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  1. #11
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    Why not? If you can tell a white, hispanic or asian not to use it then it is no more difficult to hold them to the same standard,

  2. #12
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    Therein lies the problem...we're all NOT held to the same standard.

    The US is so busy falling all over itself to prove it's not racist that it is now acceptable - and even subtly encouraged - to imitate and emulate the worst characteristics of the sub-group of a sub-group that KC mentioned. Instead of being the "Great Melting Pot", we are now the "Great White melting pot, with a side of Non-white Ethnicity".

    And this is why a stupidly uttered word - one spoken in the heat of the moment, and likely under the influence - has generated such attention.

    I don't think Riley Cooper is a POS. I think he's a guy who got a little too full of himself and stuck his foot in his mouth while trying to act bigger than he really is. It bit him in the ass. But enough is enough.

    But I think it's telling that the same level of outrage ISN'T present when Mike Vicks BROTHER puts out a "hit" on Cooper. For a word uttered in a moment of stupidity.

    Sad.

    Caine

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    Therein lies the problem...we're all NOT held to the same standard.

    The US is so busy falling all over itself to prove it's not racist that it is now acceptable - and even subtly encouraged - to imitate and emulate the worst characteristics of the sub-group of a sub-group that KC mentioned. Instead of being the "Great Melting Pot", we are now the "Great White melting pot, with a side of Non-white Ethnicity".

    And this is why a stupidly uttered word - one spoken in the heat of the moment, and likely under the influence - has generated such attention.

    I don't think Riley Cooper is a POS. I think he's a guy who got a little too full of himself and stuck his foot in his mouth while trying to act bigger than he really is. It bit him in the ass. But enough is enough.

    But I think it's telling that the same level of outrage ISN'T present when Mike Vicks BROTHER puts out a "hit" on Cooper. For a word uttered in a moment of stupidity.

    Sad.

    Caine
    I think your downplaying of "a word" is insulting. There is a serious history attached to the use of the word nigger. No matter how some members of the black community may try to change the use of the word, there is a dangerous history attached to it. I think Oprah's statement about that being the last word that thousands of black people heard right before they were murdered via mob violence and lynching, is profound. I'm sick of the way this country is heading where celebrities can go "oh yucks" and it be ok.


    I think race has become this issue that everyone tries to tip toe around. I think the days of blatant racism being publicly allowed are gone. However, there are tons of policies and laws on the books that gives preferential treatment to one race over another. I don't believe that Riley "stupidly uttered" the word Nigger. One does not stupidly utter the word with that intention. Was he drunk? Surely. Was he comfortable? Definitely. That is when most closet racist show there true colors. Check yahoo's comment section on any article.

    Do I think he should be suspended? Hell no. Do I object to Marus Vick's hit? Hell no. If you think week 1 some guy isn't going to take his head off... you're kidding yourself.

  4. #14
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    Riley Cooper...Pariah

    COD is an embarrassment to the human race but the game is fun.

  5. #15
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    Random thoughts.....

    Anyone who doesn't believe there is racism in this country is fooling him/herself. And if you believe it only applies to one race, you are really fooling yourself.

    Whites, Blacks, Asians, American Indians, etc etc etc are all discriminated against. All of them.

    The problem is, at least the way I see it, is, the bleeding heart liberal press only seems to want to stir the pot for a certain race just to continue the divide because without it, they can't sell their drivel to the masses that buy into it.

    Whats even more shamefully is when a guy of a certain race uses, and to a great degree exploits that issue to his own benefit.

    Quick question, racism or discrimination?

    Is it OK for White College Students to Form Their Own Union? - Your Views - Loganville-Grayson, GA Patch
    Last edited by Marrdro; 08-07-2013 at 10:00 AM.
    Many many thanks to my talented friend Jos for the new Sig.http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v343/josdin00/Vikings/Marrdro_sig.jpg

  6. #16
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    I'm not racist, just hate everyone but myself.
    Disclaimer: I'm an idiot.

  7. #17
    Caine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevoncox View Post
    I think your downplaying of "a word" is insulting. There is a serious history attached to the use of the word nigger. No matter how some members of the black community may try to change the use of the word, there is a dangerous history attached to it. I think Oprah's statement about that being the last word that thousands of black people heard right before they were murdered via mob violence and lynching, is profound. I'm sick of the way this country is heading where celebrities can go "oh yucks" and it be ok.


    I think race has become this issue that everyone tries to tip toe around. I think the days of blatant racism being publicly allowed are gone. However, there are tons of policies and laws on the books that gives preferential treatment to one race over another. I don't believe that Riley "stupidly uttered" the word Nigger. One does not stupidly utter the word with that intention. Was he drunk? Surely. Was he comfortable? Definitely. That is when most closet racist show there true colors. Check yahoo's comment section on any article.

    Do I think he should be suspended? Hell no. Do I object to Marus Vick's hit? Hell no. If you think week 1 some guy isn't going to take his head off... you're kidding yourself.
    I guarantee you that nothing I say on this topic will NOT piss you off. And I think that's really too bad. I think that if you and I were at a bar, drinking beer and talking Vikings, we'd be fine.

    My question for you would be, "When do we put the past in the past? When do we look forward, and not behind"?

    Caine

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caine View Post
    I guarantee you that nothing I say on this topic will NOT piss you off. And I think that's really too bad. I think that if you and I were at a bar, drinking beer and talking Vikings, we'd be fine.

    My question for you would be, "When do we put the past in the past? When do we look forward, and not behind"?

    Caine
    I am all for the past being the past except... the past affects our present which affects our future.
    Listen, the black community has some cleaning up to do but if you cannot see some of that hearkens back to a systemic method of disenfranchising millions of people, then I say wake up.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1Dr-hMCy78where

    When you hear stories like the one listed above you should be aware.
    The lack of awareness that many members of the white community display is an luxury you have been afforded. You need not be aware of the trials and tribulations of others because it doesn't affect you. However, I haven't been afforded that silver spoon. I am still dealing with the ramifications of the Pig laws, the convict leasing programs and Jim Crow. For you its been 40 years and everything is suppose to be magically fixed. It doesn't work that way.

    Lets get laws like Stop and Frisk off the books and bring equality back (errr... for the first time) to this nation. Laws like the Chi - HUD drug prosession laws that by their nature are not prejudicial but in their application they are. I believe huge part of that would be in the decriminalization of mary-jane. I've never smoked in my life but I believe that there are thousands of people in jail because they smoke marijuana all the while cigarettes/alcohol are legal.

    I've gone way off topic (surprise) but I would enjoy drinking with you and enjoying the game.
    Last edited by kevoncox; 08-07-2013 at 05:29 PM.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevoncox View Post
    I am all for the past being the past except... the past affects our present which affects our future.
    Listen, the black community has some cleaning up to do but if you cannot see some of that hearkens back to a systemic method of disenfranchising millions of people, then I say wake up.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1Dr-hMCy78where

    When you hear stories like the one listed above you should be aware.
    The lack of awareness that many members of the white community display is an luxury you have been afforded. You need not be aware of the trials and tribulations of others because it doesn't affect you. However, I haven't been afforded that silver spoon. I am still dealing with the ramifications of the Pig laws, the convict leasing programs and Jim Crow. For you its been 40 years and everything is suppose to be magically fixed. It doesn't work that way.

    Lets get laws like Stop and Frisk off the books and bring equality back (errr... for the first time) to this nation. Laws like the Chi - HUD drug prosession laws that by their nature are not prejudicial but in their application they are. I believe huge part of that would be in the decriminalization of mary-jane. I've never smoked in my life but I believe that there are thousands of people in jail because they smoke marijuana all the while cigarettes/alcohol are legal.

    I've gone way off topic (surprise) but I would enjoy drinking with you and enjoying the game.
    First, I appreciate a civil, open, and honest discussion...let's hope this stays that way.

    Second, I agree that we have to learn from our past...but the learning has to come from BOTH sides. I think you allude to that when you say, " the black community has some cleaning up to do".

    I think, sincerely, that we - and by "we" I refer to the not-black community - are awaiting that "cleaning up". At this point, many feel we (again, that other community), have given much, and received little in return. After all, it was not WE who committed the atrocities. Nor was it WE who put the bad laws in place. But it is WE who are paying for the sins of generations before.

    As for the video - my thoughts are on multiple levels. On the immediate level, I say being a "f***in' Mutt" isn't illegal. The Cops are wrong...completely...based upon what I hear here. on another level, I ask what happened 60 seconds before? What happened 3 minutes before? What was "Alvin" wearing? There is a rule that if you look like a duck, walk like a duck, and talk like a duck, you're a duck. Did Alvin look like, walk like, or talk like a Duck?

    Stop-n-frisk....sounds like a bad idea to me. I can only see this applied to young males of any race, primarily to young minorities. I will heartily agree that this has an overwhelming potential for abuse.

    But WHY was it put in place? Was it due to the large percentage of armed gang members? And are these gang members disproportionately minority?

    My point here is, if you don't want to be treated like a gang member, take the effort to disassociate yourself from them. I think Bill Cosby said something to that effect some years back.

    Now, if you're going to tell me that you shouldn't have to - because it's your right to act/dress/talk like such, or because you're representing your cultural heritage, or whatever, I will point out that this simple rule applies to EVERYONE.

    Example: I play in a Country Rock band. We were thinking of taking the name "The Hogtied Bridesmaids" (don't ask me why). The Bass player, after a few weeks, stated that he didn't like the name because he was afraid that some (many?) would find it offensive. The drummer got mad and said that people should get over it, and he didn't see why we should change.

    The Bass player was right. We changed the name.

    Do we have the RIGHT to call ourselves the Hogtied Bridesmaids? Absolutely.

    Do we have the RIGHT to express ourselves any way we want? Absolutely.

    But when we DO, we have to be aware that there are repercussions. And if we want to avoid negative PR, we should avoid unnecessarily pissing people off.

    yes, this is an oversimplified example, but the CORE truth is what I'm trying to illustrate.

    "The lack of awareness that many members of the white community display is an luxury you have been afforded. You need not be aware of the trials and tribulations of others because it doesn't affect you."

    First, I'm not certain the "lack of awareness" is as prevalent as you think, and second, we ARE affected by it. We - the aforementioned faction - have to dance on egg shells around any Minority for fear of being labeled as an "IST". We are not allowed to make comparisons that negatively impact those same people for fear of those comparisons being labeled as "IST" and being summarily rejected, regardless of their merits.

    I am still dealing with the ramifications of the Pig laws, the convict leasing programs and Jim Crow.

    It would be interesting to see what ramifications still exist from those - since they were abolished in 1965. My initial response would be that you can't legislate the abolishing of racism...but I would think that the 48 years since those laws were eliminated would have made the landscape a lot brighter for those once afflicted.

    Further, I would point out that it is that very majority - which has that "lack of awareness" - that was aware enough to repeal those laws. Have we gone all the way? No. but we're getting there. Hell, we elected a Black president...TWICE. I couldn't have imagined that 20 years ago.

    And that brings us to "For you its been 40 years and everything is suppose to be magically fixed. It doesn't work that way." And my reply is, "For you it's been 48 years. WE'VE been trying...what are YOU doing?" Not you personally, understand.

    Lets get laws like Stop and Frisk off the books and bring equality back (errr... for the first time) to this nation. Laws like the Chi - HUD drug possession laws that by their nature are not prejudicial but in their application they are.

    Again, why not simply disassociate from the elements that are causing the desire (need?) for Stop-n-frisk? Negate the law by removing yourself from the picture. America has a history of targeting criminal activity broadly, then narrowing the lens. The Mafia spawned any number of laws, all of which were applied to a select portion of society. If you were Italian, in New York or Chicago, and wearing a pinstripe suit, you were watched. Why? Because pin striped suit wearing Italians in New York and Chicago were killing people and controlling criminal enterprises.

    Now, good Irish-German boys (like me), unless they were red heads (I am not), that didn't want to get caught up in the fight didn't act like them, look like them, or talk like them. Therefore, we didn't get shot....very often.

    And the application of drug laws is only prejudicial if they are applied to only one segment. They aren't. The problem is that one segment of society has a far higher per capita number of members who believe it is OK to engage in the sale and distribution of drugs. They are targeted because they represent a target rich environment, and Law Enforcement can rack up an impressive number of "wins" in a cost effective fashion. Then Joe Public can believe we're winning the war on drugs (We aren't....not even close)

    Want to stop it from happening? Encourage that segment of the population to cease their involvement in the drug trade. In short, if you follow the same laws everyone else is following, you don't get singled out. I know the Perps of the two biggest narcotics busts in my town...both are WHITE. It didn't help them.

    I believe huge part of that would be in the decriminalization of mary-jane. I've never smoked in my life but I believe that there are thousands of people in jail because they smoke marijuana all the while cigarettes/alcohol are legal.

    Boy, this is a debate all by itself. I agree it should be decriminalized. I agree that it is FAR too easy to wind up a Felon due to MJ. And change is coming....slowly. The last election's referendums on MJ showed a clear pattern.

    In the end, however, you're partly right. We have a long way to go. But ALL of us do. And every successive generation will take steps - hopefully - in the right direction.

    Caine

    PS: Your comments caused me to read the following:
    The Convict Lease System by Frederick Douglass
    The Public Intellectual Something smells like a pig, you say?
    Both excellent articles.
    Last edited by Caine; 08-07-2013 at 08:44 PM.

  10. #20
    Purple Floyd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kevoncox View Post
    I am all for the past being the past except... the past affects our present which affects our future.
    Listen, the black community has some cleaning up to do but if you cannot see some of that hearkens back to a systemic method of disenfranchising millions of people, then I say wake up.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1Dr-hMCy78where

    When you hear stories like the one listed above you should be aware.
    The lack of awareness that many members of the white community display is an luxury you have been afforded. You need not be aware of the trials and tribulations of others because it doesn't affect you. However, I haven't been afforded that silver spoon. I am still dealing with the ramifications of the Pig laws, the convict leasing programs and Jim Crow. For you its been 40 years and everything is suppose to be magically fixed. It doesn't work that way.

    Lets get laws like Stop and Frisk off the books and bring equality back (errr... for the first time) to this nation. Laws like the Chi - HUD drug prosession laws that by their nature are not prejudicial but in their application they are. I believe huge part of that would be in the decriminalization of mary-jane. I've never smoked in my life but I believe that there are thousands of people in jail because they smoke marijuana all the while cigarettes/alcohol are legal.

    I've gone way off topic (surprise) but I would enjoy drinking with you and enjoying the game.
    Look, I am not going to even attempt to say that I understand the prejudices you face. I am white, blonde haired and blue eyed. That doesn't mean that we had some sort of silver spoon that made our lives some sort of honeymoon. When I was a kid growing up we routinely got stopped by police for whatever reason they decided to stop us for. We would have our cars checked by them ( I remember one particular night driving with friends in a nearby town and getting pulled over after doing some pheasant hunting earlier in the day. The shotguns were still in the trunk and they took them out and inspected them in front of the whole crowd parked by the mall across the street and gave us the rundown about whether we were out causing trouble, shooting out windows etc. We got over it. But we certainly had plenty of run ins with overzealous law enforcement officers. So it really isn't something that any particular ethnic group has a monopoly on.

    The country has changed dramatically in the nearly 50 years that I have been living. I know that in the rural town I grew up in there was not a single black person in the town the whole time I lived there. People would use derogatory language for sure when referencing blacks but to be honest I know only a small percentage even in that town really were racist. The derogatory comments that they made were the same they used in reference to people in the surrounding communities, Iowa etc.

    One thing that always fails to be mentioned is that yes, your ancestors were subjected to Slavery and that was a terrible thing. But remember that my ancestors did not like, condone or tolerate it and they went to war, shed blood and died so that your ancestors could be freed and treated as equals, they voted for candidates that passed laws establishing those rights and freedoms that should have never needed to be passed in the first place and if it would have been up to my ancestors that dark part of our history would have never happened in the first place.

    So, while there are certainly racist people of all colors in the world, when you look at someone who is white from now on just remember that while some of our ancestors did do terrible things to your ancestors, others gave their lives to make sure you got on the road to where you are today. And many of us would do the same thing today if the need arose. And yeah, sometimes we may say a word that may make you uncomfortable but we also say things to each other that are no better, just as you do. But that doesn't mean we are all out to hold you back or put up barriers or think of you in any way that resembles what others thought of your ancestors.

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