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  1. #91
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    Re: T-Jack vs Whitehurst

    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102899
    =

    Also, and my memory aint too good, but looking at the stats it appears not every game in 07 was completely bad(though some certainly were).

    http://www.nfl.com/player/tarvarisjackson/2495863/gamelogs?season=2007
    Fair, but the point I'm saying, is once the pressure is on, TJ crumbles.

    If you stick him out there to start vs. an aaverage to above average team while you've clinched a playoff spot, he'll probably do just fine.

    Put him out there in a situation where you have to win to clinch a playoff spot, and it's a hole other story.

    2008 is a perfect example. Came in during the Lions game, played very well as a backup. Started the Cards game, had an excellent game. Falcons game, not quite so hot. Giants game, pretty bad. Eagles game? Well, need I go on?

    His play went from great, to struggling and choking. He simply does not seem to have the mental makeup needed to be a good QB.

    Some of the guys thrown out there right away and were successful was due to how they handled themself.

    Guys liek "Matty Ice", who doesn't let pressure phase him. or "Cool Joe", had played strong through the season and playoffs. Roethlisberger is confident, isn't jumpy and does what is needed. TJ has yet to show that. He's got the physical skills, his downfall is what's upstairs.

  2. #92
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    Re: T-Jack vs Whitehurst

    Quote Originally Posted by "singersp" #1102876
    Quote Originally Posted by "Caine" #1102875
    Quote Originally Posted by "singersp" #1102843
    Quote Originally Posted by "midgensa" #1102393
    Quote Originally Posted by "Caine" #1102388
    Quote Originally Posted by "singersp" #1102367
    Quote Originally Posted by "Purple Floyd" #1102362
    Quote Originally Posted by "singersp" #1102349
    Quote Originally Posted by "Caine" #1102273
    Quote Originally Posted by "singersp" #1102254
    Looks like Caine & 13 others are wrong....

    Seattle Seahawks name Tarvaris Jackson starting QB

    http://aol.sportingnews.com/nfl/story/2011-07-30/seattle-seahawks-name-tarvaris-jackson-starting-qb
    How am I wrong? Look at the #46 post in this thread (Mine) and you'll see the following quote:

    Yup, he got a job because Seattle was dumb enough to sign Bevell as the OC.

    Carroll installed Jackson as the starter right away because he wanted to build "continuity". Also, did you see who the Seachickens have as QB's? Hell, I would be the starter there....

    That doesn't mean he'll do well.
    Did he compete for this job? Nope...just like every other time he's been named starter, it was gifted to him.

    Caine
    This is how....

    Poll: If it\'s down to these two, who will start in Seattle?
    Charlie Whitehurst 14
    58.3%
    Tarvaris Jackson 10 41.7%
    I'm referring to the 14 that answered "Whitehurst" to the poll of which you are easily one.

    It's irrelevant to the poll whether that position was won or gifted.
    its only irrelevant if you ignore the opening post to understand the context:

    "So if it does happen to come down to Charlie Whitehurst and Tarvaris Fox Jackson III battling it out for the starting job for the Seahawks, which one do you think wins it? "


    They never battled it out as was prefaced in the initial post so the results are void. I even asked for clarification in an early post and he reinforced that the poll was about a competition not a gifted spot as this appeaes to be.
    I was referring to the poll question as it was asked, not the poll question as it was interpreted along with or in addition to another post in this thread.

    Like I said, gifted or not, Jackson has been named the starter, not Whitehurst
    Yup. According to the verbiage of the question, I am wrong.

    However, I'm pretty sure that the results of the season will show Carrol and Bevell wrong...

    B)

    Caine
    Oh no Caine ... you are fully aware of how it works.

    It is the offensive line's fault, the WR's fault, the coaches fault or the punter's fault.

    But it is NEVER ... and I mean EEEEEEEEVVVVVVER ... T-Jack's fault.
    You must have Favre confused with Jackson.
    No one made excuses for Favre...he got crucified. Only Teflon Jackson was showered with excuses.

    Caine
    Your memory that short it only goes back a few months & not from the time he got here?

    I believe you your self made a post that said similarly "If he only had receivers to throw to".

    There were excuses made on receivers not getting open.

    There were excuses made about receivers dropping balls, especially those that touched outstretched arms.

    There were excuses made on the front line not protecting the QB.

    There were excuses made on him being rusty due to lack of training/preparation.

    There were excuses made on him not having gelled with the team yet.

    There were excuses made because of his ankle, his shoulder, his tendonitis.

    There were excuses made on him not having gelled with the team yet.

    There were excuses made on play calling.

    There were excuses made on receivers zigging when they should have zagged.

    Your memory being refreshed yet?
    Wow, talk about selective memories....

    When discussing Favre last year, the VAST MAJORITY of his SUPPORTERS stated, "Favre played like crap...AND the receivers sucked, AND the O-line sucked".

    When discussing Teflon Tarvaris, his supporters left off the "Tarvaris played like crap" part and went right to the other elements as EXCUSES for his poor performances.

    And, FYI, the excuse about "him being rusty due to lack of training/preparation" was never used...that was BLAME that was directed straight AT him.

    And play calling excuses weren't made either, because we all knew Brett changed the play at the line many times...Jackson was the ONLY beneficiary of the "play calling" excuses.

    Again, my memory isn't the one needing refreshing...

    Caine

  3. #93
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    Re: T-Jack vs Whitehurst

    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1102900
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102899
    =

    Also, and my memory aint too good, but looking at the stats it appears not every game in 07 was completely bad(though some certainly were).

    http://www.nfl.com/player/tarvarisjackson/2495863/gamelogs?season=2007
    Fair, but the point I'm saying, is once the pressure is on, TJ crumbles.

    If you stick him out there to start vs. an aaverage to above average team while you've clinched a playoff spot, he'll probably do just fine.

    Put him out there in a situation where you have to win to clinch a playoff spot, and it's a hole other story.

    2008 is a perfect example. Came in during the Lions game, played very well as a backup. Started the Cards game, had an excellent game. Falcons game, not quite so hot. Giants game, pretty bad. Eagles game? Well, need I go on?

    His play went from great, to struggling and choking. He simply does not seem to have the mental makeup needed to be a good QB.

    Some of the guys thrown out there right away and were successful was due to how they handled themself.

    Guys liek "Matty Ice", who doesn't let pressure phase him. or "Cool Joe", had played strong through the season and playoffs. Roethlisberger is confident, isn't jumpy and does what is needed. TJ has yet to show that. He's got the physical skills, his downfall is what's upstairs.
    When the playoffs were on the line in the fourth quarter against the Giants Tjack did come through with a 56 yard TD pass. Yes against backups, but he didn't choke.
    No one is saying they think Tjack is a star or anywhere near a franchise player. But when you say he's only had 1.5 good games its just unfair.

    Matty Ice. First year makes the playoffs. 3 turnovers, less than 5 yards a pass play, under 200 pass yards. Loss
    2nd year misses playoffs.
    3rd year. Makes playoffs. 3 turnovers again, Less than 200yards again. Loses again. HAS YET TO WIN A PLAYOFF GAME.
    http://www.nfl.com/player/mattryan/310/gamelogs?season=2008

    Joe flacco. First year makes playoffs. Wins 2 games loses the third. In those playoffs games he completes 44% of his passes and has 1 td and 3 turnovers. QB rating 50.8.
    2nd year makes playoffs. Wins first game with 34 yards passing and a QB rating of 10. 2nd playoff game he loses to the colts and the offense scores 3 points. QB rating 0td 2int, QB rating 48.4.
    3rd year makes playoffs again. Finally has a good playoff game in his 6th attempts, to beat the chiefs. Following game he has 125 yards passing and a QB rating of 61. and a fumble.
    Career playoffs for Flacco. 7 starts 98/184 53.2% 1050yds(150/game)4td 7int, QB rating 61.6.
    http://www.nfl.com/player/joeflacco/382/gamelogs?season=2008
    Big Ben is a stud that has ice in his Veins, almost a guaranteed hall of famer.

  4. #94
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    Re: T-Jack vs Whitehurst

    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102906
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1102900
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102899
    =

    Also, and my memory aint too good, but looking at the stats it appears not every game in 07 was completely bad(though some certainly were).

    http://www.nfl.com/player/tarvarisjackson/2495863/gamelogs?season=2007
    Fair, but the point I'm saying, is once the pressure is on, TJ crumbles.

    If you stick him out there to start vs. an aaverage to above average team while you've clinched a playoff spot, he'll probably do just fine.

    Put him out there in a situation where you have to win to clinch a playoff spot, and it's a hole other story.

    2008 is a perfect example. Came in during the Lions game, played very well as a backup. Started the Cards game, had an excellent game. Falcons game, not quite so hot. Giants game, pretty bad. Eagles game? Well, need I go on?

    His play went from great, to struggling and choking. He simply does not seem to have the mental makeup needed to be a good QB.

    Some of the guys thrown out there right away and were successful was due to how they handled themself.

    Guys liek "Matty Ice", who doesn't let pressure phase him. or "Cool Joe", had played strong through the season and playoffs. Roethlisberger is confident, isn't jumpy and does what is needed. TJ has yet to show that. He's got the physical skills, his downfall is what's upstairs.
    When the playoffs were on the line in the fourth quarter against the Giants Tjack did come through with a 56 yard TD pass. Yes against backups, but he didn't choke.
    No one is saying they think Tjack is a star or anywhere near a franchise player. But when you say he's only had 1.5 good games its just unfair.

    Matty Ice. First year makes the playoffs. 3 turnovers, less than 5 yards a pass play, under 200 pass yards. Loss
    2nd year misses playoffs.
    3rd year. Makes playoffs. 3 turnovers again, Less than 200yards again. Loses again. HAS YET TO WIN A PLAYOFF GAME.
    http://www.nfl.com/player/mattryan/310/gamelogs?season=2008

    Joe flacco. First year makes playoffs. Wins 2 games loses the third. In those playoffs games he completes 44% of his passes and has 1 td and 3 turnovers. QB rating 50.8.
    2nd year makes playoffs. Wins first game with 34 yards passing and a QB rating of 10. 2nd playoff game he loses to the colts and the offense scores 3 points. QB rating 0td 2int, QB rating 48.4.
    3rd year makes playoffs again. Finally has a good playoff game in his 6th attempts, to beat the chiefs. Following game he has 125 yards passing and a QB rating of 61. and a fumble.
    Career playoffs for Flacco. 7 starts 98/184 53.2% 1050yds(150/game)4td 7int, QB rating 61.6.
    http://www.nfl.com/player/joeflacco/382/gamelogs?season=2008
    Big Ben is a stud that has ice in his Veins, almost a guaranteed hall of famer.
    And yet Ryan and Flacco not only made the playoffs, but did so convincingly. They didn't sneak their way in DESPITE bad QB play, they led their teams in as the leader of the offense should.

    Yes. Flacco had a couple bad games int he playoffs. Some easy passes missed, but the point is he made it that far, not as someone being carried by the team, but as a legitimate starter, contributor and leader of the team. Same with Ryan. Was there help? Of course, but I'm not sure if you took all the best playmakers from the Ravens and Falcons, put them on a team and had TJ quarterback it, that they would get even as far as Ryan or Flacco did.

  5. #95
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    Re: T-Jack vs Whitehurst

    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1102907
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102906
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1102900
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102899
    =

    Also, and my memory aint too good, but looking at the stats it appears not every game in 07 was completely bad(though some certainly were).

    http://www.nfl.com/player/tarvarisjackson/2495863/gamelogs?season=2007
    Fair, but the point I'm saying, is once the pressure is on, TJ crumbles.

    If you stick him out there to start vs. an aaverage to above average team while you've clinched a playoff spot, he'll probably do just fine.

    Put him out there in a situation where you have to win to clinch a playoff spot, and it's a hole other story.

    2008 is a perfect example. Came in during the Lions game, played very well as a backup. Started the Cards game, had an excellent game. Falcons game, not quite so hot. Giants game, pretty bad. Eagles game? Well, need I go on?

    His play went from great, to struggling and choking. He simply does not seem to have the mental makeup needed to be a good QB.

    Some of the guys thrown out there right away and were successful was due to how they handled themself.

    Guys liek "Matty Ice", who doesn't let pressure phase him. or "Cool Joe", had played strong through the season and playoffs. Roethlisberger is confident, isn't jumpy and does what is needed. TJ has yet to show that. He's got the physical skills, his downfall is what's upstairs.
    When the playoffs were on the line in the fourth quarter against the Giants Tjack did come through with a 56 yard TD pass. Yes against backups, but he didn't choke.
    No one is saying they think Tjack is a star or anywhere near a franchise player. But when you say he's only had 1.5 good games its just unfair.

    Matty Ice. First year makes the playoffs. 3 turnovers, less than 5 yards a pass play, under 200 pass yards. Loss
    2nd year misses playoffs.
    3rd year. Makes playoffs. 3 turnovers again, Less than 200yards again. Loses again. HAS YET TO WIN A PLAYOFF GAME.
    http://www.nfl.com/player/mattryan/310/gamelogs?season=2008

    Joe flacco. First year makes playoffs. Wins 2 games loses the third. In those playoffs games he completes 44% of his passes and has 1 td and 3 turnovers. QB rating 50.8.
    2nd year makes playoffs. Wins first game with 34 yards passing and a QB rating of 10. 2nd playoff game he loses to the colts and the offense scores 3 points. QB rating 0td 2int, QB rating 48.4.
    3rd year makes playoffs again. Finally has a good playoff game in his 6th attempts, to beat the chiefs. Following game he has 125 yards passing and a QB rating of 61. and a fumble.
    Career playoffs for Flacco. 7 starts 98/184 53.2% 1050yds(150/game)4td 7int, QB rating 61.6.
    http://www.nfl.com/player/joeflacco/382/gamelogs?season=2008
    Big Ben is a stud that has ice in his Veins, almost a guaranteed hall of famer.
    And yet Ryan and Flacco not only made the playoffs, but did so convincingly. They didn't sneak their way in DESPITE bad QB play, they led their teams in as the leader of the offense should.

    Yes. Flacco had a couple bad games int he playoffs. Some easy passes missed, but the point is he made it that far, not as someone being carried by the team, but as a legitimate starter, contributor and leader of the team. Same with Ryan. Was there help? Of course, but I'm not sure if you took all the best playmakers from the Ravens and Falcons, put them on a team and had TJ quarterback it, that they would get even as far as Ryan or Flacco did.
    Your point keeps changing. First it was Tjack has only played 1.5 good games in his career. false
    Then it was other young QB's(flacco and ryan) don't let the pressure get to them and play well in the playoffs. false

    Now it is that they don't limp into the playoffs. In 08 both made the playoffs as a wild card. In 09 Ravens went as a wildcard, Falcons didn't make it, in 2010 Ravens went as a wild card. Ryan got the first division title between the two, but lost badly at home to the packers in the first game(choke?).

  6. #96
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    Re: T-Jack vs Whitehurst

    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102912
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1102907
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102906
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1102900
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102899
    =

    Also, and my memory aint too good, but looking at the stats it appears not every game in 07 was completely bad(though some certainly were).

    http://www.nfl.com/player/tarvarisjackson/2495863/gamelogs?season=2007
    Fair, but the point I'm saying, is once the pressure is on, TJ crumbles.

    If you stick him out there to start vs. an aaverage to above average team while you've clinched a playoff spot, he'll probably do just fine.

    Put him out there in a situation where you have to win to clinch a playoff spot, and it's a hole other story.

    2008 is a perfect example. Came in during the Lions game, played very well as a backup. Started the Cards game, had an excellent game. Falcons game, not quite so hot. Giants game, pretty bad. Eagles game? Well, need I go on?

    His play went from great, to struggling and choking. He simply does not seem to have the mental makeup needed to be a good QB.

    Some of the guys thrown out there right away and were successful was due to how they handled themself.

    Guys liek "Matty Ice", who doesn't let pressure phase him. or "Cool Joe", had played strong through the season and playoffs. Roethlisberger is confident, isn't jumpy and does what is needed. TJ has yet to show that. He's got the physical skills, his downfall is what's upstairs.
    When the playoffs were on the line in the fourth quarter against the Giants Tjack did come through with a 56 yard TD pass. Yes against backups, but he didn't choke.
    No one is saying they think Tjack is a star or anywhere near a franchise player. But when you say he's only had 1.5 good games its just unfair.

    Matty Ice. First year makes the playoffs. 3 turnovers, less than 5 yards a pass play, under 200 pass yards. Loss
    2nd year misses playoffs.
    3rd year. Makes playoffs. 3 turnovers again, Less than 200yards again. Loses again. HAS YET TO WIN A PLAYOFF GAME.
    http://www.nfl.com/player/mattryan/310/gamelogs?season=2008

    Joe flacco. First year makes playoffs. Wins 2 games loses the third. In those playoffs games he completes 44% of his passes and has 1 td and 3 turnovers. QB rating 50.8.
    2nd year makes playoffs. Wins first game with 34 yards passing and a QB rating of 10. 2nd playoff game he loses to the colts and the offense scores 3 points. QB rating 0td 2int, QB rating 48.4.
    3rd year makes playoffs again. Finally has a good playoff game in his 6th attempts, to beat the chiefs. Following game he has 125 yards passing and a QB rating of 61. and a fumble.
    Career playoffs for Flacco. 7 starts 98/184 53.2% 1050yds(150/game)4td 7int, QB rating 61.6.
    http://www.nfl.com/player/joeflacco/382/gamelogs?season=2008
    Big Ben is a stud that has ice in his Veins, almost a guaranteed hall of famer.
    And yet Ryan and Flacco not only made the playoffs, but did so convincingly. They didn't sneak their way in DESPITE bad QB play, they led their teams in as the leader of the offense should.

    Yes. Flacco had a couple bad games int he playoffs. Some easy passes missed, but the point is he made it that far, not as someone being carried by the team, but as a legitimate starter, contributor and leader of the team. Same with Ryan. Was there help? Of course, but I'm not sure if you took all the best playmakers from the Ravens and Falcons, put them on a team and had TJ quarterback it, that they would get even as far as Ryan or Flacco did.
    Your point keeps changing. First it was Tjack has only played 1.5 good games in his career. false
    Then it was other young QB's(flacco and ryan) don't let the pressure get to them and play well in the playoffs. false

    Now it is that they don't limp into the playoffs. In 08 both made the playoffs as a wild card. In 09 Ravens went as a wildcard, Falcons didn't make it, in 2010 Ravens went as a wild card. Ryan got the first division title between the two, but lost badly at home to the packers in the first game(choke?).
    It's all part of the same point. Ryan or Flacco I would trust as a QB, not because they are physically more gifted than TJ, but because they can handle playing the position.

  7. #97
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    Re: T-Jack vs Whitehurst

    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1102913
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102912
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1102907
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102906
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1102900
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102899
    =

    Also, and my memory aint too good, but looking at the stats it appears not every game in 07 was completely bad(though some certainly were).

    http://www.nfl.com/player/tarvarisjackson/2495863/gamelogs?season=2007
    Fair, but the point I'm saying, is once the pressure is on, TJ crumbles.

    If you stick him out there to start vs. an aaverage to above average team while you've clinched a playoff spot, he'll probably do just fine.

    Put him out there in a situation where you have to win to clinch a playoff spot, and it's a hole other story.

    2008 is a perfect example. Came in during the Lions game, played very well as a backup. Started the Cards game, had an excellent game. Falcons game, not quite so hot. Giants game, pretty bad. Eagles game? Well, need I go on?

    His play went from great, to struggling and choking. He simply does not seem to have the mental makeup needed to be a good QB.

    Some of the guys thrown out there right away and were successful was due to how they handled themself.

    Guys liek "Matty Ice", who doesn't let pressure phase him. or "Cool Joe", had played strong through the season and playoffs. Roethlisberger is confident, isn't jumpy and does what is needed. TJ has yet to show that. He's got the physical skills, his downfall is what's upstairs.
    When the playoffs were on the line in the fourth quarter against the Giants Tjack did come through with a 56 yard TD pass. Yes against backups, but he didn't choke.
    No one is saying they think Tjack is a star or anywhere near a franchise player. But when you say he's only had 1.5 good games its just unfair.

    Matty Ice. First year makes the playoffs. 3 turnovers, less than 5 yards a pass play, under 200 pass yards. Loss
    2nd year misses playoffs.
    3rd year. Makes playoffs. 3 turnovers again, Less than 200yards again. Loses again. HAS YET TO WIN A PLAYOFF GAME.
    http://www.nfl.com/player/mattryan/310/gamelogs?season=2008

    Joe flacco. First year makes playoffs. Wins 2 games loses the third. In those playoffs games he completes 44% of his passes and has 1 td and 3 turnovers. QB rating 50.8.
    2nd year makes playoffs. Wins first game with 34 yards passing and a QB rating of 10. 2nd playoff game he loses to the colts and the offense scores 3 points. QB rating 0td 2int, QB rating 48.4.
    3rd year makes playoffs again. Finally has a good playoff game in his 6th attempts, to beat the chiefs. Following game he has 125 yards passing and a QB rating of 61. and a fumble.
    Career playoffs for Flacco. 7 starts 98/184 53.2% 1050yds(150/game)4td 7int, QB rating 61.6.
    http://www.nfl.com/player/joeflacco/382/gamelogs?season=2008
    Big Ben is a stud that has ice in his Veins, almost a guaranteed hall of famer.
    And yet Ryan and Flacco not only made the playoffs, but did so convincingly. They didn't sneak their way in DESPITE bad QB play, they led their teams in as the leader of the offense should.

    Yes. Flacco had a couple bad games int he playoffs. Some easy passes missed, but the point is he made it that far, not as someone being carried by the team, but as a legitimate starter, contributor and leader of the team. Same with Ryan. Was there help? Of course, but I'm not sure if you took all the best playmakers from the Ravens and Falcons, put them on a team and had TJ quarterback it, that they would get even as far as Ryan or Flacco did.
    Your point keeps changing. First it was Tjack has only played 1.5 good games in his career. false
    Then it was other young QB's(flacco and ryan) don't let the pressure get to them and play well in the playoffs. false

    Now it is that they don't limp into the playoffs. In 08 both made the playoffs as a wild card. In 09 Ravens went as a wildcard, Falcons didn't make it, in 2010 Ravens went as a wild card. Ryan got the first division title between the two, but lost badly at home to the packers in the first game(choke?).
    It's all part of the same point. Ryan or Flacco I would trust as a QB, not because they are physically more gifted than TJ, but because they can handle playing the position.
    I can agree with that, it's pretty obvious. It's just how you got there that had me puzzled.
    Tjacks biggest knock is he can't stay healthy, no Qb will be successful if they can't stay on the field.

  8. #98
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    Re: T-Jack vs Whitehurst

    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102915
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1102913
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102912
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1102907
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102906
    Quote Originally Posted by "i_bleed_purple" #1102900
    Quote Originally Posted by "jmcdon00" #1102899
    =

    Also, and my memory aint too good, but looking at the stats it appears not every game in 07 was completely bad(though some certainly were).

    http://www.nfl.com/player/tarvarisjackson/2495863/gamelogs?season=2007
    Fair, but the point I'm saying, is once the pressure is on, TJ crumbles.

    If you stick him out there to start vs. an aaverage to above average team while you've clinched a playoff spot, he'll probably do just fine.

    Put him out there in a situation where you have to win to clinch a playoff spot, and it's a hole other story.

    2008 is a perfect example. Came in during the Lions game, played very well as a backup. Started the Cards game, had an excellent game. Falcons game, not quite so hot. Giants game, pretty bad. Eagles game? Well, need I go on?

    His play went from great, to struggling and choking. He simply does not seem to have the mental makeup needed to be a good QB.

    Some of the guys thrown out there right away and were successful was due to how they handled themself.

    Guys liek "Matty Ice", who doesn't let pressure phase him. or "Cool Joe", had played strong through the season and playoffs. Roethlisberger is confident, isn't jumpy and does what is needed. TJ has yet to show that. He's got the physical skills, his downfall is what's upstairs.
    When the playoffs were on the line in the fourth quarter against the Giants Tjack did come through with a 56 yard TD pass. Yes against backups, but he didn't choke.
    No one is saying they think Tjack is a star or anywhere near a franchise player. But when you say he's only had 1.5 good games its just unfair.

    Matty Ice. First year makes the playoffs. 3 turnovers, less than 5 yards a pass play, under 200 pass yards. Loss
    2nd year misses playoffs.
    3rd year. Makes playoffs. 3 turnovers again, Less than 200yards again. Loses again. HAS YET TO WIN A PLAYOFF GAME.
    http://www.nfl.com/player/mattryan/310/gamelogs?season=2008

    Joe flacco. First year makes playoffs. Wins 2 games loses the third. In those playoffs games he completes 44% of his passes and has 1 td and 3 turnovers. QB rating 50.8.
    2nd year makes playoffs. Wins first game with 34 yards passing and a QB rating of 10. 2nd playoff game he loses to the colts and the offense scores 3 points. QB rating 0td 2int, QB rating 48.4.
    3rd year makes playoffs again. Finally has a good playoff game in his 6th attempts, to beat the chiefs. Following game he has 125 yards passing and a QB rating of 61. and a fumble.
    Career playoffs for Flacco. 7 starts 98/184 53.2% 1050yds(150/game)4td 7int, QB rating 61.6.
    http://www.nfl.com/player/joeflacco/382/gamelogs?season=2008
    Big Ben is a stud that has ice in his Veins, almost a guaranteed hall of famer.
    And yet Ryan and Flacco not only made the playoffs, but did so convincingly. They didn't sneak their way in DESPITE bad QB play, they led their teams in as the leader of the offense should.

    Yes. Flacco had a couple bad games int he playoffs. Some easy passes missed, but the point is he made it that far, not as someone being carried by the team, but as a legitimate starter, contributor and leader of the team. Same with Ryan. Was there help? Of course, but I'm not sure if you took all the best playmakers from the Ravens and Falcons, put them on a team and had TJ quarterback it, that they would get even as far as Ryan or Flacco did.
    Your point keeps changing. First it was Tjack has only played 1.5 good games in his career. false
    Then it was other young QB's(flacco and ryan) don't let the pressure get to them and play well in the playoffs. false

    Now it is that they don't limp into the playoffs. In 08 both made the playoffs as a wild card. In 09 Ravens went as a wildcard, Falcons didn't make it, in 2010 Ravens went as a wild card. Ryan got the first division title between the two, but lost badly at home to the packers in the first game(choke?).
    It's all part of the same point. Ryan or Flacco I would trust as a QB, not because they are physically more gifted than TJ, but because they can handle playing the position.
    I can agree with that, it's pretty obvious. It's just how you got there that had me puzzled.
    Tjacks biggest knock is he can't stay healthy, no Qb will be successful if they can't stay on the field.
    That's a big knock on him, but when ont he field, I have absolutely no confidence in his ability to play a strong game.

    For example, when I see him wind up to go deep, my first thought is "oh shit..."

    When Favre wound up to go deep, I actually found myself getting excited to see a big play, as more often than not that's what happened.

    Yes TJ hit the occasional deep play, just as he had the occasional good game, but at this point in his career, I expect alot more, even if you are from a DI AA school.

  9. #99
    Purple Floyd's Avatar
    Purple Floyd is offline Jersey Retired
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    Re: T-Jack vs Whitehurst

    He is gone.

    I wish him well and hope he can find out there what he didn't find here.

  10. #100
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    Re: T-Jack vs Whitehurst

    Quote Originally Posted by "Caine" #1102903
    Quote Originally Posted by "singersp" #1102876
    Quote Originally Posted by "Caine" #1102875
    Quote Originally Posted by "singersp" #1102843
    Quote Originally Posted by "midgensa" #1102393
    Quote Originally Posted by "Caine" #1102388
    Quote Originally Posted by "singersp" #1102367
    Quote Originally Posted by "Purple Floyd" #1102362
    Quote Originally Posted by "singersp" #1102349
    Quote Originally Posted by "Caine" #1102273
    Quote Originally Posted by "singersp" #1102254
    Looks like Caine & 13 others are wrong....

    Seattle Seahawks name Tarvaris Jackson starting QB

    http://aol.sportingnews.com/nfl/story/2011-07-30/seattle-seahawks-name-tarvaris-jackson-starting-qb
    How am I wrong? Look at the #46 post in this thread (Mine) and you'll see the following quote:

    Yup, he got a job because Seattle was dumb enough to sign Bevell as the OC.

    Carroll installed Jackson as the starter right away because he wanted to build "continuity". Also, did you see who the Seachickens have as QB's? Hell, I would be the starter there....

    That doesn't mean he'll do well.
    Did he compete for this job? Nope...just like every other time he's been named starter, it was gifted to him.

    Caine
    This is how....

    Poll: If it\'s down to these two, who will start in Seattle?
    Charlie Whitehurst 14
    58.3%
    Tarvaris Jackson 10 41.7%
    I'm referring to the 14 that answered "Whitehurst" to the poll of which you are easily one.

    It's irrelevant to the poll whether that position was won or gifted.
    its only irrelevant if you ignore the opening post to understand the context:

    "So if it does happen to come down to Charlie Whitehurst and Tarvaris Fox Jackson III battling it out for the starting job for the Seahawks, which one do you think wins it? "


    They never battled it out as was prefaced in the initial post so the results are void. I even asked for clarification in an early post and he reinforced that the poll was about a competition not a gifted spot as this appeaes to be.
    I was referring to the poll question as it was asked, not the poll question as it was interpreted along with or in addition to another post in this thread.

    Like I said, gifted or not, Jackson has been named the starter, not Whitehurst
    Yup. According to the verbiage of the question, I am wrong.

    However, I'm pretty sure that the results of the season will show Carrol and Bevell wrong...

    B)

    Caine
    Oh no Caine ... you are fully aware of how it works.

    It is the offensive line's fault, the WR's fault, the coaches fault or the punter's fault.

    But it is NEVER ... and I mean EEEEEEEEVVVVVVER ... T-Jack's fault.
    You must have Favre confused with Jackson.
    No one made excuses for Favre...he got crucified. Only Teflon Jackson was showered with excuses.

    Caine
    Your memory that short it only goes back a few months & not from the time he got here?

    I believe you your self made a post that said similarly "If he only had receivers to throw to".

    There were excuses made on receivers not getting open.

    There were excuses made about receivers dropping balls, especially those that touched outstretched arms.

    There were excuses made on the front line not protecting the QB.

    There were excuses made on him being rusty due to lack of training/preparation.

    There were excuses made on him not having gelled with the team yet.

    There were excuses made because of his ankle, his shoulder, his tendonitis.

    There were excuses made on him not having gelled with the team yet.

    There were excuses made on play calling.

    There were excuses made on receivers zigging when they should have zagged.

    Your memory being refreshed yet?
    Wow, talk about selective memories....

    When discussing Favre last year, the VAST MAJORITY of his SUPPORTERS stated, "Favre played like crap...AND the receivers sucked, AND the O-line sucked".

    When discussing Teflon Tarvaris, his supporters left off the "Tarvaris played like crap" part and went right to the other elements as EXCUSES for his poor performances.

    And, FYI, the excuse about "him being rusty due to lack of training/preparation" was never used...that was BLAME that was directed straight AT him.

    And play calling excuses weren't made either, because we all knew Brett changed the play at the line many times...Jackson was the ONLY beneficiary of the "play calling" excuses.

    Again, my memory isn't the one needing refreshing...

    Caine
    We aren't talking about just 2010 here, it includes 2009 as well. Sure some fans finally admitted Favre played like shit after losses piled up & they no longer could avoid the inevitable, but others hung on to excuses for as long as they could.

    The term "rust" wasn't used to blame Favre, it was used more in the sense of giving him a free pass because of it. (See Vikings vs. Saints 2010 postgame thread)

    Others in that thread talked about many things that were wrong & left Favre out of the equation.

    You yourself never mentioned Favre playing bad in that thread either, but made sure you went off & bragged about all the records Favre owns when someone mentioned the INT's.

    "If at first you don't succeed, parachuting is not for you"

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