made just prior to the sale (and there is no way that you can convince me that he didn't...because there is no way that he would have made any maverick moves that would have jeopardized the sale...NO WAY...even he is not THAT stupid). So place the blame squarely where it belongs...on a new ownership group that wanted to shake things up and an outgoing owner who was eager to please the guys who were buying his team at a premium price...and THEM'S the facts.
The biggest fact remains that if we had kept Moss, there is no way that we could have offered our new defensive players contracts that they would have accepted...and they would have signed somewhere else. To believe anything else is foolish.
NO, the biggest thing that Red is responsible for is cheaping out on the coaching staff...we deserve the best that money can buy...since there is no salary cap on coaching staffs, that is where he shirked his duty to the fans...he has NO excuse for not paying more for more talented coaches and more coaches in general. The coaching staff (particularly Loney and Tice) is spread way too thin...simply because Red was a tightwad. However, Wilf has to take some blame...because he could have brought in more coaches (such as an offensive consultant) to lighten the load for Tice and Loney...and he didn't. He shares some of the blame for the 0-2 start...again, to believe otherwise is to be pulling the wool over your own eyes (which is something Packer fans are better suited for).
BANNED OR DEAD...I'LL TAKE EITHER ONE